Lester Tipton - This Won't Change - Anyone Know What Year?

[Ian Dewhirst]

Hi All,

 

Anyone know the year for "This Won't Change" - Lester Tipton on La Beat?

 

Many thanks,

 

Ian D 

[Denbo]

In 2008 it sold for around £4300. The next one appeared in 2009 for about £1800. Since then, I don't think any have sold on eBay, except on Grapevine of course.

[Pete S]

I think it's 1967

[Kjw]

I thought it was 1966

[Ian Dewhirst]

That's what I'm talking about. Need to pin down the exact year if poss......

 

Ian D 

[Pete S]

Dave Welding will know

[Ian Dewhirst]

In 2008 it sold for around £4300. The next one appeared in 2009 for about £1800. Since then, I don't think any have sold on eBay, except on Grapevine of course.

 

Nice to get the prices Denbo, but what about the year of recording.....? 

 

Ian D 

[Sebastian]

Considering the cat# pattern (65xx, 66xx, 67xx etc.), 1966 seems plausible:

 

6504 - Spider , Snake & Eee - Only A Boy / When I Have To Say, Be On Your Way
6602 - Al Williams - I Am Nothing / Brand New Love (Also released on Palmer 5011)
6604 - James Shorter - Ready For The Heartbreak / Modern Day Woman
6605 - The Masqueraders - A Family Part I / A Family Part 2
6066 - The Masqueraders - I'm Gonna Make It / How
6607 - Lester Tipton - This Won't Change / Go On
6608 - Nelson Sanders- This Love Is Here To Stay / Tired Of Being Your Fool
6609 - Don Hart & James Shorter - I Shed A Tear / All The Love I Got
6701 - The Masqueraders - Be Happy For Me / (Instrumental)
6701 - The Masqueraders / The L. P. T.'s - Be Happy For Me / (Instrumental)
6701 - The L.P.T's / The L. P. T. Orchestra - Together That's The Only Way (Vocal) / Together That's The Only Way (Instrumental)  
6702 - The Masqueraders - (Work) Together, That's The Only Way / One More Chance .
6704/5 - The Masqueraders - I Got The Power / (Work) Together, That's The Only Way

[Pete S]

I believe it is '66

 

here's an interesting piece..

 

https://thatsallritemama.blogspot.co.uk/2008/12/lester-tipton-labeat-6607.html

[Premium Stuff]

The Lou Beatty's Detroit Soul CD also puts it at 1966.

Cheers

Richard

Edited July 29, 2014 by Premium Stuff

[Sebastian]

It's definitely pressed in 1966.

 

Manufactured at Rite.

 

The Rite numbers allocated to this 45 (17867 and 17868) places it as a 1966 press:

 

https://www.45rpmrecords.com/press/RITE.php?pageNum=11&totalRows=3405

[Pete S]

It's definitely pressed in 1966.

 

Manufactured at Rite.

 

The Rite numbers allocated to this 45 (17867 and 17868) places it as a 1966 press:

 

https://www.45rpmrecords.com/press/RITE.php?pageNum=11&totalRows=3405

 

Posted Rite info above :-)

[Sebastian]

Posted Rite info above :-)

 

Well there you go!

[Peter99]

Interesting stuff.

 

It's a stormer of a record isn't it.

 

Peter

[Pete S]

The following was in the Michigan Chronicle for Saturday, February 27, 1982, Section D-Page 1. 

SERVICES HERE - Find Famed Twin Dancer Slain in L. A. by Rita Griffin. 
Services were held Tuesday for Lester Tipton, a former Detroiter who gained popularity in his you with his twin sister Leslie as dancers on "Swinging Time," a local variety television show. The body of Tipton, 33, a resident of Los Angeles at the time of his death, was discovered by his sister last Friday. He had been beaten and robbed. "As shattering as it was, we all had a premonition something was wrong," said Tipton's mother, Mrs. Lucy Tipton of Detroit. "Leslie who had been in touch with him every day, hadn't heard from him since last Tuesday. And, I know it sounds strange, but for two nights, I had the same dream about a beating death." Tipton's sister, (Leslie) Mrs. Jerome Russell, had tried to gain entrance to her brother's house on one occasion, but it was locked. When phoning Detroit relatives about her concern, she was advised by her mother to try and get into the bedroom. "I wasn't expecting the worse," said Mrs. Tipton. "I just felt he might be sick or something. But I did have the feeling he was in his room." When Mrs. Russell and her husband went back to her brother's residence Friday, there was a strong odor coming from the house. They broke down the door and found Tipton dead in his room. "Just what happened or how it happened is a mystery," said Mrs. Tipton. "I had talked to him (Lester) earlier in the week and he did mention losing his keys a while back. Police are still investigating, but they feel the first blow that hit him knocked him unconscious. His watch and ring had been removed, so robbery was apparently involved." Twins Lester and Leslie were high school celebrities in the late 60's as regular performers on Robin Seymour's "Swinging Time" dance program, which aired on Channel 9. The two were not only noted for putting popular steps to music, but for their mode of dress as well. Both were fashion-conscious teens with high-style tastes. Their dancing ability, however, won them national recognition when chosen to represent Detroit on Dick Clark's "American Bandstand" competition. They topped the grand finals in 1968, winning two cars and a trip for their parents to Florida. The team decided to pursue their interests in California, where they both became involved in fashion activity and films. "They worked a lot as extras," said their mother. "Of course, they weren't stars by any means, but would call us when they were going to be in something and we knew which scenes to check for. It got so we could spot them right away." The twins were seen on televisioon in a "Dynasty" episode last Wednesday and on "The Love Boat" Saturday. "That hurt us so much to watch, especially Leslie," said Mrs. Tipton, "because that was the day after his body was discovered." Tipton had moved back to California following a year in New York, where he graduated from a school of cosmetology. In Detroit, he attended Goldberg Elementary, Hutchins Junior High and Northern High Schools, and was a member of Mt. Zion Missionary Baptist Church. Rites were held at the Charles E. Cole Funeral Chapel on E. Grand Boulevard. In addition to this mother and sister, Tipton is survived by his father, Willard, and two brothers, Larry and Eddie.

[Denbo]

That's what I'm talking about. Need to pin down the exact year if poss......

 

Ian D 

Oops, sorry, I'm full on Man Flu

[Ernie Andrews]

The following was in the Michigan Chronicle for Saturday, February 27, 1982, Section D-Page 1. 

SERVICES HERE - Find Famed Twin Dancer Slain in L. A. by Rita Griffin. 

Services were held Tuesday for Lester Tipton, a former Detroiter who gained popularity in his you with his twin sister Leslie as dancers on "Swinging Time," a local variety television show. The body of Tipton, 33, a resident of Los Angeles at the time of his death, was discovered by his sister last Friday. He had been beaten and robbed. "As shattering as it was, we all had a premonition something was wrong," said Tipton's mother, Mrs. Lucy Tipton of Detroit. "Leslie who had been in touch with him every day, hadn't heard from him since last Tuesday. And, I know it sounds strange, but for two nights, I had the same dream about a beating death." Tipton's sister, (Leslie) Mrs. Jerome Russell, had tried to gain entrance to her brother's house on one occasion, but it was locked. When phoning Detroit relatives about her concern, she was advised by her mother to try and get into the bedroom. "I wasn't expecting the worse," said Mrs. Tipton. "I just felt he might be sick or something. But I did have the feeling he was in his room." When Mrs. Russell and her husband went back to her brother's residence Friday, there was a strong odor coming from the house. They broke down the door and found Tipton dead in his room. "Just what happened or how it happened is a mystery," said Mrs. Tipton. "I had talked to him (Lester) earlier in the week and he did mention losing his keys a while back. Police are still investigating, but they feel the first blow that hit him knocked him unconscious. His watch and ring had been removed, so robbery was apparently involved." Twins Lester and Leslie were high school celebrities in the late 60's as regular performers on Robin Seymour's "Swinging Time" dance program, which aired on Channel 9. The two were not only noted for putting popular steps to music, but for their mode of dress as well. Both were fashion-conscious teens with high-style tastes. Their dancing ability, however, won them national recognition when chosen to represent Detroit on Dick Clark's "American Bandstand" competition. They topped the grand finals in 1968, winning two cars and a trip for their parents to Florida. The team decided to pursue their interests in California, where they both became involved in fashion activity and films. "They worked a lot as extras," said their mother. "Of course, they weren't stars by any means, but would call us when they were going to be in something and we knew which scenes to check for. It got so we could spot them right away." The twins were seen on televisioon in a "Dynasty" episode last Wednesday and on "The Love Boat" Saturday. "That hurt us so much to watch, especially Leslie," said Mrs. Tipton, "because that was the day after his body was discovered." Tipton had moved back to California following a year in New York, where he graduated from a school of cosmetology. In Detroit, he attended Goldberg Elementary, Hutchins Junior High and Northern High Schools, and was a member of Mt. Zion Missionary Baptist Church. Rites were held at the Charles E. Cole Funeral Chapel on E. Grand Boulevard. In addition to this mother and sister, Tipton is survived by his father, Willard, and two brothers, Larry and Eddie.

Cheers Pete - That's so sad!

[Robbk]

Yes, it was released in 1966, along with the other early LaBeats, according to the pressing plant code, everything I've ever read about it, and Lester, himself.  It was ironic that he didn't even have one copy of it.  

 

I met him in early 1979, introduced by Tom DePierro.  When he found out that I was an active '60s Soul collector, he asked me to find one for him.  I never did again find one.  But, ironically, I had passed it up in late 1966 or early 1967, when I found many LaBeats in a 2-for $1 bin in a Detroit shop.  I bought all The Masqueraders, James Shorter, Nelson Sanders, several Mary Jane and 2 Cool School 45s.  Only Al Williams was missing.  I didn't buy The Lester Tipton record because I didn't like either side.

[Guest]

Yes, it was released in 1966, along with the other early LaBeats, according to the pressing plant code, everything I've ever read about it, and Lester, himself.  It was ironic that he didn't even have one copy of it.  

 

I met him in early 1979, introduced by Tom DePierro.  When he found out that I was an active '60s Soul collector, he asked me to find one for him.  I never did again find one.  But, ironically, I had passed it up in late 1966 or early 1967, when I found many LaBeats in a 2-for $1 bin in a Detroit shop.  I bought all The Masqueraders, James Shorter, Nelson Sanders, several Mary Jane and 2 Cool School 45s.  Only Al Williams was missing.  I didn't buy The Lester Tipton record because I didn't like either side.

That`s a man true to his values! 

[Robbk]

That`s a man true to his values! 

You have to remember that there was NO Northern Soul scene at that time, and I was a poor university student with no money, paying my way through university at that time.  Fifty cents US to me in 1966 was like £ 100 to you lot now, and there were literally thousands of Soul records I could have bought for from 10-50¢, ALL of which were more valuable and more tradable, AND, which I liked better than the Lester Tipton record (in spite of the fact that I later became his friend).

 

I left literally 1000s of Soul 45s on Herman Griffith's record shop tables, all costing 10¢, just because I couldn't have afforded one more dime. The same type of thing happened to me when Pat's Records, and Sam's Records and other record shops in L.A. and Chicago sold off their stocks.  I could have borrowed money to buy them all, and taken a big risk of going into the record business.  

 

But that wasn't for me, and I'm glad I didn't end up being a Chris Peake or John Hillyard.  I got to see The World for 20 years as an engineer/environmental scientist and economist, and have been a cartoonist for the past 30 years.  I wouldn't have traded that for dealing with record collectors for 50 years (no offence intended, I include myself in that lot).

[Guest]

I was just noting the irony of it Robb

[pow wow mik]

Nice to get the prices Denbo, but what about the year of recording.....? 

 

Ian D 

t'old denbo, he's pretty attached to that wrong end of the stick :-)

]

[Robbk]

I was just noting the irony of it Robb

I suppose it's ironic.  Not as ironic as Tom DePierro having a mint store stock 45 of Frank Wilson's "Do I Love You (Indeed I Do)", and his owing me $30,000 US at the time, AND his allowing me to take ANY of his records as "a little compensation", but he probably sold off THAT record to Simon Soussan, AND the most ironic part:  (fanfare, please!) is that I like the flip, "Sweeter As The Days Go By" MUCH, MUCH better!  

 

 

No accounting for taste, eh?

Edited July 29, 2014 by RobbK

[Guest Ivor Jones]

Cheers Pete - That's so sad!

Isn't it just……….Tragic.

[Dave Pinch]

It tells you on the record. The first 2 digits on the catalogue number is actually the year it was pressed... It wouldn't surprise me if the 2nd digits are the month it was issued also

Edited July 30, 2014 by dave pinch

[Louise]

Considering the cat# pattern (65xx, 66xx, 67xx etc.), 1966 seems plausible:

 

6504 - Spider , Snake & Eee - Only A Boy / When I Have To Say, Be On Your Way

6602 - Al Williams - I Am Nothing / Brand New Love (Also released on Palmer 5011)

6604 - James Shorter - Ready For The Heartbreak / Modern Day Woman

6605 - The Masqueraders - A Family Part I / A Family Part 2

6066 - The Masqueraders - I'm Gonna Make It / How

6607 - Lester Tipton - This Won't Change / Go On

6608 - Nelson Sanders- This Love Is Here To Stay / Tired Of Being Your Fool

6609 - Don Hart & James Shorter - I Shed A Tear / All The Love I Got

6701 - The Masqueraders - Be Happy For Me / (Instrumental)

6701 - The Masqueraders / The L. P. T.'s - Be Happy For Me / (Instrumental)

6701 - The L.P.T's / The L. P. T. Orchestra - Together That's The Only Way (Vocal) / Together That's The Only Way (Instrumental)  

6702 - The Masqueraders - (Work) Together, That's The Only Way / One More Chance .

6704/5 - The Masqueraders - I Got The Power / (Work) Together, That's The Only Way

 There is also a mispress of 6702 with the label credited as "Be Happy For Me" on the A and B side which plays as the vocal and instrumental of "Together That's The Only Way"

Dave

Edited July 31, 2014 by Louise

[Pete S]

Courtesy Dave Welding