Will The Real Simon Soussan Stand Up

[Pete S]

Wow. I've never actually seen that. It'd be interesting to see how it compares to Johnny and Tim's guides........

Incidentally, a good book to get for the Uni project might be the Album Cover Album. It's got all the good 60's & 70's Hipgnosis/Roger Dean sleeves etc. Here's one going cheap - https://cgi.ebay.ca/Album-Cover-Album-Hipgn...1742.m153.l1262

Ian D

that was me selling it - thats my old book. It's ultra, ultra rare is that book, I've seen it sell for £100 in the days before the priceguides came out. I actually managed to get another one quite cheaply which I still have. If anyone wants me to bootleg it I will

[Ian Dewhirst]

I thought Chris had access to all of the Motown tapes in storage at Abbey Road...or sommat. Definitely had the tapes though

Oh yeah. Forgot about that.

However, I think I'm right in saying that Abbey Road would only have the original copy masters which were originally ordered by the UK licensees of the time (EMI I think) and they wouldn't contain a tape of a record which never got properly released in the UK IMO.

I think the situation changed when Universal bought Motown because then all the original tapes would be transferred to Universal. However, there are tens of thousands of tapes and it would take years to go through them properly. Gordon Fruin originally had the job of going through the tapes for Universal around 10 years ago and I suspect that this is where some of the more interesting new discoveries came from.

Does Mr King come on here?

I think he'd know best, so can someone give him a nudge?

Ian D

[Pete S]

the good 60's & 70's Hipgnosis/Roger Dean sleeves etc.

Crikey Ian, do me a favour, I had enough of that stuff from the hippies at school, the prog rockers...Tales From Topographic Oceans and all that crap (stuff we'd like to forget not be reminded of!)

Edited April 6, 2008 by Pete S

[Ian Dewhirst]

that was me selling it - thats my old book. It's ultra, ultra rare is that book, I've seen it sell for £100 in the days before the priceguides came out. I actually managed to get another one quite cheaply which I still have. If anyone wants me to bootleg it I will

LOL!

Great minds think alike. I've got one as well. It's bloody awkward to file because of it's shape but I can't bring myself to get rid of it.....

You've probably got all the others I'd imagine......

Ian D

Edited April 6, 2008 by Ian Dewhirst

[Ian Dewhirst]

Crikey Ian, do me a favour, I had enough of that stuff from the hippies at school, the prog rockers...Tales From Topographic Oceans and all that crap

I'm a sucker for great artwork and I loved some of the artwork in that book.

They never really spent anything on Black acts back in the day until Isaac Hayes came along with "Black Moses" and almost bankrupted Stax before it went down anyway LOL.....

Best Northern Soul album sleeve? The Skull Snaps with the full gatefold and that unbelievable inner sleeve!

Ian D

[Guest Paul]

... If anyone wants me to bootleg it I will

That would be a little bit of "poetic justice". It's what he deserves.

Paul

[Dave Rimmer]

No... but I was looking for album covers for a uni project last year and came across this on Popsike.

Published in 1994... I surprised by how recent it was.

Sold on Ebay for £44 in 2006

Apparently the reason it's so rare is Motown stopped the publication because of the copyright implications in using images of their labels. At the time, Simon Soussan rang me up and asked if I wanted to buy ten copies at a wholesale price.

I's never spoken to him before in my life, but was well aware of his reputation, so I suggested he send me ten, sale or return, payment when I'd sold them, or he send me one copy so that I could have a look at it. A week later one copy arrived, I never ordered any more and never heard from him again.

I gather that the copies that he had printed before the block was put on the book were eventually sold at one of the big US record fairs, hence a few copies have found their way into the UK.

[Chris Anderton]

I gather that the copies that he had printed before the block was put on the book were eventually sold at one of the big US record fairs, hence a few copies have found their way into the UK.

..................

I bought my copy on the West coast around 1992...it was definatly 92 or 93 as it was the second time i went to the States with Dave Ingle and we only ever did the west coast....never went there for another ten years...

Still got the book, came across it the other day actually...I`d pay most of those prices now!

Chris

[Ian Dewhirst]

Apparently the reason it's so rare is Motown stopped the publication because of the copyright implications in using images of their labels. At the time, Simon Soussan rang me up and asked if I wanted to buy ten copies at a wholesale price.

I's never spoken to him before in my life, but was well aware of his reputation, so I suggested he send me ten, sale or return, payment when I'd sold them, or he send me one copy so that I could have a look at it. A week later one copy arrived, I never ordered any more and never heard from him again.

I gather that the copies that he had printed before the block was put on the book were eventually sold at one of the big US record fairs, hence a few copies have found their way into the UK.

[Ian Dewhirst]

Damn.

Dunno what happened there but I lost a whole mail!

I was replying to Dave's post about the book. Fascinating - Simon wouldn't have dared mess with Motown so he'd have been stuck with a whole pile of unsellable books and large printing bill no doubt. Bet the printer's still waiting LOL......

One thing we haven't touched on in this thread, was Simon's habit of appropriating and 're-writing' Northern Soul tunes for his Disco productions in the late 70's.

Here's a couple of examples:

"After Dark" - Patti Brooks (see attached)

Anyone notice a passing resemblence to Shawn Robinson's "My Dear Heart" perchance?

He did it again with Arpeggio's "Love & Desire" - a blatant remake of the Flirtations "Stronger Than Her Love".

In both the above cases the lyrics were completely re-written but the underlying tune, melody and basic rhythm arrangement are exactly the same.

I haven't checked the song credits but I'm sure one S. Soussan will be pretty prominent!

I'll write about my horrific first night in L.A. with Soussan when I pluck up the moral courage to re-visit the embarassment of that particular occasion.

Next coupla days probably. .....it'll be painful but I may as well get it out of the way!

Ian D

[Sean Hampsey]

Here's the very original "Love & Desire"

[Sean Hampsey]

And the flipside "Panic" (another great simon soussan original)

[Sean Hampsey]

Oh... what about this for a goodie "Queen Of Fools".... how creative was this fellow!

[Sean Hampsey]

A prophetic title... don't you think?

There's one thing I think he forgot!

[Sean Hampsey]

And here's the boy wonder (Just before the time when Malc Burton met him at the Tailors).

How sweet!

[Ian Dewhirst]

Blimey. Sean Hampsey is closet Soussan fan shock horror!

Do you have a Soussan Shrine in the cellar perchance.....?

And careful mate. That "Love & Desire"'s a boot - the original was on Polydor......

Ian D

[The Yank]

Once in awhile Simon did give the actual writers credit- "Girl Don't Make Me Wait",

"Love Shook" and "This Is The House Where Love Died" all by Pattie Brooks.

Now here's a good trivia question for you ! I was doing some spring cleaning this

last week and found a flyer from a record store- their hot pick of the week was .....

"Uptown Festival " by Sam and Kitty (!!!!!)

Was this an early pressing or something Simon did on the side ?

[Ian Dewhirst]

Once in awhile Simon did give the actual writers credit- "Girl Don't Make Me Wait",

"Love Shook" and "This Is The House Where Love Died" all by Pattie Brooks.

Now here's a good trivia question for you ! I was doing some spring cleaning this

last week and found a flyer from a record store- their hot pick of the week was .....

"Uptown Festival " by Sam and Kitty (!!!!!)

Was this an early pressing or something Simon did on the side ?

That was Simon's early name for the group which would become Shalamar. In fact, I still have a 10" acetate which says "Uptown Festival" - Sam & Kitty right here.

Sam & Kitty was a holdover from when Simon originally wanted to do a Northern Soul medley, until I pointed out that Sam & Kitty would have prior rights to the name and it wasn't such a good idea to have a duo name for a trio group!

I should be thanked really otherwise there could have been a whole ramp of hit records in the 70's by Sam & Kitty, which I don't think has the same ring as Shalamar!

Ian D

[Sean Hampsey]

Blimey. Sean Hampsey is closet Soussan fan shock horror!

Do you have a Soussan Shrine in the cellar perchance.....?

Ian D

Nah, just my burgeoning archive of crap records Ian

Wish I'd had the Mutha in my cellar last summer, during the flood!

Sean

[Guest TONY ROUNCE]

However, I think I'm right in saying that Abbey Road would only have the original copy masters which were originally ordered by the UK licensees of the time (EMI I think) and they wouldn't contain a tape of a record which never got properly released in the UK IMO.

As it happens, a considerable number of TMG 500s were dubbed here from US 45s, rather than manufactured from tapes sent over from Motown. I've been told this by several people who worked for EMI in the 60s. That why a lot of them sound a bit different to their US counterparts - disc dubbing facilities were not as sophsiticated back then, even at EMI. Personally I think that EMI's mastering engineers created what British ears came to think of as "The Motown Sound" - most of the US 45s never sound quite as dynamic to these ears...

EMI used to request two copies of every new Motown 45 that they felt they might release, one for 'office play' and one that was supposed to remain unplayed, in case a decison was later made to dub it for UK release. I was told, only a few weeks ago and by someone who was present at the dubbing, that the copy of "Reach Out I'll Be There" that was used to dub TMG 579 was the fairly knackered copy that had been played to death to all and sundry by the A & R department, the unplayed copy having vansihed the day before the mastering session was due to take place. Shades of Soussan, even before there was a Soussan!

Edited April 7, 2008 by TONY ROUNCE

[Guest TONY ROUNCE]

A prophetic title... don't you think?

There's one thing I think he forgot!

Is this a misprinted title, Sean? Surely it's really called "Mr. Big Shi*"!

[Ian Dewhirst]

As it happens, a considerable number of TMG 500s were dubbed here from US 45s, rather than manufactured from tapes sent over from Motown. I've been told this by several people who worked for EMI in the 60s. That why a lot of them sound a bit different to their US counterparts - disc dubbing facilities were not as sophsiticated back then, even at EMI. Personally I think that EMI's mastering engineers created what British ears came to think of as "The Motown Sound" - most of the US 45s never sound quite as dynamic to these ears...

EMI used to request two copies of every new Motown 45 that they felt they might release, one for 'office play' and one that was supposed to remain unplayed, in case a decison was later made to dub it for UK release. I was told, only a few weeks ago and by someone who was present at the dubbing, that the copy of "Reach Out I'll Be There" that was used to dub TMG 579 was the fairly knackered copy that had been played to death to all and sundry by the A & R department, the unplayed copy having vansihed the day before the mastering session was due to take place. Shades of Soussan, even before there was a Soussan!

Wow. That really surprises me. I've often thought that the sound really leapt from some of those early TMG 500's. I still find the UK mastering on, for example, "Love Is Like An Itching In My Heart" and "You Keep Me Hangin' On" to be some of the best I've ever heard. I wonder who mastered them - someone in-house @ Abbey Road maybe? And if they're dubs, then gimme a dub anytime LOL.....

And what became of the EMI library? I never saw it but I understood there was one at the pressing plant in the early 80's.

Also, theoretically, that could mean that 2 x Frank Wilson's came over here in the 60's, unlkely though it seems........

Was anyone's Grandad an EMI rep in the 60's LOL?

Ian D

[Guest TONY ROUNCE]

Wow. That really surprises me. I've often thought that the sound really leapt from some of those early TMG 500's. I still find the UK mastering on, for example, "Love Is Like An Itching In My Heart" and "You Keep Me Hangin' On" to be some of the best I've ever heard. I wonder who mastered them - someone in-house @ Abbey Road maybe? And if they're dubs, then gimme a dub anytime LOL...

Also, theoretically, that could mean that 2 x Frank Wilson's came over here in the 60's, unlkely though it seems........

Ian D

I'll ask a couple of 'There At The Time' pals to confirm - but I think that quite a few were done by a guy called George 'Porky' Peckham, who was one of the chief mastering engineers at Abbey Road before he went off and opened his own independent mastering studios. - you might have seen 'Pecko' or 'Porky' engraved in the deadwax on 70s EMI pressings. But whoever did them really knew how to make those records tingle with excitement. As you say, "Love Is Like An Itching In My Heart" is sensational on 560. In fact. whoever did 555 thru' 569 deserves a permanatent enshrinement in the NS hall of fame, their work on "Get Ready", "This Old Heart of Mine", "Whole Lot Of Shakin' In My Heart", "Nothing's Too Good For My Baby" and, perhaps most of all, Marvin Gaye's "Take This Heart Of Mine" is absolutely breathtaking. Other 'better than the US' items from around that time include 552 ('One More Heartache') and 542 ('Something About You'). Not that they are bad on US, of course!

BTW I understand that at least most of the UK Motown albums were not dubbed from disc - they had the luxury of waiting for tapes on those!

I think I know where the bulk of what used to be the EMI library resides, but if I told you I'd have to kill you, mate...

[Guest Paul]

I agree, Tony.

Many of the UK pressings were better mastered than the US originals, even when they were dubbed from discs, and I'd also say the vinyl and quality control was superior. Apart from EMI Abbey Road cutting good lacquers, the custom-built presses at EMI Hayes were the best in the business. Our Selecta and Shotgun 45s are pressed on those same machines at their new location.

George Peckham ("Porky") cut a lot of lacquers for me and my clients (including Grapevine) over the years when he was in Shaftesbury Avenue. He was a great guy, originally from Liverpool, and always did a good job. Since he retired a few years ago, I've used EMI Abbey Road for master cutting.

If I run into George I'll ask him about those EMI Tamla Motown masters, I know he did some of them.

Sorry for getting a bit off-topic but Tony started it so it's his fault.

Paul

[CliftonHall1]

Did you know him when he was in Leeds Julian?

The only N.S. person I can remember who knew him from back then was Al ??????? from Halifax - the recreational rock climber who was always pretty zapped up but knew his British stuff especially well. Apparently he met Simon in Jumbos whilst listening to Jimmy James "A Man Like Me" on Stateside as a new release and Simon came up to the counter saying "excuse me, excuse me but what ees zees record? It elates me, it excites me, it unblocks my nostrils!"

Simon repeated the above story to me in L.A. and said that Al ?????? introduced him to Northern Soul following that meeting and within months he was off to New York hunting for Northern............

And the 'unblock my nostrils' quip was pure Simon and he built it into his routine everytime we went crate-digging. A typical exchange would be when Simon would suddenly stop digging and pull out a record....

He'd then hold the record directly in front of his eyes and say "Hey, baby boy. Are you're nostrils blocked my friend? Well, you will breathe forever when you hear this baby boy. I have just found the ultimate sinus-deblocker"!

And he'd usually be right. He had a photographic memory for label credits and could usually spot a 'good possibility' Northern unknown immediately, usually from a tiny credit buried away on the label. I have to give him that.

Anyone got any scans of his lists handy? The sheer scale of some of them was daunting.

Also I haven't mentioned it yet, but his personal collection was staggering when I was there. He didn't have quantity but, boy, he sure had some quality there. He kept the collection in his office at his Hollywood pad which was directly next to the pool and they were all housed in wooden, lockable cabinets right the way around the room. He reckoned that he also had over 100,000 records in storage but I never saw 'em. But the stuff in his office. Phew!

Every so often I'd be in there and he'd say, "are you ready for a sinus-deblocker that will rip your nose to shreds baby boy"? And he'd put a record of staggering brilliance on.

I'd say, "Jesus Christ. What the F*&k is THIS?

And he'd say "a very, very rare record baby boy. I have zee only one and I must find another one before I unveil zees record to England".

I'd then jump up to look at the label and he'd snatch it off the turntable.....

And I'd say "C'mon Simon. You're nuts man. This is a huge record!"

And he'd look at me, smile and say "sinus-deblockers don't grow on trees baby boy".

Ian D

Ian,

small world! but did you know of the name of John Frank from Leeds?

If not he was a Architect and interior designer and designed Cinderella Rockerfella's for Stingfellow in Leeds and went on to do for 'stringy the Millionaire, Manchester then Stringfellows in London and L.A and Miami (Coconut Grove - another story!)....anyway Johnnie did a few places for me and remembered Simon.

Remenbers Soussan as he once auditioned for the DJ Job at Cinder Rocks but Jimmy Saville got the job.....

Never told you my missus Cousin bought the Central?

And guess what...they have Northern Nights!!!

When he was going to reopen the place he was looking for a name...i suggested DE JA VOUS....But not being of Northern ascent he didnt get the joke.. ...ps Len Cohen was last time i saw him.....selling Condom Vending machines.....reminds me of that young lady of your aquaintance Sally Ann was it....??

Edited April 7, 2008 by Alan Senior

[Ian Dewhirst]

I'll ask a couple of 'There At The Time' pals to confirm - but I think that quite a few were done by a guy called George 'Porky' Peckham, who was one of the chief mastering engineers at Abbey Road before he went off and opened his own independent mastering studios. - you might have seen 'Pecko' or 'Porky' engraved in the deadwax on 70s EMI pressings. But whoever did them really knew how to make those records tingle with excitement. As you say, "Love Is Like An Itching In My Heart" is sensational on 560. In fact. whoever did 555 thru' 569 deserves a permanatent enshrinement in the NS hall of fame, their work on "Get Ready", "This Old Heart of Mine", "Whole Lot Of Shakin' In My Heart", "Nothing's Too Good For My Baby" and, perhaps most of all, Marvin Gaye's "Take This Heart Of Mine" is absolutely breathtaking. Other 'better than the US' items from around that time include 552 ('One More Heartache') and 542 ('Something About You'). Not that they are bad on US, of course!

BTW I understand that at least most of the UK Motown albums were not dubbed from disc - they had the luxury of waiting for tapes on those!

I think I know where the bulk of what used to be the EMI library resides, but if I told you I'd have to kill you, mate...

George 'Porky' Peckham did all my Mastercuts albums. I LOVE him!

If you check all the Mastercuts albums Porky's trademark etching is on all the masters 'cos he was the king in my opinion.

But I never knew his history prior to the mid 70's. He used to talk about Elvis Costello and Stiff all the time. I never knew he did Motown!

NOW I get it totally.

That guy had the magic touch.

Blast, I wish I'd known that in the mid 90's!

Quality is quality.......

And c'mon Tone.....we've known each other a long time........so that EMI stash.........?

Ian D

Edited April 7, 2008 by Ian Dewhirst

[jazzyjas]

And I know exactly in Baltimore where he probably bought his copy, too. Roadhouse Oldies I'd bet. I sent my Scottish friend James Maxwell over in 1997 to buy one. I almost bought the remaining copies to keep them out of site. It's a good book for certain images, although the quality is poor. I've taken a few things out of it for There's That Beat! and worked some photoshop magic on the images.

My copy still sits next to my computer. Back in 1992 when I was trying to learn more about NS, this book and Craig Moerer lists were all I had to go on. Everything was guesswork back in those days. I was living in West Virginia and making regular trips to Pittsburgh to get all my sounds. Simon Soussan's guide really served me well for a period of time.

Now you can jump on ebay and be an expert overnight. I almost never look at price guides now. What's the point?

-Jas

[Ian Dewhirst]

Ian,

small world! but did you know of the name of John Frank from Leeds?

If not he was a Architect and interior designer and designed Cinderella Rockerfella's for Stingfellow in Leeds and went on to do for 'stringy the Millionaire, Manchester then Stringfellows in London and L.A and Miami (Coconut Grove - another story!)....anyway Johnnie did a few places for me and remembered Simon.

Remenbers Soussan as he once auditioned for the DJ Job at Cinder Rocks but Jimmy Saville got the job.....

Never told you my missus Cousin bought the Central?

And guess what...they have Northern Nights!!!

When he was going to reopen the place he was looking for a name...i suggested DE JA VOUS....But not being of Northern ascent he didnt get the joke.. ...ps Len Cohen was last time i saw him.....selling Condom Vending machines.....reminds me of that young lady of your aquaintance Sally Ann was it....??

Yeah, I think so. I certainly seem to recall the name.

Wow, when did your missus buy the Central? I used to know Tony Gedge and I know the Hi-Fi Club guys - I used to do the Queens Hotel Northern Soul Do's on New Years Eve.....

And I've bumped into Sally Ann a few times down here - she like's a drink does our Sall LOL.... !

Lovely lass - certainly livened up my Saturday nights at the Central LOL!

Ian D

[Eddie Hubbard]

Yes 800 plus on Sassy, from Billy Jackson's apartment in New York. They go for £500 each now so that was a cool £400k find....but I wholesaled most of them for £3 each. Bily confirmed the story to Butch and co when he came over to the UK some years back.

I think before I found them only the issues were known about, and that was with "Love(Your Pain Goes Deep) on the flip.

I also found the white dj's of these and the issues and demos with "This Is Just A B Side as the flip.

The reason they were all there was that Billy had licenced the record early doors to Gamble, and was asked as part of deal not to distribute the Sassy copies.

A friend,Graham Hawkins from Walall ,was a top collector at the time and he happened to drop into the office the day the haul turned up. Bill Baker and myself said we were off to the pub across the road but could he open the parcels as we thought there might be a couple of the Sassy 45's in there and we knew he was desperate for a copy. We left him to it for a bit and then couldn't stand it anymore and went back - Graham was in a state of shock and and could hardly talk, surrounded by 100's of the single. Brillaint.

We missed the fact that we had both demos and issues of the version with "This Is Just a B Side", we thought that it was on just a demo or issue, but not both, and the missing format copies were found while doing a record bar at a Birmingham Locarno All-Dayer, Eddie Hubbard either found them or was there when I found them, and it was my turn to be nonplussed.

Billy Jackson was a real nice guy and he also licenced the single to me for Inferno. It was good to meet up with him when he came over to the UK.

Van McCoy was a right result but one of the three times in my left when I was too in awe of the person I was meeting to talk to them apart from burbling Hello or whatever...other two were George Best and Bobby Moore.

All the Best,

Neil

I was with you when you found them Neil , and bought one of each !! Tell us the story of how you turned up the Mel Britt's , because I had one of those off you via an ad in Echoes , £8 I think ? Best ,Eddie

[Ian Dewhirst]

I was with you when you found them Neil , and bought one of each !! Tell us the story of how you turned up the Mel Britt's , because I had one of those off you via an ad in Echoes , £8 I think ? Best ,Eddie

Neil had Mel Britt's as well? Were they originals or the last of the re-presses? Sounds like a bargain either way.......

Ian D

[Eddie Hubbard]

Neil had Mel Britt's as well? Were they originals or the last of the re-presses? Sounds like a bargain either way.......

Ian D

Real one's Ian , I got £350 for mine which seemed like a fortune at the time - not now tho ' !! Best ,Eddie

[Sean Hampsey]

And I know exactly in Baltimore where he probably bought his copy, too. Roadhouse Oldies I'd bet. I sent my Scottish friend James Maxwell over in 1997 to buy one. I almost bought the remaining copies to keep them out of site. It's a good book for certain images, although the quality is poor. I've taken a few things out of it for There's That Beat! and worked some photoshop magic on the images.

My copy still sits next to my computer. Back in 1992 when I was trying to learn more about NS, this book and Craig Moerer lists were all I had to go on. Everything was guesswork back in those days. I was living in West Virginia and making regular trips to Pittsburgh to get all my sounds. Simon Soussan's guide really served me well for a period of time.

Now you can jump on ebay and be an expert overnight. I almost never look at price guides now. What's the point?

-Jas

Good bet Jas...

...It was Roadhouse Oldies in Baltimore where the book came from.

Good shop in the day.

Is it still open?

Sean

[Bully Boy]

"Good bet Jas...

...It was Roadhouse Oldies in Baltimore where the book came from.

Good shop in the day.

Is it still open?

Sean "

Sean, is that where Tats put the George Blackwell - "Can't Lose My Head" back on the shelf after the guy asked him

for $80 for it, when he produced the book

The Bulmeister

[Sean Hampsey]

Sean, is that where Tats put the George Blackwell - "Can't Lose My Head" back on the shelf after the guy asked him

for $80 for it, when he produced the book

The Bulmeister

Yes it is Bull.

We went back for it though a few days later, if you recall!

But not before he got 50% off first!

Legend!

Sean

[Bully Boy]

Yes it is Bull.

We went back for it though a few days later, if you recall!

But not before he got 50% off first!

Legend!

Sean

Are You The Tough Guys From England

Them Three Ain't

But I Am

Nice One Seanturion

Bully!

[Guest]

Simon is alive, well and still living in the L.A area. Hasn't changed his spots any but he is applying his 'talents' to other aspects of the music business these days.

mulb

[Ian Dewhirst]

Simon is alive, well and still living in the L.A area. Hasn't changed his spots any but he is applying his 'talents' to other aspects of the music business these days.

mulb

What music business LOL? I'd be curious to know what he's up to........

Ian D

[Guest]

Simon is alive, well and still living in the L.A area. Hasn't changed his spots any but he is applying his 'talents' to other aspects of the music business these days.

mulb

What a fascinating "first" post....

And as for the man himself.................

[Julianb]

What a fascinating "first" post....

And as for the man himself.................

Hi Ian

remember that night in Leeds trying to track him down to 'sort him out' and get your money back from some deal he had conned you on!

Neil Mason was there, but I can't remember who else - I bet you can add a few names ( Les Cokell maybe?)

Julian

I've got a picture of him with Van McCoy in LA somewhere.

[Ian Dewhirst]

What a fascinating "first" post....

And as for the man himself.................

That looks like your stand @ Midem circa the mid 90's?

Ian D

[Guest]

That looks like your stand @ Midem circa the mid 90's?

Ian D

Yes but it was the late eighties. 1988 I believe.

And the last time I had that stand was 1993, so it couldn't have been the mid nineties anyway, but I know for a fact that photo was taken in 1988.

[Guest]

Hi Ian

remember that night in Leeds trying to track him down to 'sort him out' and get your money back from some deal he had conned you on!

Neil Mason was there, but I can't remember who else - I bet you can add a few names ( Les Cokell maybe?)

And that was in 1972, after he stole Earl Wright, Roy Hamilton, and The Sweet Things from me.

[Guest familytree]

I'm here!

Oh boy, there's enough material about Simon Soussan for another monster thread.

Drew came up with a blinder here LOL.......

I will write at length about Simon because he does have a place on the scene without a shadow of a doubt. There's no doubt that he was a serious hustler and chancer - that was the nature of the guy. He couldn't help himself as Ady rightfully pointed out.

These days they'd put it down to an ego disorder or just bad genes but Simon was basically a very slick French-Morroccan confidence trickster - if you've ever been in a Morroccan street market you'll know the type.

But he was also blessed with a lot of intelligence, confidence and passion so it was hard not to like him, even though you knew that the guy would screw you at some point 'cos he screwed everyone.

Even though he ripped myself and Neil Rushton off on the Shalamar record, we kinda both saw it coming so we only had ourselves to blame LOL.

But there was a weird upside to knowing him. I had a stack of adventures with the guy and hung around with him in L.A. for a few months. I also had a million-selling record with the guy - "Uptown Festival" by Shalamar (where do you think THAT name came from) and packed a wealth of experiences into a few months in L.A. He got me into the Dramatics, all the best clubs in L.A., he hooked me up with Don Cornelius, Ike Turner, El Coco, Jack Ashford, Solomon Burke etc, etc and got me laid a few times. I liked him.

Anyway, I'll expand on this thread, but in short and in answer to Drew's original points:-

Where was he from and what was his background in soul music?

A French-Morroccan who moved to Leeds, Yorkshire and worked designing suits for Burtons. He discovered Northern Soul in Leeds and became quite passionate about it very quickly.

What contributions did he make to the scene, good or bad?

Where do I start? He discovered literally hundreds of Northern Soul records and his knowledge and memory retention was phenomenal. But he ripped-off a lot of people and didn't give a shit about it as long as he was OK.

Where did he go and what finished his involvement with the NS scene?

Still in L.A. with new wife and new kid when I last saw him in 1990, but in vastly different circumstances to when he was flying high in the mid 70's. I think he'd burned all his bridges and there was no one to call anymore. On the skids basically. I couldn't get out fast enough. But there again, I was on my way to Vegas to get wed at the time......

A star who burned bright, but burned out quickly.

Is he still involved in music production?

Nope. He's probably somewhere in vastly diminished circumstances. I think he sold his music catalogue to Unidisc at some point.

Is he still alive?

Good question Drew. Dunno. Does anyone else know?

I actually have some phenomenal Soussan stories. They're just incredible really.

Here's a quicky.......

When I arrived at L.A.X., Simon came to meet me and this is what happened within the first 2 minutes of meeting him.....

I passed customs and walked through arrivals and immediately spotted Simon. I vaguely knew what he looked like - smooth, chiselled Middle-Eastern hustler and there he was right in front of me.

We greeted each other and sort of embraced. The last time I saw Simon @ Blackpool Mecca I got glassed and had my nose broken. No big deal and I kind of peaked the situation and gave Simon the chance to slip away. Which he did. Totally vanished LOL...

So he believed that I'd saved his life.

So we kind of embraced, weird though it was and he said "welcome to L.A. baby boy. We're gonna have fun"!

And with that he starting leading me through the airport telling me that America was 'the land of opportunity' and that there was 'pussy everywhere' and he was 'going to get me laid' etc, etc...

I mean I was jet-lagged, knackered and still getting adjusted to things and I have this silver fox like cartoon character speaking ten to the dozen and I'm just trying to keep up with the whirlwind.........

And, all of sudden, he smashes me in the ribs and says, "hey baby boy....look at THAT"!

And the greatest looking female I had ever seen in my entire life was approaching us...

And Simon said, "watch this baby boy........"

And he went up to her and said, "Hello madame. I couldn't help noticing you because you are beautiful and I notice beauty because I am a fashion designer. I run the company called "Our Love Is In The Pocket" - we're the ones who put the pocket in between the breasts to give the illusion of accessibility to the male species. The pockets themselves are designed by J.J. Barnes of the Revilot organisation - you'll have read about him in Vogue I'm sure, so I was wondering if you'd be interested in modelling our new Summer line which is coming up. We're going to call it "Sweet Sherry" and I think you'd be the perfect girl to front the campaign. Would it be possible to have your number so our business affairs people can contact you"?

By this point, both the greatest looking female of all time and me were absolutely mesmerised. A FANTASTIC spiel. Right up there with Mussolini and Hitler in my opinion......

So the greatest looking female of all time gave Simon her number, smiled seductively at him and said "make sure you call me. Quick!"

She walked off and I looked at Simon and said, "Wow. I'm dead impressed. When are ya gonna ring her"?

And Simon went very serious for a milli-second and then smiled, ripped the greatest looking female of all time's number into tiny shreds and threw the pieces of paper into the air.

Then he looked at me and said, "Baby boy, this is L.A. There are a million beautiful women here and you're gonna f*$k 'em all"!

THAT was within the first 2 minutes of being with Simon in L.A.

It was hard not to be impressed by the pure bullshit approach. He was the grandmaster of bullshit. On the other hand, if I was going to be honest, the thought of f&%king a million women at that point was pretty appealing.

So he suckered me into the bullshit.

Welcome to Hollywood.

Ian D

What a great story... you mucky pup!

[Guest familytree]

Hi Rod,

No it was me that had the priviledge of being smacked in the kisser with a 1 pint pebble-glass beer mug!

This thread is brilliant! i will be here all night reading it... LOVE you description of the glass yopu were hit with just to let us know the weight of the bugger!... fab x

[John Elias]

OMG this thread is absolutely EDUCATIONAL can we have more please sir ,need to unblock me sinuses further thanks.

ps....Bob Foster still around these parts,someone on this site has his contact details,John Elias

Edited January 26, 2009 by dancingcollector

[Madmandy]

Have been reading this thread for the last hour or so ...what fantastic stories

Never met the man ...what a character

But the stories told on here remind me of the stories told by a chap called Frank on another forum

Had me enthralled as do these...

Northern soul history is peppered with fantstic characters

Thanks for sharing

Mand

[SHEFFSOUL]

And he hasn't PM'd me yet, the bugger!

I'm DYING to know this story.

Also, one of the funniest ones is when Simon broke into the Reddington's Rare Records warehouse through the skylight but we really need Kev Roberts to tell that one. Funny as hell..........

Ian D

presumably..thats the one where SS is pushing Kev thru the skylight saying '..dont forget James Conwell 'love runs out..is really Willie Hutch on Dunhill..' I met dave Rai at the hilton Heathrow just a few weeks ago..we spent six hours retelling many great northern record stories..the Alco pressing plant sory still kills me..

[Ian Dewhirst]

Hi Rod,

No it was me that had the priviledge of being smacked in the kisser with a 1 pint pebble-glass beer mug!

This thread is brilliant! i will be here all night reading it... LOVE you description of the glass yopu were hit with just to let us know the weight of the bugger!... fab x

Yep, that smack in the kisser with a 1 pint pebble-glass beer mug turned out to be the ultimate 'sinus-deblocker' literally LOL. It actually realigned my nostrils which had been knocked out of shape from a previous punch a few years back, hence for a while it actually greatly facilitated the air-flow through my nostrils until the blood started to congeal.............

It's amazing how I managed to retain my good looks after all these nose-flattenings over the years LOL.....

Ian D

[viphitman]

It's amazing how I managed to retain my good looks after all these nose-flattenings over the years LOL.....

Ian D

[Guest familytree]

presumably..thats the one where SS is pushing Kev thru the skylight saying '..dont forget James Conwell 'love runs out..is really Willie Hutch on Dunhill..' I met dave Rai at the hilton Heathrow just a few weeks ago..we spent six hours retelling many great northern record stories..the Alco pressing plant sory still kills me..

please expand! cant keep leaving us in suspense like this..... I feel like Ive been reading a book tonight, great fun! Howlin at the Mecca scufffle... or should that say shuffle.. Not at the pain you suffered Mr dewhurst I hasten to add.

Edited January 26, 2009 by familytree