Mello Souls

[Guest Bearsy]

I blame Bearsy Dave

All this fuss over a played out all nighter record ......jeez if it were'nt rare who'd care:whistling:

If you think this thread is bad enough wait for me next one

[Agentsmith]

i also have an acetate.....but it has a b-side and NO,.....its not a carver and although i COULD play it,i dont out of respect to the people who own the real thing. i really dont see how its played out as ONLY 3 PEOPLE of genuine standing on the northern scene, possess it and whilst it may have passed from 3OTHER PEOPLE'S HANDS, and YES, they did play it as well BUT it cant be heard in, for instance, 60+ venues up and down the uk on fridays and saturdays....ALL AT THE SAME TIME........CAN IT???. SO where's the logic in that then?. i remember the first time i heard it courtesy of shifty at the may day bank holiday "RAREST OF THE RARE" all-nighter at the manchester ritz, circa 2001....WOW!...STOMP OR WHAT?!!

anyway, what the hell, im just airing my opinion.

[Simon T]

i also have an acetate.....but it has a b-side and NO,

What is the title of the b side to WCMI ?

[Shsdave]

i also have an acetate.....but it has a b-side and NO,.....its not a carver and although i COULD play it,i dont out of respect to the people who own the real thing. i really dont see how its played out as ONLY 3 PEOPLE of genuine standing on the northern scene, possess it and whilst it may have passed from 3OTHER PEOPLE'S HANDS, and YES, they did play it as well BUT it cant be heard in, for instance, 60+ venues up and down the uk on fridays and saturdays....ALL AT THE SAME TIME........CAN IT???. SO where's the logic in that then?. i remember the first time i heard it courtesy of shifty at the may day bank holiday "RAREST OF THE RARE" all-nighter at the manchester ritz, circa 2001....WOW!...STOMP OR WHAT?!!

anyway, what the hell, im just airing my opinion.

Hey Rob how you doing mate ?

I think the "played out" remark was just a pizz take......thats how I took it anyway

You say you don't play your acetate, out of respect to those who own the real thing. Well IMO if it's a genuine studio acetate as Des copy is I don't understand the problem. Do you not consider a studio acetate as the real thing ? Ok it's not an actual release but by that criteria do you think that demos shouldn't be played ? Or am i missing something here ?????? (Wouldn't be the first time ) What is on the other side ?

All best

Dave

Edited October 1, 2010 by SHSDave

[Guest Bearsy]

i also have an acetate.....but it has a b-side and NO,.....its not a carver and although i COULD play it,i dont out of respect to the people who own the real thing. i really dont see how its played out as ONLY 3 PEOPLE of genuine standing on the northern scene, possess it and whilst it may have passed from 3OTHER PEOPLE'S HANDS, and YES, they did play it as well BUT it cant be heard in, for instance, 60+ venues up and down the uk on fridays and saturdays....ALL AT THE SAME TIME........CAN IT???. SO where's the logic in that then?. i remember the first time i heard it courtesy of shifty at the may day bank holiday "RAREST OF THE RARE" all-nighter at the manchester ritz, circa 2001....WOW!...STOMP OR WHAT?!!

anyway, what the hell, im just airing my opinion.

You wanna sell it Rob

[Agentsmith]

Hey Rob how you doing mate ?

I think the "played out" remark was just a pizz take......thats how I took it anyway

You say you don't play your acetate, out of respect to those who own the real thing. Well IMO if it's a genuine studio acetate as Des copy is I don't understand the problem. Do you not consider a studio acetate as the real thing ? Ok it's not an actual release but by that criteria do you think that demos shouldn't be played ? Or am i missing something here ?????? (Wouldn't be the first time ) What is on the other side ?

All best

Dave

hi dave,

i would bet the sound quality is similar to des's copy, though NOT an original one as is suggested about des's, nevertheless it IS a proper acetate and i didnt ask where it came from. it has earnestine eady - lets think it over, on the other side. i'll be honest, i did play it a couple of times at prestwich but early doors ( 9-10pm).

demo's are original vinyl records, in some cases, rarer than original issues and in others, not....either way the owner of the legitimate vinyl issue or demo is entitled to play to play it...but that goes without saying really. where acetates are concerned, there are genuine studio ones....and in a lot of cases they are the source of recorded material that has never been issued. then, as in the 70's and onwards, there are acetates that are cut due to demand because, a person simply couldnt afford the vinyl original because of its rareity.

these items, whilst not really considered to be bootlegs, i suppose can be frowned on, in the main by the djs who have the genuine article, and you cant really blame them for that.

to the punter, on the other hand, its neither here nor there so long as they hear and can dance to the tune.

in as much, i suggest, its how your conscience wrestles with that fact...im djing at: brighouse fri 15th oct and after that at the tower, kings hall, and for neil at grt wyrley on new years eve....its in the box...i could play it, there's precisely no reason not to as you say, otherwise, why have it?....but would i or anyone else play it blatently in front of, lets say, mick.h?,does a person risk being labelled a cheapskate for the ambition of djing?.

i also have, BUT ON A CARVER, AND AS FAR AS I KNOW, ITS THE ONLY ONE, a copy of sandi golden's - you are my everything, a truely great record. in reality its a vinyl rareity of rocking horse proportions. to my knowledge, only butch and richard have copies and as the story went, richard had an unfortunate accident with his copy. now, although this is NOT an acetate, it still presents a quandry to me...i ought to play it because it deserves to be played, it really is a brill tune, but at the same time i dont wont to offend or have a bad reputation tagged on me.

you can, at your discretion, label this issue as being about elitism, something that has permeated the scene since stafford and the quest to hear different tunes, but even that has its limilations based on the simple fact that not enough vinyl and too many djs equates to having the next best thing....an acetate.

anyway, GAWD BLESS YA, GUV!

[Agentsmith]

You wanna sell it Rob

aye up lad,

on the spot question....obviously, if i hadnt have mentioned this, i would never have been asked, funny thing is, when i played it at prestwich no-one batted an eyelid and i didnt get asked to sell it then. i think for now, i'll pass on your offer, but thanks anyway.....just to refresh the memory, hasnt it been posted up here before, exactly HOW MANY copies are in circulation?. there REALLY cant be that many as, it could concieveably have been booted by now...AND as its only in the hands of djs ( yes?), how many close friends have had "favours" done?, in other words, had an acetate cut for them ( and certainly not a carver). is it the case that des has a genuine acetate and i just have....an acetate but after that....nothing?.

[Guest Brian Ellis]

aye up lad,

on the spot question....obviously, if i hadnt have mentioned this, i would never have been asked, funny thing is, when i played it at prestwich no-one batted an eyelid and i didnt get asked to sell it then. i think for now, i'll pass on your offer, but thanks anyway.....just to refresh the memory, hasnt it been posted up here before, exactly HOW MANY copies are in circulation?. there REALLY cant be that many as, it could concieveably have been booted by now...AND as its only in the hands of djs ( yes?), how many close friends have had "favours" done?, in other words, had an acetate cut for them ( and certainly not a carver). is it the case that des has a genuine acetate and i just have....an acetate but after that....nothing?.

Could someone explain the difference between:

1. "not an original acetate"

2. "had an acetate cut for them"

3. "a carver"

Edited October 2, 2010 by Brian Ellis

[Dave Abbott]

Could someone explain the difference between:

1. "not an original acetate"

2. "had an acetate cut for them"

3. "a carver"

i would say the only difference is format i.e. carvers now can be made onto vinyl as well as metal acetates...other than they're not original - unless cut from a master tape or CD only release of course

[Guest Brian Ellis]

i would say the only difference is format i.e. carvers now can be made onto vinyl as well as metal acetates...other than they're not original - unless cut from a master tape or CD only release of course

Thanks for clearing that one up Dave. For a moment I was starting to think that somehow these were something other than a bootleg.

[Agentsmith]

Could someone explain the difference between:

1. "not an original acetate"

2. "had an acetate cut for them"

3. "a carver"

brian,

an original acetate is the one that was used by artists/publishing companies to sell the product to interested parties.

having an acetate cut from an original vinyl record was probably more popular in the 70's when the appearance of emi-discs was common. djs who did not have the record at the time, but wanted the tune badly could, for a sum at the owners descretion, get an "emi" prior to any bootlegging.

carver is a reference to vinyl carvers, as opposed to acetates, tunes are cut on thick, chunky vinyl and have infinitestimal wear, unlike acetates, a bit like bootlegging....but not!, its personal preference you see:rolleyes:

[Tony Smith]

i also have, BUT ON A CARVER, AND AS FAR AS I KNOW, ITS THE ONLY ONE, a copy of sandi golden's - you are my everything, a truely great record. in reality its a vinyl rareity of rocking horse proportions. to my knowledge, only butch and richard have copies and as the story went, richard had an unfortunate accident with his copy. now, although this is NOT an acetate, it still presents a quandry to me...i ought to play it because it deserves to be played, it really is a brill tune, but at the same time i dont wont to offend or have a bad reputation tagged on me.

Kitch also has Sandi Golden, I have both sides on tape good enough to cut from, done just before Rob Marriott sold it to Richard, but I don't like the idea of playing a carver unless it's something unissued.

Edited October 2, 2010 by Tony Smith

[Jumpinjoan]

brian,

an original acetate is the one that was used by artists/publishing companies to sell the product to interested parties.

having an acetate cut from an original vinyl record was probably more popular in the 70's when the appearance of emi-discs was common. djs who did not have the record at the time, but wanted the tune badly could, for a sum at the owners descretion, get an "emi" prior to any bootlegging.

carver is a reference to vinyl carvers, as opposed to acetates, tunes are cut on thick, chunky vinyl and have infinitestimal wear, unlike acetates, a bit like bootlegging....but not!, its personal preference you see:rolleyes:

What do you consider your acetate of Mello Souls to be?

With Ernestine Eady on the other side I would say it is as far from an original acetate as you can get.

[Jumpinjoan]

these items, whilst not really considered to be bootlegs, i suppose can be frowned on, in the main by the djs who have the genuine article, and you cant really blame them for that.

to the punter, on the other hand, its neither here nor there so long as they hear and can dance to the tune.

It would bother me and I am just a punter!

i also have, BUT ON A CARVER, AND AS FAR AS I KNOW, ITS THE ONLY ONE, a copy of sandi golden's - you are my everything, a truely great record. in reality its a vinyl rareity of rocking horse proportions. to my knowledge, only butch and richard have copies and as the story went, richard had an unfortunate accident with his copy. now, although this is NOT an acetate, it still presents a quandry to me...i ought to play it because it deserves to be played, it really is a brill tune, but at the same time i dont wont to offend or have a bad reputation tagged on me.

You would be bang out of order for playing it! Not sure if that would bother you though.

Kitch also has a copy.

[Shsdave]

hi dave,

i would bet the sound quality is similar to des's copy, though NOT an original one as is suggested about des's, nevertheless it IS a proper acetate and i didnt ask where it came from. it has earnestine eady - lets think it over, on the other side. i'll be honest, i did play it a couple of times at prestwich but early doors ( 9-10pm).

demo's are original vinyl records, in some cases, rarer than original issues and in others, not....either way the owner of the legitimate vinyl issue or demo is entitled to play to play it...but that goes without saying really. where acetates are concerned, there are genuine studio ones....and in a lot of cases they are the source of recorded material that has never been issued. then, as in the 70's and onwards, there are acetates that are cut due to demand because, a person simply couldnt afford the vinyl original because of its rareity.

these items, whilst not really considered to be bootlegs, i suppose can be frowned on, in the main by the djs who have the genuine article, and you cant really blame them for that.

to the punter, on the other hand, its neither here nor there so long as they hear and can dance to the tune.

in as much, i suggest, its how your conscience wrestles with that fact...im djing at: brighouse fri 15th oct and after that at the tower, kings hall, and for neil at grt wyrley on new years eve....its in the box...i could play it, there's precisely no reason not to as you say, otherwise, why have it?....but would i or anyone else play it blatently in front of, lets say, mick.h?,does a person risk being labelled a cheapskate for the ambition of djing?.

i also have, BUT ON A CARVER, AND AS FAR AS I KNOW, ITS THE ONLY ONE, a copy of sandi golden's - you are my everything, a truely great record. in reality its a vinyl rareity of rocking horse proportions. to my knowledge, only butch and richard have copies and as the story went, richard had an unfortunate accident with his copy. now, although this is NOT an acetate, it still presents a quandry to me...i ought to play it because it deserves to be played, it really is a brill tune, but at the same time i dont wont to offend or have a bad reputation tagged on me.

you can, at your discretion, label this issue as being about elitism, something that has permeated the scene since stafford and the quest to hear different tunes, but even that has its limilations based on the simple fact that not enough vinyl and too many djs equates to having the next best thing....an acetate.

anyway, GAWD BLESS YA, GUV!

Hi Rob yes I only mentioned the demo thing as I couldn't understand your reluctance to play your acetate. I only suggested that there was nothing wrong in playing a STUDIO acetate. Lets be honest mate yours is just an emidisc, no different to a boot or carver etc no matter who or where it's come from & I certainly did not say OK you've got a copy you might as well play it but as you say "it's how your conscience wrestles with it", to me if you ain't got the original you don't play it but thats been gone over again & again on here.

Does a person risk being labelled a cheapskate for the ambition of DJing you ask? Only by idiots, not everybody can have the "top" records as played by Butch for instance but then why would you want to ? Far better in my eyes to dig up some forgotten oldie or semi known that nobody else is playing. Thats the problem with the cheque book DJs, instead of using a bit of initiative & developing a choice of their own they constantly buy up other DJs playlists because they can afford to & because it's easy.

You suggest that punters don't care what format a track is on, i would suggest that a large amount do care & it's the expensive oldies that they don't care about & would prefer to hear cheaper & fresher tracks than the bloody obvious things I see on so many play lists. Anyway (as usual) I'm straying from the original post so i'll shut me gob & go look at the footie half times.

Bout time you got back down to Solid Hit mate

All best

Dave

[Agentsmith]

What do you consider your acetate of Mello Souls to be?

With Ernestine Eady on the other side I would say it is as far from an original acetate as you can get.

no arguement there joan, like i said its just an acetate, not an original promotional one like des's, but unusual just the same. as for sandi golden the story is that this recording came direct from a studio tape of a show that richard was on ( not necessarily richard's show) amazingly it wasnt talked over so, its a perfect cut AND it was done before the genuine record got scuffed on the intro....or something like that. ive stuck to my guns from the point of view of not playing them, i bought them because they were there and like many, i like them both. the FOR & AGAINST lobby is omni-present on ss, no matter what the subject, but thats democracy for you, nothing wrong with freedom of speech. our breed has refined itself over the decades and things that werent paid attention to in the 70's are now held in disdain under the banner of political correctness so, everyone manjack who played acetates back in the day, wouldnt be given a minutes solace now...as bad as bootlegging you'd say. but, they're not bootlegs, on the sole point that they're individually manufactured, in most cases to people's personal preferences. if they're unissued cuts from cd's, i dont see anything wrong with that as i wouldnt be the only person doing that right now, otherwise HOW are the tracks going to get played and recognised. bootlegging constitutes not touching them with a bargepole and i wouldnt dream of playing bootlegs. there is a middle ground though, where a certain single can be so obscurely rare and heard so few times but nevertheless, appreciated by many who happen to be in earshot, that to get it heard in more places it should necessitate some acetates in the hands of more influential djs....thats something that happened years ago as well. on the back of that the much loved track would get, hopefully, an overdue release on legitimate vinyl through a major out let...such as kent. we rage against each other from time to time about exclusivity, its good and at the same time its bad. do we all go to our graves smuggly satisfied that we with-held a treasure to our dying breath or do we wring our hands and grieve that we never got to own a track?.

have we overcooked the rule book? like they say about football....its only a game,...what about music?....what are we on this scene for, if not the music?. alright ive got these items....play them or not, i'll offend someone...in life offending is an everyday occurance...but we get over it.

at this moment in time im not playing anything ANYWHERE.....bookings please anyone? guarenteed 100% records...no cds:lol:

[funkyfeet]

brian,

an original acetate is the one that was used by artists/publishing companies to sell the product to interested parties.

having an acetate cut from an original vinyl record was probably more popular in the 70's when the appearance of emi-discs was common. djs who did not have the record at the time, but wanted the tune badly could, for a sum at the owners descretion, get an "emi" prior to any bootlegging.

carver is a reference to vinyl carvers, as opposed to acetates, tunes are cut on thick, chunky vinyl and have infinitestimal wear, unlike acetates, a bit like bootlegging....but not!, its personal preference you see:rolleyes:

I think Brian, knows the difference, there's no difference between a non-original acetate (70's emi disc), a vinyl craver, or a boot. Playing out is another debate.

Edited October 2, 2010 by funkyfeet

[Guest gordon russell]

hi dave,

i would bet the sound quality is similar to des's copy, though NOT an original one as is suggested about des's, nevertheless it IS a proper acetate and i didnt ask where it came from. it has earnestine eady - lets think it over, on the other side. i'll be honest, i did play it a couple of times at prestwich but early doors ( 9-10pm).

demo's are original vinyl records, in some cases, rarer than original issues and in others, not....either way the owner of the legitimate vinyl issue or demo is entitled to play to play it...but that goes without saying really. where acetates are concerned, there are genuine studio ones....and in a lot of cases they are the source of recorded material that has never been issued. then, as in the 70's and onwards, there are acetates that are cut due to demand because, a person simply couldnt afford the vinyl original because of its rareity.

these items, whilst not really considered to be bootlegs, i suppose can be frowned on, in the main by the djs who have the genuine article, and you cant really blame them for that.

to the punter, on the other hand, its neither here nor there so long as they hear and can dance to the tune.

in as much, i suggest, its how your conscience wrestles with that fact...im djing at: brighouse fri 15th oct and after that at the tower, kings hall, and for neil at grt wyrley on new years eve....its in the box...i could play it, there's precisely no reason not to as you say, otherwise, why have it?....but would i or anyone else play it blatently in front of, lets say, mick.h?,does a person risk being labelled a cheapskate for the ambition of djing?.

i also have, BUT ON A CARVER, AND AS FAR AS I KNOW, ITS THE ONLY ONE, a copy of sandi golden's - you are my everything, a truely great record. in reality its a vinyl rareity of rocking horse proportions. to my knowledge, only butch and richard have copies and as the story went, richard had an unfortunate accident with his copy. now, although this is NOT an acetate, it still presents a quandry to me...i ought to play it because it deserves to be played, it really is a brill tune, but at the same time i dont wont to offend or have a bad reputation tagged on me.

you can, at your discretion, label this issue as being about elitism, something that has permeated the scene since stafford and the quest to hear different tunes, but even that has its limilations based on the simple fact that not enough vinyl and too many djs equates to having the next best thing....an acetate.

anyway, GAWD BLESS YA, GUV!

Alan Kitchener also has a copy of this:thumbsup:

[Guest gordon russell]

sorry folks really must keep up........just read the rest of the thread;) ...........non original acetates of any record must never be played........it don,t do a dj any favours to do this.........besides why would you want to?.....amongst other things whilst l might tell ya it,s out of order..........think of all those folk smiling to your face.......and then cussing ya behind your back.................luckily that never happens at the moment.........BUT IT MIGHT START... :lol:

[Anoraks Corner]

i would bet the sound quality is similar to des's copy, though NOT an original one as is suggested about des's,

I've lost the plot a bit...is it 'suggested' that the one Des has is, or is not, an original vintage studio acetate/cut?

[KevH]

I've lost the plot a bit...is it 'suggested' that the one Des has is, or is not, an original vintage studio acetate/cut?

Dave.Don't worry mate. ,about the Mello Souls posts.Its the Sandi Golden "taped from a radio show" that interests me.

Must have a go at that myself.

When is a door not a door?.

[Tricky]

tomayto - tomarto

emi disc (not a real acetate) - bootleg carver,

[Shsdave]

I've lost the plot a bit...is it 'suggested' that the one Des has is, or is not, an original vintage studio acetate/cut?

lol How you doing Mr Flynn ?

Des most definately HAS an original vintage studio acetate, any suggestion otherwise is a scurrilous lie & the perpetrator deserves to be whipped with a wigan casino beer towel.........preferably an original vintage towel

Edited October 2, 2010 by SHSDave

[tim smithers]

Think this was played by a well known dj prior to my spot at the Brighton beach allnighter in Hove, not buy any of the names mentioned so far:no:

[Chalky]

no arguement there joan, like i said its just an acetate, not an original promotional one like des's, but unusual just the same. as for sandi golden the story is that this recording came direct from a studio tape of a show that richard was on ( not necessarily richard's show) amazingly it wasnt talked over so, its a perfect cut AND it was done before the genuine record got scuffed on the intro....or something like that. ive stuck to my guns from the point of view of not playing them, i bought them because they were there and like many, i like them both. the FOR & AGAINST lobby is omni-present on ss, no matter what the subject, but thats democracy for you, nothing wrong with freedom of speech. our breed has refined itself over the decades and things that werent paid attention to in the 70's are now held in disdain under the banner of political correctness so, everyone manjack who played acetates back in the day, wouldnt be given a minutes solace now...as bad as bootlegging you'd say. but, they're not bootlegs, on the sole point that they're individually manufactured, in most cases to people's personal preferences. if they're unissued cuts from cd's, i dont see anything wrong with that as i wouldnt be the only person doing that right now, otherwise HOW are the tracks going to get played and recognised. bootlegging constitutes not touching them with a bargepole and i wouldnt dream of playing bootlegs. there is a middle ground though, where a certain single can be so obscurely rare and heard so few times but nevertheless, appreciated by many who happen to be in earshot, that to get it heard in more places it should necessitate some acetates in the hands of more influential djs....thats something that happened years ago as well. on the back of that the much loved track would get, hopefully, an overdue release on legitimate vinyl through a major out let...such as kent. we rage against each other from time to time about exclusivity, its good and at the same time its bad. do we all go to our graves smuggly satisfied that we with-held a treasure to our dying breath or do we wring our hands and grieve that we never got to own a track?.

have we overcooked the rule book? like they say about football....its only a game,...what about music?....what are we on this scene for, if not the music?. alright ive got these items....play them or not, i'll offend someone...in life offending is an everyday occurance...but we get over it.

at this moment in time im not playing anything ANYWHERE.....bookings please anyone? guarenteed 100% records...no cds:lol:

you can get an acetate done at numerous places, it is no different to a carver, if for your own listening pleasure fine, if sold or played out it is no different to a bootleg. If it is of an unisuued or cut from unissued master tape, again no problems with those. Don't know how you can suggest what you have is any different to a cut/carver or whatever you want to call them. People have been cutting acetates for years and years, carvers are simply more modern method.

You can or could still buy original Virtue blanks and get stuff cut to them.

There are loads of acetates and carvers of Sandi Golden, my mate had Robs copy for a while before it went to Richard S and cut and acetate. Rob no doubt did at least one.

Mello Souls is btw a Virtue recording, it says so in the run out.

[Dave Thorley]

christ allmighty.....40 posts to come to a conclusion that should of lasted 5 posts at best. no wonder people are dropping from this site like flies . sometimes it does your head in

dave

Agree totally, who cares. Please post up something about a record that most of us don't know, so we all learn something coming on this site, information about artists, labels, venues, records. But is there now 2, 3 , 10, 30 copies in circulation, please!!!

Yes I'm having a bad day, ready for all comers

[Johnmcc]

Agree totally, who cares. Please post up something about a record that most of us don't know, so we all learn something coming on this site, information about artists, labels, venues, records. But is there now 2, 3 , 10, 30 copies in circulation, please!!!

Yes I'm having a bad day, ready for all comers

Sind Sie nach Hamburg nicht gefahren?

[Dave Thorley]

Sind Sie nach Hamburg nicht gefahren?

No, as you can see I'm still not feeling that great and pretty grumpy:D

[Agentsmith]

dave,

No, as you can see I'm still not feeling that great and pretty grumpy:D

dave,

come and get yourself to stoke tonight and see your old mate adey in the side room, might relieve the pressure!

[Anoraks Corner]

Des most definately HAS an original vintage studio acetate,

With a Dick Charles label on it?!

The Mello Souls tracks were recorded and mastered at Virtue in Phillie.

The Dick Charles studios were in NYC and for recording tracks in...they weren't a re-mastering service.

Paging Mr.Parker.

[Guest Bearsy]

Agree totally, who cares. Please post up something about a record that most of us don't know, so we all learn something coming on this site, information about artists, labels, venues, records. But is there now 2, 3 , 10, 30 copies in circulation, please!!!

Yes I'm having a bad day, ready for all comers

I do and thats why i started this thread but im sorry i didnt know the rules im learning with threads like this cos unlike many i dont know it all and if my inferior knowledge upsets you that much just avoid my threads in future

atb

Bearsy

[Dave Thorley]

I do and thats why i started this thread but im sorry i didnt know the rules im learning with threads like this cos unlike many i dont know it all and if my inferior knowledge upsets you that much just avoid my threads in future

atb

Bearsy

Don't come the 'inferior knowledge' thing. You know more than most. So why not share more of the good stuff you do know.

[Shsdave]

With a Dick Charles label on it?!

The Mello Souls tracks were recorded and mastered at Virtue in Phillie.

The Dick Charles studios were in NYC and for recording tracks in...they weren't a re-mastering service.

Paging Mr.Parker.

Err I didn't say that it had a Dick Charles label, Gene said he thought it was a Dick Charles acetate, I didn't correct him as I'm not 100% certain but pretty sure Des told me it was a Virtue acetate.

I'm sure when Des is back from Philly he'll let us know

[Guest Brian Ellis]

I think Brian, knows the difference, there's no difference between a non-original acetate (70's emi disc), a vinyl craver, or a boot. Playing out is another debate.

I certainly do Mark; you know me pretty well !!

[Andy Rix]

I've spoken about the Mello Souls before ... Chalky is the one with the sense to keep track of threads going back over the years so if required he can post anyting of interest

The track was mastered at Virtue ... the publishing was Mary Hill Music .. named after the wife of Frank Virtue.

Mary died a few years ago in a bizarre accident when clearing snow from her front porch after heavy snow fall .. the porch collapsed and she was crushed.

Anyway..... . I would think any acetate, given what I know, could only be a Virtue one given they were done at the mastering / recording stage

The flip side is called 'i've got my pride'

Silas Phifer has been dead for a few years now. The co-writer George Wilson is nowhere to be found. He did compose some tracks published by Jamie/Guyden but they have had no contact for years

Will anybody ever find the remaining stock ... I don't think so .. enough have tried to locate those involved and have all fallen short

Unless there is divine intervention it will remain one of the rarest of the rare

Andy

[Chalky]

Not much to add to that Andy.

Steve Green met Silus in a nursing home if I remember rightly.

They did at least one other 45 on Candi. One side is Silus Phifer and the Mellow Fellows and other is Edwin Johnson and the Mellow Fellows. I put it in refosoul but getting error message at the minute, if can't sort will repost them.

[Andy Rix]

Thanks Chalky .... James Chavis, who owned Chavis & Candi Records, was based in Wilmingtom

Silas Phifer did record for him as lead on the Mellow Fellows, the embryonic Mello Souls, on Candi

James last saw Silas in the late 70's, as Chalky has said Silas ended up in a nursing home, and has since died.

When I last spoke to Mr Chavis Jnr he said his dad, James, was also in a home and despite being 92 still had his memory fully intact

On the occasions I spoke to James he was not interested enough to go into any great detail about his time in the music industry. Not exactly rude but you had to prepare yourself to call him back

Marc Gordon was just the same

As I recall the Empires (Candi), Mellow Fellows (Candi) & Matadors (Chavis) had strong family links, brothers/cousins etc, and group members would move from one to another as required

Andy

[boba]

Thanks Chalky .... James Chavis, who owned Chavis & Candi Records, was based in Wilmingtom

Silas Phifer did record for him as lead on the Mellow Fellows, the embryonic Mello Souls, on Candi

James last saw Silas in the late 70's, as Chalky has said Silas ended up in a nursing home, and has since died.

When I last spoke to Mr Chavis Jnr he said his dad, James, was also in a home and despite being 92 still had his memory fully intact

On the occasions I spoke to James he was not interested enough to go into any great detail about his time in the music industry. Not exactly rude but you had to prepare yourself to call him back

Marc Gordon was just the same

As I recall the Empires (Candi), Mellow Fellows (Candi) & Matadors (Chavis) had strong family links, brothers/cousins etc, and group members would move from one to another as required

Andy

there is an article about the empires in the june issue of Echoes of the Past (doowop magazine). Someone forwarded me a copy of the article. It goes into detail about the group and says the recording lineup was Ronald Thomas, David Thomas, Carlton Banks, Robert Harold, Henry Singleton, Forrest Elliot, and George Evans. I don't know if some were band members and some were singers or what. But the article doesn't mention any connection to the Matadors or Mellow Fellows.

[cenco]

hi bob as far as i know Silas had nothing to do with empires but he was cousin to guys who were in the matadors by the name of leatherbury i spoke to there mum and one of the brothers recorded in a group called the ambassadors but years before, doo wop group i think, the other brother who wrote the matadors 45 on chavis was killed in vietnam. When silas was put into the nursing home the leatherburys sister cleared his home and the whole contents of the house was skipped .....

Edited October 3, 2010 by cenco

[Sebastian]

Just found a photo of the Mello Souls 45 on an italian web site:

https://soulconnection.too.it/

https://digilander.li...kenny/kenny.htm

Edited October 3, 2010 by Sebastian

[macca]

When is a door not a door?.

When it's a hatch!

I suppose bootlegs are pressed up purely for financial gain whereas an emidisc/carver of material that never saw an official release on vinyl. i.e. lifted from CDs for use at a venue and not intended to be sold on are kosher, especially if one is loathed to use a CD. Or am I wrong?

[Simsy]

Just found a photo of the Mello Souls 45 on an italian web site:

Nice one mate.

[Md Records]

Just reading this from my Philly hotel, and as I've I always said, I have no idea about the "Acetate" I bought. I got it about 8 Years or so ago, whilst with a mate out in Philadelphia, form a small time dealer along with a load of other Acetates, and peculiarly enough some oddball early Motown stuff. I paid about 200 U.S. for it, it's one sided, with no credits and does indeed have a "Dick Charles" label. The thing is disintegrating fast, so I'm careful with it now - maybe I was duped, but I showed to Rob Thomas, who gave it the scratch & sniff test & he was convinced, but if anyone wants a look, you're more than welcome. There's no providence with it so .......who knows. I'm not gonna try and sell it, so it remains an odd, but rather nice curio in my collection. Next time you're over Mr. Flynn, I'd love you to have a look & tell me what you think?? Anyhow I've got records to look at.

Des

[Md Records]

Ironically enough I've been listening to an unreleased track from the "Chavis/Candi" stable of records by the "In Souls" which is a fantastic cover of the Detroit "I've Got The feeling" track - work that one out!!

Des

[Anoraks Corner]

Anyhow I've got records to look at.

Priority #1...good luck digging, Des and maybe see you over Chrimbo/New Years.

[Guest Bearsy]

Don't come the 'inferior knowledge' thing. You know more than most. So why not share more of the good stuff you do know.

Dave ive been in the scene no more than 5 years and ok im learning a lot but trust me i dont know naff all compared to most and a record such as this is of interest to me and i didnt know much about although after this thread i do now, its one big learning curve for me so sorry if my not so great knowledge has offended the more knowledgable

atb

Bearsy

[Guest Bearsy]

brilliant thread for me so far thanks everyone great info and pics

[Shsdave]

brilliant thread for me so far thanks everyone great info and pics

& thats all that matters Bearsy

[Dave Thorley]

Dave ive been in the scene no more than 5 years and ok im learning a lot but trust me i dont know naff all compared to most and a record such as this is of interest to me and i didnt know much about although after this thread i do now, its one big learning curve for me so sorry if my not so great knowledge has offended the more knowledgable

atb

Bearsy

Hi

I agree the last few post have also provided me with info I didn't know, so sorry about the shit I gave you

Dave

[Guest Bearsy]

Hi

I agree the last few post have also provided me with info I didn't know, so sorry about the shit I gave you

Dave

No worries Dave