The Most Miserable Record Dealer

[George G]

I always got on well with DJ Beans - he even let me go through the back room and buy multiple copies of titles for cheap. One of my better scores came at the expense of a Northern Soul guy from the UK - I showed up one morning and in the reject box was a rare garage 45 - he told me that someone from the UK passed on it the night before - bought for $10 or about 5% of what it was worth.

 

Don Parker - been a long time since I bought from him, what a pain in the ass he was. He may have blocked me from bidding on his ebay auctions just for spite. Used to make tapes of stuff for preferred customers i.e. people who he could get to compete against each other.

 

Ha, great thread. I think I missed this the first time around. No names to add but some comments on a few already mentioned:

 

4. DJ Beans at the now-defunct D&J Records in Carnegie, Pennsylvania. No problems except the one time he made the mistake of yelling at my (tough, record-collecting) girlfriend for some silly reason and she nearly came to blows with him.

 

Oh, haven't seen this name mentioned: DON PARKER. Used to buy from him over the phone all the time 15-20 years or so ago, but then he started getting rude and cocky and I stopped dealing with him. When I saw him at Allentown a few years later he said "WOW! You've lost a lot of hair and packed on some pounds!"

[George G]

This is (was?) Garnicks...it is an old store but I have no idea how long in business, probably since the 1930s. I lived in Lowell during the late 1980s. Occasionally they would put out stacks of 45s for sale and I got some good records, especially local 45s like Little John and the Sherwoods. I tried the list on them and surprisingly they took the time and had a couple things. There were two really good places to buy records around the corner, Record Lane, a store in business since the 1950s and that kept most of the unsold stock, and Harvey's Bookland that had 1000s of 45s including the complete library of a local radio station.

 

Back in the mid 90's, went to Lowell, Massachusetts. Went into a TV store and the guy said it was the oldest record store in the USA. Possibly true as Lowell had the first cotton mills in the country. Owner and sidekicks were out of Deliverance, weird but oddly effeminate. Said I could not look at the stock as I did not have a list. Now lost track of the times access has been refused on the grounds of 'no list'...
 

[Frankie Crocker]

Spot on George. Wished I'd known about the other places besides Garnick's. Do the meter maids still ticket your car before the meter runs out?

[Lenny Harkins]

Spot on Mate ....yes Rosin gets my vote.....he is by far the rudest I have met in the States.......

 

First year I visits his shop...the conversation is basically built around how brilliant he was and how shite I was....how much he knew and how little I knew....how many W**kers there were on the UK wanting his records...etc , anyway he had an Acetate I wanted which cost me the best part of a $1000.....I listened to his shite, paid my money, got my record....and got out, felling like my balls had just been parted!....seething I vowed I'd never be back.

The next year I went back (thinking maybe it was me , nobody was that rude)....I walked in the door of the shop....he was on the phone,  looking up at me he said to whoever,,"here comes another one.....and he doesn't look like the kind of guy to pay a 1000 bucks for a record, "......(what do they look like exactly ?)

He's on the phone for ages and by this time I've pulled out a knackered looking Meridians and a knacked copy of  Anne Byres - Happy, and took them to the counter.....he still never looked up, squinted at the discs and then spouted down the phone to whoever...." and if he thinks he's leaving here that Anne Byres on the cheap he got another thing coming!"........balls kicked second year on the bounce!

I'd had enough of him at that point and his overpriced shagged out records......and left forever.

Edited August 7, 2013 by Lenny Harkins

[Jim Ohara]

Great Stories, but cant seem to see any mention of Butch,  he can be both miserable and rude..

Must disagree with you there

IMO, Butch is 100% gent

Known him for years and have never had any trouble dealing with him at all

Has a good dry sense of humour and has always been a pleasure to either deal with or just chat with

The problem is, when you have the reputation he has and get loads of twats hanging around him and asking him for loads of records, he probably gets pissed off - so would I !!!

[Lenny Harkins]

Must disagree with you there

IMO, Butch is 100% gent

Known him for years and have never had any trouble dealing with him at all

Has a good dry sense of humour and has always been a pleasure to either deal with or just chat with

The problem is, when you have the reputation he has and get loads of twats hanging around him and asking him for loads of records, he probably gets pissed off - so would I !!!

"The problem is, when you have the reputation he has and get loads of twats hanging around him and asking him for loads of records, he probably gets pissed off - so would I !!!"

The Nail right on the head Jimbo.

[Scal]

I have met and had dealings with many of the "illustrious" people mentioned above; Balbier, D&J, John Moore,Rosen, Butch, Domar....but they are what they are, they are businessmen; they can't be everyones best mate and interpersonal skills are not taught but acquired....you either have them or not.

[Sammy Seaman]

LETS START A NEW THREAD ,WHO IS THE BEST DEALER YOU HAVE DEALT WITH IE POLITENESS ,PRICES ,AFTER SERVICE ECT

[Upthejunction]

If you're talking about the US...

Bob "the count" Ellis wins

Nods to Rich Rosen and Les Harris

Funny, I bought one record from Richard Domar and it went fine. Maybe I got the 'first purchase' VIP treatment and it's downhill from there.

Agree with that selection,  The Count is a most irritating character and very demanding  :-(   !!!

 

His grading was pretty shabby too, and used to demand positive feedback ,  would never use him again   !!!

Edited August 7, 2013 by upthejunction

[Geordiejohnson]

anyway- henry atkinson is very grumpy-or is it me+

 

Ive never had a bad dealing with henry..in fact i go to him before i go elsewhere hes always been top..

 

Best laugh with a dealer ...I knew john powney of castle records from old ..I moved away from the north east

then one day about 15 years later phoned him up after getting a list (how i got the list or how it ended up at my address I dont know to this day) and said Hi John do you remember me blah blah..he was quiet for a moment and then said "oh yeh from the compass club whitley bay... now that i remember you ..phone me back im going for a shit"!!!!!...

 

This thread though has showed one thing, it seems the dealers in the USA are wise to the brits, many of who have legally trounced them of their wares and are now very protective, they are price savvy and it seems bargains are few and far between from them, I cant blame them for being a bit miffed that they were a bit wet behind the ears

Edited August 8, 2013 by geordiejohnson

[Frankie Crocker]

Agreed Geordie. The shrewder US dealers have now caught up with play, but others, perhaps the miserable ones, have been left with stores of unwanted records that no one wants. On a trip to Detroit about 10 years ago, I phoned Cappy and he said don't bother coming as he had no records: a few days later, I was driving by Cappy's so decided to knock on the door - he peeped through the curtains but he would not open the door so we had a conversation through the closed door with him asking if I was willing to buy the whole store. It must have dawned on him that all the best records had been cherry picked and he wanted out of the business but was trapped with unsellable inventory.

Bob May in Detroit was a real character, only ever sat down behind the counter, hard to engage in conversation but if you hung around long enough he would take something out from under the counter and say 'here's something you might be interested in' (Jack Montgomery on Barracuda) or 'some feller never collected this last week' (Connie Questell on Decca). A visit to Bob's store was always worth the effort and though he was a man of few words, he could deliver the goods.

Part of the 'essence' of collecting records has been relating to the dealers and working around their idiosyncrasies, coming away with the records at prices that are mutually acceptable.

[Steve G]

Spot on Mate ....yes Rosin gets my vote.....he is by far the rudest I have met in the States.......

 

First year I visits his shop...the conversation is basically built around how brilliant he was and how shite I was....how much he knew and how little I knew....how many W**kers there were on the UK wanting his records...etc , anyway he had an Acetate I wanted which cost me the best part of a $1000.....I listened to his shite, paid my money, got my record....and got out, felling like my balls had just been parted!....seething I vowed I'd never be back.

The next year I went back (thinking maybe it was me , nobody was that rude)....I walked in the door of the shop....he was on the phone,  looking up at me he said to whoever,,"here comes another one.....and he doesn't look like the kind of guy to pay a 1000 bucks for a record, "......(what do they look like exactly ?)

He's on the phone for ages and by this time I've pulled out a knackered looking Meridians and a knacked copy of  Anne Byres - Happy, and took them to the counter.....he still never looked up, squinted at the discs and then spouted down the phone to whoever...." and if he thinks he's leaving here that Anne Byres on the cheap he got another thing coming!"........balls kicked second year on the bounce!

I'd had enough of him at that point and his overpriced shagged out records......and left forever.

 

Strewth he wasn't that bad with me.....but I did get an "endorsement" as being "OK"  Problem was his store although full, wasn't exactly the treasure trove that he thought it was. I think I got massive credit too for turning down "Would you like a copy of Frederick Hymes III?" (from his supply under the counter).  Best thing I got out of there was a "Perfect love" (Diplomats) acetate for $300, and a few nice about right priced sweet soul bits. But there was also an awful lot of what I'd call "WALOP" (Worth a lot on paper) that no one will ever buy, and some dodgy re-presses too. The best thing he did was tell me about a group appearing at an off-strip Hotel that i would have never of otherwise known about, turns out one of them was in the Natural 4!  

[Mal C]

I have met and had dealings with many of the "illustrious" people mentioned above; Balbier, D&J, John Moore,Rosen, Butch, Domar....but they are what they are, they are businessmen; they can't be everyones best mate and interpersonal skills are not taught but acquired....you either have them or not.

 of course, but this thread is our shared experiences with them, and its pretty hilarious...

 

M

[Kev Cane]

Talking of Richard Domar, a trip in the early nineties that I wasn,t on, my mate Gaz Simon, Pete and Mick were somewhere in Philly, Gaz had designated everyone an area to cover with a fine tooth pick so to speak, "no stone unturned" we used to say, Richard Domar walked in and started looking himself, obviously, conversation started, niceties etc, all he was talking about was getting out of there and going to see the latest Ninja Turtles film that was showing to the extent of being unbearable, apparently he was quite condescending and had no crack, anyway, after a couple of hours Domar pulled a record out and started chuckling to himself, "oh look, Metros-Since I found my baby on an issue" he gloated, "foynd of the daay" he kept repeating as he went to pay for his finds, steam coming out of Gaz,s ears by now, even after paying and on his way out "foynd of the daay" he gloated. As soon as the door shut Gaz went ballistic with the other 2 "how the f--k did you 2 useless b------s miss that" he ranted as a full blown out shouting inquest was held. Sounds like an annoying fella, and Richard Domar

 

Kev

Edited August 8, 2013 by kev cane

[Scal]

I do have a load of stories that are amusing...however they would have to be cleared with the people/person who I was with before I could relate them.

In essence we are all odd balls and consumed by jealousy.

I never thought I would talk like my Dad!

[Swifty]

Used to get lists of Richard Domar , never bought owt though as I never had any dosh but used to love reading through his Rules & Regulations !

 

He must have had a lot of stock , so where did it go ?

 

[Kev Cane]

Used to get lists of Richard Domar , never bought owt though as I never had any dosh but used to love reading through his Rules & Regulations !

 

He must have had a lot of stock , so where did it go ?

 

To be honest Swifty, I did ok off his lists Cliff Nobles-My Love-J-V £2  Brothers of Soul-Come on back-Boo £2, there was more, just can,t remember

 

Kev

[Ian Dewhirst]

Richard Domar was fine with me. I think I got a few things off him. Mind you, I didn't dick around shooting the breeze with him. I told him what I wanted and he came up with a few over the years I seem to recall.

 

But record dealers by the nature of the business probably need to be a bit hard-bitten. They've seen everything a zillion times, so it's probably a natural by-product of the business for them to be more cynical then the rest of us. Get most of 'em in a none business situation and they're generally nice as pie - Val Shively being a prime example.

 

The only example of pure hatred I ever got was from some guy in Texas - it could be one of the people mentioned earlier. Les Harris springs to mind. I remember walking into his shop and I started looking through the cheap boxes when he asked me what I was looking for. I just said, "anything that I like the look of that I don't know".

 

The second he heard my accent, he went into an incredible rant about how we British come over and rape their heritage etc, etc. I could tell he was probably capable of continuing indefinitely, so I just said, 'hey. No problem. I'll leave" and I left. There was no point in even continuing. He was an extreme example though. In the 70's and 80's I seemed to get on OK with most US dealers. Terry Geston from Terre Haute was pretty paranoid but once I got past his shotgun welcome he was fine. 

 

Ian D 

[Guest JohnnyHitman]

If you're talking about the US...

Bob "the count" Ellis wins

Nods to Rich Rosen and Les Harris

Funny, I bought one record from Richard Domar and it went fine. Maybe I got the 'first purchase' VIP treatment and it's downhill from there.

I bought a few records from Les Harris and was lucky. When I bought a very expensive record from him it was bulletproofed packed. Three packages in eachother like russian Matrjoschkas.

[Guest Paul]

...but once I got past his shotgun welcome he was fine. 

 

Ian D 

 

The nicest way to welcome new customers is to open the door with a loaded shotgun in your hand.

It always puts people at ease.

 

[Slim Jim]

 I asked whether I could hear it down the phone -'Can't mate, I haven't got a record player'. A truly class act.

 

 

That's brilliant 

 

I actually picked up some great tunes in his US original's packs back in the 80's , 100 records for £100 mostly all pretty decent with the odd dud thrown in from the legend that is Richard Domar .

 

His lists were amazing - about the size of a Yellow Pages it must have taken him weeks to type it up , it certainly took me weeks to read it . 

 

The Diplomats - Cards on the Table on Arock was one of the many decent tunes that slipped into his bargain basement packs though I was a little bemused when I ordered 50 different US originals for £50 and got 8 yes 8 copies of Dobie Grey -Out on the Floor .... he must have had a few spares of that one I'm guessing .

They were all stamped originals though so i gave them to my mates for Xmas presents .

Edited August 9, 2013 by Slim Jim

[Steve G]

Love Stormy Weather another £3 Domar special.....

[Tiberius]

Always a bargain to be found with Richard Domar, from his lists right up to when he closed down his website.  You just didn't know what to expect when you phoned, or emailed, after something........a lack of interpersonal skills is how I'd best describe it.  Richard could be as nice as pie, I have emails to prove it!

[Agent45]

Al at Passado Music is up at the top of my list.

 

https://www.discogs.com/sell/seller_feedback/PASSADO_MUSIC?show=Negative

 

The guy did refund my money for a scratchy record that had a pressure crack (VG+!!), but was a real ass about it.

[Tiberius]

Les Harris has been mentioned a few times.  Les is currently selling on ebay as jhatala210.  Is he miserable?  I don't know, but his customer care leaves a lot to be desired.  I've never actually met, or spoken to Les, in person, but had all sorts of problems with him over the years, mainly records not as described  eg. described M- but arriving thrashed on more than one occasion.  Another time I bought a 45 for $50 as a buy it now on ebay, Les contacted me within hours to say it was listed in error, I said fair enough.  Next thing Les has flagged me as a non paying bidder.  About 12 months later I spotted the same 45 on ebay again.....he had relisted it, this time for $100.  Mainly he will ignore emails/ebay messages, or take days to reply, and you may have to go through the complaints/claims procedure.  He puts a little slip in with the records asking for 5 star feedback & that you contact him in the event of a problem.

 

The problem I have is he seems to regularly turn up records on my "wants" list at low prices, so over time I've tended to accept the grading will most likely be off so long as the price is right.

 

The last one I bought from Les was another long time want, described as M- but arrived VG with a lot of scratches on one side. I got in touch then waited a few days before getting a short reply.  In fairness Les was fine and we agreed a partial refund.  I was happy........maybe Les was too.

 

EDIT: typo

Edited August 10, 2013 by tiberius

[Gene-R]

These days, Haggle Vinyl in Islington, London will take some beating as having the most miserable, obnoxious and pig-ignorant proprietor.  I've been at the receiving end of the shyster proprietor, Lynn Alexander, on his good days and on his bad days, who is heard to say in a YouTube documentary about the shop, that "most of his customers are f***ing idiots".  But then, it's people like Lynn (now 75 years of age) who, unfortunately, become record dealer folklore, and will always be remembered and spoken about, though not for any good attributes.  He really knows f**k-all about record collecting,  or the music itself, having taken over the shop from a friend.  He also has a well-deserved bad report on recordjunkie.com:

 

https://www.recordjunkie.com/stores/view/231

 

I think that I will make a point of stating in my will that when I die, my records should be sold - but NOT to Lynn Alexander or anyone representing Haggle Vinyl!

 

The documentary is in three parts, so excuse the three YouTube clips that are about to display, but well worth watching (refer to part 3 for the "f***ing idiots" quote):

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PaCfWjfEs8s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4IUE0mY84eI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__obPz-1rIw

Edited August 20, 2013 by Gene-R

[Guest Northampton]

was Pied Piper in Northampton now closed, just the way he was even if you knew him, he just ignored you until you handed him your purchase and then just took money, but underneath it all a nice guy who did lots for charity.  The guy in Carnegie Pittsburg is OK was there 10 years back he just wants to be in charge.  Try Spiral Archive in Northampton, probably biggest vinyl shop north of London, not sure if anything bigger in Brum these days, certainly not Norwich, and not sure whats in Manchester or Liverpool.  The shop in Northampton is taking over the building.  Alex is a great guy, knows his stuff, is a singer in a long running band, just back from touring Europe well parts of it, buy a lot good discounts.

[Pete S]

was Pied Piper in Northampton now closed, just the way he was even if you knew him, he just ignored you until you handed him your purchase and then just took money, but underneath it all a nice guy who did lots for charity.  

 

Nick Hamlyn?

[Neil Rushton]

Agreed Geordie. The shrewder US dealers have now caught up with play, but others, perhaps the miserable ones, have been left with stores of unwanted records that no one wants. On a trip to Detroit about 10 years ago, I phoned Cappy and he said don't bother coming as he had no records: a few days later, I was driving by Cappy's so decided to knock on the door - he peeped through the curtains but he would not open the door so we had a conversation through the closed door with him asking if I was willing to buy the whole store. It must have dawned on him that all the best records had been cherry picked and he wanted out of the business but was trapped with unsellable inventory.

Bob May in Detroit was a real character, only ever sat down behind the counter, hard to engage in conversation but if you hung around long enough he would take something out from under the counter and say 'here's something you might be interested in' (Jack Montgomery on Barracuda) or 'some feller never collected this last week' (Connie Questell on Decca). A visit to Bob's store was always worth the effort and though he was a man of few words, he could deliver the goods.

Part of the 'essence' of collecting records has been relating to the dealers and working around their idiosyncrasies, coming away with the records at prices that are mutually acceptable.

[Neil Rushton]

I got some great stuff from Bob Mays..

[Tony A]

I got some great stuff from Bob Mays..

 

Likewise, 

[Guest enchantedrythm]

The horrible American who owned the Swan masters and Global in Manchester...was his name Ed Balbier?..

One day before a Ritz All-Dayer they had a sale so we went along and were invited to order from a list.,

I was wholesaling at the time so ordered (more in hope than anything else) big quantities of titles. He went mad when he saw the amount I wanted and started screaming and swearing at me, I gave him back the same to the astonishment of a watching Pat Brady we had a massive row. He banned me for life there and then. As a parting shot i said "Well if you have only got the one Detroit Sound LP can I still have it" and he went really ballistic.

A few years later I released The Four Perfections "I'm Not Strong Enough" on Inferno and as he had relased it already on Cream, he demanded that we cease and desist. Have still got a copy of the telegram from Irving Weinroth to Balbier pointing out that his licence had expired and he should shut up. 

Funniest dealer has got to Anthony Lewis of Oldies Unlimited in Telford. We used to buy from him all the time and I  never get over that if you said you wanted a certain quantity he would not count the quantity,  but instead would measure out "two inches worth" or whatever. He was very fair to deal with. I was the very first  customer allowed to see him when he moved to Telford from St. Leonards-On-Sea and had memorised on the train all the O-keh titles on Brian Phillips latest list. I got them all and ended up taking loads up to Va-Va's to flog.  He appears on TV now as an expert on Massage Parlours.

Nail on the head neill- he was very obnoxious

[Guest enchantedrythm]

on another note as dick domar gets it in the ass- had some great UK stuff of him early days- he took the money, i paid the pittance

[Guest enchantedrythm]

Ive never had a bad dealing with henry..in fact i go to him before i go elsewhere hes always been top..

 

Best laugh with a dealer ...I knew john powney of castle records from old ..I moved away from the north east

then one day about 15 years later phoned him up after getting a list (how i got the list or how it ended up at my address I dont know to this day) and said Hi John do you remember me blah blah..he was quiet for a moment and then said "oh yeh from the compass club whitley bay... now that i remember you ..phone me back im going for a shit"!!!!!...

 

This thread though has showed one thing, it seems the dealers in the USA are wise to the brits, many of who have legally trounced them of their wares and are now very protective, they are price savvy and it seems bargains are few and far between from them, I cant blame them for being a bit miffed that they were a bit wet behind the ears

 

 

 

still hard work for me twice- but i still love everybody

[Mach]

  

Edited September 12, 2018 by Mach