John Anderson's Soul Junction Does It Again, Hopkins Bros

[Dave Pinch]

Dave ...don't take that the wrong way ..."trophy" being a word used by many as a way to describe those of us who choose to collect big ticket rare records.

Wether it sits easy or not with you or me... it goes with the territory and it does'nt bother me one bit ..they are my trophy's

trophy.............dont know what it means so i cant tell you if i`m bothered or not ..ok i have the shit hytones. but i also got richard darbyshire

[Chalky]

hey i appreciate what your saying and gareth is 100% correct and i for one wont be lining john andersons pocket. someone on this thread i`m sure did say about the quality being harder to come by than it used to be as well as the turnover of records. its not gonna get any easier. andy`s podcast is one of the best out there. but the hopkins brothers doesnt stand out.....imperial c`s and hytones just two oldies eh lol even tho weve known them for what seems forever theres still loads that dont know em to this day....put the hytones on the last H & G cd and some were scratching there heads.......i agree dereks second post came across as a bit leery......uneccessary.........now john harris that does float my boat

dave

I understand what you are saying Dave believe me. I love the Hytones and Imperial C's as well.

[Guest Paul]

Paul makes good points at ever but I think the comment about not being dictated to by the deejays comes across as high-handed to be frank.

Bottom line is that without the efforts of the few deejays who bother to break newer sounds there wouldn't be the possibility of reissuing this material. Like in the wider music industry the deejays on the rare soul scene are part of the mechanism for selling records.

Unlike the wider music industry they are an essential part of the process as they set the agenda for which tracks come to be deemed in-demand. They create the impetus these days rather than being drip-fed by dealers or record companies. That's one of the big differences between now and the scene's heyday (as is the sheer speed of turnover of unfamiliar material).

On the other side of the coin to this instance of re-isssuing a rarity if you have un-issued material (particularly by relatively unknown artists) the 'right' deejays are the vital cog in building up some demand for that product. Record companies (big or small) can't have it both ways with regard to this extremely specialised market.

I think the rare soul deejays are so annoyed in this instance because it seems to them that John Anderson dips into the rare soul arena nowadays only when he feels he has something to gain. Which is of course his prerogative, but he should not be immune to criticism if he causes a degree of upset by creating the perception of treading on some toes. John can rightly point to a track record as some kind of godfather of the scene but let's be clear that he did so primarily as a businessman. We'll all be grateful to him for his lifetime's work but it was carried out as a business, not some altruistic charity.

Bottom line is that without the few deejays playing the Hopkins Brothers in recent times the band themselves would never be given the chance to finally see some fruit for making the record forty-odd years ago. Anyone who wished to could have found the band and put this out any time in the intervening years, but it would have been pointless as there was no demand for the record. I think it's understandable that the persons creating that demand feel let down because it makes the task of finding and playing the 'next Hopkins Brothers' that bit more difficult.

Hello Gareth,

Interesting points but I don't think my attitude about not being dictated to is high-handed because I'm not actually involved with reissues of any records which are hot on the rare soul scene.

The Hopkins Bros single was reissued by John Anderson, Tommy & The Derbys was reissued by Garry Cape.

Most of the songs I own or control are classic soul, deep soul, vintage northern soul etc. and I've been familiar with most of them since I was a teenager.

I don't own or control many masters but, again, I don't think any of them are big on the rare soul scene. We're talking about catalogues such as Quinvy / South Camp, Creative Funk, Harthon, etc.

And none of the singles I've issued on Shotgun were hot on the rare soul scene: Rozetta Johnson, Eddie Floyd, Sam Dees, Rhetta Hughes, Don Varner, Sandra Wright, Ted Ford, David Sea, Debbie Taylor, etc. I'd been familiar with some of these tracks and artists since the mid 1970s.

The Eddie Floyd, Rozetta Johnson and Sam Dees singles were previously unissued masters which weren't even known on the rare soul scene. In fact they weren't known to any scene until I issued them.

I didn't even use the rare soul scene as a platform for advance promotion. I remember Tim Brown commented that I should have exposed the Rozetta Johnson single on the rare soul scene before I released it...

As it happens, I had considered giving a pre-release acetate of Rozetta Johnson to a well-known rare soul DJ and he was very excited about it but would only play it if it was exclusive to him and if I agreed not to release it for a couple of years!

There's no way I would have agreed to that because it would have been insulting to all the other club and radio DJs who have given support over the years. And my rights would have almost expired by then (I only had a three-year license) and the Shotgun release was intended to concide with the release of Rozetta's Soulscape album which I was also involved with - and that was already scheduled for release.

Pre-release exposure on the rare soul scene would have helped but at the end of the day I don't think total sales would have been any higher because of it. I think that record sold about 400 copies which isn't so bad these days.

Best regards,

Paul

[Garethx]

Thanks for the explanation Paul.

[Guest James Trouble]

Pretty sure Ian Wright played this long before anyone on the soul scene? The difference is only a handful of people take notice of what he plays, the rare soul scene lifts a record like this to a higher level, but should the rare soul scene be given more respect than to reissue sounds for an individual's financial gain, even if the individual is someone who made the record and may or may not have any legal claim to royalties anyway.

The rare soul scene in the uk is a social eco system, a living breathing 'thing', not just an internet stream, with sounds like this acting as the heart beat that keeps the whole thing alive + exciting. Is the scene in the uk and the 100s (or1000s?) of people make it their 'way of life more important than selling a few hundred pressings?

Even if we assume the scene is more important, are we sure these records being reissued effects the scene in a bad way or is it purely a handful of DJs egos being dented and a few dummies being spat out?

Answers:

DJs pull your necks in and get on with it as a reissue like this is unlikely to kill off the enthusiasm of the hard skinned, way of life, newies/rare scene. However it's often that ego and one up manship that drives these guys to do what they do.

DJs stop playing the resissued track? Seems sad to me.

DJs spit your dummies and stop DJing, because life is so unfair!

Rant on message boards about it, risking making yourself look a bit crazy?

Personally I've tried ranting on message boards, as far back as 1998/1999 I think. Didn't seem to change anything + made me look a bit crazy.

I've also done something really bonkers, but it's probably the only rational answer, I've offered to pay cash to the people reissueing a record, can't remember how much I offered Jazzman, a grand or maybe £1500, equal to the profit they'd make, to hand me the contract and not reissue said record.

No answer to it really. But I won't buying a reissue of it, I am however concidering attending the next Lifeline. Clearly the more exciting option...

[Sebastian]

And none of the singles I've issued on Shotgun were hot on the rare soul scene: David Sea,

The "Believe In Me" side should be. It's a fantastic dancer!

[Marc Forrest]

Pretty sure Ian Wright played this long before anyone on the soul scene?

No, think that would be Tim Brown..

[Guest Paul]

The "Believe In Me" side should be. It's a fantastic dancer!

Thanks Sebastian,

I should have only pressed three copies and sold them for £1000 each.

That sounds like a plan.

[Chalky]

No, think that would be Tim Brown..

Not that I'm aware Marc. As far as I know it was Wrighty and sure Ian said Butch got one a couple of weeks later , it's on soul source somewhere. Matters little who played it first really.

[Simon M]

No, think that would be Tim Brown..

In his record room maybe

[Guest James Trouble]

No, think that would be Tim Brown..

Therefor it could be argued that my observation is correct?

Anyhow, not important.

Edited February 13, 2012 by James Trouble

[Marc Forrest]

Not that I'm aware Marc. As far as I know it was Wrighty and sure Ian said Butch got one a couple of weeks later , it's on soul sourced somewhere.

Hi Chalky, Tim told me about him buying a copy for a mere 40 UKP back then (forgot off whom..) then filed it away soon as he didnt liked it that much back then.

[Marc Forrest]

No, think that would be Tim Brown..

By the way James, nice to see you back (seriously).

[Chalky]

Hi Chalky, Tim told me about him buying a copy for a mere 40 UKP back then (forgot off whom..) then filed it away soon as he didnt liked it that much back then.

Never heard or aware of Tim playing this out, not saying he didn't have one just not played it out. I know or pretty sure Andy had his a long time but wasn't right for the time so his was filed. Ady Croasdell had one years filed away which eventually went to Mick H. It was known and in collections, not just Funk collectors either as alluded to.

[Guest James Trouble]

Hi Chalky, Tim told me about him buying a copy for a mere 40 UKP back then (forgot off whom..) then filed it away soon as he didnt liked it that much back then.

So what you're saying is, kill Tim Brown and take the tastless selfish horder's collection from his dieing hands for the good of the wider scene?

Needs a new thread for that I think, but thanks for raising the issue.

[Marc Forrest]

It was known and in collections, not just Funk collectors either as alluded to.

Yes indeed, the same old story as so often. Thats why in this day and age I came to the conclusion to use phrases such as "found by", "discovered by", "first played by" etc.very very reluctant.

"It was made massive" is a whole different thing though and I would wholeheartedly agree on the fact that (again) it was/is Andy and Butch who are responsible for this being as hot as it was/is.

[Simon M]

JT's point on DJ's buying the rights to bloke the re-issue . Can that work ?

Edited February 13, 2012 by Simon M

[Marc Forrest]

JT's point on DJ's buying the rights to bloke the re-issue . Can that work ?

answer is a simple no as re-issues are only half the "problem"..bootleggers wouldnt be hold back form the fact some DJ committee owns the rights..

[Simon M]

answer is a simple no as re-issues are only half the "problem"..bootleggers wouldnt be hold back form the fact some DJ committee owns the rights..

Hmm true . also include the carve up situ' which can lead to needle lifting

Edited February 13, 2012 by Simon M

[Marc Forrest]

My general point of view on this matter is that it is indeed sad to see so many "hot" tunes being re-released so soon, too soon these days! Be it done the legal or illegal way. Willie Tee, Cosmos Universal Band, Roy Roberts, Salt & Pepper, Parliaments, Hopkins Bros. etc etc etc

My reason for thinking it is sad is that indeed it will kill the Upfront scene in the long run. Much because of what has been said already, "new" tunes being so seldomly found these days, people loosing interest in supoorting the forward thinking venues on a wide basis because they can easily access the song they wanna hear at home. But not only via bootlegs and re-issues..also soundcloud, mixcloud, youtube..rare tunes dont seem to have that mystical extra added to them anymore since you can access easily almost every tune these days via your i-phone or home pc.

I dont think the fact that any Dickie and Tommy will play said tunes via re-releases or bootlegs will do the Upfront Scene any harm as I believe what has been often said (on this forum)..it is two seperate scenes and worlds really. And why should the Soul Scene be any different to say the world of fashion ? You have some forward thinking small designers and a year or two later some big branches have copied what was so unique and sell it on a global scale. It always worked that way and will always continue to do so.

But it takes away the fuel our Rare Soul scene is moving by...new and fresh tunes to play out, to dance to, to chat about and to hunt down.

[Simon M]

But the new Northern Soul tunes will run out one day . then again it depends how you define NS as someone just said to me

Edited February 13, 2012 by Simon M

[spot]

Blood hell that was a long read & valid points on both sides, plus it clarified in my mind why I never started collecting again on our return to the good old bad old days, why, because like Andy, Mark, Mick H etc I'd be beside myself if I'd paid big money for a tune & shortly there after it was, whatever, I do notice that the Parliments, Ravins & Tommy and the Derby's still fill the floor at Rarer events & now also do the same at Oldies venues, good thing? I don't know you make your own mind up. I'm afraid that most of the Oldies fraternity have an intolerence to most of the rarer/upfront stuff & are very vocal about it, I've done cd's for numerous people, some love them,some hate them & use them as bird scarers in the allotment but that's their choice,I remember Sam playing Parliaments, Margaret Little etc at Brighouse for well over a year & almost everyone ranting about new/modern shite they didn't know & maybe 10 people dancing, try not to play them now though & the reverse would be true,sorry went off at a tangent there.

Gail & I travel the lenght & breadth of the Country to all types of venues but mainly underplayed & rarer venues, we also still love an Oldies night locally & love them, we also recognise that most people don't give a flying f**k if the tune is original,re-issue,bootleg or god forbid cd & they're not bothered who makes money or doesn't & really aren't bother if or when the artist make a penny from it, a sad indictment to some but to most dancers "no problem", cos they're just out to dance & enjoy the night, just as we are.

Remember even the Upfront/Rarer scene can get monotenous & boring due to the small number of Dj's & venues, a recent one drove me to the edge of misery & I think most people there if truth be known but hey lets just get on with it & be happy we're still around at least some of & don't blow to many gaskets, as we're in the heart attack zone btw I wont be purchasing any re-issues ever.

Take care,be safe & remember,"You spin me right round baby, right round, like a record baby",

Spot.

[boba]

is "leech" spelled differently in England? Because every single person in this thread is spelling it with an "a". or is it a reference to Robin Leach?

[Guest Paul]

is "leech" spelled differently in England? Because every single person in this thread is spelling it with an "a". or is it a reference to Robin Leach?

Hello Bob,

It's odd that I don't know because I'm a "leach" too now.

I'll look it up on google while I try to keep my sense of humour.

[Guest wrighty]

from wikipedia

In computing and specifically Internet, a leech or leeching is one who benefits, usually deliberately, from others' information or effort but does not offer anything in return, or makes only token offerings in an attempt to avoid being called a leech

[KevH]

With the costs etc of putting out these re-issues of rare tunes,who are the target audience?.Does market research show a demand for them,or is it a egg and chicken effect regarding demand.?

[Modernsoulsucks]

Hello everybody.

Chalky and Mike are offline at the moment so I'd just like to ask that some members tone it down please. I've removed a couple of posts to this effect.

Bob, "spirit of friendship" . Brilliant!

ROD [as moderator] except for the bit addressed to Bob.

[Guest ruppy]

Well gonna keep it short and sweet, i agree with Andy Dyson ,just fkn stinks the whole bootleg problem we have today worst it,s ever been new tunes are not given enough time to collect the dust , before the vultures hit the pressing plant,what pisses me off, most, of these bootleggers have never been to a Lifeline or 100 club Allnighter Look at some of the records played by Lifeline & the ; 100 club. djs ,Parliments,marge little,joe jamma,and many more ,butch,s Willie tee another great tune booted far to early.,now the nail in the coffin for the Hopkins Bros is the hopkins bros going to make John Anderson a fortune ,i think not proberley sell a handful if lucky,so no thousands going direct to the group which you would not mind if that was the case take Kings Hall Stoke were i,am a resident for the last several years ,a world known top allnigher pulling in around 1500 to 1800 every allnighter, ,i could walk round the venue and ask 99% of people do you know the Hopkins Brothers and the answer would be no,not there fault ,its just a rare 45 played mainley at Lifeline & the; 100 club call it a preserved premier 45 what touches the heart of Lifeline &; 100 club travellers Like Andy states there is not enough newblood records coming through today,so what could happen is certain few upfront djs calling time on there new discovorie here in the uk and playing them in europe only were they gain respect from the promotors and there soulies,alike and the bootleg vultures of the uk will be fucked once and for all over here and the Roy Roberts to Hopkins bros type records could have a long life a head of them after all

Mick H

Edited February 14, 2012 by ruppy

[Guest wrighty]

not a final word on reissues etc by any means (dont think thats likely any time soon) but whilst thinking about the 'rewarding the artist' vs 'keeping newly discovered tunes exclusive' argument i was reminded about the recent situation with the ishola muhammed 45 where he was contacted directly by a collector who offered him a decent four figure sum for a copy, artist gets rewarded, tune stays exclusive, both parties happy, win win all round?

[Pomonkey]

Can't help but instead try look it from the artist's point of view, they're real people, not inanimate discs, many still living and breathing, who created this music. Would the Hopkins Bros, or any other singer, rather

a) have the few remaining copies of the records they made stay "exclusive" and only be heard by people who get to hear the current owners play them in a limited # of soul venues, in return for which of course they themselves get sweet FA

b) be paid good money for the master rights but purely so that they agree their music cannot ever be reissued to a wider audience (this seems to be what some people are leaning towards as a "win/win" for both the artists and the Scene)

c) strike a legit licensing deal and know that 100's of soul fans around the world are finally buying and loving, and most importantly sharing, the songs they put their heart and soul into all those years ago

Having worked with dozens of soul artists now they almost invariably have variations of the same story - they were never paid properly, never got the recognition they deserved, and nowadays to greater or smaller extent are all not just long in years but in failing health too, which in America is definitely no joke. They know people with funny accents across the water mysteriously still adore recordings of theirs they not only rarely own but often barely remember, they also know these records are selling for crazy amounts that they don't see a penny of.

So given the choice? Do you think many of them would be happy just to know a few copies of their recordings are in "good hands" and go for a)? You'd definitely have plenty accept b), simply because they'd be grateful for the extra money just to survive. But if they were really given a choice between b) or c)?

No right answer, but having had an amazing singer try and refuse their entire fee because the pure experience of being on a stage having a packed audience cheer their hearts out for their songs for the first time in decades, and knowing the music they created not just still survives but will even outlive them, meant more to them than the money ever could, can't help feeling know which way am leaning on this one.

ps massively over-simplistic assumption here that the singers own the rights, most don't, but for the Hopkins at least it's true.

[Ady Croasdell]

And a final point from me to those who try to justify the making of re-issues as a means of giving back something to the artists ,if you really care about these forgotten heroes ...there are thousands of artists out there who never made it ,didn't get the riches they longed for ,so how come we only concentrate on the ones who made the records that are rare and oh so desirable ?

Hi Nev,

At Kent we put out music that is rare (from a demand point of view) and also music that is good but unavailable and will often spotlight artists with no big rareties at all. The recent Paul Kelly, O C Tolbert, Maxine Brown, Apollas, Etta James, Swamp Dogg, Bettye Swann and Doris Troy CDs aren't full of in demand rareties. Even on vinyl we put out singles by Millie Jackson, Luther Ingram, Trini Lopez, Jackie Lee that aren't particularly currently "hot". We do put out rare records too and treat the artists and owners as well as we possibly can do, I could give you a list of people we know and admire who are very happy with our treatment of them.

As Dean says isn't it better it happens this way than wait for the bootleggers who will cream all the top sales and probably make it financially unviable for a legitmate release to come out. I have to tell artists or label owners, oh we'll only be doing that on CD now because the 45 has been booted so you'll be getting a third of the money you would have got. It's not a good conversation.

Ady

PS I know you're very fair minded, I just wanted to quote your post for the specific point.

Edited February 17, 2012 by ady croasdell

[Guest the fifer]

not a final word on reissues etc by any means (dont think thats likely any time soon) but whilst thinking about the 'rewarding the artist' vs 'keeping newly discovered tunes exclusive' argument i was reminded about the recent situation with the ishola muhammed 45 where he was contacted directly by a collector who offered him a decent four figure sum for a copy, artist gets rewarded, tune stays exclusive, both parties happy, win win all round?

That's great to hear but how many dealers /collectors would be that fair.

Must have been a few artists, producers and label owners who have been treated far less fairly over the years. Over 45s which were KNOWN to be worth big money over here at that time.

Derek

[Ady Croasdell]

not a final word on reissues etc by any means (dont think thats likely any time soon) but whilst thinking about the 'rewarding the artist' vs 'keeping newly discovered tunes exclusive' argument i was reminded about the recent situation with the ishola muhammed 45 where he was contacted directly by a collector who offered him a decent four figure sum for a copy, artist gets rewarded, tune stays exclusive, both parties happy, win win all round?

Unfortunately Ian there are more examples of dealers paying next to nowt for an artists old records that they're not bothered with any more.

[Ady Croasdell]

Incidentally I've noticed Butch playing Toni & The Showmen recently. We put it out on Kent 4 years ago because of the demand for it (and we own the label) and it's still available. If Butch can go with a sound like that that is in the shops, I don't see why other DJs can't carry on playing their originals of sounds that have been re-released. At OVO dos which is mainly the venues they attend, nobody is gonna be playing the reissues. However I'm more than happy to play the Hopkins Bros at a general soul party or evening piss-up do (not the likes of Solid Hit) and maybe a dancer will enjoy it, ask what it is, look into the story behind it and be a convert to the scene or at least enjoy some of it. Stranger things have happened.

[NEV]

Hi Ady

On a lighter note ....I bet you never thought it would turn into this when you put your copy up for sale late last yr eh

[Guest wrighty]

Unfortunately Ian there are more examples of dealers paying next to nowt for an artists old records that they're not bothered with any more.

quite aware thats its an unrealistic ideal ady, for every deal like that there must be hundreds of artists letting their records go for peanuts, and for these guys a reissue a few years down the line is their only way of recouping anything i guess...and i think on this occasion the artist actually quoted the price he wanted so he must have been pretty clued up

[Ady Croasdell]

Hi Ady

On a lighter note ....I bet you never thought it would turn into this when you put your copy up for sale late last yr eh

No and it's just as well it didn't come out on a Kent 45 or I'd be in for a Lifeline lynching!

[boba]

why can't the artists be well paid for their records and have a reissue. I don't see how they're mutually exclusive. Also, just paying an artist well for their records and not offering them a reissue deal won't guarantee no reissue. Someone else will probably be even more likely to source them after they know the artist has been found to try to do a reissue. The only way you would prevent a reissue would be to negotiate some sort of rights contractually with the artist after buying their 45. That seems sort of shady (unless you actually plan to reissue it).

Edited February 17, 2012 by boba

[Dave Rimmer]

No and it's just as well it didn't come out on a Kent 45 or I'd be in for a Lifeline lynching!

Well there is a handy balconey

[Marc Forrest]

That's great to hear but how many dealers /collectors would be that fair.

Must have been a few artists, producers and label owners who have been treated far less fairly over the years. Over 45s which were KNOWN to be worth big money over here at that time.

Derek

Derek, you are so spot on! And this annoys me big time..many people say they care for the music and the artists and tell you a moment later for how much (little!) they managed to get hold of "..all his copies", "all the remaining stock that was there left" etc etc

Talk about hypocricy...

Edited February 17, 2012 by Marc Forrest

[boba]

Derek, you are so spot on! And this annoys me big time..many people say they care for the music and the artists and tell you a moment later for how much (little!) they managed to get hold of "..all his copies", "all the remaining stock that was there left" etc etc

Talk about hypocricy...

For the record, I have talked to hundreds of artists and literally have never gotten a single record from anyone, 99% of them don't have a single copy of their own record. For many of them I have bought a copy of their record and given it to them.

I also don't hear people who track records (which usually come from the producer or label owner not the artist btw) going around bragging about how much they care about the artist or bragging about copies. People who source records are ultra-secretive about what they've done and what they get.

[boba]

In fact, reading your post again, I can't imagine a single person ever bragging about how little they paid someone for copies of a record (I initially read it as just bragging that they got all the copies). Anyone who would do that is a total idiot. If someone ever actually said that, who was it?

Also, hypocrisy is spelled with an s.

[NEV]

Dwight franklin springs to mind !

Some woman came on here and answered my want post for his record ... I pm'd the lady in question and got asked for $20 a copy ...later found out that the seller was acting on behalf of Dwight himself ,and although she said she had 4 copies ,every man and his dog on here pmd her and got multiple copies ?

In fairness though ,the price was quoted and not negotiated .... So on that note ,if Dwight was happy with $20 a copy ,why did I pay over £500 for one when it was rare ,and are we guilty of ripping off artists ,or each other in the quest for rare records ?

[boba]

That is a totally different situation. You didn't find anyone with a 3 figure record, tell them how great they were and make them feel so happy that they were recognized after all these years, and then offer to buy copies, have them say they want to just give them to you because they're so happy to be recognized, and then you setting on $2 a copy. Typical story...

Now what kind of idiot would brag about that?

[Guest the fifer]

That is a totally different situation. You didn't find anyone with a 3 figure record, tell them how great they were and make them feel so happy that they were recognized after all these years, and then offer to buy copies, have them say they want to just give them to you because they're so happy to be recognized, and then you setting on $2 a copy. Typical story...

Now what kind of idiot would brag about that?

Bob, have heard such stories on a few occasions over the years.

Derek

[NEV]

That is a totally different situation. You didn't find anyone with a 3 figure record, tell them how great they were and make them feel so happy that they were recognized after all these years, and then offer to buy copies, have them say they want to just give them to you because they're so happy to be recognized, and then you setting on $2 a copy. Typical story...

Now what kind of idiot would brag about that?

The world of the serious record collector is very dark and murky Bob ... A psychologists dream .lol

[boba]

Bob, have heard such stories on a few occasions over the years.

Derek

You've heard the story I describe (which is common) or you've heard about someone doing that and then bragging about it afterwards?

[Guest the fifer]

You've heard the story I describe (which is common) or you've heard about someone doing that and then bragging about it afterwards?

Both

Derek

[NEV]

You've heard the story I describe (which is common) or you've heard about someone doing that and then bragging about it afterwards?

Bob ,I would wager that there are more unscrupulous people who live your side of the pond ,who make a living out of "hood winking " reclusive artists out of their last copies for peanuts,only to sell em to us fanatics over here ,for big bucks !

[boba]

Both

Derek

wow... to me that's like pretty much racism, some (probably White) person in tune with an expensive market defrauding an old Black artist of his valuable records and then bragging about it? AND saying that they care about the artist?