Guest Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) Here's something to think about. Virtually all the histories of disco have stated that disco was born out of the predominantly white New York gay scene. Perhaps it's time that this perspective was challenged. One could argue that the real driving force - in a cultural sense - which ultimately led to what came to be known the world over as "disco' was straight black teens ... those black kids in the the larger US urban cities like New York, Chicago, Philly, Detroit and LA . The whole dancing in "discotheques" and "go go" craze that had hit the US in the mid 60s via Motown and the golden era of soul may have been fading fast by 1967 with psychedelia - at least as far as mainstream white US society was concerned - but the black kids in urban cities never stopped going to clubs (and school gymnasiums !) and dancing to their favourite soul and funk tunes and creating new dances all the time (the Tighten Up , Funky Chicken , Robot etc ). Just read the chapter on dancing in Robert Pruter's brilliant book "Chicago Soul" to see exactly what was going on in a major city like Chicago in the late 60's in terms of how influential young straight black kids were in the development of music culture in the US at the time . What the conventional histories of the disco scene never state - such as the books which Mark Res refers to in an earlier post - is that for every one of those legendary small gay haunts in New York with DJs like Francis Grasso which were considered to be the well spring for disco , there were a whole host of little black clubs with their own DJs , not only New York but the other major cities , and which played popular soul and RnB tunes of the day and catered to a primarily straight young black clientele, and that's not to mention the plethora of night clubs for older blacks , as well as the usual chitlin circuit for live soul acts ( the Howard Theatre , Apollo etc) ... Furthermore, the TV show "Soul Train" went into national syndication in 1971, and was based in LA by the way, not New York , having started life as a local show for black teens in Chicago in 1969 . Have a look at some of those early episodes of Soul Train; the template for disco was already there by 1971 for all Americans to see every week , while the gay club scene in New York at that time was still in its infancy and still very underground. What I'm getting at is that it wouldn't be unreasonable to say that the whole disco era may well have happened even if there had been no gay New York club scene / culture at all ... This is not to dismiss the influence that the New York gay scene actually did have on disco but to give a more balanced perspective on what really led to the cultural phenomenon of disco. Total agreement. I have talked to many Black people in the USA in their 50s and 60s, looked at their photos of the period etc...and their memories of the time revolve around the type of clubs you are talking about and they were pre-dominant throughout the USA especially as you have highlighted on the East Coast...What always becomes confusing in this subject - is the polarising of what to me, represent two separate stories....1.The development of Black Disco Music, it's evolution from hard funk and the social culture as related to Black mainly heterosexual Americans and...2. The explosion and impact of the 'Gay disco' scene, the influence of which was admittedly enormous, but which evolved as a definite secondary strand from the first...These stories are obviously linked by the music but socially and culturally they are two separate entities... If we examine the lyrics of a very soulful 70s dance record like 'my Baby love' from THE TEMPREES, a Stax recording, you can hear the words 'a disco night is like a breath of spring' but the whole accent is on 'she' and 'her'...These type of records were not being made with the Artists and Producers thinking they were trying to exclusively hit a gay audience...When the Gay disco explosion became big news, things changed but I still feel this poster is factually correct with his appraisal which touches upon the much more complex story of 'Disco' rather than the cliched phenomenon which is commonly presented. And where did the word 'disco' come from? From 'discoteque'' obviously....In the UK, in 1971 MERCURY were releasing their excellent 'Mobile Discoteque' compilations with contributions from JERRY BUTLER, BILL BRANDON and BOBBY HEBB...Pure Soul records but the concept of a 'disco' was already out there in marketing terms, even in the UK, years before the Gay Disco scene sprung into focus.... Edited March 5, 2012 by rich chorley Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Pete S Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Up until the end of the 70's, all clubs were called Discos anyway. I remember I used to do Disco top 30's of my own from my own records, when I was 14, they included things as diverse as Festival Time and Ire Feelings by Rupie Edwards - it was literally records played at our local disco. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ian Dewhirst Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Total agreement. I have talked to many Black people in the USA in their 50s and 60s, looked at their photos of the period etc...and their memories of the time revolve around the type of clubs you are talking about and they were pre-dominant throughout the USA especially as you have highlighted on the East Coast...What always becomes confusing in this subject - is the polarising of what to me, represent two separate stories....1.The development of Black Disco Music, it's evolution from hard funk and the social culture as related to Black mainly heterosexual Americans and...2. The explosion and impact of the 'Gay disco' scene, the influence of which was admittedly enormous, but which evolved as a definite secondary strand from the first...These stories are obviously linked by the music but socially and culturally they are two separate entities... If we examine the lyrics of a very soulful 70s dance record like 'my Baby love' from THE TEMPREES, a Stax recording, you can hear the words 'a disco night is like a breath of spring' but the whole accent is on 'she' and 'her'...These type of records were not being made with the Artists and Producers thinking they were trying to exclusively hit a gay audience...When the Gay disco explosion became big news, things changed but I still feel this poster is factually correct with his appraisal which touches upon the much more complex story of 'Disco' rather than the cliched phenomenon which is commonly presented. And where did the word 'disco' come from? From 'discoteque'' obviously....In the UK, in 1971 MERCURY were releasing their excellent 'Mobile Discoteque' compilations with contributions from JERRY BUTLER, BILL BRANDON and BOBBY HEBB...Pure Soul records but the concept of a 'disco' was already out there in marketing terms, even in the UK, years before the Gay Disco scene sprung into focus.... I agree too. There's a little too much focus on the Gay angle because I think most of the books concentrate on New York because that was the most well documented area with plenty of media around. Let's not forget the French word 'Discotheque' was penned in the mid 60's:- dis·co·theque also dis·co·th¨que (dsk-tk, dsk-tk) n. A nightclub that features dancing to recorded or sometimes live music and often has showy decor and elaborate lighting. [French, record library, discoth¨que, from Italian discoteca, record library : disco, disk, record (from Latin discus, quoit; see discus) + biblioteca, library (from Latin bibliothca; see bibliotheca).] I can remember going to School Discos in 1968 LOL. Also I'm pretty sure that Gamble & Huff and the rest of the Philly contingent weren't writing exclusively for gays by any means..... ......shameless plug time, since Gamble & Huff and Moulton featured in the programme! Out on the 26th of this month and pretty much the best example of Soulful Disco you'll ever find:- Philadelphia International Classics: The Tom Moulton Remixes - Track Listing (All songs in chronological order from when they originally charted on the Billboard RnB Single or Album Chart) CD 1 1. Back Stabbers 9.36 - The O'Jays Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 08/07/72 2. (Win, Place Or Show) She's A Winner 7.28 - The Intruders Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 19/08/72 3. Slow Motion 7.47 - Johnny Williams Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 09/09/72 4. Love Train 6.14 - The O'Jays Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 20/01/73 5. I'll Always Love My Mama 9.41 - The Intruders Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 12/05/73 6. The Love I Lost 12.28 - Harold Melvin & The Blue Notes Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 22/09/73 7. Dirty Ol' Man 8.17 - The Three Degrees Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 06/10/73 Total Playing Time: 61.31 CD 2 1. The Whole Town's Talking 8.39 - Billy Paul Original U.S. Album Chart Debut 24/11/73 2. Love Epidemic 7.32 - The Trammps Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 29/12/73 3. T.S.O.P The Sound Of Philadelphia 5.42 - MFSB Featuring The Three Degrees Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 02/03/74 4. Year Of Decision 6.44 - Three Degrees Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 09/03/74 5. Where Do We Go From Here 5.30 - The Trammps Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 18/05/74 6. Love Is The Message 11.30 - MFSB Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 13/07/74 7. The Devil Made Me Do It 10.35 - Robert Upchurch Original U.S. Single Release (Didn't Chart) 8. When Will I See You Again 5.52 - Three Degrees Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 28/09/74 Total Playing Time: 62.04 CD 3 1. Trusting Heart 5.58 - The Trammps Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 23/11/74 2. Bad Luck 8.00 - Harold Melvin & The Blue Notes Original U.S. Album Chart Debut 01/03/75 3. Trammps Disco Theme/Zing Went The Strings Of My Heart 6.41 - The Trammps Original U.S. Album Chart Debut 10/05/75 4. Do It Any Way You Wanna 5.30 - People's Choice Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 19/07/75 5. I Love Music 9.43 - The O'Jays Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 01/11/75 6. Don't Leave Me This Way 11.03 - Harold Melvin & The Blue Notes Original U.S. Album Chart Debut 06/12/75 7. Let's Groove 10.20 - Archie Bell & The Drells Original U.S. Album Chart Debut 27/12/75 8. You'll Never Find Another Love Like Mine 9.57 - Lou Rawls Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 15/05/76 Total Playing Time: 67.12 CD 4 1. Where Will You Go When The Party's Over 9.05 - Archie Bell & The Drells Original U.S. Album Chart Debut 22/01/77 2. Jam Jam Jam (All Night Long) 7.42 - People's Choice Original U.S. Album Chart Debut 26/06/76 3. I Don't Love You Anymore 8.41 - Teddy Pendergrass Original U.S. Album Chart Debut 19/03/77 4. See You When I Git There 9.36 - Lou Rawls Original U.S. Album Chart Debut 16/04/77 5. This Time Baby 9.50 - The O'Jays Original U.S. Album Chart Debut 29/04/78 6. Party Time Man 9.09 - The Futures Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 13/01/79 7. My Love Don't Come Easy 10.46 - Jean Carn Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 22/12/79 8. Nights Over Egypt 9.12 - The Jones Girls Original U.S. Single Chart Debut 13/02/82 Total Playing Time: 67.12 Amazon Link:- https://www.amazon.co.uk/Philadelphia-International-Classics-Moulton-Remixes/dp/B006W33UC4/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1326472760&sr=1-1 Ian D Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Wrongcrowd Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 I can remember going to School Discos in 1968 LOL. Also I'm pretty sure that Gamble & Huff and the rest of the Philly contingent weren't writing exclusively for gays by any means..... ...... I fully agree Ian, it's completely ridculous to even try to beleive that the gay communities can claim ownership of disco or any other music genre. I was thinking exactly your point on the Philly music machine being completely geared to producing music aimed at the gay scene... journalism skewed just a little here. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ian Dewhirst Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Oh, I almost forgot, for those who like the kind of Disco largely featured in the show, we have 4 new Disco Discharge albums out in March, April and May to compliment the 12 which are already out there...... https://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_1?url=search-alias%3Dpopular&field-keywords=disco+discharge# Not a bad week for Disco LOL..... Ian D Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Oh, I almost forgot, for those who like the kind of Disco largely featured in the show, we have 4 new Disco Discharge albums out in March, April and May to compliment the 12 which are already out there...... https://www.amazon.co...disco+discharge# Not a bad week for Disco LOL..... Ian D Seems like the tradition of 'Disco' marketing is alive and well in the UK, that's for sure!.... Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Steve G Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Yes that's the problem with these programmes, usually very poorly researched and cliched in their content. In fairness most of the books on the subject are just as bad, bleating on about the NY clubs and how fabulous they all were and the outrageous things that went on in them. When the reality was that disco was a huge phenomenon in other parts of the USA and of course Europe.....Soul Sam was running a disco in the late 60s in Spain when he was on holiday there. They wired up a deck or a couple of decks and played music on the beach. And of course the youth club and local disco phenomenon which was by and large (down here) playing JB, Ohio Players, Whispers, Bohannon etc. and up north playing early Northern. I think I'll give the programme a miss. It sounds like another poorly done job like ones I've seen in the past. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Funny enough, I was talking to my Mrs about being ejected from a school disco circa 1969/70 only a couple of days ago! The letter to my parents said 'over-excitement and encouraging others to misbehave'....Hmmmm...Shape of things to come afterwards methinks! Those old Schoolteachers had no flies on'em!..... Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest soulboy Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 well i never knew what a gay was when i worked down the pit ? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Geeselad Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Considering the usual quality of music programme's on bbc 4 I was very disappionted with the show, it speaks volumes that Levine was one of the most articulate, relevant and accurate guests on the programme. Whole chapters of the history were missed, the Sanctuary, salsoul and the latin influence on the music didnt really get a mention instead they decided to focus on euro disco and moroder ect who no doubt were influencial but have been well documented in the past. Input from Mark moore was pathetic and embarassing, and I felt the whole subject was treated with the derision I'd expect from a bunch of rock jorno's from the 7ts still busy buying the latest ELP or yes triple set. BBC 4, this was very poor indeed! Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
De-to Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 for those who missed the prog,!!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qmxc-rfy4-0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vRLfyxSD18 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGCSYFL7P1M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t52rxSYiShk Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest daz mycroft Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 Considering the usual quality of music programme's on bbc 4 I was very disappionted with the show, it speaks volumes that Levine was one of the most articulate, relevant and accurate guests on the programme. Whole chapters of the history were missed, the Sanctuary, salsoul and the latin influence on the music didnt really get a mention instead they decided to focus on euro disco and moroder ect who no doubt were influencial but have been well documented in the past. Input from Mark moore was pathetic and embarassing, and I felt the whole subject was treated with the derision I'd expect from a bunch of rock jorno's from the 7ts still busy buying the latest ELP or yes triple set. BBC 4, this was very poor indeed! dont get any pleaserue at all from this but" told you so".The docu on Bill Withers this Friday should be good as although shown by the BBC was not put together by them Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Gogger Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 enjoyed the program, but everybody knows the disco was invented by jimmy saville Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ian Dewhirst Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 enjoyed the program, but everybody knows the disco was invented by jimmy saville Absolutely. He was also the inventor of using two record decks instead of one, thus inadvertently starting the mixing phenomenon in the early 60's. Ian D Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
ashleysoul Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 but hang on...the debate isnt who invented/started 'THE' disco, its who started 'DISCO'. of course there were discos all over the world from 1907 or whatever....and unless im mistaken, i doubt soul sam wasnt playing upstempo soul with extended breaks to his dancers in 1963 in falaraki or whatever? and im pretty sure there werent many people freaking out to fantastic moulton mixes in idaho in 1954! but i am pretty sure that the first 12"s and records that specifically were designed for dancers, were played to a predominately gay audience in new york in the late 1970's. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest mickeyb Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 but hang on...the debate isnt who invented/started 'THE' disco, its who started 'DISCO'. of course there were discos all over the world from 1907 or whatever....and unless im mistaken, i doubt soul sam wasnt playing upstempo soul with extended breaks to his dancers in 1963 in falaraki or whatever? and im pretty sure there werent many people freaking out to fantastic moulton mixes in idaho in 1954! but i am pretty sure that the first 12"s and records that specifically were designed for dancers, were played to a predominately gay audience in new york in the late 1970's. Absolutely true. However, after 20 minutes or so (good tunes and a bit about the Philly boys) it degenerated into Eurodisco, Bee Gees, Donna Summer. No Salsoul or Prelude. A bit about Nicky Siano but nothing about Larry Levan or Frankie Knuckles or Tony Humphries. Would have been great to hear about how it all eventually morphed into House. Remember a quote on a Wally Jump Jr LP in the late 80's "No Philly, No Salsoul, No Salsoul, No House" Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
ashleysoul Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 I'm with you Micky, but a history doc on BBC had to adhere to the masses. Be thankful moulton siano and mancuso showed their faces. I'd love nothing more than to see a programme on prelude salsoul west etc etc, but it ain't going to happen soon. Personally I loved it, the early bit that is, I've seen the second half a million times on a million programmes! Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Geeselad Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 I'm with you Micky, but a history doc on BBC had to adhere to the masses. Be thankful moulton siano and mancuso showed their faces. I'd love nothing more than to see a programme on prelude salsoul west etc etc, but it ain't going to happen soon. Personally I loved it, the early bit that is, I've seen the second half a million times on a million programmes! sorry but I disagree, BBC4 is a brilliant specialist chanel that regualrly features non english language movies, high brow documentaries and proper drama. Anyone seen 'only disconnect'? hardly fodder for the masses, this channel is capable of so much better. 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Geeselad Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 but hang on...the debate isnt who invented/started 'THE' disco, its who started 'DISCO'. of course there were discos all over the world from 1907 or whatever....and unless im mistaken, i doubt soul sam wasnt playing upstempo soul with extended breaks to his dancers in 1963 in falaraki or whatever? and im pretty sure there werent many people freaking out to fantastic moulton mixes in idaho in 1954! but i am pretty sure that the first 12"s and records that specifically were designed for dancers, were played to a predominately gay audience in new york in the late 1970's. for me, it stems back to grasso @ sanctuary, mixing 45's in the early 7ts or maybe Kool Herc doing his thing in the blocks around the same time. UK wise, froggy was one of the first along with Levine to beat mix. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Jimmy Mack Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 ian that's your new mission if you have got a spare week do a series on salsoul & prelude Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Geeselad Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 Total agreement. I have talked to many Black people in the USA in their 50s and 60s, looked at their photos of the period etc...and their memories of the time revolve around the type of clubs you are talking about and they were pre-dominant throughout the USA especially as you have highlighted on the East Coast...What always becomes confusing in this subject - is the polarising of what to me, represent two separate stories....1.The development of Black Disco Music, it's evolution from hard funk and the social culture as related to Black mainly heterosexual Americans and...2. The explosion and impact of the 'Gay disco' scene, the influence of which was admittedly enormous, but which evolved as a definite secondary strand from the first...These stories are obviously linked by the music but socially and culturally they are two separate entities... Some very articulate posts here, careful though the homiphodia polce are watching! If we examine the lyrics of a very soulful 70s dance record like 'my Baby love' from THE TEMPREES, a Stax recording, you can hear the words 'a disco night is like a breath of spring' but the whole accent is on 'she' and 'her'...These type of records were not being made with the Artists and Producers thinking they were trying to exclusively hit a gay audience...When the Gay disco explosion became big news, things changed but I still feel this poster is factually correct with his appraisal which touches upon the much more complex story of 'Disco' rather than the cliched phenomenon which is commonly presented. And where did the word 'disco' come from? From 'discoteque'' obviously....In the UK, in 1971 MERCURY were releasing their excellent 'Mobile Discoteque' compilations with contributions from JERRY BUTLER, BILL BRANDON and BOBBY HEBB...Pure Soul records but the concept of a 'disco' was already out there in marketing terms, even in the UK, years before the Gay Disco scene sprung into focus.... Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
ashleysoul Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 Geeslad, spot on. I was waiting for someone to pick up on that. BBC 4 constantly shows films of niche interest, but I guess they missed a slight trick here. It wasn't perfect but it was better than holby city! Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Steve G Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 sorry but I disagree, BBC4 is a brilliant specialist chanel that regualrly features non english language movies, high brow documentaries and proper drama. Anyone seen 'only disconnect'? hardly fodder for the masses, this channel is capable of so much better. Bang on the money. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ian Dewhirst Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 I'm not really sure if it can be successfully condensed to one hour anyway. But it's quite a hard process to get a documentary made for TV these days plus the budgets aren't great and licensing the music is always a major headache, so there's lot of obstacles in the way of anyone who tries to be definitive. Plus what size of audience would the documentary command (because it's ALWAYS about audiences whichever channel sponsors it)? I've recently watched the definitive docementary about the birth of House music in the UK. I want to release the soundtrack and the DVD and see if I can get it on TV and selected film screenings too. But the music clearance budget is just nuts so the project is currently stalled. So it's not that easy even with a completed great documentary. We're probably lucky we even got this. I don't know if other countries have as much choice or diversity as we do over here. It could be worse believe me! Ian D Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 but hang on...the debate isnt who invented/started 'THE' disco, its who started 'DISCO'. of course there were discos all over the world from 1907 or whatever....and unless im mistaken, i doubt soul sam wasnt playing upstempo soul with extended breaks to his dancers in 1963 in falaraki or whatever? and im pretty sure there werent many people freaking out to fantastic moulton mixes in idaho in 1954! but i am pretty sure that the first 12"s and records that specifically were designed for dancers, were played to a predominately gay audience in new york in the late 1970's. So who were all those people dancing to those records on Soul Train?....The idea that there were not heterosexual Black people all over the USA, dancing to these records in clubs way outside of the oft-quoted New York Gay disco scene, is not only silly but historically inaccurate....But the history of Disco mirrors the often-told 'Northern Soul Story', i.e it has become a dot-to-dot ABC guide of cliches, distortions and often now, downright untruths.... https://youtu.be/b2dYoE2UmI8 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
ashleysoul Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 Trust me, ian d speaks the truth, I make tv programmes for a living. We were lucky to get what we got. I didn't see the history of hip hop the other day but it sounded pony. The exception to the rule was the history of house from 10 years ago, THAT was how you make a music doc! 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
ashleysoul Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 Rich! I have never said that black folks aren't involved in disco, others have. As I understood it, the crowds at the loft, gallery etc were predominately black and Hispanic. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Geeselad Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 Trust me, ian d speaks the truth, I make tv programmes for a living. We were lucky to get what we got. I didn't see the history of hip hop the other day but it sounded pony. The exception to the rule was the history of house from 10 years ago, THAT was how you make a music doc! I have a distant recollection of that, didnt they go into knuckles record room? and visit the the lawers office on jefferson way that now occupies place the warehouse was, asking the suits ' you ever heard of house music? well it started right here. well due a re- run. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
ashleysoul Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 Yep. Larry shearmin also did the iv where he explained that all trax sounded records rubbish cos they were printed on melted records. Class! Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ian Dewhirst Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 LOL, I should dig that Larry Sherman footage out for the Trax 30th..... Actually I want to add a bit more but I'm on an I-phone and I can't see the bloody keypad...... Ian D Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Paul Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 Interesting documentray but a bit narrow and general and inaccurate in places. Disco obviously meant different things to different people and it had its high points as well as its embarrassing lows. The gay aspect is often overstated but there's no doubt some early influential clubs had a big gay crowd and quite a few DJs and producers happened to be gay ...but hasn't it always been that way? We used the word "disco" (school disco, youth club disco, mobile disco) long before the disco boom. And, as Rich mentioned, we had those Phonogram albums in 1971 ...'Mercury Mobile Discotheque', 'Avco Mobile Discotheque' and 'Chess/Janus Mobile Discotheque'. Most historians carelessly think of "disco" as a distinct musical genre and forget that most "disco people" were actually into uptempo soul, R&B, funk and jazz etc. Disco did become a music genre, of course, but that's what caused the eventual backlash. The disco boom happened (or developed gradually) when I was a teenager but I was already buying soul and dance records by The O'Jays, Harold Melvin & The Blue Notes, The Trammps, Don Downing, Candi Staton, George McCrae, James Brown, Kool & The Gang, Barry White etc. I got into groups such as Crown Heights Affair and even Doctor Buzzard's Original Savannah Band but I don't remember buying any records by Donna Summer, Andrea True, John Travolta, Paul Jabara, Boney M, Ottawan, etc. Motown and the emerging Philadelphia soul sound provided the most obvious musical formulas but we could probably go way back to Bo Diddley and others. And it's likely that 'Shaft' was the first real disco record. One day I hope someone will make a really good documentary about disco. Paul Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
De-to Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 (edited) type in youtube, the history of house music, then take your pick,lol... Edited March 7, 2012 by de-to Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Polyvelts Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 sorry but I disagree, BBC4 is a brilliant specialist chanel that regualrly features non english language movies, high brow documentaries and proper drama. Anyone seen 'only disconnect'? hardly fodder for the masses, this channel is capable of so much better. Is 'only disconnect' your nickname for 'Only connect' ? Cos I definitely feel very disconnected when playing it !!! If I get 1 question right I feel like a genius ! Great show tho !! These broad brushed documentaries are a nightmare for specialist enthusiasts like us, the show was worth watching For the one minute of earl young drumming !! Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Glynn Jones Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 well i never knew what a gay was when i worked down the pit ? That was the guy who was always eager to scrub your back for you in the showers. lol Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Pete S Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 sorry but I disagree, BBC4 is a brilliant specialist chanel that regualrly features non english language movies, high brow documentaries and proper drama. Anyone seen 'only disconnect'? hardly fodder for the masses, this channel is capable of so much better. It is, and their music documentaries are usually of a superb standard. 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Geeselad Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 Is 'only disconnect' your nickname for 'Only connect' ? Cos I definitely feel very disconnected when playing it !!! If I get 1 question right I feel like a genius ! Great show tho !! These broad brushed documentaries are a nightmare for specialist enthusiasts like us, the show was worth watching For the one minute of earl young drumming !! Oops sorry I watch 'only connect' only for Victoria Corwen, bow wow! the questions go right over me head,LOL. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Anais nin Carms Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 BBC 4 is top channel for me I just love it ! The stuff they put on is so intersting , not just the music but the films too and the educational sid eof things too. The run they had about great photographers had me on the edge of my seat. I would say I watch this channel the most Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Geeselad Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 BBC 4 is top channel for me I just love it ! The stuff they put on is so intersting , not just the music but the films too and the educational sid eof things too. The run they had about great photographers had me on the edge of my seat. I would say I watch this channel the most me too Carms, its my default station. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Daved Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 ian that's your new mission if you have got a spare week do a series on salsoul & prelude I wonder why they only focussed on the Casablanca label specifically. I've only got a few records on that label and never considered it be nowehere near as influential as, say, Salsoul. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ian Dewhirst Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 (edited) I wonder why they only focussed on the Casablanca label specifically. I've only got a few records on that label and never considered it be nowehere near as influential as, say, Salsoul. Me too. Casablanca predominently released many of the huge U.S. Gay hits - Village People, Donna Summer, Patrick Juvet, Dennis Parker, Love & Kisses etc, etc which is why I suspect it kept coming up in the programme........ Strange combination for a label really - Pumping High Energy Gay Disco and Slinky, Dirty, Nasty P-Funk. Musta been fun in those offices when Parliament/Cameo brushed past Patrick Juvet and Dennis Parker in the corridor LOL..... Ian D Edited March 7, 2012 by Ian Dewhirst Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Tricky Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 Not bothered about the questions on Only Connect.Just watch Her! She is the dogs doodas. 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Geeselad Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 Not bothered about the questions on Only Connect.Just watch Her! She is the dogs doodas. Thinking mans totty, glad someone else is a fan. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Geeselad Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 I wonder why they only focussed on the Casablanca label specifically. I've only got a few records on that label and never considered it be nowehere near as influential as, say, Salsoul. Casablanca in fairness is probably more influencial culturally than musically, I've read tales of the secetary doing lines at 10 in the morning, before answering the phone. Its often used as a metphor for disco in general, its excesses and boom and bust attitude. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ian Dewhirst Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 Casablanca in fairness is probably more influencial culturally than musically, I've read tales of the secetary doing lines at 10 in the morning, before answering the phone. Its often used as a metphor for disco in general, its excesses and boom and bust attitude. It was nuts. I tried to sell 'em Shalamar so I saw it first hand. If I'd have ever worked there I'd be dead without a shadow of a doubt LOL.... Neil Bogart was a born promotion man though. Got his start @ Cameo and then Buddah ..... Ian D 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Soulman Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 Me too. Casablanca predominently released many of the huge U.S. Gay hits - Village People, Donna Summer, Patrick Juvet, Dennis Parker, Love & Kisses etc, etc which is why I suspect it kept coming up in the programme........ Strange combination for a label really - Pumping High Energy Gay Disco and Slinky, Dirty, Nasty P-Funk. Musta been fun in those offices when Parliament/Cameo brushed past Patrick Juvet and Dennis Parker in the corridor LOL..... Ian D Yeah, just imagine it! Patrick: "Wellll heeelllloooo George, how are you today?" George Clinton: Hey Patrick, don't call me George otherwise I'm gonna take my Mutha Ship and shove right up yo ass". Patrick: Oooohh George, don't make promises you can't keep." BTW, the Americans would probably make a comedy sketch from it but this is in no way meant to be derogatory to the Gay community or the straight community for that matter because if George Clinton personally wanted to shove a Mutha Ship up my ass I probably wouldn't argue. If I did he's probably shoot me Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
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