Would Some Current Venues Be A Success Without Alcohol?

[Soulman58]

Has beer replaced gear?

[Zed1]

Has beer replaced gear?

No..... but it's replaced THE music for many..

Edited November 24, 2012 by Zed1

[Russ Vickers]

Not for me....

Russ

[tim smithers]

Dont like either, most people talk a lot of sh*t when on one or the other or even both

[Soulman58]

Tim, I don;t disgaree I stopped attending venues ages ago, though stil go to odd gigs, just trying to get a feel for the current scene.

[Guest gordon russell]

Has beer replaced gear?

at commercial venues for sure!!

[Kev John]

ay up lets start having Northern Tea dances !!!! :boxing: fight

Edited November 24, 2012 by soulghost

[manus]

Seems to me there's a certain Puritanism taking hold on the scene these days. It almost as if you can't be a genuine Soul fan if you don't follow the strict rules of the non drinking gang and their revisionist laws of etiquette. Plenty of drinking went on in the past despite what some say - all dayers for instance and we would always meet in a pub before an allnighter and would most likely end up in one the day after. People are getting too serious these days - it's supposed to be about having fun isn't it having a laugh with friends to the music we love.

Cheers

Manus

Edited November 24, 2012 by manus

[Guest Bearsy]

Dont like either, most people talk a lot of sh*t when on one or the other or even both

I resemble that remark

[Modernsoulsucks]

Im with Manus and Russ.

Its the bier next so enjoy yourself.

ROD

[Zed1]

Seems to me there's a certain Puritanism taking hold on the scene these days. It almost as if you can't be a genuine Soul fan if you don't follow the strict rules of the non drinking gang and their revisionist laws of etiquette. Plenty of drinking went on in the past despite what some say - all dayers for instance and we would always meet in a pub before an allnighter and would most likely end up in one the day after. People are getting too serious these days - it's supposed to be about having fun isn't it having a laugh with friends to the music we love.

Cheers

Manus

I dont think any of us would advocate bringing in prohibition but it is pretty clear that many nites are now little more than Teen disco's for 50 somethings with the prospect of listening to a night of Northern Soul Music not exactly being high on their reasons for attending.

[Steve L]

No beer = no me

[Guest gordon russell]

heres a thought .....l know plenty of fellas who love their beer at nighters and they're a good laugh,don,t cause any trouble and really enjoy emselves and actually like the music....Mace,jonny beggs,bob the hat,cliff steele and loads more.

It,s these only drink soft drinks...practise their dancing all week...right on keep the faith...dancefloor etiquette ..it,s my life soulie types who spoil it

Edited November 24, 2012 by gordon russell

[manus]

I dont think any of us would advocate bringing in prohibition but it is pretty clear that many nites are now little more than Teen disco's for 50 somethings with the prospect of listening to a night of Northern Soul Music not exactly being high on their reasons for attending.

Fair enough but I don't really see what that has to do with some Soul fans enjoying a drink. I like a glass or two but I spend almost all my spare time listening to Soul music and when I go out to a venue it's to listen to Soul music - although some of the music played and danced too wouldn't qualify as Soul music in my personal opinion but I accept that's part of the game but I'd have to say some of the non drinking attendees would seem to be fairly disinterested as to whether a record is a Soul record or not as long as they can dance to it - now that's not my thing I'd much rather listen to Soul music all night but I accept that others have different takes on things and I wouldn't want to get too judgmental and start proscribing what people can or can't do.

Cheers and off out for a drink now lol

Manus

[Grayman45]

Beer is needed these days to kid the brain into thinking that you can still dance.

[Guest manusf3a]

Seems to me there's a certain Puritanism taking hold on the scene these days. It almost as if you can't be a genuine Soul fan if you don't follow the strict rules of the non drinking gang and their revisionist laws of etiquette. Plenty of drinking went on in the past despite what some say - all dayers for instance and we would always meet in a pub before an allnighter and would most likely end up in one the day after. People are getting too serious these days - it's supposed to be about having fun isn't it having a laugh with friends to the music we love.

Cheers

Manus

Seems to me there's a certain Puritanism taking hold on the scene these days. It almost as if you can't be a genuine Soul fan if you don't follow the strict rules of the non drinking gang and their revisionist laws of etiquette. Plenty of drinking went on in the past despite what some say - all dayers for instance and we would always meet in a pub before an allnighter and would most likely end up in one the day after. People are getting too serious these days - it's supposed to be about having fun isn't it having a laugh with friends to the music we love.

Cheers

Manus

Puritisam taking hold,sure sounds like it, old Oliver Cromwell making a bid to take over the east anglian soulclub of old(he lived in st Ives I do believe) All nighters ,dayers and soul nights that are no Gear! no Beer! and to cap it all off no dancing!.The puratins were not to keen on a dance being done at any time but dancing on a Sunday,a big no no,what would they make of the dancing going on after midnight and on into the early hours of Sunday each week!

Is that the next one to come,joining the beer the gear ,smoking of course and any other things to abstain from to become a truely pure listener to soul who may by further refraining from ,gear,beer,fags and what have ya! become a liker and then maybe even a lover of soul music,no dancing at soul venues.So leave your gear at home if you have any,theres no bar you will be frisked at the door and any fags you have will be taken from you but most important will be a strict no dancing to any record what so ever policy.Of course plenty of drinking went on in the past before setting out and afterwards,it always will imho when folk meet in social situations in this culture of ours(culture in generel uk)

Hope you are well from the other one!

Edited November 25, 2012 by manusf3a

[Guest Nick Harrison]

It,s these only drink soft drinks...practise their dancing all week...right on keep the faith...dancefloor etiquette ..it,s my life soulie types who spoil it

:lol: "bloody knobbers" .

Edited November 25, 2012 by Nick Harrison

[Guest gordon russell]

hey manus fallon......is that you on ya avatar piccy........you ain,t changed much.....well you,ve got a different shirt on lol :D

[Soultown andy]

Best of luck sourceing a venue with no bar sales for the venue owner.First question from venue owners is usualy,what kind of bar takeings can we expect.

[Guest Sean Haydon]

I doubt if any venue would work without alcohol. If you bear in mind that most venue hire rates are subsidised by the bar takings, they need to sell alcohol (many at inflated prices) to make it viable.

I generally go for the music, not to get drunk

[Guest dundeedavie]

Best of luck sourceing a venue with no bar sales for the venue owner.First question from venue owners is usualy,what kind of bar takeings can we expect.

totally agree, when we started basics in the current venue that was the concern of the management, mainly due to us wanting to restrict entry to maintain a dancefloor space. When they found out our customers drink their own weight at the bar all was sweet and we now get offered any dates we want, as many as we want

[bri phill]

Ridiculous question.

No venue and no punters without booze.

[Guest gordon russell]

Sean has touched on something.........which is you can go out and have a few beers......without getting drunk.

Edited November 25, 2012 by gordon russell

[Guest gordon russell]

Something else just came to mind.......bet all those clubs back in the late 60's/early 70's....convinced the councils to give em a nighter license.....citing NO BOOZE!!will be served....how responsable is that lol.....we all know the rest lol :lol:

[Diddy Morgan]

not forgetting a lot of people need some dutch courage to get them on the floor

[ste gal 7]

ive even been to places and caught people laughing and enjoying themselves, what will they think of next shocking.

[bri phill]

Something else just came to mind.......bet all those clubs back in the late 60's/early 70's....convinced the councils to give em a nighter license.....citing NO BOOZE!!will be served....how responsable is that lol.....we all know the rest lol :lol:

In the sixties it was very dificult to get a late license.It was called a supper license and you had to provide food included in the entrance fee..

All the non drinking clubs wanted a license because that's where the profit was.

The Wheel shut down because the owners could make more money out of opening a drinking club it suited them that the council were restricting clubs open more than two hours after midnight.

The Hacienda never made any money because everyone was on ectasy.

So no booze the entrance fee would have to treble and the venue take a big slice of it.

[Guest Nick Harrison]

The Hacienda never made any money because everyone was on ectasy.

Edited November 26, 2012 by Nick Harrison

[Guest Nick Harrison]

ive even been to places and caught people laughing and enjoying themselves, what will they think of next shocking.

A visit in court and a severe punishment for doing so !!

[Swifty]

And some tunes do sound better after 10 Pints !!!

[Guest manusf3a]

hey manus fallon......is that you on ya avatar piccy........you ain,t changed much.....well you,ve got a different shirt on lol :D

hey manus fallon......is that you on ya avatar piccy........you ain,t changed much.....well you,ve got a different shirt on lol :D

Yes it is Terry,couple of stone heavier,I think I have been quite lucky over the years with health and things ,not to many bumps in the road,I put it all down to not abstaining from things I enjoy.I met Georgina recently and she looks exactly like she did,the first question she asked me was ",Are you still really mad!",just a little bit was my answer.atbmanus

[Guest manusf3a]

Keep a bottle of spirits at home most of the time and every now and then like to have a couple of glasses of whisky such as bushmills or jamesons and at other times glenmorangie or a brandy,sitting back and listening to some music while having a tipple at home with friends or on your own in my book is good for you!mpo.

[SallieJane]

Years ago when I first started going to niters no one really bothered with booze....but we're all older now....so if anyone fancies a drink it's cool.

Guess where the original question came from is if people just want to go to a niter on booze (and get drunk in the process) then is that ok now.

I for one have no probs with anyone having a drink or two but if there's a fair few drunk people around then that for me aint what the scene is about...

[Guest souldjer 1]

drunk folks =trouble..big venue or small they spoil it..

spilled beer on the dancefloor can ruin your night..

[Guest Krissii]

No . The more ale the better as far as i am concerned , especially if someone else is buying them . Its a night out . We need MORE swahlis . Not less . . . . This is all getting a bit too polite for me . You lot will be telling folk what papers to read and what coffee to drink next

[Barry]

Would Some Current Venues Be A Success Without Alcohol Blokes?

[Guest Krissii]

Yes definately Barry . Because at a lot of events it is only the lasses who get up and dance anyway or are the first to get up and dance . So what are blokes bother being there for int first place ! ! ! . . . . . . . .

[Tezza]

Seems to me there's a certain Puritanism taking hold on the scene these days. It almost as if you can't be a genuine Soul fan if you don't follow the strict rules of the non drinking gang and their revisionist laws of etiquette. Plenty of drinking went on in the past despite what some say - all dayers for instance and we would always meet in a pub before an allnighter and would most likely end up in one the day after. People are getting too serious these days - it's supposed to be about having fun isn't it having a laugh with friends to the music we love.

Cheers

Manus

100%

Its a nothing question because it would be impossible to prove unless you are brave enough to put one on yourself.

We run a club that sells Beer etc but we don't get pissheads in and have no alcohol related incidents at all. The Music is still the draw. Play shit music and cheap beer v Play quality Music and a little more expensive Beer. Which gets the most punters.

Ask the question and the self righteous will wave the Beer Free flag ( but its OK to knock a few Tabs back )

Most people are sensible drinkers, if they are not, chuck em out !

Before we went to Sams or Casino or the Palais od Unity Hall etc we met in the pub and had a couple of pints - OK then but not now.

Occasionally you may get an unruly but, depending on the place you go, it is rare. If you see them regularly then change your venue.

[Biggordy]

A lot of venues won't let you hire the place unless there's a certain amount guaranteed to be spent at the bar.

As for personal drinking, I'm not allowed alcohol after having major surgery to have half of my stomach removed so drink orange juice or just bottled water at events I go to.

The music's still great and I don't throw up when I get home!

[Back Street Blue]

What constitutes being a success?

Does it mean (a) providing a good vibe and catering for the tastes of those in attendance and getting good feedback; or does it mean

(b) making a profit for the promoters and the venue ?

If the promoters are simply looking to cover their costs then you might manage to get enough folk to attend the odd temperance night at a small and cheap venue but I bet you would struggle to break even and keep the event running without selling alcohol.

It seems to me that there are as many former gene genie/ soul converts out and about as there are old soulies and the former go for the social side rather than the music and who I would assume would not be as interested if there was no beer. That said, not many of my old "Riker Liker" mates would be coaxed out at the week end unless there was a cheap bar either.

I think the scene would be a much smaller minority affair if it was restricted to alcohol free venues so the answer to the question raised in the original post is "No they wouldn't be a financial success and no they wouldn't be around long or large enough to be considered a success by the devotees.

[Geeselad]

Interestingly no one seems to have picked up on the fact that the politeness and respect element thaty used to exist in alco free nighter seems to have, to a certain extent, extended out into soul nights where carling plays a greater role than sknf. your certaily a lot less likely to end up in 'mayther' @ a soul event than you would at any other kind of mainstream music event.

[hullsoul]

Beer is definitely the drug of choice these days for most.I like a drink as much as anyone (more then most some would say ) but most weekends I'm driving to some venue or other so don't get the chance that often but the wife enjoys a drink & providing it enhances your night & you aren't pissed slumped in a corner I don't see much wrong with it.I think the problem is who is getting drunk at "do's"?A soulie who has been brought up on the scene even when pissed knows not to take his/her drink on the dancefloor,not to take the piss out the way someone dances,go & abuse a dj for not playing what they like/know etc. But unfortunately someone without being brought up in the etiquettes of the scene just reverts to been a drunken lout & all the behaviour that comes with it,that's life I'm afraid?

Cheers

Martyn

Edited November 29, 2012 by hullsoul

[Guest MrC]

Beer is definitely the drug of choice these days for most.I like a drink as much as anyone (more then most some would say ) but most weekends I'm driving to some venue or other so don't get the chance that often but the wife enjoys a drink & providing it enhances your night & you aren't pissed slumped in a corner I don't see much wrong with it.I think the problem is who is getting drunk at "do's"?A soulie who has been brought up on the scene even when pissed knows not to take his/her drink on the dancefloor,not to take the piss out the way someone dances,go & abuse a dj for not playing what they like/know etc. But unfortunately someone without being brought up in the etiquettes of the scene just reverts to been a drunken lout & all the behaviour that comes with it,that's life I'm afraid?

Cheers

Martyn

Aren't all the venues you visit 'without alcohol' Martyn? Or is that just for the people who arrive half an hour later than you......

[hullsoul]

Aren't all the venues you visit 'without alcohol' Martyn? Or is that just for the people who arrive half an hour later than you......

Paul

Lynn doesn't drink that much

Cheers

Martyn

[Len]

I generally go for the music, not to get drunk

I generally go for the dr*gs, I can’t stand the music

Seriously though, I don't care what others do, as long as they know the general etiquette - It's actually hard to tell how wasted / p*ssed / 'glue sniffed up' or whatever these people are anyway, because they don't have that - "Look ya f*ckers, I'm really drunk" - thing going on.

Whether an atmosphere where everyone is on the one 'thing' would be different if all on another 'thing', well I think that's a certainty. It would be interesting to analyse the difference......Not sure about the one where everyone's been Glue Sniffing though!

But in answer to the original question - Not quite, but more so as time goes on.

All the best,

Len

Edited November 29, 2012 by LEN

[Guest db121]

And some tunes do sound better after 10 Pints !!!

You need 10 pints before you listen to some underplayed rare tunes and a lot of others

[Guest manusf3a]

ive even been to places and caught people laughing and enjoying themselves, what will they think of next shocking.

My God! have you got names,times places, to send off to the correct department of the National soul police,special investigation branch,these people can not be allowed to get away with it!!!!!!!!! signed. horrified of suburbia.

[Guest manusf3a]

Its a good job the soul police appear to be self funding ,a voluntary organisation or so it appears,perhaps a percentage of the takings from soul nights and nighters and all sales of merchandise go towards their funding and research costs,like a form of covert taxation.

The "force",seems to be growing at an ever increasing rate,constantly expanding with ever more speciallist divisions,out of the major division of their labour,(1)music based (2)non music based,it is sub divisions of (2) that are growing in number at a phenomenal rate,we have...

(A)Gear squad,the longest established of this set of sub divisions

(B)The Beer squad......rapidly catching up with the Gear squad in number of investigations.

(The dance squad...also well established but a rapidly expanding area with remarks of old v new in terms of dancers age,those let us say "younger",folk taking the piss out of what they call the "Wigan walkers? and the so called "walkers",criticism of the trainee at "Rooneys soccer skills ,type step (but without the ball)trick of one foot behind the other "default step".This branch could well come to rival the Gear squad so intense seems the commitment of its constables to the cause!could well result in internal conflict being the driving force for the creation of a internal policing department of the soul police to handle affairs like such arising when younger and not so younger constables withing the squad set about each other with ridicules and insult as to the others dance steps and stop concentrating 100% on the out group non squad members of the soul scene.

(d)The no laughing and smiling here ,move along theres nothing to laugh and smile and enjoy yourself about at a soul do! squad!,this branch may be viewed as perhaps the most darkt and sinister of them all,to be a member you must have a real," I want to kill christmass,shoot bambi ,ban birthdays," personality to even pass the first entrance exam. Particulary sour faced individuals have been known to be fast tracked into this elite squad,and are oft seen as those who will go on to high rank.

Theres more of course other squads such as the way to dress squad etc but they all go to show the insight had by Orwell when looking around back then and seeing the ways things were and what they will become.The famous (though his name eludes me at this moment on time)French philosopher who spoke of surviellence and the need to look at and patrol by keeping a watching eye on as [part of controling populations ,individuals,the no such thing as a private place scenario, would see the forces at work within the scene.Ah I remember the mans name Foucalt,if that is spelled correctly thats the one,French philosopher.

You know there may come a day where the soul police will have a health division along the lines of certain fascist parties(communists werent slow at doing it either)selecting by physical feature and health,waiting at the door of a nighter or soul night a booth with attendents ready to check if your hearing is perfect,if not no get in you must have 100%hearing without artificial aid to listen to these records played here,eyesight,glasses ,short,long sight,need artificial means lenses etc to read the very smallest writing or detect the faintest scratch on a record,sorry you are not good enough to come in here and buy and sell records 20 20 vision folk only.Then to small,to tall,to thin ,to fat ,to old to young,cant come in you wont look good on the dancefloor .What a happy place such an event in total control of the police would be.Oh and of course hint of a smile,out,out out.

Edited November 30, 2012 by manusf3a