Poll: Bbc Culture Show - Northern Soul - Your Take ?

[Little-stevie]

3 from me....  I thought i would be watching from behind the sofa but not a bad effort and some of that passion that got us all hooked did shine through..

 

I will let Paul Mason off as he as been away for all these years.... 

 

It made it look like its just teenagers or  50 somethings, Wigan and then nostalgia scene....

 

 

We know there is so much more inbetween to this thing called soul....

[Guest soulsurfer81]

I don't think this show is really for people who are already totally and utterly absorbed into Northern Soul. To be honest, you can't possibly get it all into 30 minutes for a start. However, for someone like me, who has to explain to friends that just go with the tat we hear on the radio, how wonderful this music and dancing is, it's real a godsend. The programme is an honest portrayal of someone who was there (sad that the presenter had to prove his credentials but you can understand why) and, for me at least, the best bit of PR for Northern Soul I've seen in a long time. Had me tapping my feet and feeling lucky that I have a headstart at least on newcomers!

 

I love Northern Soul music but it is definitely one of those scenes were it's impossible not to upset somebody over something. I'd imagine the couple featured in the programme will be lambasted for one item or incorrect fashion or possibly a dodgy step (I've actually met them and they are really nice people!). If Northern Soul is to survive and prosper it needs to welcome the introduction of new blood, build on the legacy of those got it kicking in the first place and ensure it keeps on burning in years to come.

 

Looking forward to the film when it finally makes its way too!

 

Totally agree. The programme wasn't made for us! So it would never be as we want, even if we could include all the myriads of our music.

 

It is good to see that programmes like this are still being made and our music is placed in a wider cultural and social context. It would also have been nice to include more of the younger blood rather than the usual overused clips but you can only fit so much in.

 

I found it enjoyable especially as I was watching it with a non-Soulie.

[Soulman]

Paul Mason, away from the scene for 35 years. Were his clothes researched and funded by the BBC for his first visit to a niter in three decades? As for those two eejots who featured throughout... they make a mockery of the scene by turning it into a fancy dress party. Baggy trousers, circle skirts, just a case of re-living what they missed out on I guess whilst living a "normal" life away from the scene for many years IMO. It's what's in the groove that counts so FFS... GROW UP!      

[Sooty]

I'll say it because it needs saying....and is pert to the BBC's approach to the scene as witnessed last night!x

 

Yesterday morning a good 20 year friend of my Producer friend and now mine was having a meeting with the BBC Executives that deal with placement for music across the service and channels. In his bag he had some of our music which i've shared with you in here. By pure co-incidence....our friend has been a good friend to Ian levine over the years...dares to say he's been his 'guru' in such matters which Ian would acknowledge he has said! It came out in discussions we had when first meeting about our album. From my perspective it was great....somebody 'knew the craic' about Norvern and was out to promote our music and by default the Soul scene....which has always been my intention! I haven't been wrong! Anyway....his feed back after a lengthy discussion is that folk in the BBC are MAD...about Northern!!!!!x It bears out too. I hear quite often tracks backing trailers for this and that.....and ater last night I think because of Paul's approach and truth....I think it can only build better ties with the scene from within the service!x

 

We already do brilliant with Sky! Regularly Northern tracks back football montagues.....feature as links to shows...and all kinda bits and bobs. Soccer AMs Max Rushden and the show ownerTim are Northern fans....and loads come through that medium too. Max is a Cambridge United fan...we worked together often before he got the job....(Sorry Ian!xhehe!x). I had a cable show in Cambridge which he watched ritually back in 2001/2 and we used Northern stuff to our program every week! Lovejoy took on board some of our ideas.....even had Chris Kamara doing cameos of stuff I did on our show! So...the 'influence' has been there for years!x

 

ITV? Advert after advert feature Northern! Those folk like our mutual friend who deal with the Commercial aspect of telly.....are 'switched' on to it....indeed it is the 'buzz' word in the industry.....hence the super reception we are getting with our music....for the modern era!x

 

One of the hats I wear is as a media man and self styled journalist....I notice these things......and felt the need to share it!x The scene is in a good place at present.....it needs capitalising on and invested into the future....by all who have time served and something to give.....I reckon...X

 

LUV
SOOTY
X

Edited September 26, 2013 by SOOTY

[Simsy]

Well the presenter knew his onions, could still dance (just about) and spin. Boy was he proud of that spin! Elaine bits were great and the clips from the film looked interesting. Just let down by Ronald Mac Donald, as we knew we would be..

[Sooty]

Paul Mason, away from the scene for 35 years. Were his clothes researched and funded by the BBC for his first visit to a niter in three decades? As for those two eejots who featured throughout... they make a mockery of the scene by turning it into a fancy dress party. Baggy trousers, circle skirts, just a case of re-living what they missed out on I guess whilst living a "normal" life away from the scene for many years IMO. It's what's in the groove that counts so FFS... GROW UP!      

 

Soulman...I respect your opinions friend....but you can't say after 35 years....he didn't 'have it' still? It hasn't left him....a true soulie....I reckon...X 

 

LUV

SOOTY

X

[Daved]

What was the song playing as he was driving up the M6?

[Soulman]

You know I wonder about this drugs thing, it's being over played. Yep know a lot of people did, but equally a lot of people didn't.....

 

Glad you're on the same wavelength Steve. Presume you've read the new book. Why dedicate the first two and half chapters to the subject I wonder... no need!!!

Steve

[Kegsy]

What was the song playing as he was driving up the M6?

 

 

It was Testify pity he didn't play the much better version

by Johnnie Taylor.

 

Kegsy

[Pete S]

You know I wonder about this drugs thing, it's being over played. Yep know a lot of people did, but equally a lot of people didn't.....

 

True. About 50/50 I'd say.  I went for an exactly a year without touching anything.  The one night decided to do it just because the others were doing it.  Worst decision EVER.

[Pete S]

Wasn't too convinced about the film clips.  Bloke starts dancing, another one steps out from the sides to join in, then three or four more do - it just didn't happen like that, you had to do an apprenticeship, the older guys would not accept little div kids straight away, it took months and months to really get in there with the main crew.  And that guy dancing on his own doing those 'look at me' gestures, what was that all about?

(nb I do realise it's a film and not a documentary and the need to take some poetic license - just saying thats all)

And back to the documentary piece - yet AGAIN concentrating on a style of dancing that was all over by 1977 unless you turned up at the Casino on the two nights that they filmed in there, acrobatics had practically died out except for spins, but over those two nights, it was back again, and now in 2013 everyone's going to think that we dance and dress exactly the same as we did in 1976 and that's just not right.  

Edited September 26, 2013 by Pete S

[Kegsy]

Biggest problem for me was the assertion that 'the dance styles' emanated from Kung Fu. Just seen Pete's comment, and I know Keb used to incorporate some moves into the drops but please. 

 

 

The dance styles were there long before any of the "Kung Fu" stuff was even thought of, so how that

connection was made is beyond me. Also a born in 1961 "original" I think not !.

 

Thought the soundtrack was pretty representative, funny how pictures

from back then and Tobi Legend playing still gets you up the back of the neck.

 

Pity he played the wrong version of Testify too, Johnnie Taylor's version for me every time.

 

I'd give it 3/4 because of the emphasis on the music being the thing.

 

Anybody else catch the photo of Andy Simpson, think he was in Levine's record room.

 

Kegsy

Edited September 26, 2013 by Kegsy

[TheBigO]

Gave it a 4. As has been said 30 mins to cover the myriad of diversity (thats not the dance group btw) that is the Northern/Modern Soul Scene is never going to be enough and your simply not going to tick everyones boxes and keep all happy. FFS just look at the weekly rants that go on here, it anit going to happen. I got into Northern back in the late 70's and for me one of the biggest things, outside of the music obviously and the friendship etc, was the fact that as long as you loved the music who gave a f**k what you wore! I remember baggies and vests (me for a time) alongside circle skirts, rockabilly's (not Keb lol) skinheads, Mods, the odd Hippy (where is Sid Whitworth now?) soulboys and jazz funkers all in the same venue and none of us went up to the other to have a go about their sartorial elegance. All there for the SOUL!

The programme did very well in the time given and if it gets some new blood into the scene then great because we aren't that relevant anymore in the world of Spotify, MP3's and downloads etc. Thought Paul came across very well (loved him spinning in various locations across the world, nice touch) and Elaine was fantastic, summed up that feeling of euphoria on the dancefloor, that collective heartbeat brilliantly.

[Simsy]

Glad you're on the same wavelength Steve. Presume you've read the new book. Why dedicate the first two and half chapters to the subject I wonder... no need!!!

Steve

 

Quick off topic, there's ammo there for a poll if we haven't done it before - How important are drugs on the scene?

 

If everyone who normally does gear didn't turn up to the next popular nighter, there'd be the dj and a dozen dancers?

[Chippy Minton]

I think it needs assessing for what it was - a decent 25 minute introduction to the topic. It was never going to please everyone and was probably never intended to, but it certainly meant well. 

 

Everyone has their own take on the music and what actually attracted them to it in the first place. For me, without Punk I would never have been drawn in, as even though I'm certainly old enough to have taken part, I absolutely loathed the whole Wigan Casino thing at the time and would never have entertained going anywhere near it, although mant friends did.

 

It was an obsession with Weller and co that first ignited an interest in the mod thing, which then moved onto the soul and R&B sounds of the late fifties / mid-sixties. This programme was always going to have the Casino at it's core, although I'm glad that the Wheel also got in there, too.

 

Good luck to those that still feel the need to dress in mid seveties baggies and the like, it's part of the whole persona of the era and although it's certainly not for me, as long as they're enjoying themselves surely that's all that matters...

[Phild]

Quick off topic, there's ammo there for a poll if we haven't done it before - How important are drugs on the scene?

 

If everyone who normally does gear didn't turn up to the next popular nighter, there'd be the dj and a dozen dancers?

 

Which DJ?

[Stevie T]

Err! , was nothing new , different slant . Looking through my eyes , being into this for so long , its always been about the music and the pull that it has on me , kind of don't

have a say in the matter , it chose me and not the other way round ,but I tend to imagine it through the eyes of people seeing this for the first time, and can see it being a little cringe worthy ! saying that , the less people that like it leaves more room on the floor for us that do .

[Simsy]

Which DJ?

 

Toughie, but on our scene everyone is a dj, so there would be some fecker with his/her pro plus & Red Bull giving it large..

[Guest trickbag]

obviously he just didnt walk in of the street,he'd be to Clarkes dance

studios in Donegal St for lessons with larry.

waste of time,contrived,old hat,and time its forgotten about.

ricky.

[Steve S 60]

If anybody is interested in a review of last night's show by an "outsider", here's what the Guardian TV critic had to say:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2013/sep/26/northern-soul-keep-the-faith-review

 

Picked up on a few of the comments already posted.

[Phild]

Toughie, but on our scene everyone is a dj, so there would be some fecker with his/her pro plus & Red Bull giving it large..

 

Her? You mean there are female DJ's. That's a non sequitur, surely?

[Liamgp]

It was a more personal look at Northern Soul than an objective programme might have been, so I wasn't too bothered. What I would really like to see is a show purely about the music - taking say, 5 representative records and finding out where they came from, who recorded them, how they ended up in the UK and why people love them. That would be more interesting and put the music at the forefront where it should be.

[spot]

First 16 minutes were on the money for me, same old footage but still gave the old tingle seeing it & decent quality for a change. Have to agree with LDS to much emphasis in the program on retro dress, most of us pot bellied pigs couldn't carry off the trousers etc anymore & an arse as wide as a pair of French doors looks no better in a circle skirt btw that isn't aimed at anyone, just a generalization. The Bruce Lee stuff comes from Keb & "This England" but weren't the Teddy Boys doing a bit first, back in the day? I thought my Sis was young at 13 going to Cleethorpes but Sammy who said he was born in 61 & was one of the original boys must have gone at 12 when Wigan opened in 73.

 Just like Wigan's Young Souls I remember the older lads coming back from God knows where, later found out it was The Wheel or Torch, and playing Bunny Sigler - Let the good times roll, Willie Tee - Walkin' up a one way street,etc, and copying them dancing and thinking I was the dogs, till I met Snowy from Donny at Tech and that's when it all began. Seems Elaine's film is gonna be along those line, so could be the closest yet, I hope so for her and us. Finally Steve G, I'm afraid I can't agree about the Drug thing, and I applaud anyone who went without, respect, it was an integral part and planning started for procurement very early in the week, it's what made us different from the norm, along with the music and as Russ Winstanley said, "There was never a drug problem at Wigan", he was right, you never had a problem getting them.  

 

Take care, be safe & remember, " Let the good times roll, while you still can",

                                                                                                                                    Spot.  

p.s. Get ready for a mid 70's influx of Soul Tourists, ouch!!!  

p.p.s. Take the time to talk to Pete & Sue, they're actually very nice, committed people, to the music that is.     

Edited September 26, 2013 by spot

[Simsy]

Very good observation by me mate Dave...

 

"Northern soul fans are distinguishable by their tattoos, cloth badges and faces that say "I spent the 1970s doing spins and drops to driving American soul records in sprung Northern ballrooms between the hours of 2am and 8am"

 

That is a quote from the Radio Times from tonights Culture Show.

 

David Abbott

[Vynilhound]

In my humble opinion it was pretty fair, but the attraction for me of the soul scene ( northern has nothing to with it, as its just a label) was that it was not mainstream, we had our own sub culture and rules that only those that loved it knew about. As Pete said we all had to do our apprenticeship and learn about the music, which without computers and mobiles took a lot of dedication & leg work. Although as others have said we should welcome the youngsters into the scene, if only so there's some one alive to sell your record collection to!

 

With so much publicity everyone jumps on the bandwagon and wants a part of the action it just takes away its exclusivity, what next, come northern soul dancing on bbc1 with Anne Widicombe in a circle skirt!! 

 

Having said that, Paul mason was pretty good and genuine, a 3 from me, but no more publicity, keep it quiet I say!!

 

Cheers  

 

Andy

[Winnie :-)]

3 from me....  I thought i would be watching from behind the sofa but not a bad effort and some of that passion that got us all hooked did shine through..

 

I will let Paul Mason off as he as been away for all these years.... 

 

It made it look like its just teenagers or  50 somethings, Wigan and then nostalgia scene....

 

 

We know there is so much more inbetween to this thing called soul....

Didn't I glimpse you dancing in the programme Stevie?

[Winnie :-)]

Paul Mason, away from the scene for 35 years. Were his clothes researched and funded by the BBC for his first visit to a niter in three decades? As for those two eejots who featured throughout... they make a mockery of the scene by turning it into a fancy dress party. Baggy trousers, circle skirts, just a case of re-living what they missed out on I guess whilst living a "normal" life away from the scene for many years IMO. It's what's in the groove that counts so FFS... GROW UP!      

I think that's really harsh. I'm not a lover of baggies/circle skirts myself, but if you know these two at all you'd know they're extremely dedicated, and not just arrived and got dressed up. They run a successful nighter and soul night, and neither have any airs or graces. 

[Citizen P]

 what next, come northern soul dancing on bbc1 with Anne Widicombe in a circle skirt!! 

 

 

 

Andy

 

 

Only one problem with that....

 

 These days she wouldn't look out of place 

[Alison H]

I think that's really harsh. I'm not a lover of baggies/circle skirts myself, but if you know these two at all you'd know they're extremely dedicated, and not just arrived and got dressed up. They run a successful nighter and soul night, and neither have any airs or graces.

I completely agree Winnie about being harsh on Pete & Susan. Their scene is different to the scene that I was brought up on, and I admire their passion. I personally don't have that strong passion anymore, I still have soul in my blood (gosh that sounds really cheesy lol) I just don't feel the need to have a soul weekend every weekend like I used to.

Like I said on the other thread, the programme didn't reflect the whole scene, which was fine in my book, as some things are best kept a secret & as underground as possible

4 out of 5 from me.

Soundtrack was obviously superb :o))

Regards

Ali x

Edited September 26, 2013 by Alison H

[Winnie :-)]

Only one problem with that....

 

 These days she wouldn't look out of place 

In fairness I think the women have worn a lot better than us lot

[Maark]

Here's a text I had from a non soulie but music loving mate after last nights programme.

 

'U watching the culture show? It's all about Northern Soul. It's Brilliant. Making me wanna join in.........'

 

Whether it ends up being a good or bad thing if my mate, or loads like him around the country do join may depend on your perspective........

[Guest scottie]

it could`ve been a lot worse and i think everyone involved had the best of intentions would be interested too see what the viewing figures were cos i have a feeling a large percentage would have already been into northern so maybe it was  preaching to the converted.as to how people dress, after the music what i found appealing when i first started out discovering soul music around 82 was the lack of dress code and i hope it continues.the music is too powerful to let the width o someones breeks distract me.bottom line for me it proved that northern soul didnt die when the casino shut and thats got to be a good thing

[Sooty]

If anybody is interested in a review of last night's show by an "outsider", here's what the Guardian TV critic had to say:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2013/sep/26/northern-soul-keep-the-faith-review

 

Picked up on a few of the comments already posted.

 

Super stuff Rebecca!!x Get ure ar*e to a gig...u'll luv it!!x

@@

~

LUV

SOOTY

X

[Winnie :-)]

If anybody is interested in a review of last night's show by an "outsider", here's what the Guardian TV critic had to say:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2013/sep/26/northern-soul-keep-the-faith-review

 

Picked up on a few of the comments already posted.

Enjoyed the review Steve, cheers for posting

[Guest scottie]

I think that's really harsh. I'm not a lover of baggies/circle skirts myself, but if you know these two at all you'd know they're extremely dedicated, and not just arrived and got dressed up. They run a successful nighter and soul night, and neither have any airs or graces. 

 

I think that's really harsh. I'm not a lover of baggies/circle skirts myself, but if you know these two at all you'd know they're extremely dedicated, and not just arrived and got dressed up. They run a successful nighter and soul night, and neither have any airs or graces. 

youre right winnie i see pete &sue  sometimes at the central in leeds or at the black bee  and spoke to pete in blackpool and they are two of the most friendly and approachable people out there and their dedication is second to none and if people are gony get upset by a pair o baggie pants im gony really throw the cat amongst the pigeons and start wearin ma kilt to dos` including kicks and spins heehhee.love to all.x

[Citizen P]

In fairness I think the women have worn a lot better than us lot

 

 

you can, of course, only speak for yourself...

[Steve S 60]

Enjoyed the review Steve, cheers for posting

 

Thanks Win, but I'd like to point out I'm not a Guardian reader.

[Davetay]

The dance styles were there long before any of the "Kung Fu" stuff was even thought of, so how that

connection was made is beyond me. Also a born in 1961 "original" I think not !.

 

Thought the soundtrack was pretty representative, funny how pictures

from back then and Tobi Legend playing still gets you up the back of the neck.

 

Pity he played the wrong version of Testify too, Johnnie Taylor's version for me every time.

 

I'd give it 3/4 because of the emphasis on the music being the thing.

 

Anybody else catch the photo of Andy Simpson, think he was in Levine's record room.

 

Kegsy

Yeah, I clocked Andy's photo.

And on a sadder note, a few peps no longer with us from the older footage.

[Guest Simon]

I gave it a 3, it was an enjoyable half hours entertainment that i wished had gone on longer.

 

Paul Mason came across very well & with passion, as he generally does on Newsnight.

 

Simon

[Stevie T]

I completely agree Winnie about being harsh on Pete & Susan. Their scene is different to the scene that I was brought up on, and I admire their passion. I personally don't have that strong passion anymore, I still have soul in my blood (gosh that sounds really cheesy lol) I just don't feel the need to have a soul weekend every weekend like I used to.

Like I said on the other thread, the programme didn't reflect the whole scene, which was fine in my book, as some things are best kept a secret & as underground as possible

4 out of 5 from me.

Soundtrack was obviously superb :o))

Regards

Ali x

pete and sue 2 of the nicest people you could ever meet anywhere , the good thing about the strange world of N.S is that can be said about 99.99% of the people , what other night clubs could you go , drink and dance in a safe environment . I can only hope for that reason alone more Kids get into it . including mine .

Edited September 26, 2013 by Stevie.T

[TOAD]

Didn't watch it and yet its sad that this has happened

[Soul-slider]

Enjoyed it but I'm not a baggy trouser fan.

Some good tunes played, Turley Richards 'I Feel Alright' sounded great!

[stokesoulboy]

Pretty well done, music was great and the filming was spot on, we all knew "this england" would pop into it somewhere, but for the BBC i say well done

[manus]

I think that's really harsh. I'm not a lover of baggies/circle skirts myself, but if you know these two at all you'd know they're extremely dedicated, and not just arrived and got dressed up. They run a successful nighter and soul night, and neither have any airs or graces. 

 

I agree Winnie I'm not a fan of baggies either but I've seen those two around at events and they are really friendly and just doing their thing which is fair enough I think.  

I thought the journalist seemed a decent guy but I found the programme overall a bit predictable and didn't really add to anything that's been done before - maybe there isn't anything else to say that hasn't been said already - but I know some non scene people who really enjoyed it so fair play.

[Kegsy]

Dear BBC

 

Who was it in your vast bloated empire that thought last nights culture show was a good idea,

What's to celebrate about the opening of Wigan Casino ?

 

As a former members of the Drug Squad we can tell you there was nothing at all to celebrate "back in the day".

Let us tell you what really happened. Hundreds of little toe rags from all over the country would descend on Wigan.

They would burglarise all the chemist shops within a thirty mile radius before going to the all nighter.

They would then abandon stolen cars all over Wigan before proceeding to nick another car for the journey home.

 

We see no cause for celebration the thieving little bleeders should have been birched !!.

 

Yours Sincerely

Messer's Cream & Turner (ex Manchester Drug Squad)

 

P.S. I'm surprised you didn't add insult to injury by featuring that B*stard Kegsy

Edited September 26, 2013 by Kegsy

[Steve S 60]

Dear BBC

 

Who was it in your vast bloated empire that thought last nights culture show was a good idea,

What's to celebrate about the opening of Wigan Casino ?

 

As a former members of the Drug Squad we can tell you there was nothing at all to celebrate "back in the day".

Let us tell you what really happened. Hundreds of little toe rags from all over the country would descend on Wigan.

They would burglarise all the chemist shops within a thirty mile radius before going to the all nighter.

They would then abandon stolen cars all over Wigan before proceeding to nick another car for the journey home.

 

We see no cause for celebration the thieving little bleeders should have been birched !!.

 

Yours Sincerely

Messer's Cream & Turner (ex Manchester Drug Squad)

 

P.S. I'm surprised you didn't add insult to injury by featuring that B*stard Kegsy

 

P.P.S.  Howzabout a re-run of Z Cars?

[Stevie T]

P.P.S.  Howzabout a re-run of Z Cars?

 Jeez ! now ill be humming that tune in head all day !

[Kegsy]

P.P.S.  Howzabout a re-run of Z Cars?

 

 

F*ucking brilliant.

Kegsy

[Winnie :-)]

Whilst we're at it, how come that bloke, Ian somebody or other, didn't get some rattle on here for that tie dye purple shirt he was wearing.......

 

Yes I know it was Ian D, before anybody takes me seriously ;)

Edited September 26, 2013 by Winnie :-)

[Kegsy]

Whilst we're at it, how come that bloke, Ian somebody or other, didn't get some rattle on here for that tie dye purple shirt he was wearing.......

 

 

He was being authentic, he used to wear it to the Mecca in 1973.

 

Kegsy