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Guest Carl Dixon

Well, I was one of the dancers, as you all know and loved it. I love dancing, I did then and I do now. I love showing off, I love coming up with new dance ideas and love the notion that I am better than the person next to me and probably look shite. But so what!

 

The BBC was out of this world. The respect they had for us as a group and individuals was unprecedented. My wife worked for the BBC so have been to a number of productions for radio and TV in the past. Also I have worked for Sky TV for 24 years and used to work on their UK top 40 programme in the 1990’s. Bringing a programme like that together isn’t easy. It went like clockwork. All the staff were professional and even the young work experience bods that looked after us in and out of the building all afternoon were superb ( and some extremely interested in what this music is about). I was blown away with the enthusiasm of some of the young dancers. They seemed passionate about the same things I was when I was 17. In fact last night when the music played, I shivered down my back just like I did when I first heard some of those records in Hull. It was uplifting to see myself, how I was 40 years ago and humbling, really it was. I was chatting to the young Spanish dancer, who told me she heard two soul records in Barcelona and said from that day, this music will be her life. I nearly wept…..then I noticed the man next to me was stood on my foot.

 

I know it is not easy for some of you to accept change. That is absolutely clear by some of your comments and so be it. I see myself in these kids and want them to embrace the music for their kids! If there are the odd pair of coloured trouser on the journey…fine, it suites me…and I chuckle. Yes, some of the outfits were animated, but I thought some put a lot of effort into their individuality. One girl told me she designed her own trousers and got them made, just like I did in 1974 when I wanted to be different. It was a carbon copy of what I was doing. Yes, the gentleman with the flowery hat, what a great guy and so knowledgeable about the music. Not a bad word to say about anybody. He was a diamond and treated the kids with the utmost respect encouraging them. Wonderful…..

 

Ask yourself this, how do you think Lorraine Chandler will react when she sees all these kids dancing to something she recorded 45 years ago? Do you think she will smile graciously and encourage them or join in the banter on this thread? Let’s ask her………

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The only point of this effort was to try and highlight a film that probably so far not got sufficient funding to get a distributor.

So the media and business luvvies call in a few favours.

Let's get Ms. S to chat on the sofa, do a bit of all encompassing PR for the film and her music/ acting at the same time.

We have a ready made set of spacefillers/ extras to ridicule.....and they supply their own wardrobe.

The regular employees can pretend they are interested and dress like clowns too.

We can shoot some additional footage and it will fill the void and eat up the budget so next year we can expect the "Show" to be retained and we keep our fatuous jobs together with our fat salaries.

Or have I missed something......?

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Guest Matt Male

Well, I was one of the dancers, as you all know and loved it. I love dancing, I did then and I do now. I love showing off, I love coming up with new dance ideas and love the notion that I am better than the person next to me and probably look shite. But so what!

 

The BBC was out of this world. The respect they had for us as a group and individuals was unprecedented. My wife worked for the BBC so have been to a number of productions for radio and TV in the past. Also I have worked for Sky TV for 24 years and used to work on their UK top 40 programme in the 1990’s. Bringing a programme like that together isn’t easy. It went like clockwork. All the staff were professional and even the young work experience bods that looked after us in and out of the building all afternoon were superb ( and some extremely interested in what this music is about). I was blown away with the enthusiasm of some of the young dancers. They seemed passionate about the same things I was when I was 17. In fact last night when the music played, I shivered down my back just like I did when I first heard some of those records in Hull. It was uplifting to see myself, how I was 40 years ago and humbling, really it was. I was chatting to the young Spanish dancer, who told me she heard two soul records in Barcelona and said from that day, this music will be her life. I nearly wept…..then I noticed the man next to me was stood on my foot.

 

I know it is not easy for some of you to accept change. That is absolutely clear by some of your comments and so be it. I see myself in these kids and want them to embrace the music for their kids! If there are the odd pair of coloured trouser on the journey…fine, it suites me…and I chuckle. Yes, some of the outfits were animated, but I thought some put a lot of effort into their individuality. One girl told me she designed her own trousers and got them made, just like I did in 1974 when I wanted to be different. It was a carbon copy of what I was doing. Yes, the gentleman with the flowery hat, what a great guy and so knowledgeable about the music. Not a bad word to say about anybody. He was a diamond and treated the kids with the utmost respect encouraging them. Wonderful…..

 

Ask yourself this, how do you think Lorraine Chandler will react when she sees all these kids dancing to something she recorded 45 years ago? Do you think she will smile graciously and encourage them or join in the banter on this thread? Let’s ask her………

 

 

That's an odd comment to make. Change is what I want, the scene depicted as it is today, not everyone dressed as they did in the 70s and dancing to the same old records with the same old 40 year old footage of Wigan. I'm not being funny but surely you and those who participate and allow the media to depict northern soul in this way are the ones who cannot change?

Edited by Matt Male
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The only point of this effort was to try and highlight a film that probably so far not got sufficient funding to get a distributor.

So the media and business luvvies call in a few favours.

Let's get Ms. S to chat on the sofa, do a bit of all encompassing PR for the film and her music/ acting at the same time.

We have a ready made set of spacefillers/ extras to ridicule.....and they supply their own wardrobe.

The regular employees can pretend they are interested and dress like clowns too.

We can shoot some additional footage and it will fill the void and eat up the budget so next year we can expect the "Show" to be retained and we keep our fatuous jobs together with our fat salaries.

Or have I missed something......?

 

Last i heard I thought it had been picked up for distribution from a major US film company?

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:thumbsup: I've followed this topic with interest, (with a few chuckles along the way).   So how about the promoters of the 'upfront/rarer' side of things , contact the media , with the hope that they will portray the 'true' ethos of the soul scene, by allowing cameras into their venues?

 

    A lot of mixed feelings and opinions here, so if we saw both sides in the media (obviously we have a split scene?), then all of us can see what the other half are missing

 

p.s. I'm on the fence,   I loves me oldies, I also enjoy the soulful 'crossover', along with the Philly stuff and the club classics.  So if you want the world to see anything other than a retro scene, you know what to do 

Edited by IanP
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"A great british northern soul sowing bee, sports  and masterchef special " ???

..the specially chosen participants  could drive to the studio on thier renovated  lammies.... make thier own faithfully recreated  dancing outfits while listening to frank wilson ,the snake and other cutting edge tunes ,cook and eat chicken in the basket and maybe watch match of the day1978 presented by the man from its a knockout ...... who needs owt else..............

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Don't panic.........the one shows shit & no one watches it............I bet there's one tosser at work who does watch it & he'll tell the rest of the lads & they'll love taking the piss :(

Correct!!..........one tosser recorded it...........I still await the piss take :(

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Thing is Mark, it's embarrassing to us, a mature audience I would think, but to some of the young ones today, they would find it cool

The irony for me, is that I left the Mod Scene in the 80's (because I was tired of wearing the uniform) to join the, what I called at the time, "Northern Soul Scene" & was over the moon that I could still hear fabulous black music & not have to wear any "uniform" but hey, times have clearly changed, I still refuse to wear a uniform, but if others want to then that's their choice

Regards

Ali

Ali in a uniform my mind is working overtime ;)
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Guest MBarrett

Ask yourself this, how do you think Lorraine Chandler will react when she sees all these kids dancing to something she recorded 45 years ago? Do you think she will smile graciously and encourage them or join in the banter on this thread? Let’s ask her………

 

Funny you should say that Carl - time after time when there is some controversy or spat going on I think to myself "what would the artists say"

 

I somehow doubt if Lorraine will find her way to post 312 on this thread - if not maybe someone can point her here. I can't believe she won't be impressed with this new breed . . . . .

 

Anyway below are the relevant bits from the programme now on You Tube.

 

Lorraine - your starring role comes in at about 14mins 10secs. Get the family round you are on the BBC . . . . . ! :D

 

https://youtu.be/DXrDnCiaDEE

Edited by MBarrett
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Guest Carl Dixon

That's an odd comment to make. Change is I want, the scene depicted as it is today, not everyone dressed as they did in the 70s and dancing to the same old records with the same old 40 year old footage of Wigan. I'm not being funny but surely you and those who participate and allow the media to depict northern soul in this way are the ones who cannot change?

 

 

You have a point...it is odd. What I could have written is that by definition there is change or swing to a different agenda with this music for better or worse. On the one hand there is terrific passion for much rarer soul records being played at certain venues that don't necessarily tick the boxes for others. Yet, in some circles, reputable oldies and some rare cuts crop up which in essence is what I tend to like. A few years ago I would have just preferred mainly the oldies, but now because some of the venues are playing some interesting records that I have never heard before...I enjoy going and am curious. I too do not wear the style of clothes I wore in the 1970's, I am happy with my skinny Levi's, Converse and baseball cap. Never did the acrobatics, couldn't, thought it looked crazy and dangerous, still do...but...so what! I am adapting and as I get older. 

 

As for the media, well I hear you, but whether we like it or not, they will always be around. I am pleased with what I saw last night. I think they did a good job covering a small percentage of this evolving scenario. I personally think the term 'Northern Soul' needs an overhaul, because there are differing factions now up and down the country. The clubs have different ages and policies; there is this rare record scenario and the clubs that will drop in the odd 1980's track. Also the fact the some of the attendees wish to wear a style of clothing reminiscent of the 1970’s actually makes it ‘current’…like the records are! 

Edited by Carl Dixon
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Guest Matt Male

You have a point...it is odd. What I could have written is that by definition there is change or swing to a different agenda with this music for better or worse. On the one hand there is terrific passion for much rarer soul records being played at certain venues that don't necessarily tick the boxes for others. Yet, in some circles, reputable oldies and some rare cuts crop up which in essence is what I tend to like. A few years ago I would have just preferred mainly the oldies, but now because some of the venues are playing some interesting records that I have never heard before...I enjoy going and am curious. I too do not wear the style of clothes I wore in the 1970's, I am happy with my skinny Levi's, Converse and baseball cap. Never did the acrobatics, couldn't, thought it looked crazy and dangerous, still do...but...so what! I am adapting and as I get older. 

 

As for the media, well I hear you, but whether we like it or not, they will always be around. I am pleased with what I saw last night. I think they did a good job covering a small percentage of this evolving scenario. I personally think the term 'Northern Soul' needs an overhaul, because there are differing factions now up and down the country. The clubs have different ages and policies; there is this rare record scenario and the clubs that will drop in the odd 1980's track. Also the fact the some of the attendees wish to wear a style of clothing reminiscent of the 1970’s actually makes it ‘current’…like the records are! 

 

 

Personally if I had been you or anyone there last night, the second I saw Matt and Alex dressed like that I would have walked. They were taking the p**s and it's not on. Let the media cover the scene any way they want, but I wouldn't be a part of it just for a few minutes on telly and I can't understand why anyone would, fair play to those that did take part, but that's just me.

Edited by Matt Male
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Guest MBarrett

World Champions ??

 

I was actually more impressed when he said his brother is a world boxing champion.

 

I know even that is a bit devalued nowadays. When I was a kid there were 8 weights and 8 world champions. :yes:

 

But anyone know who is brother is?

Edited by MBarrett
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Guest Carl Dixon

I guess it's tongue in cheek Matt. I must admit I was smiling.

 

A woman behind the barrier said to me 'what's with the clothing'! Then she said it looked smart. I was right next to the decks and I could see and hear what was going on with the public and BBC staff because the music was not played loud. In fact at one stage you couldn't hear the beat for some reason, so people danced without hearing any fills or anything. I heard two girls sn*****ing and one saying it looked fantastic. There were people with their mouths open ha ha! Can't imagine what they were thinking. I am sure you could come up with some ideas lol! One of the security guards said he was not aware of this culture and asked is it a new thing ha ha. If you look at me at the back I am facing the massive TV in the other building adjacent to the dance floor watching the programme and cueing on the dancing at the back because we couldn't hear the director. It was fun Matt....it will never be what everybody wants will it? I want to go back to 1973 where it all began, because I was innocent and green and learning. These days I seem to find fault with everything, but I am 58. But once I hear the music, I don't care where it is. There was never a disclaimer from the producers of these records saying it cannot be played on national television where it just might make me some money..because it was a commercial project back in the day for somebody. And yes, I was dancing on Green Park tube station last night on the way home. That was fun too.

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Guest BAKUNIN

A good dancer exhibits an effortless movement on the floor without the need for any "look at me " gimmicks or theatricals...the late Chantel (R.I.P.) from Bedford being a case in point.

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Guest brian smith

Worth watching for Lisa  :wub:  :wub:  Elaine, Sammy n Trickster didn't do anything wrong . Dancers where good in the main. Yeah parts were bit hide behind the settee ie the presenters. But seen worse on the television. Steve. Lisa :wub:  :wub:

Have to agree with you both. Yes a bit cringy but does it really matter. Great to see the young un's embracing the scene and the music. Surely that can only be a good thing?

 

Would much rather mix with the dancers than listen to the soul snobbery that seems to riddle the scene at times

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Guest Carl Dixon

The

 

Carl. What about calling it Universal Soul. Makes sense with social media being  universal. Steve

Don't know Steve. Something is bound to happen surely? Maybe not. A bit like that 'Lovers Rock' scenario years ago.

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I guess it's tongue in cheek Matt. I must admit I was smiling.

 

A woman behind the barrier said to me 'what's with the clothing'! Then she said it looked smart. I was right next to the decks and I could see and hear what was going on with the public and BBC staff because the music was not played loud. In fact at one stage you couldn't hear the beat for some reason, so people danced without hearing any fills or anything. I heard two girls sn*****ing and one saying it looked fantastic. There were people with their mouths open ha ha! Can't imagine what they were thinking. I am sure you could come up with some ideas lol! One of the security guards said he was not aware of this culture and asked is it a new thing ha ha. If you look at me at the back I am facing the massive TV in the other building adjacent to the dance floor watching the programme and cueing on the dancing at the back because we couldn't hear the director. It was fun Matt....it will never be what everybody wants will it? I want to go back to 1973 where it all began, because I was innocent and green and learning. These days I seem to find fault with everything, but I am 58. But once I hear the music, I don't care where it is. There was never a disclaimer from the producers of these records saying it cannot be played on national television where it just might make me some money..because it was a commercial project back in the day for somebody. And yes, I was dancing on Green Park tube station last night on the way home. That was fun too.

 

I always love your enthusiasm for everything you do Carl.  Sometimes I feel sad at being an old cynic.

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total crap...and lets hope the dancers in the film are better than elaines special moves on t.v.   

 

Agreed  - More moves than Bruce Lee - But hardly Northern Soul !

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Guest Carl Dixon

Carl, Man of you to own up. You are evidently a soulful guy but you can achieve this state of nirvana at any half decent venue every weekend in Britain. Keeping The Faith means just that, not smearing it across the TV screens because reckon you are 'better than the person next to' you. The BBC was out of order dressing the presenters as clowns and to get a young soulie do a backdrop for a biscuit was dog-training at its demeaning worst. You all looked stupid in the wrong setting and should be ashamed for dragging the scene down a notch. This weekend I shall be celebrating my 40th anniversary of starting the journey at The Casino by listening to a live tape made that night in March 1974 - appreciating good soul music is a personal thing, best expressed in the clubs where it is rooted and in the company of fellow soulies, hopefully something that won't change. On this occasion, you let your 'media head' over-rule your 'soulful heart' and and exposed the scene to ridicule...

How eloquently written and sincere. Thank you.

 

For a moment I nearly thought you were right. I am happy looking stupid to some, but to others I am not. It's the story of my life. When I set out on my soulful journey in 1973 one of the things I nearly believed from those around me was that my affair with the music would end and that I would never get to Hitsville or Detroit and cut any of my songs. I did all three. I said I would find the musicians and thank them. I did it in the studio in 2008 and the media was there. It is in the archives of The Detroit News because I wanted it to be. As for the BBC...again, it's tongue in cheek, a little like 'Wigan's Ovation', Lenny Gamble....and Joe 90 or even the cover ups and boots. All part of the history that helps define the true music we cherish. If I need taking down a peg or two on occasions, fine, but that makes me fight stronger and reach for the stars like I did with my session. As for being better than the person next to me on the dance floor, I would hope I am..I did ballroom in the 1960's doesn't that count for anything lol! And I did get booted out the dance competition in Prestatyn which took me down more than a few pegs...but I'll be back. 

 

I must mention you say that good soul music...best expressed in the clubs where it rooted etc, is a fine and admirable notion, but it is not a reality. But part of me shares that concept a little at times. Just like that bottle of 1969 Nuits St. George, why would you want the masses to know it exists, so they can exploit and trivialise it? I can understand that. As for my media head, well, I work in the business and on this occasion I felt my head was saying no, but my heart said it had to play out like this for the bigger picture this time. I have lost two good friends with cancer, one recently....I want that next generation, his 17 years old daughter to discover the passion that her dad once had. It's the least I can do at my age...

 

Enjoy the tape..I wish I could join you and chat about the music. I would be even tempted to open the Nuits St. Georges if I had one to share, if you did drink wine of course. Tell me the first and last track of the tape. I am curious.

Edited by Carl Dixon
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Have only just watched it now as no telly so had to wait for it to be on iPlayer...  My thoughts in no particular order:

 

1.  If destroying all the ivory out there would bring the elephants back to life, I'm totally for it...

 

2.  Well done Mark for doing your part in keeping an older man out of an isolated lonely life and bringing Billy out with you to soul dos...

 

3.  If this is all in aid of promoting Elaine's film, why was there no real information about the film like a release date?

 

4.  Did I mis-hear or did Ginger say that the kids get into the clothing first and then discover the music???

 

5.  I'm out nearly every weekend somewhere with Dave and whilst I have certainly been to some venues (which shall remain nameless) that the programme was a valid representation of unfortunately, there are many more that are not like that at all -- long live Rugby!

 

6.  Where can I buy a cuddly lion cub to have as a pet???!

Edited by Guest
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Guest Byrney

total crap...and lets hope the dancers in the film are better than elaines special moves on t.v.

Just to clarify, that's not the Elaine who's behind the film.

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I agree with most of the above comments, but it was Lisa Stansfield's contribution I found disappointing. She had a chance to relay the importance of the music, after all that's what she is 'famous' for. I presume she knows and has listened to a fair amount of "Northern Soul" music.

But she didn't engage in the real reason the 'scene', for what it's worth, exists in the first place.

A few well chosen words regarding the wonderful music we have would have impressed more viewers than the obvious 'dancers' and fashions that the presenters/ producers fail to see beyond .

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:thumbsup: I've followed this topic with interest, (with a few chuckles along the way).   So how about the promoters of the 'upfront/rarer' side of things , contact the media , with the hope that they will portray the 'true' ethos of the soul scene, by allowing cameras into their venues?

 

    

 

I don't like that idea Ian. :ohmy:

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Strange that you want to change the name of the scene but haven't changed your baggy trousers for nearly 40 years :)

Ah Mr Dixon. You seemed to miss my question on FB? I assume you have now read Mr Byrnes clarification on which Elaine was on telly and might want to correct your statement.
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Guest brian smith

Carl, Man of you to own up. You are evidently a soulful guy but you can achieve this state of nirvana at any half decent venue every weekend in Britain. Keeping The Faith means just that, not smearing it across the TV screens because reckon you are 'better than the person next to' you. The BBC was out of order dressing the presenters as clowns and to get a young soulie do a backdrop for a biscuit was dog-training at its demeaning worst. You all looked stupid in the wrong setting and should be ashamed for dragging the scene down a notch. This weekend I shall be celebrating my 40th anniversary of starting the journey at The Casino by listening to a live tape made that night in March 1974 - appreciating good soul music is a personal thing, best expressed in the clubs where it is rooted and in the company of fellow soulies, hopefully something that won't change. On this occasion, you let your 'media head' over-rule your 'soulful heart' and and exposed the scene to ridicule...

Would that tape from 1974 have had young kids dancing to the music dressed in baggy trousers with shirts covered in badges by any chance? A little bit like the One Show portrayed. Strange how one is acceptable and one is isn't :g:

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Guest Carl Dixon

Strange that you want to change the name of the scene but haven't changed your baggy trousers for nearly 40 years :)

Don't wear baggies...but thin jeans, polo/t shirt. My original gear went in the bin in the 80'sas instructed by the first wife because I was weak and passive then.

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Guest Carl Dixon

Ah Mr Dixon. You seemed to miss my question on FB? I assume you have now read Mr Byrnes clarification on which Elaine was on telly and might want to correct your statement.

Hi Jocko, which thread on FB, I will take a look...just to clarify I saw some of the tx, but never heard it. My wife and I will watch it tomorrow or Saturday. 

Edited by Carl Dixon
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Ah Mr Dixon. You seemed to miss my question on FB? I assume you have now read Mr Byrnes clarification on which Elaine was on telly and might want to correct your statement.

Just went to bed TBH as was working early. Not read any reply but feel free to pm me a link.

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