Russoul1 Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 someone paid £245.00 for a natural four issue and it was clearly stated that it was a reissue with copied labels madness....could have got a real one for that....who are these buyers....must have the money to buy 45s so why buy a dud copy....strange world of northern soul 2 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Frankie Crocker Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 I totally get what you're saying. But I've said this before. If someone's dumb enough to spend even fifty quid on a 7inch piece of plastic (and I am more than dumb enough believe me) then they need to go in armed with at least a basic level of knowledge surely. I'm not defending this carry on but I do think the buyers need to shoulder most of the responsibility. Absolutely, it's the buyer who validates the transaction. On the other hand, we have a moral obligation to look out for our fellow vinyl gatherers when something toxic drifts over. On a practical note, it is annoying having to scrutinise the small print for fake labels when browsing sales lists. 2 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Billywhizz Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 The only trouble with threads like this is that the majority couldn't give a ****. I despise boots and re-issues personally, but it's gone too far now. It's one thing to have 45's that don't look anything like the original, but once you start scanning labels it becomes very dodgy indeed. It then becomes a counterfeit as it is trying to deceive. As far as the scene goes, I hate to be the one to burst some bubbles but......many of the so called big name Dj's are playing these fakes week in, week out at events all over the country, to protect their original copy. So what's the difference between your hero big name Dj, and the wannabe's? Especially when the same big name Dj sells his original copy yet continues to play the carver. After all, who would dream of questioning our hero's? The hypocrisy on the scene has killed it for me. I've even been threatened for daring to go up to the decks to check the authenticity of records being played by big names. Would you Dj with the Eddie Parker you had just paid £12k for? Hi Quinvy I know where your coming from, especially if someone is dancing next to the decks can jump the record, that happened to Kenny at the half orange when he was playing frank wilson i think he paid 17 and a half grand for that and he was quite cool about it. Afterwards i asked if it was an original "of course Billy I always play it when im out" Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Stateside Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 OBO - Original bootlegs only Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Popular Post Quinvy Posted January 17, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted January 17, 2015 (edited) Hi Quinvy I know where your coming from, especially if someone is dancing next to the decks can jump the record, that happened to Kenny at the half orange when he was playing frank wilson i think he paid 17 and a half grand for that and he was quite cool about it. Afterwards i asked if it was an original "of course Billy I always play it when im out"Mmmmmmm, not sure about that Billy. Unless you had the record in your hand, how would you know? It's like I said in my post, once you atcheive national acclaim, nobody will question your ethics.I can give you an example. I was very good mates with Guy Hennigan in the seventies, but lost touch with him when I left the scene around 76. I think Guy moved to Derby?Anyway twenty odd years later, I met someone that knew Guy and put me back in touch with him. We met up a few times as he was running various events and doing some Dj spots at that time.Long story short, a few years down the line and I started running my own Allnighters at Burnley. Word got out about what I was trying to acheive and the first couple of nighters were like a who's who the rare soul scene. Guy turned up along with many other luminaries of the scene. Guy said he would help me out by Dj'ing for me. Now at the time he was playing some very rare stuff in his sets, but I knew he didn't actually own them. So as diplomatically as I could I explained that he couldn't play any carvers at my event.He went ballistic." I discovered all these records" "who the f**k do you think You are" blah, blah, blah.He has never spoken to me since. But nobody else dared to question what he was playing. Nobody else could care less. The promoters are to blame. Edited January 17, 2015 by Quinvy 6 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Billywhizz Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 (edited) Mmmmmmm, not sure about that Billy. Unless you had the record in your hand, how would you know? It's like I said in my post, once you atcheive national acclaim, nobody will question your ethics. I can give you an example. I was very good mates with Guy Hennigan in the seventies, but lost touch with him when I left the scene around 76. I think Guy moved to Derby? Anyway twenty odd years later, I met someone that knew Guy and put me back in touch with him. We met up a few times as he was running various events and doing some Dj spots at that time. Long story short, a few years down the line and I started running my own Allnighters at Burnley. Word got out about what I was trying to acheive and the first couple of nighters were like a who's who the rare soul scene. Guy turned up along with many other luminaries of the scene. Guy said he would help me out by Dj'ing for me. Now at the time he was playing some very rare stuff in his sets, but I knew he didn't actually own them. So as diplomatically as I could I explained that he couldn't play any carvers at my event. He went ballistic." I discovered all these records" "who the f**k do you think You are" blah, blah, blah. He has never spoken to me since. But nobody else dared to question what he was playing. Nobody else could care less. The promoters are to blame. nice post ,good nights at burnley , k o k on billy Edited January 17, 2015 by billywhizz Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
3 Before 8 Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 How long its going to be when the boot goes for more than the original? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Frankie Crocker Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 someone paid £245.00 for a natural four issue and it was clearly stated that it was a reissue with copied labels madness....could have got a real one for that....who are these buyers....must have the money to buy 45s so why buy a dud copy....strange world of northern soul Just wait for the mug buyer to sell it on when he realises what a jerk he is... Bids starting at £250.00 'cos that's what I paid for it'... Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Popular Post purist Posted January 17, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted January 17, 2015 I honestly believe that if the owner of the £12K Eddie P plays it sparingly, then puts it up for sale in a years time on a 'Buy It Now' for £15K it'll sell in minutes, possibly seconds. A 25% profit on a years investment, - better than pensioners bonds !!! Why get so upset about somebody sticking labels on old boots? £3K profit on one record makes overpaying for boots, either with pretty labels stuck on them or just old 70's creations, or newly created facsimiles, seem like chickenfeed to me? If you dont know how to tell if a record is genuine or not, either on the net or in a record bar, then ASK. Our scene is chock full of folk who enjoy sharing their accumulated wisdom, you only have to read this site to see that, and record bars are exactly the same. I was once at a Niter, about 20 0dd years back, where somebody pointed at me and said to the person who'd asked him about originality " go and ask that soul encyclopedia over there". Now I don't profess to such vast knowledge, but if I don't know, I'll involve every person I know in the venue until we at least reach agreement on an answer, rather than fob the lad off with duff info. And I'm not the exception, I'm more the rule. You know how some kids love standing by the roadside and telling motorists who stop and ask for directions the totally wrong answer, then running off laughing, well I've never known that happen when someone has asked about a record in a record bar in all the years I've been doing this. Not even when the person asking me was a complete and utter twat who I really disliked - I still gave him the correct info and saved him buying a boot. Not because I'm a saint (not yet anyway) but because there's a truth to it which we all as collectors aspire to. Anyway, surely its now only a matter of time before somebody starts listing on ebay perfect label photocopies of rare originals A+B sides, so that folk can buy them, then get an old boot or carver, add a prittstick, and make their own lookalikes? A whole new hobby might open up, vinyl collaging [ borrowing a definition :- "An artistic composition of materials pasted over a surface, often with unifying lines and color, to create a new piece of art" i.e. an ugly old boot turned into a pretty mock original boot ] btw, off on a tangent, I was told years ago that colour photocopies of label scans are much more difficult to tell from originals than those produced with a home printer. Not convinced, I was then shown the proof of the arguement and I have to say at that time, about 10 years back, that the photocopies were much more difficult to tell than the printer ones, much more "real", especially on paler colours, but maybe things have improved with home printers over that time period? caveat emptor - the only way to be as a vinyl addict 4 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Frankie Crocker Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 https://www.ebay.com/itm/181637535018?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT here's an example - maybe seller is unaware, certainly doesnt say. Just crap cluttering up the place, poluting the music and the spirit of record collecting with its cheapness, and for what? For someone to make a bit of money and someone else to be an unnecesary dj - both though depending on other people doing it the right way. In response to above posts - no, I dont buy fake clothes either, but its not the same anyway ; casual wear isn't a beautiful artform that should be loved and respected, and doesn't support or sustain grass roots non-profiteering social culture. lot of us on here have been early on newies, had one offs, rarities, in demand records and acetates but haven't made boots of them or cashed in in any way. I'd rather graft for tenner an hour than squeezing money out of something good, that isnt mine to sell, or by creating superflous crap that enables chancers to appear on-trend. And I prove this by doing exactly that. Phil I'm shocked that big djs play boots on the northern scene, talk about having your cake and eating it. All I can say is that on the scene I've djed on for the last ten years - mod and r&b I suppose - I've never known anyone play a boot or reissue at a do ive been at. In 2008 I saw someone play that 70s mosquitos boot of manny corchado and pulled them up on it :-) should name and shame, I would. No good ever came of arse kissing, back slapping, double standards or cheating. Meaningful culture thrives on integrity. Clutter sums it up. Clutter in the record box. Clutter in the sales lists. Why don't eBay start a new sales category for Clutter so miscellaneous junk like bootlegs can be stuffed in there and serious collectors can be spared looking at endless pages of fake dross? 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Popular Post pikeys dog Posted January 17, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted January 17, 2015 I was DJing at a Charity do a few years ago and the DJ playing on the decks before me had several of these carvers with mocked up labels... As he finished his set with Jimmy Wallace "I'll be back", I picked up the mic and said "thanks to x... That was Jammy Willis - a bit like Jimmy Wallace, but not quite..." 6 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
phillyDaveG Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Surely we should be reporting these items to Ebay - this is illegal after all? There will be some out there who haven't read the item description properly and will be duped, and then there will be buyers who will get one and then pass it off as an original to the unknowing. either way it's bad for the scene, and bad for genuine sellers. 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Carty Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 I have to admit I was tempted by a Bob & Fred boot this guy was selling a few days ago.... I haven't been collecting that long and have about 40 singles and not a single boot among them... All mint but nothing really worth over £100. I love the Bob & Fred track and there is no way I will ever be able to afford (Or in reality justify) buying an original copy. If it were available as a legitimate re-release I would buy a copy tomorrow.... I would just love the track as a 45 single. I resisted buying as I kind of thought it would "spoil" the rest of my collection, but right or wrong I can see why people are tempted to hand over money. What I don't understand are the crazy prices for something that is really pretty worthless... Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Carty Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Sure its on goldmine sevens . Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Carty Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Sure its on goldmine sevens . Sorry guys , noticed this has been answered at least twice before in this thread. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Carty Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 What about if the option was between say owning Jimmy mack on goldmine or soul galore or having a look alike palmer stuck on label copy for about the same price ? personally i would chose the latter ( realistically i,m not going to pay several hundred pounds for an original, much as i would love one) quite happy to have my integrity as a " record collector "brought into question , however for me , i,m primarilly in it for the music and always have been and i enjoy it better in the vinyl format . i pick up originals , boots , carvers, uk , us ,first issues second issues, legitimate releases , emidiscs etc.. i can appreciate the magic of owning an original , also i can enjoy putting a disc on the turntable that i know is a boot and i know thats the only way i could own a vinyl copy . This topic re manifests itself daily on soul source , it always surprises me the depth of vitriol summoned up in some people when this issue is raised , my view is , you know of all the problems, threats.dangers and injustices in the world , a few stuck on labels dont really come on the radar(IMHO) . The guy ( and i dont know him ) clearly states they are not original . btw whoever bought that natural four had their hat nailed on big time . 2 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Shsdave Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 (edited) It has been. Came out on goldmine sevens label. Shouldn't be too hard to find and not cost a lot. in fact, a quick look on eBay. Here ya go https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BOB-FRED-Ill-Be-On-My-Way-THE-PARLIAMENTS-Heart-Trouble-GS022-/151548068175?pt=UK_Records&hash=item2348f8014fPi At least the likes of the Goldmine 45s, plus grapevine, kent, outta sights etc are legal reissues. If they help drive out the bootleggers then surely it's a good thing? Are all the Goldmines legal ? Edited January 17, 2015 by SHSDave Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Ivor Jones Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 (edited) I personally think that many people will be duped into thinking they have bought rare originals. Don't forget most of us on here know what we are looking at but honestly, putting comments up like "You Know What They Are" does'nt mean anything to most people. Its just snide and blaming it on the unsuspecting buyer is just wrong. The seller is just being economical with the truth and setting out to deceive in my view….I think we are actually in a minority, there seems to be a wide range of people who are seemingly happy to overpay for reissues[legal or otherwise],it happens on a regular basis on Ebay. People question Ebay but I don't believe they really know anything about the intricacies of Northern/Rare Soul record collecting….Why would they ? Edited January 18, 2015 by Ivor Jones Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mtay9778 Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I have to admit I was tempted by a Bob & Fred boot this guy was selling a few days ago.... I haven't been collecting that long and have about 40 singles and not a single boot among them... All mint but nothing really worth over £100. I love the Bob & Fred track and there is no way I will ever be able to afford (Or in reality justify) buying an original copy. If it were available as a legitimate re-release I would buy a copy tomorrow.... I would just love the track as a 45 single. I resisted buying as I kind of thought it would "spoil" the rest of my collection, but right or wrong I can see why people are tempted to hand over money. What I don't understand are the crazy prices for something that is really pretty worthless... I got mine on goldmine sevens Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mtay9778 Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Oops, I really ought to read the full thread before replying! It's madness what people are paying for boots! They are surely people who are relatively new and haven't got a clue. On the Facebook pages there are people who time and time again ask what's on in a certain area that weekend, they clearly haven't heard of soul source! I've stopped looking on eBay now for records. You have to trawl through hundreds of listings that are mainly boots/pressings with the odd decent original. They then sell for silly money. It's much easier on the likes of here or discogs. Fair price, you know what you are getting, none of the bootleg bull$ Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
John A Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I personally think that many people will be duped into thinking they have bought rare originals. Don't forget most of us on here know what we are looking at but honestly, putting comments up like "You Know What They Are" does'nt mean anything to most people. Its just snide and blaming it on the unsuspecting buyer is just wrong. The seller is just being economical with the truth and setting out to deceive in my view You might be right but surely when he says THIS IS NOT A FIRST ISSUE well,you can't get much clearer than that. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Ivor Jones Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Well John, I think I am right. To us, its clear as day. But, to a newcomer or someone less clued up,this is just a smokescreen. "This is not a first issue" is clearly not the same as "This is a bootleg" or "This is a counterfeit" is it ! Yet thats clearly what they are. All I'm saying is, blaming it on the buyer is wrong because I think in many cases people who buy them just don't realise what they are. Its just shit isn't it ? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
oficrete Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I deal in antiques . Ebay used to be a fantastic place to buy ,but unfortunaly it is now so full of fakes that I don't even bother to trawl through all the new just made to desive crap that's on offer .I just hope that records don't go to far down that same slippery slope As at the end of the day the big problem is the people who own and run ebay are only interested in one thing and that's money and don't give a toss what's on offer Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
pow wow mik Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 What about if the option was between say owning Jimmy mack on goldmine or soul galore or having a look alike palmer stuck on label copy for about the same price ? personally i would chose the latter ( realistically i,m not going to pay several hundred pounds for an original, much as i would love one) quite happy to have my integrity as a " record collector "brought into question , however for me , i,m primarilly in it for the music and always have been and i enjoy it better in the vinyl format . i pick up originals , boots , carvers, uk , us ,first issues second issues, legitimate releases , emidiscs etc.. i can appreciate the magic of owning an original , also i can enjoy putting a disc on the turntable that i know is a boot and i know thats the only way i could own a vinyl copy . This topic re manifests itself daily on soul source , it always surprises me the depth of vitriol summoned up in some people when this issue is raised , my view is , you know of all the problems, threats.dangers and injustices in the world , a few stuck on labels dont really come on the radar(IMHO) . The guy ( and i dont know him ) clearly states they are not original . btw whoever bought that natural four had their hat nailed on big time . Not having a go, but you say youre 'primarily in it for the music' yet 'enjoy it better in the vinyl format'. That just isnt rational sorry, you cant present it as a rational argument. Vinyl is only a collectable, as a practical means of listening to music, its long since been superceded. The only non-collectable value to vinyl is djs and collectors finding newies, which to date only exist on original vinyl. whatever way you dress it up, the reality is that its pretending to do something and somewhat inexplicable. I love music, I collect records. The majority of music I like, I dont have on original vinyl, so listen to on itunes, or burn cds and listen to them, how on earth would my enjoyment of, say, hamilton movement, be enhanced by listening to it on a pretend old 45? no vitriol; I just dont understand this weird in-between place, and I dont believe it can be justified. and its not a life and death issue, no one said it was; but that's not a valid defence of anything. I couldnt defend walking in around town with a scrubs on and stethoscope round my neck pretending to be a surgeon by saying that there's worse things happening in the world - it'd still be weird behaviour and you'd have to say I was a bit of a knob for doing it. And its not only terrible things that matter in life....more damage to civilisation is done by things like Croc shoes and Coldplay than you'd think. 3 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
pow wow mik Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Well John, I think I am right. To us, its clear as day. But, to a newcomer or someone less clued up,this is just a smokescreen. "This is not a first issue" is clearly not the same as "This is a bootleg" or "This is a counterfeit" is it ! Yet thats clearly what they are. All I'm saying is, blaming it on the buyer is wrong because I think in many cases people who buy them just don't realise what they are. Its just shit isn't it ? I cant believe that. I collected records for 10 years before I spent £50 on a single record. Fair enough, it was different times, but if people are willing to spend these amounts yet dont have a clue about what they're buying then they are still responsible, additionally lazy, dim and too rich. 2 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
boff Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Salvadors wise world boot £112 this week ? Unbelievable ......why would someone pay that much for a boot.....£20 max... Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Popular Post Chalky Posted January 18, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted January 18, 2015 Why on earth would you spend £112 on a boot? It has to be because they are DJing with it. It the argument was simply to play some vinyl at home then you get a carver cut at £30 and save almost £100, make the labels yourself. The scene was built and based on rare 45's in their original format. That seems to have been lost along with a lack of imagination. What happened to DJ's getting a set because they actually had something different to bring to the party and not the same as the previous DJ? The whole market has become infested with boots, google any particular record and you will get a result for somewhere like Juno with one of these lookalikes or ebay with the same. Ebay is a waste of time, far too much time wasted trying to find anything decent amongst the boots. What are the record companies doing about these sellers, surely they are watching places like ebay? Are they bothered? As for DJing if you don't have the records leave it to those who do, there are enough of them without the need to resort to boots. 14 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
boff Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I cant believe that. I collected records for 10 years before I spent £50 on a single record. Fair enough, it was different times, but if people are willing to spend these amounts yet dont have a clue about what they're buying then they are still responsible, additionally lazy, dim and too rich. Why don't these people do some research first before they buy..... It ain't hard... Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
oficrete Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Chalky , the record companies won't do anything because it would cost far to much money and time to pursue these individuals .As for ebay they aren't interested all that concerned them is the end product ,proffit . Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Carty Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Not having a go, but you say youre 'primarily in it for the music' yet 'enjoy it better in the vinyl format'. That just isnt rational sorry, you cant present it as a rational argument. Vinyl is only a collectable, as a practical means of listening to music, its long since been superceded. The only non-collectable value to vinyl is djs and collectors finding newies, which to date only exist on original vinyl. whatever way you dress it up, the reality is that its pretending to do something and somewhat inexplicable. I love music, I collect records. The majority of music I like, I dont have on original vinyl, so listen to on itunes, or burn cds and listen to them, how on earth would my enjoyment of, say, hamilton movement, be enhanced by listening to it on a pretend old 45? no vitriol; I just dont understand this weird in-between place, and I dont believe it can be justified. and its not a life and death issue, no one said it was; but that's not a valid defence of anything. I couldnt defend walking in around town with a scrubs on and stethoscope round my neck pretending to be a surgeon by saying that there's worse things happening in the world - it'd still be weird behaviour and you'd have to say I was a bit of a knob for doing it. And its not only terrible things that matter in life....more damage to civilisation is done by things like Croc shoes and Coldplay than you'd think. I disagree on several points , I much prefer vinyl to other formats , rational or not and for me i would prefer a vinyl copy to a copy burnt onto cd or on an i pod . if you dont , then thats your choice . also, yes i sit firmly in the in between place and feel no need what soever to justify it . Not too sure about the pretending aspect here , i,m not pretending to own an original, wheres the pretence? plenty more to say but my energy for this particular topic has run out, also , ive been overtaken by an irrational urge to give my vinyl copy of the mello souls a quick spin . Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
stokesoulboy Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Soussan is alive and well in 2015 ! Buyer beware I say Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Ivor Jones Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I cant believe that. I collected records for 10 years before I spent £50 on a single record. Fair enough, it was different times, but if people are willing to spend these amounts yet dont have a clue about what they're buying then they are still responsible, additionally lazy, dim and too rich. You're welcome to not believe it. However, no one will convince me that someone would happily pay £245 odd for a bootleg of the Natural Four when you could pick up a bona fide orig for around the same price[give or take a few quid].Its just not gonna happen is it ? They bought it thinking its the proper thing because of the way the seller worded it. Not everyone knows about records. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Dr Good Soul Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 If people are daft enough to pay for these fakesLeave them to itIt's upto them what they spend there money on. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Kjw Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 You're welcome to not believe it. However, no one will convince me that someone would happily pay £245 odd for a bootleg of the Natural Four when you could pick up a bona fide orig for around the same price[give or take a few quid].Its just not gonna happen is it ? They bought it thinking its the proper thing because of the way the seller worded it. Not everyone knows about records. A short while back someone on here posted up a thread about bootlegs / re-issues. He thought all issues were originals and this was from someone who DJ's and promotes his own event. So I guess that backs up your point Ivor. 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Sjclement Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 A Natural Four issue that has the same label on both sides and plays Call Me Eddie Bishop on the 'other side'........got to be worth at least £245.00 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Quinvy Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 (edited) Why on earth would you spend £112 on a boot? It has to be because they are DJing with it. It the argument was simply to play some vinyl at home then you get a carver cut at £30 and save almost £100, make the labels yourself. The scene was built and based on rare 45's in their original format. That seems to have been lost along with a lack of imagination. What happened to DJ's getting a set because they actually had something different to bring to the party and not the same as the previous DJ? The whole market has become infested with boots, google any particular record and you will get a result for somewhere like Juno with one of these lookalikes or ebay with the same. Ebay is a waste of time, far too much time wasted trying to find anything decent amongst the boots. What are the record companies doing about these sellers, surely they are watching places like ebay? Are they bothered? As for DJing if you don't have the records leave it to those who do, there are enough of them without the need to resort to boots. Yes but the ones who do have them are playing lookalike carvers because they don't want to damage their real copy on some badly set up deck with a knackered stylus. Or they have sold their original copy but can get away with it because they are "A BIG NAME", or they've just paid £12k on Eddie Parker and they don't want to risk it. If the promoters actually ran their events professionally, and actually knew how to set up their equipment. Then made it clear to the Dj's that they play o.v.o. or not at all, these records wouldn't have a market. And we would get rid of 80% of the Dj's overnight. Talk about double standards, and lack of ethics. Edited January 18, 2015 by Quinvy Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Chalky Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 (edited) Who is playing carvers Phil? I'm not one for going and looking at what is being played unless I want to know what a record is or if I am surprised by someone playing some major rarity/obscurity. You can set up the decks as professionally as you want but it all goes tits up when the DJ's arrive cause they f*** it up again as they have little idea what to do most of them. Edited January 18, 2015 by chalky 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Popular Post Cunnie Posted January 18, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted January 18, 2015 Can we just clear one thing up here. These records are not bootlegs, they are counterfeits & that is far far worse. A bootleg is an illegal press of an item but a counterfeit is made to deceive & that is regardless of what it say's in the ebay post. 6 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Soulskate70 Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I'm from the CD generation, and found over the last few years I've purely been listening to music via MP3 etc which is WHY I started to collect vinyl.. not a large collection, bit it's growing... With itunes/MP3's etc you never actually OWN the music and I like the whole idea of putting the 45 on the turntable platter and placing that needle on the record. Yes it's an old format, and not that practicle compared to a CD at home, but I like the whole ritual of listening to a 45... it seems more "real" (if that makes any sense)!!!!! I understand why some people are tempted to buy these "ebay lookalikes" compared to a re-release on a totally different label. A lookalike for £20 compared to £1000+ it to tempting for some, it's just the moral/copyright implications make it all a bit unsavoury, and some guy is making a killing on ebay, either selling to stupid people, or DJs using them to fool the public.... I would like to keep my collection originals only, and so far I have suceeded, but with prices for some titles going through the roof, this type of thing is bound to happen.... What about if the option was between say owning Jimmy mack on goldmine or soul galore or having a look alike palmer stuck on label copy for about the same price ? personally i would chose the latter ( realistically i,m not going to pay several hundred pounds for an original, much as i would love one) quite happy to have my integrity as a " record collector "brought into question , however for me , i,m primarilly in it for the music and always have been and i enjoy it better in the vinyl format . i pick up originals , boots , carvers, uk , us ,first issues second issues, legitimate releases , emidiscs etc.. i can appreciate the magic of owning an original , also i can enjoy putting a disc on the turntable that i know is a boot and i know thats the only way i could own a vinyl copy . This topic re manifests itself daily on soul source , it always surprises me the depth of vitriol summoned up in some people when this issue is raised , my view is , you know of all the problems, threats.dangers and injustices in the world , a few stuck on labels dont really come on the radar(IMHO) . The guy ( and i dont know him ) clearly states they are not original . btw whoever bought that natural four had their hat nailed on big time . Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest smudgesmith Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Not having a go, but you say youre 'primarily in it for the music' yet 'enjoy it better in the vinyl format'. That just isnt rational sorry, you cant present it as a rational argument. Vinyl is only a collectable, as a practical means of listening to music, its long since been superceded. The only non-collectable value to vinyl is djs and collectors finding newies, which to date only exist on original vinyl. whatever way you dress it up, the reality is that its pretending to do something and somewhat inexplicable. I love music, I collect records. The majority of music I like, I dont have on original vinyl, so listen to on itunes, or burn cds and listen to them, how on earth would my enjoyment of, say, hamilton movement, be enhanced by listening to it on a pretend old 45? no vitriol; I just dont understand this weird in-between place, and I dont believe it can be justified. and its not a life and death issue, no one said it was; but that's not a valid defence of anything. I couldnt defend walking in around town with a scrubs on and stethoscope round my neck pretending to be a surgeon by saying that there's worse things happening in the world - it'd still be weird behaviour and you'd have to say I was a bit of a knob for doing it. And its not only terrible things that matter in life....more damage to civilisation is done by things like Croc shoes and Coldplay than you'd think. "Burn CD,s ? do you put labels on them??? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Tricky Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Just a point about records in general.Personally at home or if i DJ i play the original. I have paid nothing and upwards for my tunes. They are meant to be played so i play them.That is what they are for. If you spend loads and dont play them you are just an investor and that is not what a lot of us ever bought records for. Tricky Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Quinvy Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Who is playing carvers Phil? I'm not one for going and looking at what is being played unless I want to know what a record is or if I am surprised by someone playing some major rarity/obscurity. You can set up the decks as professionally as you want but it all goes tits up when the DJ's arrive cause they f*** it up again as they have little idea what to do most of them. I'm not naming names on a public forum, but you must be aware it goes on. I'm talking about the ones that are out Dj'ing every week all over the country. As for the decks, you tell them to leave them alone, then you constantly check them throughout the night. That's what I did. Same with the mixer. Oi Dj........NO! It's called being a promoter and acting professionally. 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Quinvy Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Just a point about records in general.Personally at home or if i DJ i play the original. I have paid nothing and upwards for my tunes. They are meant to be played so i play them.That is what they are for. If you spend loads and dont play them you are just an investor and that is not what a lot of us ever bought records for. Tricky Exactly. But what about if you had paid thousands of pounds for them. Would you still play them? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Chalky Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I'm not naming names on a public forum, but you must be aware it goes on. I'm talking about the ones that are out Dj'ing every week all over the country. As for the decks, you tell them to leave them alone, then you constantly check them throughout the night. That's what I did. Same with the mixer. Oi Dj........NO! It's called being a promoter and acting professionally. We do check them and reset them but Dj's like to fiddle. They don't seem to realise it sounds different out front. 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Russoul1 Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 maybe this is the new generation of record collecting a new breed of collector whos intent of outbidding everybody to cock wave they have the best and most expensive collections of boots/reissues etc regards ebay havnt brought a 45 now for a age, and if I did put a bid on something been totally outbid....sign of the times and the growing interest in rare soul 45s whatever format for some..... Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Russoul1 Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 We do check them and reset them but Dj's like to fiddle. They don't seem to realise it sounds different out front. some djs just cant help themselves....have seen it in the past and rightly said chalky the difference in sound quality just tells you that something aint right and normally it isn't, went up to the decks of a do a while back for this reason and lord and behold there was a carver on the decks...and a well known oldies dj on the scene.....my thinking AS ALWAYS been if you havnt got it on original don't play it simples... 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Tricky Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I wouldnt buy a record at any price and not play it. Honestly. A record is intended for a deck. Tricky 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mtay9778 Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Just goes to show how many nights there are playing boots! But they might as well just play off a laptop and save the expense! Silly people! 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Steviehay Posted January 18, 2015 Author Share Posted January 18, 2015 I quite agree with a lot of the posts on here regarding this,yes some of us have sold and bought boots but at a said price not An auction if he was genuine enough he would have a buy it now and give the full information about these records this is a money making enterprise he has ventured into he could be reported to eBay but that is taking things a bit too far ,it would be interesting to know though where he got the scans from some big tunes he had sold in the past Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Lionelonthevinyl Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I wouldnt buy a record at any price and not play it. Honestly. A record is intended for a deck. Tricky I agree totally.....have dj'd a couple of times...can't say I like it, but, only play the stuff that's original...it's what the whole scene was built on.....from your cheap bits through to your more expensive....that's the way I see it anyway, and how it should be in my opinion.....Rob 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
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