Soul Sounds record label. Legit or bootlegs?

[Ik001]

Don't know if this topic has been covered before? but were these early releases issued legitimately or were they one of the first bootlegs to hit the market?

It will be interesting to hear the comments as I do have one for sale at present and although I haven't seen many for sale there may be many out there.

Many thanks,

In Anticipation,

Ian

Edited March 13, 2017 by ik001

[Steve L]

Bootlegs

[Ik001]

Cheers Steve. Thought as much. I'll maybe stick it on evil bay and describe it as such.

Best,

ian

P.s whilst on to you did you once mention to me that you had a French L.P. copy of Hank Jacobs with an extended version of Elijah rockin' with soul on it? or has my senile dementia started in earnest? 

[Guest]

I have an album with a 5 minute version on which I had a carver made out of to play out. You should see the faces on the dancers around the 4 minute mark.

[Ik001]

Yes I know. you played it at Rolls Barnoldswick which is when you told me. At least my memory is all as it should be. Do you still have the L.P. by the way?

 

[Guest]

Yes........Instrumental Explosion. I think it`s one of Mr Croasdell`s creations. You`ll find one on eBay Ian.

And I think you got me mixed up with Steve L but we`ll sweep that bit under the carpet.

[Guest]

There`s nothing else on the LP which is playable.

[Ian Stacey]

  Bootlegs all of them,

[Ik001]

6 minutes ago, Steve Lane said:

There`s nothing else on the LP which is playable.

Just had an eyeball on evilbay but can't find it Steve Lane.

 

[Guest]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/INSTRUMENTAL-EXPLOSION-Various-Artists-NEW-SEALED-SOUL-FUNK-R-B-2X-LP-VINYL-BGP-/162062834784?hash=item25bbb29c60:g:~y4AAOSwd4tT2UfO

[Ik001]

5 minutes ago, Steve Lane said:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/INSTRUMENTAL-EXPLOSION-Various-Artists-NEW-SEALED-SOUL-FUNK-R-B-2X-LP-VINYL-BGP-/162062834784?hash=item25bbb29c60:g:~y4AAOSwd4tT2UfO

[Jez Jones]

Integral part of our Northern Soul history really. I think they are quite collectable in their own right. Not many have the 'full run' 

...failing memory but was it Jeff King who did them ?. probably started late 60's.....I remember some of the older 'wheel lads' bringing back the likes of Leon Hayward and Little Carl Carlton...for us minions to drool over :-)

twas only a year or two later we realised what they were !...at that time it just seemed like a really cool label !!

Edited March 13, 2017 by jez jones

[Easty]

If you're talking about the ones that Jeff King did in 70/71 they have to be bootlegs. All the tracks released would have been copyright and no label would have allowed their tracks to be put out back to back with another label's product. Strange that they are now collectable and someone else has now started doing a Soul Sounds label in the same format. Boots of boots, that's a new one.

[Guest]

8 hours ago, ik001 said:

Don't know if this topic has been covered before? but were these early releases issued legitimately or were they one of the first bootlegs to hit the market?

It will be interesting to hear the comments as I do have one for sale at present and although I haven't seen many for sale there may be many out there.

Many thanks,

In Anticipation,

Ian

They are Bootlegs man. No two ways about it, but they are very collectible and kinda cool because they were really the only way you could get your hands on these records relatively easily. they are also like a little time capsule.....you can see exactly what the most sought after sounds were at the time they were made.

[Kegsy]

5 hours ago, easty said:

If you're talking about the ones that Jeff King did in 70/71 they have to be bootlegs. All the tracks released would have been copyright and no label would have allowed their tracks to be put out back to back with another label's product. Strange that they are now collectable and someone else has now started doing a Soul Sounds label in the same format. Boots of boots, that's a new one.

They were bootlegs, it's hardly a secret and neither is who did them, but they all have the a/b side of the original releases, I don't think any had "another labels product" included, "back to back".  Maybe a moot point but accuracy is always important.

[Woodbutcher]

14 minutes ago, Kegsy said:

They were bootlegs, it's hardly a secret and neither is who did them, but they all have the a/b side of the original releases, I don't think any had "another labels product" included, "back to back".  Maybe a moot point but accuracy is always important.

Only the 2015 "boot of a boot" was a mash-up with Chapter 5 and Mickey Moonshine , though quite why anyone would want to re-boot Ch5 and MM is beyond me ... 

[Kegsy]

2 minutes ago, WoodButcher said:

Only the 2015 "boot of a boot" was a mash-up with Chapter 5 and Mickey Moonshine , though quite why anyone would want to re-boot Ch5 and MM is beyond me ... 

Ain't that the truth Jnr, how either of those got a release in the first place is a puzzler.

Edited March 13, 2017 by Kegsy

[Howold]

Apologies if this post is elsewhere, me and technology don't go hand in hand and I might have pressed the wrong button twice!

 

Just in case anybodys' interested here's a list of the JK copies of Soul Sound releases. I don't remember seeing any for sale in The Wheel in them days but I was given a copy of The Sharpees for free from One Stop Records on Picc. approach in the very early seventies. There was quite a lengthy post on here a while back now and I have some history somewhere on the pc, if I can find it i'll post it. One thing which was mentioned was the quality of the records and a few seemed to think the pressings were similar to President and Jay Boy records. I have to agree with the comments on the recent soul sounds 31 and 32, don't think they would have got a look in back then imho. Anyway, hello to all the Wheelies, packed as usual Sunday, another great day Pete, vinyl floors don't stop dancers, dancing. see you next time. ttfn.

 

 

--SS1/LEON HAYWOOD--                                   BABY RECONSIDER  

--SS2/DONALD HEIGHT--                                   TALK OF THE GRAPVINE

--SS3/JIMMY HOLIDAY&CLYDIE KING--          READY WILLING & ABLE

--SS4/SHIRLEY ELLIS--                                         SOUL TIME

--SS5/HUMAN BEINZ--                                       NOBODY BUT ME     

--SS6/TAMI LYNN--                                             I’M GONNA RUN AWAY FROM YOU                                       

--SS7/GENE CHANDLER--                                  THERE WAS A TIME

--SS8/ROUND ROBIN--                                       KICK THAT LITTLE FOOT SALLY ANN  

--SS9/INVITATIONS, THE--                                WHAT’S WRONG WITH ME BABY   

--SS10/EARL HARRISON--                                  HUMPHREY STOMP

--SS11/ALEXANDER PATTON--                         A LIL’ LOVING SOMETIMES

--SS12/CHUCK JACKSON                                    CHAINS OF LOVE

--SS13/DEAN PARRISH--                                     DETERMINATION  

--SS14/PEACHES&HERB--                                  WE’RE IN THIS THING TOGETHER

--SS15/MARY LOVE--                                          YOU TURNED MY BITTER INTO SWEET

--SS16/BARBARA LEWIS--                                  SOMEDAY WE’RE GONNA LOVE AGAIN         

--SS17/MITCH RYDER ETC--                              BREAKOUT/I NEED HELP

--SS18/BLENDELLS, THE--                                  DANCE WITH ME

--SS19/SOUL SISTERS--                                      GOOD TIME TONIGHT

--SS20/DEAN PARRISH--                                    TELL HER

--SS21/L.ANTHONY&IMP’S                               GONNA FIX YOU GOOD

--SS22/CHUBBY CHECKER--                               AT THE DISCOTHEQUE  

--SS23/SHARPEES, THE--                                    TIRED OF BEING LONELY

--SS24/ROSCOE ROBINSON--                            THAT’S ENOUGH

--SS25/INCREDIBLES, THE--                              THERE’S NOTHING ELSE TO SAY

--SS26/HOMER BANKS--                                    HOOKED BY LOVE

--SS27/MARGIE HENDRIX--                               RESTLESS

--SS28/BOBBY SHEEN--                                      DOCTOR LOVE

--SS29/RONNIE MILSAP--                                   AIN’T NO SOUL IN THESE OLD SHOES

--SS30/DOBIE GRAY--                                         OUT ON THE FLOOR

                                                          (---49---)

[Petedillon]

Yes Kegs.  Def had original 'b'sides on those Jeff King things. I recall being fascinated by the fact that t'other side was in most cases, only the second tune you'd heard by the artist and was an additional bonus.  So in providing the original b-side Mr King did have some credibility!! I think!!

[Ik001]

3 minutes ago, howold said:

Apologies if this post is elsewhere, me and technology don't go hand in hand and I might have pressed the wrong button twice!

 

Just in case anybodys' interested here's a list of the JK copies of Soul Sound releases. I don't remember seeing any for sale in The Wheel in them days but I was given a copy of The Sharpees for free from One Stop Records on Picc. approach in the very early seventies. There was quite a lengthy post on here a while back now and I have some history somewhere on the pc, if I can find it i'll post it. One thing which was mentioned was the quality of the records and a few seemed to think the pressings were similar to President and Jay Boy records. I have to agree with the comments on the recent soul sounds 31 and 32, don't think they would have got a look in back then imho. Anyway, hello to all the Wheelies, packed as usual Sunday, another great day Pete, vinyl floors don't stop dancers, dancing. see you next time. ttfn.

 

 

--SS1/LEON HAYWOOD--                                   BABY RECONSIDER  

--SS2/DONALD HEIGHT--                                   TALK OF THE GRAPVINE

--SS3/JIMMY HOLIDAY&CLYDIE KING--          READY WILLING & ABLE

--SS4/SHIRLEY ELLIS--                                         SOUL TIME

--SS5/HUMAN BEINZ--                                       NOBODY BUT ME     

--SS6/TAMI LYNN--                                             I’M GONNA RUN AWAY FROM YOU                                       

--SS7/GENE CHANDLER--                                  THERE WAS A TIME

--SS8/ROUND ROBIN--                                       KICK THAT LITTLE FOOT SALLY ANN  

--SS9/INVITATIONS, THE--                                WHAT’S WRONG WITH ME BABY   

--SS10/EARL HARRISON--                                  HUMPHREY STOMP

--SS11/ALEXANDER PATTON--                         A LIL’ LOVING SOMETIMES

--SS12/CHUCK JACKSON                                    CHAINS OF LOVE

--SS13/DEAN PARRISH--                                     DETERMINATION  

--SS14/PEACHES&HERB--                                  WE’RE IN THIS THING TOGETHER

--SS15/MARY LOVE--                                          YOU TURNED MY BITTER INTO SWEET

--SS16/BARBARA LEWIS--                                  SOMEDAY WE’RE GONNA LOVE AGAIN         

--SS17/MITCH RYDER ETC--                              BREAKOUT/I NEED HELP

--SS18/BLENDELLS, THE--                                  DANCE WITH ME

--SS19/SOUL SISTERS--                                      GOOD TIME TONIGHT

--SS20/DEAN PARRISH--                                    TELL HER

--SS21/L.ANTHONY&IMP’S                               GONNA FIX YOU GOOD

--SS22/CHUBBY CHECKER--                               AT THE DISCOTHEQUE  

--SS23/SHARPEES, THE--                                    TIRED OF BEING LONELY

--SS24/ROSCOE ROBINSON--                            THAT’S ENOUGH

--SS25/INCREDIBLES, THE--                              THERE’S NOTHING ELSE TO SAY

--SS26/HOMER BANKS--                                    HOOKED BY LOVE

--SS27/MARGIE HENDRIX--                               RESTLESS

--SS28/BOBBY SHEEN--                                      DOCTOR LOVE

--SS29/RONNIE MILSAP--                                   AIN’T NO SOUL IN THESE OLD SHOES

--SS30/DOBIE GRAY--                                         OUT ON THE FLOOR

                                                          (---49---)

So where in the picture is SS 1011 Alexander Patton ? I'm sure the early ones were a white label but the SS1011 is yellow. Are these second issues of the original boots?

[Petedillon]

Ive read accounts of them being sold at the Wheel but to the best of my knowledge he started doin them after the Wheel shut?  He def sold them and to me at Hernies ( I think this was the first club to see them) which was around a year & a half (correct me if wrong) later. Can't recall them at the Metro but who can remember much from there?? Blurr! Could be talkin bollox but that's how I recall it 

[Howold]

Here we go, a little note on file says refer to discogs and yes its still there:

1st ever UK based Northern-Soul counterfeit record label run by Jeff King of Leicester in the late 1960's.
The 'Soul Sounds' label was run by Jeff, who was originally an importer and cottoned on quickly to the idea of 'Bootlegging' as D.J.s started moving into the Rare Soul Field.
He sold most of his records at All-nighters and through shops like 'Ralphs' of Manchester, England
The recording of these disc's was sometimes very poor but of course it was the only way they were available at a reasonable price. This label started a trend that has carried on through to today with labels like 'O.O.T.P.' and the 'SIMON SOUSSAN' series. Every record on 'Soul Sounds' came out on British release apart from No.1 'Baby Reconcider' Leon Haywood on 'Fat Fish'.
Eventually the law caught up with 'Mr. King' and he went to prison for one thing or another but he left behind the listed disc's of which there is now a following

[Soundsokeh]

I definitely bought quite a few at "ralphs records" near Victoria Station back in the early seventies , I sold up around the mid eighties so have none of them now, and I seem to remember a few others above were on different "bootleg" labels too , I think my Alex Patton was , and Tightrope by Inez and Charlie Foxx , possibly "Discotheque" too , but I had over half  a dozen of them including Leon Haywood and Tami Lynn and Earl Harrison at the time

 

always feel nostalgic about that particular label, and AFAIK the wheel had closed before I bought mine so not sure that the wheel trade is true (I suspect its false as I seem to remember working as an apprentice when these all came out

 

and yes I have also read previous threads , probably on here as well as on discogs about this particular label and JK etc

Edited March 14, 2017 by soundsOKEH

[Guest son of stan]

Nice artefacts, but looking back was there any need to bootleg any of those?Guess it shows how little we knew back in those days...

[Kegsy]

18 hours ago, ik001 said:

So where in the picture is SS 1011 Alexander Patton ? I'm sure the early ones were a white label but the SS1011 is yellow. Are these second issues of the original boots?

All the Soul Sound "releases ?", were numbered 10xx not just Alexander Patton, they came in 4 colours White, Yellow, Green and Orange, as to why AP  should be on two colours, I don't know, but maybe it was just a second run on another colour blank to meet extra demand.

[Vadnochka]

Being a Leicester lad - the Saturday morning trip to Leicester market - only when not playing football for the school - and a rummage through the boxes on Jeff Kings stall - all multi copy imports - nothing of any consequence - at least whenever I was there, but the interesting banter of the older lads about the Wheel / Cats, even the Fantasia. All alien to me at the time  (early-mid 71) but not for much longer as the lure of the Soul Sounds 45's and the term 'bootlegs' came into being - What very few of us knew or realised was that most of the pressings on this label were from early/mid60's UK releases and not in fact imported copies - Leon Haywood being an exception.

This was the reason that the 'boots ' came into being - import copies were almost impossible to obtain - everybody had the same 100 sound playlist with a few exceptions. A bit like the current situation but with 60's UK pop shite now being banged out by djs instead of proper sounds.

Getting to the USA prohibitively expensive and remember the USA is @ 3milion sq. miles in area - so where would you go - we had no real idea about Detroit soul / Chicago / Philly / West coast / Washington / San Antonio etc. - when my brother Chris moved to Texas in the mid 70's it was a real eye-opener - ask John Manship when he popped round after Chris came back with some remarkable sounds.

The talk was of knocking the sounds out at the Wheel from the boot of Blakey's car / Mick Potter etc. ?- it was a long time ago.

But not long after this Blakey had a shop called Discland in Belvoir street and sounds such as Earl Jackson, Sam Nesbitt and numerous British rarities were available all snaffled by my brother Chris and I

I remember buying Leon Haywood and realising quickly that despite being the No.1 rare soul sound - The term Northern Soul was not actually being used then - was great to listen to but a nightmare to dance to an opinion I hold to this day. My grandmas stereogramme soon saw off the limited play quality of this and most other 45's.

[Souldogbot]

On 3/13/2017 at 11:03, ik001 said:

Don't know if this topic has been covered before? but were these early releases issued legitimately or were they one of the first bootlegs to hit the market?

It will be interesting to hear the comments as I do have one for sale at present and although I haven't seen many for sale there may be many out there.

Many thanks,

In Anticipation,

Ian

They were definately boots primarily concentrating on the top sounds of Manchesters Twisted Wheel club. 30 in total which were released gradually so that you could afford to buy them all.  I bought them all arriving through the post probably 3 at a time if i remember correctly. I had many on the UK origonals but it was nice to have the set, Leon Haywoods Baby Reconsder had no Uk release untill quite late in the day for the Twisted Wheel fratenity (i was one) and has remained an incredibally rare record on import,

 

[Guest]

On 3/13/2017 at 21:15, Kegsy said:

Ain't that the truth Jnr, how either of those got a release in the first place is a puzzler.

You Said It......Mickey Moonshine.....The name says it all (Alvin Stardust comes to mind)!

[Chalky]

8 hours ago, dogsbody said:

You Said It......Mickey Moonshine.....The name says it all (Alvin Stardust comes to mind)!

Paul Curtis his real name.

[Pete S]

On 13/03/2017 at 21:12, WoodButcher said:

Only the 2015 "boot of a boot" was a mash-up with Chapter 5 and Mickey Moonshine , though quite why anyone would want to re-boot Ch5 and MM is beyond me ... 

That's not a boot - well The Chapter Five isn't - Dave McGerty, the guy who wrote the song, licensed it to the people who made the Soul Sounds release.  It's also the best quality recording of it I've ever heard.

[Pete S]

3 hours ago, chalky said:

Paul Curtis his real name.

Deja Vu mate lol

[Pete S]

Didn't Out On The Floor come out on Soul Sounds - that wasn't UK release

[Howold]

Well, we have opened the hornets nest on this label again, lots of new comments, brilliant, keep it coming. Whats this I here, Philly making a comeback, better hold on to them as well. ttfn.

[Blackpoolsoul]

Amazingly these are being sold as re-issues on a well known auction site

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/45Re-EDDIE-HOLMAN-Eddies-My-Name-I-Surrender-Club-Classic-Northern-Soul/303021694915?hash=item468d801fc3:g:jvUAAOSwhrpcMx6O:rk:1:pf:0

[Modularman]

1 hour ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

Amazingly these are being sold as re-issues on a well known auction site

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/45Re-EDDIE-HOLMAN-Eddies-My-Name-I-Surrender-Club-Classic-Northern-Soul/303021694915?hash=item468d801fc3:g:jvUAAOSwhrpcMx6O:rk:1:pf:0

Bootleg of a bootleg or legal reissue of a bootleg?? Unf*ckingbelievable!!!