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the epitome of soul [sandbag]


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Posted

I'm sorry for being a bit senile, as I'm sure there is already a thread, but: boot or real what are the clues?

thanks for helping an old fogey

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Not true. Firstly, the original master on Sandbag was owned by Mike Szymanski. He went out of business and Bob quite rightly 'followed his nose' to see if any royalties might have accrued. He ran into

'Sandbag' may be the original US release with an unauthorised edit removing part of the three string guitar/instrumental intro without permission of the producer Robert Paladino (in Tony Bongiovi's st

Thank you Carl for posting that. I like it.  Steve 




Posted (edited)

Epitome Of Sound? 

One clue is that stock copies and demo's have a small raised hallmark which can be felt under the label.

Previous thread with some photos:-

 

Edited by autumnstoned
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Posted (edited)

'Sandbag' may be the original US release with an unauthorised edit removing part of the three string guitar/instrumental intro without permission of the producer Robert Paladino (in Tony Bongiovi's studio/1967), but this link will take you to the official UK release 45 rpm single with the ORIGINAL beginning as it should have been. There has been no licence for a UK 45 or LP comp pressing previously..as far as I am aware. Therefore...this release is the legal UK vinyl release and original version. Pity I have not heard it at any event yet. It is worthy and respectful to play it. Every song has a tale to tell I guess.

YDLM - original studio mix

Edited by Carl Dixon
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Posted
2 hours ago, Carl Dixon said:

'Sandbag' may be the original US release with an unauthorised edit removing part of the three string guitar/instrumental intro without permission of the producer Robert Paladino (in Tony Bongiovi's studio/1967), but this link will take you to the official UK release 45 rpm single with the ORIGINAL beginning as it should have been. There has been no licence for a UK 45 or LP comp pressing previously..as far as I am aware. Therefore...this release is the legal UK vinyl release and original version. Pity I have not heard it at any event yet. It is worthy and respectful to play it. Every song has a tale to tell I guess.

YDLM - original studio mix

Thank you Carl for posting that. I like it. 

Steve 

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Posted
On ‎10‎/‎08‎/‎2017 at 15:08, Carl Dixon said:

'Sandbag' may be the original US release with an unauthorised edit removing part of the three string guitar/instrumental intro without permission of the producer Robert Paladino (in Tony Bongiovi's studio/1967), but this link will take you to the official UK release 45 rpm single with the ORIGINAL beginning as it should have been. There has been no licence for a UK 45 or LP comp pressing previously..as far as I am aware. Therefore...this release is the legal UK vinyl release and original version. Pity I have not heard it at any event yet. It is worthy and respectful to play it. Every song has a tale to tell I guess.

YDLM - original studio mix

Brilliant Carl thank you very much for posting, that's what is so good about this site you learn something every day about these Great Sounds. 

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Posted
On 11/08/2017 at 00:18, Winsford Soul said:

Thank you Carl for posting that. I like it. 

Steve 

Hi

I liked it too so thought I would order it for a Mate and I off a guy called Michael @ the 45 club who welcomed me ect.

I asked politely over the last 3 weeks if My order had been posted as yet I received fack all as a reply!

Good service Michael.

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Posted

Who says it's an unauthorised edit, the producer obviously thought it necessary, it makes sense when you listen to the longer intro version which is rather pointless and doesn't add anything to it...

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Posted
10 hours ago, whiskyagogo said:

Hi

I liked it too so thought I would order it for a Mate and I off a guy called Michael @ the 45 club who welcomed me ect.

I asked politely over the last 3 weeks if My order had been posted as yet I received fack all as a reply!

Good service Michael.

I also ordered one 3 weeks ago paid for it. Still heard nothing!

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Posted

If UK releases are your bag you're better off getting the one on 'Go Ahead' from 2010, complete with picture sleeve. If you can find one now that is, copies seem to have dried up. 

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Posted
13 minutes ago, Soul-Slider said:

If UK releases are your bag you're better off getting the one on 'Go Ahead' from 2010, complete with picture sleeve. If you can find one now that is, copies seem to have dried up. 

maybe best then if you edit that ebay sales advert link you posted asp!

On 9/4/2017 at 12:31, Carl Dixon said:

Keep chasing. The squeaky wheel gets the oil.

 

after recommending the 45 to us all, can you not go and give someone a kick to help these members out?

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Posted (edited)

Hi everybody

I am not familiar with the label or who runs it, or that there has been issues with its distribution until this thread. 

Robert Paladino was the producer of the track, played guitar on it, his brother the drums and Robert wrote the song. Let me double check that my facts are correct re the intro. Robert told me the intro was edited off by Sandbag without his permission. I will clarify. 

Unless you are a song writer, producer, vocalist, arranger, label it is impossible to speculate why something is done with a mix, a master, an edit, a musical figure on a release say, in 1967. YDLM was not written and produced with a soul scene in mind that exists today. I guess like any aspiring individual who is creative and produces a record, it's popularity and sales is what would give it initial worth back then. That didn't happen, and the rest is history.

I will also clarify my comment about this release being the official UK release too. It seems that my trivia is being questioned so I will double check and breath deeply. I can maybe enquire about the labels position regarding sales at the moment, though it is none of my business.

 

Back soon....

Edited by Carl Dixon
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Posted (edited)

OK, update. The Sandbag original 60s release had approx 4 bars of the guitar intro removed without asking the producers opinion or consent. The official UK release has that intro as it should have been, plus the original fade out done by the engineer at the time. It was only when Sandbag gave Robert the d j copy (black) and general (red) copies he knew it had been released!

Edited by Carl Dixon
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Posted (edited)

Although the original intro is there on this newish release, I can't hear anything extra at the fade out (It's possible there may be about 0.5 / 1 second extra, but I couldn't be sure).

I believe Gloria Jones has something to do with the label (A previous release of Tainted Love sold out , was repressed, and sold out again - That one passed me by).

Cheers
Mick

 

Edited by Mick Holdsworth
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Posted
1 hour ago, Mick Holdsworth said:

Although the original intro is there on this newish release, I can't hear anything extra at the fade out (It's possible there may be about 0.5 / 1 second extra, but I couldn't be sure).

I believe Gloria Jones has something to do with the label (A previous release of Tainted Love sold out , was repressed, and sold out again - That one passed me by).

Cheers
Mick

 

Not sure why that sold out it was a hideous remake

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Posted
1 hour ago, Carl Dixon said:

OK, update. The Sandbag original 60s release had approx 4 bars of the guitar intro removed without asking the producers opinion or consent. The official UK release has that intro as it should have been, plus the original fade out done by the engineer at the time. It was only when Sandbag gave Robert the d j copy (black) and general (red) copies he knew it had been released!

Removed by who?  

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Posted (edited)

The record label. 

I am doing some fishing re the 45s Club. I am on their FB site and the last post regarding anything was 12th July 2016, so something must have happened. I have sent a message, even though it is none of my business why they/he/she choose not to honour their orders or communicate with purchasers etc. The message has not been delivered yet. I would suggest nobody else purchase the single until this is resolved. If their site is still taking orders and there are copies left it suggests either holidays, illness, bereavement, or...other. Three weeks is too long and I have sold records from home and would expect to certainly communicate with buyers if there were any problems like local postal strikes, or mailer shortages (which I nearly ran out of)! May I also say whoever purchased this item has a contract with The 45's Club shop, not with me. I am not connected to the organisation or know the company. What I do know this version was licensed correctly with a legal release to follow. But I smell a rat. Back shortly.

Edited by Carl Dixon
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Posted

OK, my research has revealed the following and I am afraid it is 'other'.

I am not a company person, but it looks like The 45s Club has been dissolved. Check this link for details that I found:

https://www.companydirectorcheck.com/michael-greig-thomas-2

and

https://www.duedil.com/company/gb/08994317/the-45s-club-ltd

I could be wrong, but it seems so. So the squeaky wheel does not get the oil in this case. The ramifications are that contracts and royalties have not been honoured and they are still taking orders. That is grossly out of order. Is there a legal person on here that can help individuals remedy who have ordered and not received anything?

Whiskyagogo and Tobytyke pm me your email addresses please.

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Posted

I spoke to Michael Thomas in June because last year we ran a local charity event for the Gloria Jones appeal he kindly replied that the money raised by the Rock Foundation Soul Club went to the charity 

''The funds from last year have afforded a container of furniture and computers that will shortly be making their way to Makeni, Sierra Leone, where the school walls are now up and receiving students.
 
We'll be publishing pictures of their progress on Facebook also. ''    I never saw them photos !
 
I met Robert Paladino in Orlando over 4 yrs ago , we went out to lunch and over lunch,  he mentioned the other longer take and over the next few years he offered me it ! and i offered it to Barry Simpson  ex Carlise who know lives in Perth West  Australia . Barry as the reel to reel of the Frank Wilson'' do i love you which starts with '' play it again Frank just like that one more time  '' i thought it make  a good double sidder but Barry  Simpson declined .
 
Hopefully Robert Paladino  who is busy with his daughters wedding can confirm all this .
 
On a side not as a close friend of Robert he his currently wrote   a new work one for Johnny Boy Pryers which is fantastic it is done with expertise of Carl Dixon ! Robert also has other new works he is working on !
 
best John
 
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Posted (edited)

Looks like something has gone down John.

A concern is that the purchase of these singles uses WooCommerece/Progress Marketing for their  E Commerce and customer point of sale baskets. I wonder if I advise them there maybe 'technical' issues with the sellers site and they pull the functionality away so nobody else gets stung. 

I am on the side lines with Roberts song and production, available to help if needs be. It's sounding good already. It's early days. Johnny and myself are penning a new number called 'You ain't changed' which coincidentally, the horns are being done today in Nashville. Once the mix is done, then do vocals and b/v's. I have done the scratch track vocals already and once Johnnys is released, The Delgonives may put it out digitally. There is a strong chance the two songs will be featured on a 45rpm, so stay tuned for that initiative. 

Edited by Carl Dixon
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The thing that  really makes me ANGRY is Robert Paladino & Epitome of Sound to my knowledge never received any royalties ! An interesting i had the pleasure sharing Bob's new work & the strongest response as come from Australia then England & Scotland  & Wales . Hopefully once its Baked (ha ) Bob will add on to this site !

 

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On 06/09/2017 at 02:16, Soul-Slider said:

Sorry Mike, I was really just trying to point out what Pete S noticed....all that negative feedback! I've edited it as requested ok. 

Hi Guys

Had an email off Michael with apologies, saying he would dispatch my 45s.He didnt say when and I am wondering why in 4 weeks now they have not or were nt dispatched before?

Needless to say I will provide an update when and if 45s arrive.

Thanks

Keith

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Posted
On 04/08/2017 at 18:30, autumnstoned said:

Epitome Of Sound? 

One clue is that stock copies and demo's have a small raised hallmark which can be felt under the label.

Previous thread with some photos:-

 

With regard to the original question may I just add that the raised letter can be on either side of the disc as I believe it is there on the pre pressed blank. Dave 

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Posted

Keith, that's great. I asked for your email because I wanted to give you something. I believe the right thing is being done now. Let's see how it plays out.  Gary, have you had an email yet? 

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Posted
1 hour ago, Carl Dixon said:

Keith, that's great. I asked for your email because I wanted to give you something. I believe the right thing is being done now. Let's see how it plays out.  Gary, have you had an email yet? 

Thanks Carl

I have pm'd you 👍

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Posted
16 hours ago, rushden8 said:

The thing that  really makes me ANGRY is Robert Paladino & Epitome of Sound to my knowledge never received any royalties ! An interesting i had the pleasure sharing Bob's new work & the strongest response as come from Australia then England & Scotland  & Wales . Hopefully once its Baked (ha ) Bob will add on to this site !

 

Not true. Firstly, the original master on Sandbag was owned by Mike Szymanski. He went out of business and Bob quite rightly 'followed his nose' to see if any royalties might have accrued. He ran into me and I not only promoted Eugene Thomas of the Epitome of Sound but led Bob to PRS/MCPS where a reasonable Out of royalties were laying untouched. 

Since then he has a few licensing deals under his belt and long may that continue. 

A perfect coming together of the U.K. Northern scene and and a rare obscure 45 with a positive outcome. 

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Posted

Without a doubt, the story of 'You don't love me'/The Epitome of Sound is great. It could almost be a screenplay. Imagine from the original conception and practising of that song back in 67(?), to recording it in the studio, the label, US release, the British connection and here we are discussing it, dancing to it weekly etc.

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Posted

I asked Robert to clarify thank  you Kev  for correcting me ! And to clarify Michael ringing Robert in a few hours ! So should be more then !

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Posted (edited)
On 07/09/2017 at 12:43, whiskyagogo said:

Hi Guys

Had an email off Michael with apologies, saying he would dispatch my 45s.He didnt say when and I am wondering why in 4 weeks now they have not or were nt dispatched before?

Needless to say I will provide an update when and if 45s arrive.

Thanks

Keith

Hi guys

My update is not looking good😩

I emailed Michael yesterday and his reply was that he had "cc'd Will who is organising distribution, which means, I think? That they have not been posted.

My oil has run dry now and I am hacked off and recommend that No One buys from this bunch.

I will pursue through PayPal now but if I have lost my £30+ it is small biscuits compared to some unfortunate Souls.

ktf

Keith

Edited by whiskyagogo
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Posted

Very annoying for you Keith. Not a reliable source by the look of things. I am so sorry I posted that in the first place, I was not to know. Once again, if you pm me your email address I can send you a few freebies of my material to help cheer you up.

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Posted
8 hours ago, Carl Dixon said:

Very annoying for you Keith. Not a reliable source by the look of things. I am so sorry I posted that in the first place, I was not to know. Once again, if you pm me your email address I can send you a few freebies of my material to help cheer you up.

Thanks Carl

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