my Northern Soul Moan

[BabyBoyAndMyLass]

2 minutes ago, Steve S 60 said:

I've nothing against the wearing of hats as long as they're checked in at the cloakroom.  Only ladies should wear hats indoors.

Conversely I notice very few ladies wearing hats or fascinators at soul events, I would approve, if anything the gripe I have is with the women, flat shoes, court shoes, NO! When I go out for a night I want my women in Stilettoes the higher the better, but I'm not getting that either, even from my own Mrs! But seeing as the Soul scene is definitely a Church, your point is valid. ;)

Our soul events these days are populated by the 'Peaky Blinders' it doesn't bother me, and some of them are old Yate DJs and faces from way back, I don't have any answers, only opinions and as we all know opinions are like arseholes...

Nice one though Steve, a very clever response, as I would expect from a man of your standing! Made me chuckle and look for a good response, sadly all I came up with was this!

[Tomangoes]

Interesting points. Live and let live is obviously a nice concept, but not entirely being adopted on this thread.

Some folks go with whatever the flow is, don't take anything too serious, easy going, blend in, and then there's those that don't.

Just human nature and not specific to only this scene.

For the avoidance of doubt, if promoters are specific about music policy, most issues would not be issues.

The evolution of 'multi rooms' with clear music policy has to be a good thing. 

One size fits all just does not cut it anymore, that's if it ever did.

Ed

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, BabyBoyAndMyLass said:

Just curious about the whole newcomers/returnees/dressing up aspects of the scene in the 21C, what is it that people don't like? I know my Lass, 70s Wigan veteran and 40 odd years of the scene under her belt, has seen most aspects of the scene, and me since the mid 80s, her only gripe is that sometimes they can't synchronise their dance steps, and some have little spacial awareness on the floor and can get in the way or affect her 'flow' with the music, apart from that we both find the whole dressing up thing fun and although we don't feel the need it doesn't offend us. The newcomers are fun and friendly, plus I think most know that they can't  lie about any soul credentials, they'd be outed immediately. A friend of ours and popular national DJ, who shall remain nameless in this discussion really disliked the 'flat caps, baggies and trilbies' thing, but being the ages we are, a lot of guys haven't got the 70s flowing locks and curls they once had, unlike myself, so the hat thing seems only natural if you're self conscious about being challenged in that way. But the patches, the clothes and the people who want to fit in with what has always been a very cool scene, seems to us to be a bit of good fun and quite endearing.

A lot of them are folks who like to dance, like a bit of good music and want a safe night out without the local contenders trying to make a name for themselves, and I can fully understand that. Without the people that have joined in recently, would the scene be as vibrant as it is? Also those same folks, not being bound to the popular tunes that they know, may be a factor in the bringing forward of new sounds, not being stuck in the rut of wanting the tunes that were played on a big scale back in the day.

I suppose a great deal depends on exactly what type of soul night/nighter we're speaking about. Fancy dress with baggies, badge festooned vests and bar towels ain't gonna go down too well at a venue renowned for its "upfront" mega-rare playlists, is it? I was arm twisted into attending a weeknder in Bridlington a couple of years ago, and it was plain embarrassing to see modern day Divvies with glo-sticks and light-up shoes dancing in a circle. I remember asking myself if this was actually we'd all become, just caricatures of our old selves. Depressing really. Not as depressing as hearing Bobby forking Treetop twenty times in one night though😂.

Dancing? Hardly anyone can anymore. Truly. Certainly not like almost everyone could back in the early 70s. Dance styles changed in the latter days of Wigan, plus, any of the old Wheel and Torch guys amongst us are, like myself, feeling the effects of arthritic hips and knees nowadays, so just can't move like we used to. A shuffle is probably the best I can do now, and a back flip off the wall followed by a backdrop and the splits is no more than a distant and fading memory.

i think that all in all, I have to repeat what I've said on several threads previously. Plenty of venues offering plenty of different music policies, for plenty of different demographics. Pick which one suits your tastes, enjoy yourselves, and f**k everyone and everything else.

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, Steve S 60 said:

More the latter.  "Get that cap off, you're not a Wren!"

😂😂😂😂 think that was bad? Imagine what happened to me when I turned up after weekend leave in 74 with a bloody gold hoop in my ear!!!!!!

[BabyBoyAndMyLass]

Joey, funny thing this, my lass has been approached at many an event, 'You went to WC' this on account of her regimented dancing, as if in a tiny square, obviously recognisable of a youth spent in a packed out Ms. Let's be honest, and this is for everyone, while you may love to go to a progressive event with new spins, would you still want to go to an event where the likes of Bobby Garrett, MVPs, Tomangoes etc were played? We would!

We love our oldies and would venture in a lot of cases to say that if Simon Soussan threw it back in the 70s, then it isn't of the quality that we would consider now.

Fully agree with your last line, if you don't want what is on offer don't go, there is plenty out there, unless like us you live in Cornwall but that is another matter. We have Dean Carr who I'm sure you all know, Jerry Hipkiss, Ted Massey, but we also had Lee Vowles, Mark Sargeant, Jo March and more, pushing the boundaries, we had a good blend, Lee is sadly no longer with us but his spirit of adventure lives on, so we have St Ives which has a good blend with Dean, Ted, Jordan, to name but a few, but we also have Newquay with a much more progressive playlist, a win-win as far as we are concerned. And we get the dressers up and the newcomers, all welcome, don't forget that wristband sales equals events being put on, maybe not so good up-country but certainly good for us down here in the back of beyond.

[Guest]

Ha, funny, but I got the same in M's in 74, when someone said to me, "You dance like an old fart from the Wheel". It always amazes me when I look back at how packed the floors used to be at the Pendulum, Cats, Torch etc., and how so many people could utilise such a small personal space to provide a spectacle which was so smooth, graceful, ballet-like and mesmerising. Couldn't be more different than todays stomp, stomp, stomp like an angry toddler style.

Tunes? I was very well known on the scene for my attitude towards, and distaste of, the newer tunes being broken at Wigan after the summer of 74. Thats why for my final eighteen months on the scene I stayed up in M's, where I felt far more comfortable and at home. Even my DJ spots consisted mainly of underplayed (even then) Wheel and Torch tunes, interspersed with one or two I tried (unsuccessfully) to break. Funnily enough, several of those tunes actually made it big many years after I quit in 75. Jackie Wilson "Because of You" definitely springs to mind. It used to empty the sodding floor whenever I tried it! So, would I attend an event where the playlist was exclusively Bobby Garrett, Jackie Lee etc.? You bet I would. And I still haven't heard one single tune discovered since 75 that can hold a candle to "Oh my Darlin".  Progressive events? Not my bag man, sorry! I don't mind listening to newer more modern tunes at home, but if I'm out and about, just like the original poster on this thread, I want to be transported back to when I was seventeen. Just for one more (wonderful)moment.

Venues today? And the demographic? If you're situated in greater Manchester, the Midlands, Yorkshire etc., then you have an amazing choice, week in and week out. But, being down in Cornwall, the lack of real population centres makes life far more difficult for you. Relying on a few locals, and a seasonal influx of Grockles, effectively means you pretty much have to tailor any events accordingly. 

To finish, and once again at the risk of repeating myself, there's enough out there for everyone. Take your pick, dance like no-ones watching, and enjoy life. No need for oneupmanship, snobbery, or vitriol. 

[Colouredman]

Great poem mate, it’s clear you’re a wordsmith.......But I think there’s some things I’d have to disagree with.

Your poem here, is mighty fine......As an alternative view though, here is mine......

No disrespect to you at all my friend......But the oldies newies thing will persist to the end

What can you say about the oldies firm......Antiquated,  dinosoars, like Keegans  curly perm!

There’s never been a time when someone didn’t say.....“Play oldies mate, not The Ascots, ‘Another Day”.

They’ll winge wen the dj plays something new.......But I bet they did the same When they first heard ‘Do I love you’!

Now the same people dance to it all night long.......And talk about the memories which come with the song

They won’t ever  listen to anything ‘new’ ......And leave the dancefloor if they ever have to

How you ever gonna hear the next ‘Out on the floor’......If wen the dj tries it, yre already through the door??

Today’s ‘newbie’ is tomorrow’s ‘overplayed’.......And when it is, you’ll wish you’d stayed

Every ‘oldie’ starts as something new.......But  your poem doesn’t say whether  that occurred to you.

Am I to assume from your poem about oldies.....That you still crawl over cobbled streets to buy your Hovis?????

Did you cry when they took your horse and cart......Then moaned about Ford Escorts like  a sad old fart?

To some, a newie is such a big deal.....But if we don’t move on, we’re stuck at The Wheel!

A good dj has to take a risk.....While YOU wanna still buy ‘Soul Fox’ from ‘Selectadisc’!!!!

‘Im gone’ first played to an empty Wigan floor......Coz the ‘Love you baby’ crowd had headed  out the door!

Now it’s top of everyone’s list .....And if the dj won’t play it,The dancers are pissed!

Some dancers only want the likes of  Bob and Earl .....But if they’d had their way, We wouldn’t have ‘Tough Girl’

If an oldies fan is all you’ve ever been.....Wouldn’t you be missing out on Lady in Green’??

Not every oldie’s good And every newie bad.....Coz you gotta be kiddin  if ‘Paper Tiger’ is the best we’ve ever had??????

They moaned about Keb and they moaned about Guy, and about Billy Floyd: ‘My oh my’

I hear what yre saying bout ‘educate’......But the scene can’t stand still while the ‘Spencers’ crew  we await!!!

A progressive dj has to take a chance .......He can’t be concerned  coz you may not  dance

Some cried ‘newie’ when they heard the Montclairs.....They complained to FBI: Internal Affairs!

They said the same bout ‘Sittin in my class’.......“I prefer Mitch Ryder mate, so on Ronnie I’ll pass”

I’m sure we all love ‘Girl across the street’....But not hearing it for a night, wont  make your life incomplete.

Don’t be afraid to open your ears....A song you don’t know, neednt  be the worst of your fears.

If youre scared  to listen to anything but ‘Condition Red’.....You may as well not bother getting   out of bed.

If djs had never kept up with the pace.....We’d still be wearing ‘Tonics’ n dancing to ‘Rat Race!

Every ‘oldie’  starts as something new.....Even the Tymes and Superiors  ‘What would I do’ 

Every dj has to make key decisions.....To play Exus Trek, Mello Souls, or maybe the Precision’s.

In that decision you have to trust, but I do understand  for you Mel Britt is a must!

It’s easy to stand there havin a pop.....In your ‘Prince of Wales check’ and your striped ‘Tank Top’

If you think it’s easy, then don’t just sit.....Get up there and wow em with the Funky Sisters ‘Do it to it’!!

I bet you hate Lewis; as in Herman.......But I’m sure you love your brogues,and your check Ben Sherman.

I hope you’ve understood what I’ve been sayin......Don’t get upset coz a new tune is playin.

Open your ears and give them a chance......You may hear something good which will make you dance.

But if you want to stay stuck in oldies apathy......Let’s  bring back ‘Crossroads’ Flares, n Black and white TV!!!!!!!

I do understand you love  the top 500 hits....Bet u also hate ‘Breaking Bad’ but  love the ‘Banana Splits’???

Don’t be offended coz I’ve taken the P_ss....I’m only trying to ensure a great new tune you don’t miss.

I’m sure yre a real nice guy and such, even if you won’t  dance when the dj is  Butch!

Next time yre out in your Bowling Shirt, and your Mrs is wearing her twirly flared skirt.

Spare a thought for the poor Dee jay.....Who’s trying to play a ‘newie’ like Jimmie Raye!!!!!!!!

While YOU stand there in yer ‘Pork Pie Hat’....Saying... “listen lad, we don’t want none of that”!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[BabyBoyAndMyLass]

2 minutes ago, colouredman said:

<snip>

 

Nice one Tim!

[Colouredman]

Lol, cheers😂😂😂

[Guest]

1 hour ago, tomangoes said:

Interesting points. Live and let live is obviously a nice concept, but not entirely being adopted on this thread.

Some folks go with whatever the flow is, don't take anything too serious, easy going, blend in, and then there's those that don't.

Just human nature and not specific to only this scene.

For the avoidance of doubt, if promoters are specific about music policy, most issues would not be issues.

The evolution of 'multi rooms' with clear music policy has to be a good thing. 

 

 

Ed

Agree 100%. 

"Live and let live is obviously a nice concept, but not entirely being adopted on this thread." As a whole, society is now far less tolerant than ever before. This forum is a perfect example. Mockery and vitriol the new normal?

"For the avoidance of doubt, if promoters are specific about music policy, most issues would not be issues." Yep, spot on. Be upfront about your music policy, and no-one should ever be disappointed with what they hear.

"The evolution of 'multi rooms' with clear music policy has to be a good thing." No-one can possibly disagree or argue with that.

"One size fits all just does not cut it anymore, that's if it ever did". Didn't back in the day, doesn't now. In fact, its probably worse today than in 75. If that could be at all possible.

[Guest Spain pete]

Music is something to be enjoyed ,  good music, bad music ,whatever you opinion is its all good with me , but the short timers who hijack the music l love, they are the ones to be wary of, none of us on this here site will ever give up our passion and that's why we will continue to fight ,sometimes we need to understand whatever form it comes in  MUSIC IS OUR SANCTUARY . 🎶🎶

[Mark S]

Bickering has been a part of this scene since the year dot and the needle first fell on Scratchy by Travis Wamack and folks said WTF its all part of the fun 

Edited April 13, 2018 by Mark S

[Kenb]

2 hours ago, Joey said:

Dancing? Hardly anyone can anymore. Truly. Certainly not like almost everyone could back in the early 70s. Dance styles changed in the latter days of Wigan, plus, any of the old Wheel and Torch guys amongst us are, like myself, feeling the effects of arthritic hips and knees nowadays, so just can't move like we used to.

i still think i can...and that's all that counts Joey my friend.

[Woodbutcher]

54 minutes ago, colouredman said:

Great poem mate, it’s clear you’re a wordsmith.......   etc.

 

That's got to be the most beautifully crafted post I've had the good fortune to read here on Soul Source , thank you Tim ... 

[Colouredman]

Yre welcome; it was fun to do; I hope it made a few ppl laugh😂

[Guest]

21 minutes ago, Kenb said:

i still think i can...and that's all that counts Joey my friend.

I won't argue with you. Same as I, you're of an age where all could dance well. Apart from Mad Malcolm of course.  My point was in regards to what I saw at the last weekender I attended. 90% of the dancers in a circle, dancing around their handbags, stomping away as though they were trying to extinguish a recalcitrant firework in a petrol station.

Edited April 13, 2018 by Guest

[Mark S]

Not Malcolm Lear from Sockport his spins were legendary and could take half the floor out 

[Guest]

And another bloody thing. Someone on this thread (can't be arsed trawling through it all again) mentioned people "not feeling the music" anymore when on the dance floor. That was the very first thing I noticed on my return to the scene back in the early 90s. The reason? Easy, no-one seems to use their hands and arms anymore. Back in the early days, in addition to the wonderful footwork, arms and hands were extensively used to illustrate the lyrics, and embellish and accentuate the emotions felt by the listener/dancer. Doesn't seem to happen very much nowadays. 

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, Mark S said:

Not Malcolm Lear from Sockport his spins were legendary and could take half the floor out 

Yep, the one and only Malcolm Lear. I've mentioned him several times in other threads. Most people avoided him like the plague, due to his dancing "style" and rather unconventional looks. Hence the "mad" prefix to his forename. Once you got to know him though, he was one of the kindest and nicest guys you could ever hope to meet. Not seen him since '75. 

Edited April 13, 2018 by Guest