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Frank Wilson. Do I love you. Value?


Pablorally

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Guest Shufflin
2 minutes ago, Tomangoes said:

It?

You mean them.

Plus the acetate.

My original fake pressing reissue bootleg...but signed by Frank at LA2004....I got him to sign a bar menu just to show its real....got to be £100.

Ed

my kids would say pics or didn't happen 🙂

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11 hours ago, Chalky said:

One in Scunthorpe, one in Todmorden, test press in Detroit.  File copies probably in Jobete or Motown.  No more known about although Gordy is rumoured to have one.

It’s probably worth more than some of the houses in scunny.

 

is that who bought it from manship or has it changed hands ?

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5 hours ago, Chalky said:

Same guy, he lived in hull.  I think he split from his missus for whom he bought the record. 

Luckily for him he had the £35k , and even more fortunate to have a missus called Kenny. Unfortunately, she ran off with bloke called Otis Clark (a.k.a. Eddie Foster) for his complete collection of Casino Classics.

Edited by Simon T
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Guest Shufflin

I wonder if the fact it's gonna be on Strictly tomorrow will impact the value? would a serious collector with lots of dosh still want it? no idea

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39 minutes ago, Shufflin said:

I wonder if the fact it's gonna be on Strictly tomorrow will impact the value? would a serious collector with lots of dosh still want it? no idea

Why would it?  It has been used all over TV.  You seem to hear it more commercially than you do at a venue.

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14 hours ago, Chalky said:

One in Scunthorpe, one in Todmorden, test press in Detroit.  File copies probably in Jobete or Motown.  No more known about although Gordy is rumoured to have one.

I thought Simon Soussan ‘borrowed’ the Motown file copy? Berry Gordy ordered all copies to be destoyed so he would be unlikely to keep one. Is the copy in Todmorden playable or too warped... I can’t recall the rumours on this one?

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Guest Shufflin
18 minutes ago, Chalky said:

Why would it?  It has been used all over TV.  You seem to hear it more commercially than you do at a venue.

more exposure makes something less desirable especially if seen to be a bit cheesy? like I said dunno, not one I'd go after if won lottery

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9 minutes ago, Frankie Crocker said:

I thought Simon Soussan ‘borrowed’ the Motown file copy? Berry Gordy ordered all copies to be destoyed so he would be unlikely to keep one. Is the copy in Todmorden playable or too warped... I can’t recall the rumours on this one?

I was led to believe and I'm sure the manager of the pressing plant when interviewed said one copy to Motown for their files, one copy to Jobete for their files.  Gordy could well have had a copy of every thing he cu to vinyl? I would if I owned a label.

There was a rumour Gordy bought the collection of Reg Bartlette, allegedly the most comprehensive collection there is, and there was allegedly a copy in that.  All rumours and guessing I suppose.

Edited by Chalky
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3 minutes ago, Shufflin said:

more exposure makes something less desirable especially if seen to be a bit cheesy? like I said dunno, not one I'd go after if won lottery

It can't get anymore over exposed than KFC Adverts and that didn't stop someone shelling out £26k and £75k for the test press.

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Guest Shufflin
Just now, Chalky said:

It can't get anymore over exposed than KFC Adverts and that didn't stop someone shelling out £26k and £75k for the test press.

fair enough but ads are kind of 'neutral' in the sense they are fillers between programmes, most might miss em, or not - Strictly is something else, how can that enhance the desirability of the 45?

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51 minutes ago, Chalky said:

I was led to believe and I'm sure the manager of the pressing plant when interviewed said one copy to Motown for their files, one copy to Jobete for their files.  Gordy could well have had a copy of every thing he cu to vinyl? I would if I owned a label.

 

But if a producer/arranger like Frank Wilson went and cut a record without your approval, and this attempt to become a performing artist fell short of the exacting standards at Motown, you might be so hopping mad, you would order all copies of the track to be destroyed if you were the label owner.

Edited by Frankie Crocker
insert a letter
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7 hours ago, Frankie Crocker said:

But if a producer/arranger like Frank Wilson went and cut a record without your approval, and this attempt to become a performing artist fell short of the exacting standards at Motown, you might be so hopping mad, you would order all copies of the track to be destroyed if you were the label owner.

Wasn’t done without his knowledge though was it, only after the session was it decided he’d put his efforts into writing and producing.  Regardless they weren’t all destroyed, along with file copies at least one found its way into the hands of a pressing plant employee. 

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3 hours ago, Tomangoes said:

I thought before any record went to production, even as a demo, it had to have approval of the 'committee'.

This disc certainly ticks all the boxes for intrigue.

Ed

 

I think the approach at Motown was to fast-track the acts through the studio and have a weekly ‘group’ meeting about what went to the pressing plant on the basis of sales potential. Berry Gordy had the final say more often than not. Ultimately, only the ‘best of the best’ tracks made the cut as Berry was seeking mass appeal and chart success. That said, plenty of really good sounds were left in the can as we well know.

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5 hours ago, Tomangoes said:

I thought before any record went to production, even as a demo, it had to have approval of the 'committee'.

This disc certainly ticks all the boxes for intrigue.

Ed

 

It had obviously been through all the processes as it had gone to the pressing plants.  It was whilst going through the process that they decided he would no longer be an act but a writer, producer etc.  The company pressed 6 copies for evaluation, file copies filed the rest ordered destroyed.  There is a comprehensive write up somewhere   on site.

As for the exposure tonight, don't think it will make any difference in our world.  

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10 minutes ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

Fascinating timing with this thread

Just watched Kelvin Fletcher and Oti Mabuse doing there routine on "Strictly" to the song......question ? your cup of tea or not

You cannot deny the man's dancing credentials, and he really loves the record. If he was my son I'd be as proud as anything. Kudos to him! 

BTW he's too old to be my son, just putting that out there 😉

 

Edited by Soul-Slider
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28 minutes ago, Blackpoolsoul said:

Fascinating timing with this thread

Just watched Kelvin Fletcher and Oti Mabuse doing there routine on "Strictly" to the song......question ? your cup of tea or not

Brilliant. That's put Northern Soul further up the league with the public.... Onwards and upwards.... KFC.... 

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27 minutes ago, Pablorally said:

Can you believe it. It's just been on strictly come dancing... 

That's put another 5k on it's value... 🙈

Do you seriously think anyone in that audience is prepared to splash out the sort of money soul collectors do?  There isn't one I bet in that audience who is even remotely interested in owning a proper copy unless given to them so they can sell it.  Why would it increase the value?  I bet the adverts it has featured in has reached a bigger audience.

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5 minutes ago, Chalky said:

Do you seriously think anyone in that audience is prepared to splash out the sort of money soul collectors do?  There isn't one I bet in that audience who is even remotely interested in owning a proper copy unless given to them so they can sell it.  Why would it increase the value?  I bet the adverts it has featured in has reached a bigger audience.

Hahaha...... 🙃

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never owned an original  of the record and certainly don't have that sort of money to spend on  a record, Chalky is correct about the Scunny and Hull connection, i know the lass from scunny  whose boyfriend from Hull  bought the record for her but when they parted company i believe the record went with him...... Rick 

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I'd put it at the head of a top 3 including the Carstairs and Al Wilson as ' love em or hate em' on this scene.

I'm biased since I met Frank, heard him sing it live 10feet in front of me, and danced to it at Wigan.

It's rarity adds value, it's history adds intrigue, but it's an icon, as previously reported, as probably the best known Northern Soul record to the general public.

I'd guess at £50k now if a copy changed hands.

In terms of collecting, along with a well published list of rare vynil, it's a must have item.

I'd rather have 500 x £100 originals personally. 

Both scenarios are not likely to happen BUT I have been privileged to have the second choice back in the day when they were £10 each!

Ed

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1 hour ago, Rick Scott said:

never owned an original  of the record and certainly don't have that sort of money to spend on  a record, Chalky is correct about the Scunny and Hull connection, i know the lass from scunny  whose boyfriend from Hull  bought the record for her but when they parted company i believe the record went with him...... Rick 

Still with him in Scunny I believe.  John Manship revisited it a while back, there is a video on line somewhere I think?

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Guest Shufflin

I'd imagine there will now be a Strictly limited edition 45 with picture sleeve, evoking the working class kitchen complete with table and kettle

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Guest Shufflin
1 hour ago, Frankie Crocker said:

I think I’ll stick with my Eddie Foster bootleg now as there’s no chance of upgrading to an original copy...

 

 

Edited by Shufflin
meant for the Strictly topic
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Guest Shufflin

"While the store has multiple genres to choose from, Frank Wilson’s vinyl was a part of Zieja’s personal collection."

presumably the test press (Jack White) one?

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1 hour ago, Timillustrator said:

That was the 3rd copy the test press there was a large thread on here when it was found.

 

maybe found is the wrong word.  When the owners decided they wanted to sell is more like it.  And made the collecting world aware they had it.

Edited by Dylan
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