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Frank Wilson. Do I love you. Value?

Just to lighten the mood here's a story that you can will make you both laugh and cry about said record. When johnathan woodliffe obtained said record. He couldn't resist showing it to everyone on the coach to cleethorpes. Several people took it from its crisp white sleeve to check it over, eventually ending up on the  back seat with Rob Smith. Whom proceeded to turn it on its side and said single fell from the sleeve and rolled the full length of the coach into the foot well of the door  the look of shock and horror on everyone's face was priceless. Fortunately the said sound lived to be hammered to death. 

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On 25/11/2019 at 10:23, Dobber said:

a chap that i know and and a few others on here also know him, purchased a load of jobete acetates from pete lowry in the late 80's early nineties? reportedly in that bunch was a 10 inch acetate of frank wilson,the acetate had the instrumental and 3 mixes of the tune,it also came with the sheet music and notes? he was invited onto the richard searling show to play the acetates,i didnt listen to the show so i dont know if the frank wilson was played!

i purchased a few acetates from him in the mid nineties that were defo originals...patrice holloway for the love of mike,brenda holloway lonely boy,and a jimmy ruffin and something else i cant quite remember!

if it does exist,then that is a serious item!

 

 

A lot of those were not original acetates - they were cut in the UK from tapes.

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1 hour ago, Sebastian said:

Don't know if it's of any help, but here are photos from old ebay auctions of "Quality Control" stamped test pressings of:

V.I.P. 25016 - Vows - Tell Me / Buttered Popcorn - 1965/05
MOTOWN 1086 - Tammi Terrell - I Can't Believe You Love Me / Hold Me Oh My Darling - 1965/11

Frank Wilson is from 1965/12.

 

 

soul vovs   VIP 25016, May 1965

soul Tammi   Motown M 1086, November 1965

Are they real?  I know there was some dodgy ones about at one time?

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8 minutes ago, Chalky said:

Are they real?  I know there was some dodgy ones about at one time?

I don't know for sure, but seems to be legit. That seller sold 6 Motown test pressings on January 28 2018:

https://gripsweat.com/search/?query=This+is+a+Rare+Motown+45+Prereleased%2C+Test+Pressing&button=&search_desc=1

 

And plenty more here, amongst them a Velvelettes "Bird In The Hand" with stamp:

https://gripsweat.com/search/?query=my pictures with proper lighting on just the right angle to show basically an exact description&page=1&sort_by=price&search_desc=1

soul velve

Edited by Sebastian
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1 hour ago, Nick Soule said:

There are definitely test pressings for the same record from different plants. Probably the easiest to find is “Never Can Say Goodbye” by the Jackson 5. The ARP vinyl pressings have a sticker on the label where handwritten info would go. The styrene pressings from Monarch have handwritten info. 

People only have to look t discogs or 45cat for various releases to see how many variations of any particular release there are.  Different plants, different mixes, all told apart by the matrix.

Brenda Holloway has 21 release, 15 of them US.  Its almost certain a test press existed at one time for every different version even if it was just one to check for flaws.  Some plants might check the first press of any batch rather than do a specific test press. 

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2 hours ago, Chalky said:

Are they real?  I know there was some dodgy ones about at one time?

Those with white labels, handwritten black or blue ink, with the turquoise quality control stamp (which IS the real one) look just like most of those in The Motown Vault.  There were also a few solid yellow labels there.  I'd say these were all legitimate.  Those with other-coloured labels and no stamp, I can't say.

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5 hours ago, Speedlimit said:

Just to lighten the mood here's a story that you can will make you both laugh and cry about said record. When johnathan woodliffe obtained said record. He couldn't resist showing it to everyone on the coach to cleethorpes. Several people took it from its crisp white sleeve to check it over, eventually ending up on the  back seat with Rob Smith. Whom proceeded to turn it on its side and said single fell from the sleeve and rolled the full length of the coach into the foot well of the door  the look of shock and horror on everyone's face was priceless. Fortunately the said sound lived to be hammered to death. 

So, is the one that also suffered under a hot light and is now unplayable? Not had a response to my earlier question - is one of the two known copies actually unplayable? If so, the owner of the ‘Kenny Woz ‘Ere’ copy is the only person on the planet in a position to spin an original US copy. The UK release therefore becomes most acceptable for spins at Oldies Nights, Soul Nights, Weekenders in the Med., wedding receptions and funerals but NOT crappy adverts, trashy dance shows and elevators etc.

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8 minutes ago, Frankie Crocker said:

So, is the one that also suffered under a hot light and is now unplayable? Not had a response to my earlier question - is one of the two known copies actually unplayable? If so, the owner of the ‘Kenny Woz ‘Ere’ copy is the only person on the planet in a position to spin an original US copy. The UK release therefore becomes most acceptable for spins at Oldies Nights, Soul Nights, Weekenders in the Med., wedding receptions and funerals but NOT crappy adverts, trashy dance shows and elevators etc.

Hot light or chip shop counter?  The warped copy is Tim’s and as far as I am aware it still plays. 

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1 hour ago, Chalky said:

Hot light or chip shop counter?  The warped copy is Tim’s and as far as I am aware it still plays. 

OK, so they both play. Does Tim blu-tac a penny on the arm when he plays his?

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Guest Shufflin

some very interesting inputs on this topic, learned a thing or two, I'm kind of coming to the conclusion in my own head that it is possible (but maybe not likely) that one or two additional copies could be out there

BUT (just for sake of argument) two more copies surfaced due to more mass interest in the sound (driven by Strictly, ads, Jack White or whatever) what would that do to the value of the current original 45's?

£75/25k down to £12K? or no impact at all as still dog rare?

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4 minutes ago, Shufflin said:

some very interesting inputs on this topic, learned a thing or two, I'm kind of coming to the conclusion in my own head that it is possible (but maybe not likely) that one or two additional copies could be out there

BUT (just for sake of argument) two more copies surfaced due to more mass interest in the sound (driven by Strictly, ads, Jack White or whatever) what would that do to the value of the current original 45's?

£75/25k down to £12K? or no impact at all as still dog rare?

Personally I think it would just add value to the record and it's fascinating historical story.  They knowledge on here never ceases to amaze me.  Hats off to everyone who has contributed in one way or another to this topic 

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17 minutes ago, Shufflin said:

some very interesting inputs on this topic, learned a thing or two, I'm kind of coming to the conclusion in my own head that it is possible (but maybe not likely) that one or two additional copies could be out there

BUT (just for sake of argument) two more copies surfaced due to more mass interest in the sound (driven by Strictly, ads, Jack White or whatever) what would that do to the value of the current original 45's?

£75/25k down to £12K? or no impact at all as still dog rare?

Due to the phenomenon of Supply & Demand, even if all the other speculated copies of the demo and test presses turned up, i doubt the prices would come down. Also if a hundred count box of the demo or issues came to light, would anyone be likely to offer up more than one copy?

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On 25/11/2019 at 10:23, Dobber said:

a chap that i know and and a few others on here also know him, purchased a load of jobete acetates from pete lowry in the late 80's early nineties? reportedly in that bunch was a 10 inch acetate of frank wilson,the acetate had the instrumental and 3 mixes of the tune,it also came with the sheet music and notes? he was invited onto the richard searling show to play the acetates,i didnt listen to the show so i dont know if the frank wilson was played!

i purchased a few acetates from him in the mid nineties that were defo originals...patrice holloway for the love of mike,brenda holloway lonely boy,and a jimmy ruffin and something else i cant quite remember!

if it does exist,then that is a serious item!

 

 

 

On 25/11/2019 at 10:23, Dobber said:

a chap that i know and and a few others on here also know him, purchased a load of jobete acetates from pete lowry in the late 80's early nineties? reportedly in that bunch was a 10 inch acetate of frank wilson,the acetate had the instrumental and 3 mixes of the tune,it also came with the sheet music and notes? he was invited onto the richard searling show to play the acetates,i didnt listen to the show so i dont know if the frank wilson was played!

i purchased a few acetates from him in the mid nineties that were defo originals...patrice holloway for the love of mike,brenda holloway lonely boy,and a jimmy ruffin and something else i cant quite remember!

if it does exist,then that is a serious item!

 

 

I have the record he had.

soul AD346937 F8DB 4303 A547 EE07BD68C5AC

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Guest Shufflin
9 minutes ago, Pk 22dj said:

I have the record he had.

wow! thanks for sharing

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Guest Shufflin

if ever the word "reject" was incorrectly applied this is it 🙂

would this be worth anything?

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So the ex-Kenny Burrell copy has just been sold via JM to Lee Jeffries for an undisclosed   ( but apparently record breaking ) sum.  I doubt it reached more than the alleged sum that Jack White payed for the test press but who knows apart from the parties involved.

 

 

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20 minutes ago, Woodbutcher said:

So the ex-Kenny Burrell copy has just been sold via JM to Lee Jeffries for an undisclosed   ( but apparently record breaking ) sum.  I doubt it reached more than the alleged sum that Jack White payed for the test press but who knows apart from the parties involved.

 

 

Thanks for posting :)

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17 minutes ago, Woodbutcher said:

So the ex-Kenny Burrell copy has just been sold via JM to Lee Jeffries for an undisclosed   ( but apparently record breaking ) sum.  I doubt it reached more than the alleged sum that Jack White payed for the test press but who knows apart from the parties involved.

 

 

Steve.  Hope you're safe and well mate. 

When you consider how much the so called holy grail records have doubled and trebled in recent years and Frank Wilson certainly comes into that category. The figure i have heard for the record comes as no real surprise . 

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1 minute ago, Winsford Soul said:

Steve.  Hope you're safe and well mate. 

When you consider how much the so called holy grail records have doubled and trebled in recent years and Frank Wilson certainly comes into that category. The figure i have heard for the record comes as no real surprise . 

I hope the folks that have have continued to support his massively overpriced sales over the years get shares in the 45 ... :wicked:

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Like a sell on clause in football where previous owners get a percentage of any future profit......could be the way forward

1 hour ago, Woodbutcher said:

I hope the folks that have have continued to support his massively overpriced sales over the years get shares in the 45 ... :wicked:

 

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What a load of old bollocks ..........

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Pumpkinseed - good point 👍🏻

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The copy that Kenny had that went on JM's auction has now moved on again, to buyer and seller unknown

Frank.jpg

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8 minutes ago, Tsu Tomatoes said:

The copy that Kenny had that went on JM's auction has now moved on again, to buyer and seller unknown

Frank.jpg

Try reading a few previous posts ... :facepalm:

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