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Pete S

Top Sound For You

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Obviously known but very rare I think - and listen to the quality of this recording

p.s. ignore the name it is not The Devotions

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Good choice Pete, great tune, Esther Grant on Wilstone. Sure Carl Fortnum played this at Lifeline on Saturday.

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great record pete!  :yes:

shane

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Is Tim Brown playing it??? :yes:

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Is Tim Brown playing it???  :yes:

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no, but i am glad you learnt from your mistakes and didnt have a go at chalky for naming a dj who plays it.

:yes:

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no, but i am glad you learnt from your mistakes and didnt have a go at chalky for naming a dj who plays it.

:yes:

link

Oi Chalky, what's your problem??? :yes:

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Oi Chalky, what's your problem???  :yes:

link

:yes:

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Obviously known but very rare I think - and listen to the quality of this recording

p.s. ignore the name it is not The Devotions

link

Remember this being played at TOTW Stafford...big sound for Keb Darge (or maybe Guy) as I rememeber (memories fading now I hit the big 4-0!)...always used to fill the floor....as much as you could fill the floor at Stafford..only ever 200 of us there!...have to check my old tapes see if it was Guy or Keb!!

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

......Boody 'ell I am losing my marbles...It was Pat Brady who used to play it at TOTW not Keb or Guy!...sorry Pat...credit where credit is due!...great track.

It was covered as Pat Lewis - Change your mind.

All coming flooding back now..and here's the evidence from a badly recorded tape I did in '85...need realplayer.

http://ic0htsk00.ic24.net/bay/Pat.ra

Edited by soulechoes
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Good choice Pete, great tune, Esther Grant on Wilstone.  Sure Carl Fortnum played this at Lifeline on Saturday.

link

He used to play it at the Capitol as well, I'm pretty certain. Great record. Did it make a CSC tape at one time, anyone remember?

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Tim Brown refers to this record as a "lack lustre femme-soul item" in an old article I have. I agree with him, sounds like some kind of easy listening music to me.

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Tim Brown refers to this record as a "lack lustre femme-soul item" in an old article I have. I agree with him, sounds like some kind of easy listening music to me.

link

:shades::shades::)

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He used to play it at the Capitol as well, I'm pretty certain.  Great record.  Did it make a CSC tape at one time, anyone remember?

link

Yep sure was played at Capitol SC

Top tune

Duncan

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i dont dance much these days but this is one of the only ones i ALWAYS dance to! still love it.

we must have been at he same night soulechoes cos ive got the same tape as you!!

:ohmy:

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we must have been at he same night soulechoes cos ive got the same tape as you!!

:yes:

link

Uncanny! Hope yours is clearer than mine!...I probably got some feedback from your tapedeck in the bag next to mine!

Remember arranging the plug in mic so it was in the little slide in slot in the front of my patch covered Adidas bag...happy times!..was probably wearing my T shirt with a fist saying Wigan Lives On! biggrin.gif and I never even went....was far too young of course!

But I was young and foolish then....now I'm...well older and foolish..but ditched the bag and T shirt! :ohmy:

Edited by soulechoes
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Tim Brown refers to this record as a "lack lustre femme-soul item" in an old article I have. I agree with him, sounds like some kind of easy listening music to me.

link

Obviously you've got your ear muffs on again cause of the cold weather "over there" :P .... you have to remember that people "up there" often descibe things in such a way cause they "ain't got one" or have "let it go cheap" in the past :shades: ....

Tek them off and listen properly :yes: .... or is this one of your "contensious" posts again that seem to appear every now and again :lol:whistling.gif ....

Perhaps it's just another knock at "the UK scene" rather than what "latecomers" seem to have adopted as "their scene" who are from outside these fair shores of ours :wicked::lol: ....

Top choice for a sound clip Pete :thumbsup: .... can't grumble with this one :no: ....

Remembered it from Lifeline Chalkster but couldn't remember who spun it.... thanks for reminder :thumbsup: ....

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First time i heard this it was Pat Brady who was playing it ......... 15 years ago or more. (now that's scary!)

But Butch did play it though a few years back.

FANTASTIC RECORD!!!

And anyone saying this is lack lustre easy listening needs to give their head a shake!

Pure Dynamite ......... end of!!

Loads,

Joan

PS: Kenny Burrell plays it all the time - he's got Carl Fortnums old copy.

And i believe he paid a good few thousand for it ........

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Obviously known but very rare I think - and listen to the quality of this recording

p.s. ignore the name it is not The Devotions

link

Pete any chance of sending the MP3 over in a mail to Ali or myself? Can't download from here our poxy firewall removes all the content of the file and we end up with 0 bytes whistling.gif:thumbsup::thumbsup:

John

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Pete any chance of sending the MP3 over in a mail to Ali or myself? Can't download from here our poxy firewall removes all the content of the file and we end up with 0 bytes  whistling.gif   :thumbsup:   :thumbsup:

John

link

Sure, can you just email me and I'll reply and attach it to that.

You won't like it though, it's from the 60's...

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I really think this is a weak record. Poor vocal and I really hear nothing good about it, OK the backing has a bit of pace to it, but that's about it. Not trying to be controversial, that's just what it sounds like to me, and I am sure many will agree.

Perhaps it's just another knock at "the UK scene" rather than what "latecomers" seem to have adopted as "their scene" who are from outside these fair shores of ours whistling.gif:thumbsup: ....

*This is complete nonsense and you know it. The kind of 'argument' people resort to when they, as is usually the case, have nothing intelligent to say and when they know they just can not win the debate. What is the age limit? 50+? 40 OK? Do southerners and Irish count or only English men from the north? It is all relative, knowledge, experience, age, and so on, yet often pretty irrelevant so take your 'arguments' regarding nationality and stick them where they belong. :thumbsup:

Edited by christian h.
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I really think this is a weak record. Poor vocal and I really hear nothing good about it, OK the backing has a bit of pace to it, but that's about it. Not trying to be controversial, that's just what it sounds like to me, and I am sure many will agree.

Perhaps it's just another knock at "the UK scene" rather than what "latecomers" seem to have adopted as "their scene" who are from outside these fair shores of ours :thumbsup:   :thumbsup: ....

*This is complete nonsense and you know it. The kind of 'argument' people resort to when they, as is usually the case, have nothing intelligent to say and when they know they just can not win the debate. What is the age limit? 50+? 40 OK? Do southerners and Irish count or only English men from the north? It is all relative, knowledge, experience, age, and so on, yet often pretty irrelevant so take your 'arguments' regarding nationality and stick them where they belong. :wicked:

link

Not sure I understood all that but at least you didn't use the word crap this time whistling.gif

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Obviously known but very rare I think - and listen to the quality of this recording

p.s. ignore the name it is not The Devotions

link

WOW! Absolutely brilliant!! Not just one of my faves, but one of my son's too :thumbsup:

Gets played a lot in our house I cann tell ye thumbsup.gif

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Perhaps it's just another knock at "the UK scene" rather than what "latecomers" seem to have adopted as "their scene" who are from outside these fair shores of ours blush.gif   :lol: ....

*This is complete nonsense and you know it. The kind of 'argument' people resort to when they, as is usually the case, have nothing intelligent to say and when they know they just can not win the debate. What is the age limit? 50+? 40 OK? Do southerners and Irish count or only English men from the north? It is all relative, knowledge, experience, age, and so on, yet often pretty irrelevant so take your 'arguments' regarding nationality and stick them where they belong. :)

link

Christian, the important thing is, you never went to Wigan and stuck a couple of ounces of gear up your hooter, blah blah blah.... :lol:

Best regards

A Know Nothing Southern Johnny Latecomer

(and proud of it) :lol:

PS To be fair I don't think many people think along these lines, those that do sound like they should be getting ready to check out a suitable retirement home, Uncle Bleedin' Alberts. :lol:

PPS I still like the record though.

Edited by Stuart T
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Christian, the important thing is, you never went to Wigan and stuck a couple of ounces of gear up your hooter, blah blah blah.... :lol:

Best regards

A Know Nothing Southern Johnny Latecomer

(and proud of it) :lol:

PS To be fair I don't think many people think along these lines, those that do sound like they should be getting ready to check out a suitable retirement home, Uncle Bleedin' Alberts. blush.gif

PPS I still like the record though.

link

Stuart, I've been thru my Capitol tapes and cant find one with it on. That might be because I cant find one just compiled by Carl. I'm certain he did one at Shoreditch, cos I can remember the night well. I came straight from work in Ladbrokes shirt and tie, and took a bit of ribbing. Welsh Simon and Yann, had a difference of opinion about who's bit of dancefloor was who's :)

But for some reason I must have misplaced the tape. probably left it in a hire car tape player :D

I have with me the 2nd anniversary tape, co compiled by a certain Stuart Tyler :lol:

Sorry OFF TOPIC.

Best track on a Capitol tape Shamettes - Don't waste your time. :lol:

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I might have it on a non-CSC tape then. Probably just made the association because it was played there. I never went to bar Shoreditch so wouldn't have that one.

I remember when that tape got compiled, Alan lived over a pub blush.gif , we got slaughtered with Greg afterwards on Guinness. School night as well, ouch!

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I really think this is a weak record. Poor vocal and I really hear nothing good about it, OK the backing has a bit of pace to it, but that's about it. Not trying to be controversial, that's just what it sounds like to me, and I am sure many will agree.

link

HI Christian

I do love reading your views on records but I really don't think this record is as weak as you are making it out to be - sounded fine on Saturday and is worthy of a few spins. Will never make it into my top 10, but it has enough in it for me to get plays IMHO.

As for Wigan ... what is it they say? - " If you can remember it, you weren't there " blush.gif:lol::lol:

Hammy

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I have to say as mainly a lover of 70's stuff that this track is the business!! very different from most 60's yet very cool. I don't know what Tim Brown means by lack lustre. I'd love to hear some stuff like this played out ..... mixed in with some uptempo crossover dancers of course!!

Jordi

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I agree in a way (with Hammy that is), it is certainly not THAT bad, I just don't think it is very good. Backing OK, atmospheric, I can understand some of it's appeal, but overall it doesn't do it for me. The vocal and overall approach is not my cup of tea, then again I am very fussy and have a very hard time liking many female tracks. Especially girlie sounds with high pitched, shrill out of tune squealing through the nose type vocals (not on about this one) that are soo extremely popular with a lot of people really puts me off.

Edited by christian h.
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I think this is what Tim meant, sums it all up perfectly IMO.

lacklustre

adj 1: lacking brilliance or vitality; "a dull lackluster life"; "a lusterless performance" [syn: lackluster, lusterless, lustreless]

Edited by christian h.
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I think this is what Tim meant, sums it all up perfectly IMO.

lacklustre

How about the same theme, posted time and time again ?

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No, I think repetitive or monotonous would be a better choice for that...

link

Touche Christian. whistling.gif

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lacklustre

adj 1: lacking brilliance or vitality; "a dull lackluster life"; "a lusterless performance" [syn: lackluster, lusterless, lustreless]

link

WHAT THE .......?

Sounding a little Giles Brandreth-like in Countdown's dictionary corner there Christian mate!

Like i said......... GIVE YOUR HEAD A SHAKE!!

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(christian) I really think this is a weak record. Poor vocal and I really hear nothing good about it, OK the backing has a bit of pace to it, but that's about it. Not trying to be controversial, that's just what it sounds like to me, and I am sure many will agree.

--------

(vaultofsouler) Perhaps it's just another knock at "the UK scene" rather than what "latecomers" seem to have adopted as "their scene" who are from outside these fair shores of ours :rolleyes:   :thumbsup: ....

--------

(christian) *This is complete nonsense and you know it. The kind of 'argument' people resort to when they, as is usually the case, have nothing intelligent to say and when they know they just can not win the debate. What is the age limit? 50+? 40 OK? Do southerners and Irish count or only English men from the north? It is all relative, knowledge, experience, age, and so on, yet often pretty irrelevant so take your 'arguments' regarding nationality and stick them where they belong. :)

link

Suggest the "posts" quoted above are read "in full".... rather that "selected" as above....

I responded with my post to your reply because I'm "sick and tired" of certain responses I read indicating that the "member of SS who replies" knows best.... no matter what.... and you, Christian, always come accross as "I know best" to the limited replies you make to "your" chosen topics "of interest"....

I "forgot" that you know best when it comes to "arguements" or "debates" or "whatever" you choose to call them when it comes to tunes, formats played, styles, whatever, so decide to add my reply.... I've sat back too long, in my own opinion, and read this type of stuff, without responding, for far too long.... you might be the first to have got a reply from me like that, albeit "light hearted" as we don't know each other, but you'll not be the last :D ....

I did put "various" emicons within the post to indicate it was a "tongue in cheek" reply with "a point" but obviously they were "overlooked".... so now I'll respond "in kind"....

Anyway.... "complete nonsense".... because "blah, blah, etc., etc.,".... ain't gonna re-type the rest because "that's bollox".... nothoing "intelligent" to say gives the game/story away as far as I'm concerned :D .... typical "reply" from a self opinionated person with the "if you don't agree with me" I'm throwing my "dummy" and "teddy" out of my cot "attitude" :) ....

Plus age limit "NEVER" comes in to it with me.... you brought that up into this "thread".... I used the word "latecomers" which points towards "anyone" that "joins" this scene and suddenly decides "they now know best" based on their "freshness" to "what's now" instead of "the scenes history".... I was just responding against something that comes accross as "I'M RIGHT" with what "I PUT/REPLIED" and "don't anybody disagree cause otherwise I'll back it up with comments like UNITELLIGENT" bullshit.... perhaps because it isn't prepared to accept an alternative opinion....

My "respect" for people comes from education and knowledge, open mindedness, can live with a difference of opinion and have respect for an alternative view where "the soul scene" in concerned.... not a person's "background" or "place" of birth........ the words " head, off, you, nob, f***" (you choose the order of these) spring to my mind if this is a wrong opinion to have as a "benchmark" for respect of someone....

Same goes for "origin" of a "soulie".... not everybody on the "soul scene" are ever gonna agree with each other on "topics on this forum".... would be a SAD and SORRY thing if we did.... BUT.... to resort to "wearing blinkers" or "assuming what you say yourself is the correct point of view irrespective of others" in a response to "selected posts" is a very NARROW MINDED thing to have as far as I'm concerned :sweatingbullets: ....

Irrespective of age, origan, gender, opinions or whatever other "pigeon holes" people say they are from, I'll just add that that means f*** all to me as long as "respect for differing opinions viewpoints comes first and foremost" :rolleyes: ....

Lastly.... I read your responses "with respect" for your opinion, whether I agree or not.... but I do "hate" the "holier than thy approach" that comes with them... hence this "long" reply....

Let's keep it "soulful"....

Edited by vaultofsouler
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Had some fairly nice returns from a friend in recent months:

Al Downing - "I'm just nobody" U.S. Polydor PD14311

A rather nice mid-seventies, not too discoish sound.

Otis Clay - "Three is a crowd" U.S. One-derful 4834

Stomping the way through his best friends door. What a sound!!

J.J. Barnes - "Poor-unfortunate-me" Ring 101

An oldie-but-goodie not heard for a little while. Smells of Soul!

Cynthia Brown - "Heaven must have sent you" Qiana 2001

Absolutely nowt to do with the Elgins tune. This is Modern Soul at the forefront of whatever went before . . . perhaps! It just oooozes SOUL.

Also, aswell, I haven't seen another copy of The Elites "Sir Gallahad" on Era 3146 for sale etc., anyone ever heard of this 45??

Martin

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Suggest the "posts" quoted above are read "in full".... rather that "selected" as above....

I responded with my post to your reply because I'm "sick and tired" of certain responses I read indicating that the "member of SS who replies" knows best.... no matter what.... and you, Christian, always come accross as "I know best" to the limited replies you make to "your" chosen topics "of interest"....

I "forgot" that you know best when it comes to "arguements" or "debates" or "whatever" you choose to call them when it comes to tunes, formats played, styles, whatever, so decide to add my reply.... I've sat back too long, in my own opinion, and read this type of stuff, without responding, for far too long.... you might be the first to have got a reply from me like that, albeit "light hearted" as we don't know each other, but you'll not be the last :yes: ....

I did put "various" emicons within the post to indicate it was a "tongue in cheek" reply with "a point" but obviously they were "overlooked".... so now I'll respond "in kind"....

Anyway.... "complete nonsense".... because "blah, blah, etc., etc.,".... ain't gonna re-type the rest because "that's bollox".... nothoing "intelligent" to say gives the game/story away as far as I'm concerned :yes: .... typical "reply" from a self opinionated person with the "if you don't agree with me" I'm throwing my "dummy" and "teddy" out of my cot "attitude" :yes: ....

Plus age limit "NEVER" comes in to it with me.... you brought that up into this "thread".... I used the word "latecomers" which points towards "anyone" that "joins" this scene and suddenly decides "they now know best" based on their "freshness" to "what's now" instead of "the scenes history".... I was just responding against something that comes accross as "I'M RIGHT" with what "I PUT/REPLIED" and "don't anybody disagree cause otherwise I'll back it up with comments like UNITELLIGENT" bullshit.... perhaps because it isn't prepared to accept an alternative opinion....

My "respect" for people comes from education and knowledge, open mindedness, can live with a difference of opinion and have respect for an alternative view where "the soul scene" in concerned.... not a person's "background" or "place" of birth........ the words " head, off, you, nob, f***"  (you choose the order of these) spring to my mind if this is a wrong opinion to have as a "benchmark" for respect of someone....

Same goes for "origin" of a "soulie".... not everybody on the "soul scene" are ever gonna agree with each other on "topics on this forum".... would be a SAD and SORRY thing if we did.... BUT.... to resort to "wearing blinkers" or "assuming what you say yourself is the correct point of view irrespective of others" in a response to "selected posts" is a very NARROW MINDED thing to have as far as I'm concerned :D ....

Irrespective of age, origan, gender, opinions or whatever other "pigeon holes" people say they are from, I'll just add that that means f*** all to me as long as "respect for differing opinions viewpoints comes first and foremost" :D ....

Lastly.... I read your responses "with respect" for your opinion, whether I agree or not.... but I do "hate" the "holier than thy approach" that comes with them... hence this "long" reply....

Let's keep it "soulful"....

link

Tim Brown refers to this record as a "lack lustre femme-soul item" in an old article I have. I agree with him, sounds like some kind of easy listening music to me.

Can you point out anywhere in this original post of mine above what you consider to be such a crime that it warrants your first reply to it? Can you please? Anyone? A question was asked and I replied to it, I quoted Tim Brown since he was mentioned and I basically agree with him, so I said that too, that is all. The one who does not respect other persons opinion here is you and your kind, not me. That you claim to respect others viewpoint is quite bizarre since you very obviously do not. You just could not stand that someone had the nerve to disagree with the pack on this one. Why else respond in the first place? Where do you get it all from in your lengthy, incoherent and unclear post? Certainly not from anything I ever wrote on this forum, it is all figments of your imagination, it is what you think I wrote not what I actually wrote. YOU are sick and tired? Of what? Are you sick and tired of the very few who dares to occasionally voice an opinion that differs from the pack opinion? Are you sick and tired of people occasionally disagreeing on the quality of records?! It is all about pack mentality (though no one of the pack will ever admit that, so I guess it simply does not exist) and people like yourself just can not stand that someone has the nerve to disagree. It does not really matter on what, or how, or why, it is the fact that someone dares to have a different opinion from the majority (and won't be intimidated) that makes you and many others absolutely furious it seems. If age and origin does not matter to you, then why did you bring it up? Where exactly in my first post do you find the bits about "knows best", "holier than though"? I really wonder since there is nothing of the kind there. Narrow minded? Wearing blinkers? If ten people agree unanimously on an issue and an eleventh person simply states that he disagrees, and due to this the ten become furious and shout the eleventh down for having a different opinion (a very common scenario on this forum), who in this situation would you say is probably the least narrow minded? "Feel free to have a different opinion and feel free to express it as long as it does not deviate from what the majority think is right" sums it all up...

This is what you wrote.

"can live with a difference of opinion and have respect for an alternative view where "the soul scene" in concerned"

You obviously could not live with my different opinion on this record, and you did not have respect for my alternative view concerning the soul scene in this case. What you did was to prove yet again that many like to consider themselves open minded and respectful to all, but when it really matters they are just bigots in a pack. Quite sad really. These things fall of me like water of a duck, so not really bothered myself, but I do feel it is a shame on behalf of all those who are not as stubborn as myself, Pete Smith and the 2 - 3 others who regularly dares to disagree. I won't post or read much for a while due to lack of time so this is my final word on this, for now.

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WHAT THE .......?

Sounding a little Giles Brandreth-like in Countdown's dictionary corner there Christian mate!

Like i said.........  GIVE YOUR HEAD A SHAKE!!

link

you said it joan, one does wonder

"water of a duck"??? any info? (quote)

More like the:

"glad im deaf, and no taste , and ive def had 2/3 cpies of William Cummings,and................Hurry up nurse. Oh God! they're going to ask me to provide another witty anecdote at the end pt 1, I dont know if I can do, what iif??

it'll be the end, my career....................." version of Giles B's real dictionary corner, "the INMIX"

post-1914-1109491280_thumb.jpg

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Hmmm... Something strange with this forum... Somehow it's

always considered controversial to prefer "original records"

to "re-issues and bootlegs" and real soul music to pop

music :yes: Me and Christian H. may not always agree on stuff,

but I don't really see the problem if he thinks this record

is shite. I think it's shite too. So fuckin' what???! Nothing

to get all upset about :yes:

Cheers,

Christian B

PS! Have people on here ever wondered why there are almost

no young people on the "rare soul scene" in the UK? :D

Go to our website OSLOSOUL.COM and have a look at the

pictures of the crowd here :yes:

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Cheers,

Christian B

PS! Have people on here ever wondered why there are almost

no young people on the "rare soul scene" in the UK?  :yes:

Go to our website OSLOSOUL.COM and have a look at the

pictures of the crowd here  :yes:

link

Gotta agree with you there Christian, Oslo soul scene thriving and full of young uns :yes:

Edited by chalky
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Suggest the "posts" quoted above are read "in full".... rather that "selected" as above....

I responded with my post to your reply because I'm "sick and tired" of certain responses I read indicating that the "member of SS who replies" knows best.... no matter what.... and you, Christian, always come accross as "I know best" to the limited replies you make to "your" chosen topics "of interest"....

I "forgot" that you know best when it comes to "arguements" or "debates" or "whatever" you choose to call them when it comes to tunes, formats played, styles, whatever, so decide to add my reply.... I've sat back too long, in my own opinion, and read this type of stuff, without responding, for far too long.... you might be the first to have got a reply from me like that, albeit "light hearted" as we don't know each other, but you'll not be the last :yes: ....

I did put "various" emicons within the post to indicate it was a "tongue in cheek" reply with "a point" but obviously they were "overlooked".... so now I'll respond "in kind"....

the question should be

"Do they know best?"

I think we need youth to carry on, health intact, without falling into the "non replacables" scene catagory.

(members include "swing & Miller")( or did they really become the now defunct splinter group that formed the first hard core Sinatra, post Crosby, followers of The Croon 2 scene..and who's got the Who's Who)(besides mate it'll be horrible, when we're all sat in bath chairs listening (optional) to our Fav oldies' in Biggums non- working mens club- The BNWMC- without the youth, it'd be crap, honest.....)

post-1914-1109494735_thumb.jpg

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I am confused.

Pete put up a sound file for us (which I personaly think is great) and now we have a rather confusing thread/argument about the length of time anyone has been on the scene as a qualification to speak their mind.

Am I going mad or have I missed something. :search:

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ok couple of things

first ta for your views Christian on forum, will answer them in a bit

second on "discussion " between Christian H and Vaultofsouler

this seems to have been going on now over a couple of threads, and resulted in, lengthy posts that have nought to do with the main subject and also other posts from diffferent threads been quoted,

gotta say reached point where ask you both if wanna carry this on then do it either by pm/email or whatever, just take it off the forum

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you said it joan, one does wonder

*Are you lot illiterate, dyslexic or just plain dumb? Or maybe a combination of all three? Someone wondered what lacklustre meant and I thought I should be helpful and quoted the words from an english dictionary, thought it might be useful seeing the very low level of understanding of written english some seem to have.

"water of a duck"??? any info? (quote)

*Water does not stick on ducks, it falls of immediately, they are waterproof...

More like the:

"glad im deaf, and no taste , and ive def had 2/3 cpies of William Cummings,and................Hurry up nurse.

*What are you on about? Do I know you? Or more importantly, do you know me? I have one copy of William Cummings, what's that to you, and just what are you suggesting? :yes: Would be nice if people could also provide their real names.

P.S. Sorry Mike, won't argue any more now.

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Somethings wrong here, first two regular worthwhile contributors having a go at each other over last few days

Then another worthwhile regular contributor posting up a jacked off post

All because of a thread about a simple sound file???

nah... just do what i just done, look back through recent posts over last few days, and its not hard to see why or how have ended up with current situation

not going to go into the ins and outs - just say moderation on here changed see later post

end of day

forum is all about discussion, in a worthwhile enjoyable manner

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