Barry

...then it isn't a problem. I can, up to about five grand that is, understand a person digging deep for a track. But beyond that, I do believe that you are either mad, or you are sending out a bit of a statement that goes beyond the actual need to own whatever piece of vinyl that you have spent what I see as a ridiculous amount on. Now I know, as I've said, if you can afford it it's not a problem. But does having enough money to enable you to make your dreams come true mean anything to us poor bastards that can't? Are you more of a Soulie than us poor feckers that scrimp? Not that I'm jealous or owt!

The more that are added, the more it becomes apparent.

After reading the description of what the bootleg is meant to look like in the 'Soul Detective' section of the Essential Northern Soul Guide, I'm still a little hazy. I remebered that I had a copy that I had always considered a boot, as I bought it when I was a kid, in my shit box (a term I used as a kid I must add) in the loft and after reading about it went and dug it out. Now, if I'm honest, what I've got here has to be a boot, it just screams it and I'm quite sure what I have hers is. But, what I read in the EG, doesn't really put my mind at rest. What should I be looking for in an original copy of Gwen & Ray?

...and simply as the people I am about to speak of are (younger) people that have kind of been introduced into soul music through Southport Weekenders, a clubbing youth and the fact that they have been surrounded by owd bastards during their initiation but.... ...over the last 12 months I have noticed a wonderful change, if it is such, in them. The 'change' I talk of is one that has taken them to a stage whereby, with no peer-pressure at all, to take an interest in the NS scene. For example this weekend Tina, ex-Geordie, SP veteran and her mate Jude (drug free and normal) are going to Lowton with my missus Gill, Gill being fairly well up on the scene for a young lass, for no other reason than they have obviously been intrigued by it. These are girls all in their twenties btw. This scenario I have observed quite often recently, lads and lasses. Is this proof that the Soulful House scene has become over-commercialised? Is it proof that certain individuals who maybe don't hold a great deal of 'knowledge' as such, still understand that there is a certain cut off point when it comes to over-comerciallising a scene? Also is it proof that the SH scene, being an introduction for many youngsters to independant black music these days. has ultimatley been a positive for the Northern Scene? And, does it prove that (as, on the whole, the youngsters that I have noticed that who have gained an interest in the NS scene of late are not real vinyl-purchasers, fact-finders - for want of a better description, anoraks) there is a certain beauty in just being happy listening and dancing to this great music without all the strings that we have attached to us? The lure is there at present, there appears to me to be a certain dis-harmony with what is the 'Soulful House' scene presently, that is showing itself with these fantastic random acts of interest. Promoters take note - the second phase is out there.

Keith Brady playing, was it, 'The Starlight Room' when you first walked in. Gibbons' whole family, Gran, nephews etc working everything from the cloakroom to serving tea. Janice Thorpe (ex-Wigan stomper) from Leigh, still stomping (8 months pregnant) on the little dancefloor toward the back. The night when the skinheads kicked off outside. The big old pub over the road from the Pier, what was it called, where we all used to meet up. I could go on but I'll spare you it. Great memories of a wonderful time and place.

I think the listings provided have to some degree put the record straight with the always colourful ill yet thought out attacks on The Mecca's input. I feel I must cast my critical eye over the 'soulful disco' term though. It's a tough one this in reality as I would think that the term 'Disco' generally brings up, as it should, thoughts of Chic, EWF, Jackie Moore etc....you know major label releases that brought that sound to the masses and that most of us, young or old would associate with the 'Disco' media tag. 'Disco' became a dirty word within the US 'musical fraternity', as we know with the stadium vinyl burning episode and the like - it sadly became a bit of a vent for many things socially at that time with certain people. Against this, the 'Disco' sound originated over a period of years by a natural progression of an 'in' sound by smaller independant groups, producers and song-writers, formulated a sound that was attractive to the masses at that time, therefore obviously attracting attention from the major labels and it's producers and ultimatley became what would be deemed a commercialised sound that was bastardised to f*ck for the Yankee Dollar. On the back of this though, how can the mid 70's releases that were responsible for formulating that sound, a sound that was prior to the term 'Disco' as is/was being coined, be called in any form 'Disco' - unless it is in a manner to demean these releases by association? I know at heart that it could be deemed light hearted banter but I do feel that screamingly soulful 70's all-nighter soul tends to get tarred with a brush wielded generally by people that should know better. And to save me starting another odd-ball thread, you know the old 'If a tree falls in a forst but there is no one there to hear it fall. Does it make a noise?' addage. Could we relate this to the ownership of vinyl? Think about it.

Upon reflection, the way that I worded that question does make it a bit of a non question. Fair do's.

Accept the fact that you alone, singularly, know that your view on this music is correct? Think before you answer now.

Malc, thank 'God' you are hanging about when I am on here. It's like being blind and deaf with no mates on here sometimes.

..... How many things could you find from your Jimmy White youth, a youth that gave you the posting rights on this very site due to your foolish [yet fruitful] passions? How many??? I'll bet their are feckin' thousands of big F8CK OFF great things on this scene...and maybe four daft shit things. Why dwell on the negatives? (I do understand that you may be giving it 'the nod'! )

Hayzer, Davidson and myself held a very 'Southportesque' (like Diamonique but with more Class A) interview with old Snowboy on Southport TV a few year back at SPW - it was meant to be a Sports Roundup but it kind of 'Snowboylled' , you know. Anyway! I remember halting the interview to point out to 'Snowboy' that he 'in profile resembled a Lalique glass bonnet embellishment from a 1932 Studabaker'. He didn't appreciate the obvious humour. We did.

Kids! Just say no! This brings about going to a sporadic Northern-ish night (Ska etc) at The Millstone in Newton-le-Willows about a year back and being that far gone that the lads played 'A Touch Of Velvet...' and the mement it went off I proceeded towards the decks and asked for... 'A Touch Of Velvet...' To much hilarity from the lads. As I said earlier... 'Arse'!

Ha ha, I right bolloxed that up didn't I? Arse.

We don't 'think' owt mate - we are just in control of our love of black music, a love of black music that doesn't end at a particular point - we further it - keep it alive. That's us! Lovers of black music, not people that cut off at any given point. If you are of the train of thought that doesn't envelope the progression of black music, then sit in your own shit, as you are simply being hypocritical - surely, as you have bought 'Northern' produced over a certain span of years, yes. And to Mike Hawkins, I'll refrain from the obvious answer that I should give your response, as, as much as you may think that your view is of more importance than mine Mike - it ain't mate. It's a shame what's happened with us mate, and for what?

We don't 'think' owt mate - we are just in control of our love of black music, a love of black music that doesn't end at a particular point - we further it - keep it alive. That's us! Lovers of black music, not people that cut off. If you are of the train of thought that doesn't envelope progression of black music, then sit in your own shit. Mike (Posstot),

I'll tell you what I hate most about this scene, although I'm not too sure wether it is the scene's fault or just the fact that being involved within a scene brings about certain reactions from people that are socially unavoidable. Anyway. A lad I know, that will be known to some of you, who got into the Northern scene late...who, since his inception it seems that every time our paths have crossed the whole content of his conversation has spun around how shit he thinks certain factions of the scene are. Before he became a 'blood-soulie' he was a lovely, amiable kinds guy - not so anymore. This scene appears to breed negativity. Everybody appears to be able to do a better job, play a better record, promote a better night - than the target of their venom. It strikes me as funny that people who give so much of their lives up, in their middle ages, miss the simple fact that nobody's views are wrong, they are just different to their own and this isn't the basis for a slanging match twixt their immediate group about how crap relevant others are. It's all, sadly, one-upmanship.

Now, this thread has gone on a while and I may have become a tad disorientated in it's scale - but - isn't it just a fantastic example of a thread that goes through the motions of one whereby the haters get the uneducated, poorly thought out shit off their backs in it's (the thread's) early stages to one where the true appreciation of the majority comes through, shiningly, of Ian's obvious love, passion and input in furthering his musical beliefs. Mathematically this Levine thread tells all, all that are able to read between the lines that is, the truth about where 'Ian Levine' and his vision has led this scene. Sorry to (mis)quote such a camp line from a Nighter classic Ian but I'm going to anyway mate as I think it sums you and your input up: "Wave your hands to the crowd, you're the queen of the parade" The Pages - 'Heartaches And Pain You are mate. Respect.

The pint I've had takes a good while to brew Andy, costs a feckin' fortune and doesn't do your innards a whole lot of good...done me know harm though ay?

Anyone geet? Rotherham memory.

My usual self darling, half cut and spoiling for an issue, you know. I think we will be there Malcolm, we enjoyed our last little soiree up their the other month, so the scales have been tipped.

Good answer Rod.

Tony. I will actively seek you out for a concilliatory pint.

We put Billy on at The Carlton in Warrington in the mid 80's Malc, singing his classic 'Hold Me Tighter By The Vein'. Bit of a drama queen as it happened, he wasn't too happy about changing into his spangly jacket over the barrels behind the bar. Cracking D.A. too.

Not bored mate, just passionate and in todays heady lifestyle, and not being one who is excited by politics, this is the only time that I can put my shit down - as silly as it seems to some. I love this music, I love people like yourself, those who take the time to reply with other than a negative. I apologise to those on here that read the bollocks I post occasionally, it is borne of nothing more that the wont to understand what rings your bell/makes you tick.