pow wow mik

Never thought I'd see this described as a 'big want'! Crazy record but fair play to ya for the quirky taste, did you get a copy of peter scott peters?!

What happened to vinyl carvers? They used to be great

Sure someone played this at last pow wow club - hoss ir callum I guess, great tune and sounded great

It has been discussed much before, and god forbid that we end up with more 'pages of gibberish' on the subject but here's my view: They get away with it because they steal a product that isn't much of an asset to anyone and therefore not cared about. Often there isn't even a rival product that's legitimate, sometimes, as with the r&b boots, the copyright might even have transferred to the public domain. In the best case, a modern company like Ace might own the rights, but what are they going to do, if Sony and Lacoste etc struggle to stop it? I think its a good thing that Ebay dont police it much, cos where would that end? Private business enforcing laws is never a good idea, and too slack is certainly preferable to over zealous, which is how these things usually turn out. The ultimate responsibility for the existence of bootlegs and their producers is the people who buy them, simple as that. Just like the responsibility for drug use is squarely on the user and the responsibility for x factor is on those who watch it. unfortunately, humans seem to like poor quality shite, and like easy, cheap options even more, and in this case, the need to pretend to be a record collector, obviously a massive instinctive drive in the human evolutionary process, outweighs all other considerations. "There is hardly anything in the world that some man can not make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who only consider price are these mens' prey" Ruskin

The most drum-and-bass-before-its-time record I ever hear was US Warren hard headed woman on Chytown but Wesley Paige trapped also has that tempo.

Ah, i see now why you dropped that old dinner-party favourite 'tombstones for three' :-) The set deserved better, nice one

Remember that being a big track for me in the early 90s 'acid jazz' days, great to be reminded of it

That's a bit rude. 'Endless posts of gibberish'? It's a forum. On the internet. No one plays music, listens or dances to it on here, there are plenty of other outlets for those things - this supplements those things, it doesnt replace them. Its function is ONLY to talk about things. Are you saying you simply dislike the whole concept? Ironic then that you should make your stand on here. And like any area of life, analysing and discussing things does not preclude experiencing or enjoying them. Should no one discuss anything because its not as good as listening to sam cooke? Next times you find someone talking about the weather or their kids or the infinite range of trivial concerns that occupy our days, will you tell them to stop talking gibberish and listen to some sam cooke, will you tell yourself? maybe noone ever should research history, science or philosophy, because its all gibberish, all secondary to experience itself... its a rude and misguided stand; it is at worst completely harmless for people to discuss who played a record first or whatever, it only needs to be interesting to one for it to outweigh your argument against it. It used to happen in pubs and clubs and it was harmless, now it happens on here and its harmless. And it doesnt get in the way of anyone, not one single person, enjoying sam cooke. Sorry if that seems antagonistic, but I think the original post was, and typical of a lot of barbed 'positivity' on here.

I wasn't trying to create a dichotomy where you must either relentlessly move on or stick with the same pool of classics - like anything in life, either extreme is absurd and the best approach is a balance of both. I do believe though that those who willfully decline to search for new music, are probably more interested in their own emotions than in music. anyway, that wasn't my point. Think about a track you love that is now very popular. I'm thinking of charles sheffield, but dont get hung up on my choice, its not relevent. Imagine going back to those first few nights out when you danced to it and heard it all at the same time. If you were lucky - your first point of contact for such a great record, for any record, should be a situation that complements and enhances the record. so, for me in this case, it was tape in mates car building up the mystique, then smokey packed club in Manchester - Bang! Perfect. that's what folk culture does that faceless mainstream culture doesn't - protects the context. so why I'm not a popularist, why I hate the bootlegs, the youtube, the adverts, the background music bootleg pub djs is because in all those situations the music is relegated to fashion accessory, marketing tool, background music... the first point of contact for the Suspicions should be either the film, which exactly did it justice, or a club...maybe a cd passed around. This bland mulch of exploitative non-culture in between sucks the novelty and excitement out of things, makes things familiar but lifeless. its so thick now that people cant wade through it to get to the good stuff any more. Might have been watching too many historical epics over christmas there :-).

I think someone used the phrase 'familiarity breeds contempt' to describe the phenomenon of overkill, rather than to mean literally that familiarity gave him contempt for the record. you could almost divide people according to two musical sensibilities - one type who hear songs incidentally in meaningful times of their life and then listen to these same songs over and over, in a very subjective way, and dont wish to hear anything outside of that, and another type who love music for its own sake and therefore tend to get the greater pleasure from hearing new things. for the second type, the real music lover, hearing a track 10,000 times, doesn't reinforce it in the psyche as a comforting, familiar warm blanket, but instead makes them sick of it. however good a song is, if you hear it all the time, on this advert, in this shop and in this pub, you become at best disintrested in it, unless you are a member of the karaoke singalong brigade, in which case it has the opposite effect. I used to think that the more exposure for the music, the better, but after years of seeing great music get chewed up and spat out by passing fads, and this apparently only to the benefit of superficially interested or qualified djs, advertising execs and bootleggers who never present anything in a light condusive to any meaningful advancement of the artform.. the hunting for forgotten old music, as a cultural phenomenon, is a reaction to mainstream culture, which tends to force-feed you a narrow but controlled and highly profitable selection of products. Novelty is a huge part of musical enjoyment for real music lovers, not just of individual tracks but of whole styles. With the speed people can access information nowadays, there's a genuine likelihood that these mainstream listeners will have heard enough and got bored of the whole thing before ever even dancing in a real club to a real dj. so nothing lost then, when pop culture moves on and leaves us to it? Well, yes, maybe. If those who potentially had a yearning for something new, something deeper, had had to go to a real club to find that thing, meet some real people and hear the selections of a real passionate dj, then it could be that the whole package would bond them to it for the long time, as it did a lot of us. even the most beautiful thing can be made better or worse - maximised or trivialised - via context. Anyways, just a thought

If everyone who knows anything knows who's playing boots, then doesn't it defeat the purpose of playing them? Or is the intention to impress the narrow band of audience who have somehow achieved the unenviable state of thinking that old vinyl is cool while not actually knowing what it is? it's got to count as one of the most bizarre things to do. Akin to walking round town in a pilot's uniform to make people who dont care think that you're a pilot.

The version on the tv show is by Mort Stevens, or the lp described as the 'original tv soundtrack' is. Got some nice tracks on it too. Mort was sammy D's arranger and band leader, which is probably how he came to do a version of it. i love it, proper guilty pleasure!

It hasn't struck a raw nerve, your argument is just nonsense. You're saying that spending huge amounts on one intrinsically unreasonable form of collecting is reasonable, but on another isn't. if you buy a record for any other reason than to listen to it, as you do, then it's collecting and therefore akin to stamp collecting. Sure, some collecting seems to be more rational, or better value, than others. But who are you to judge? If someone wants to spend 20 bags on this, maybe instead of another buy-to-let or a stupid 4x4 or whatever people spend surplus money on, fair enough. the only record collecting that is 100% free of irrational stamp collecting tendencies is the buying of newies really. and, ironically, this talk of british issues being re-issues is the ultimate stamp collecting concern - they were part of the contemporary history of the record and the culture surrounding it and are as valid as major label pick-ups or second runs due to good sales. 'Only the first pressing is an original'? Oh get a grip - the only person who would care about such a unimportant detail is a stamp collector type...so, how can I put this : Enjoy your filing system.

Hang on, you buy original issues of tracks that are perfectly enjoyable and available to listen to on mp3 or youtube. Why is your blowing of that money somehow more rational than the blowing of money on this? Why is your knob waving lesser? is your way just the right way, is that what you're basically saying?]

More or less yes - dana valery! Going round in strange circles this thread]

Rest in peace. What a voice, 'if I had known' also in my all time top 5

Sold it last year unfortunately, and think the buyer was in some far away place so no point directing you there

Dont even say what the do is, or where! Is it a secret? :-)

We're in agreement about progress / divergence - yes it's the same thing - and, as you said, it's probably been accused of diluting the music / ruining the scene since the 60s. All I'd say is thank god for it and that it tends to be the more musically minded who embrace variety and the most scene minded who dont. I said my ideal night would be an open minded soul night, not that it was the way all nights should be, or that I was capable of doing it! I've had to specialise and focus on r&b because I just couldn't afford to collect accross the board to the depth that I'd want to and also because I like specialist nights too. I dont think of pow wow as an r&b club these days - it starts where Lifeline starts - with 60s club soul - and while Lifeline then explores later years and styles of soul, we explore earlier ones, between us covering 30odd years of time and a fantastically wide range of the best art humans ever produced. But still we're not using that as a rule or over riding concept, we just both know the sounds we want to hear and we play them. Without radically changing the music, or playing anything far-out, I think both clubs have moved on from 'northern soul' or 'mod' or such limiting identities.

Well it isn't me that confused! I haven't a clue about northern soul, and certainly dont believe it to be dead as a progressive entity. my post was in reponse to people on here who say that the dependence on either oldies on one hand, or associated sub-styles like r&b or funk on the other, is due to a deficit of newies in the traditional northern style. I haven't a clue if there are proper northern newies to play or not, but was making the point that people dont necesarily play funk or r&b in a desperate attempt to play something new, as is often claimed, but because they really like funk & r&b, as much as northern style soul. I know I do. my ideal night simply plays great soul music, these nuances of genre that supposedly separate northern from funk from modern from northern from hard edged from r&b from popcorn...dont really mean anything to me. While I'm sure most of the old school crowd are outraged at this concept of open minded soul appreciation, it is my bet that all the people lined up to inherit soul music and save it from nostalgic battle re-enactment oblivion on one hand or chin stroking trophy collecting middle aged blokey tedium on the other, feel pretty much the same as me. remember, this genre of music we know as northern soul is so diverse as to be meaningless anyway, in a musical sense. It only exists as a construct of those who like it - like a collective version of individual taste. there's no rule or theory anywhere that says it is a correct understanding of music, or even soul music. The original musicians wouldnt recognise it, neither do I. Point being : evolution and progress seems to be discarding the old northern soul rules. Let it. If you like those rules, maybe the only place you're going to see them recognised is the oldies scene:

Unless you like funk and r&b of course, in which case the quality of records played will have seriously improved. You may have assumed that these diversifications have taken place due to people running out of the traditional style, but that isn't the case. Many people like music, and find embracing different styles rewarding, others actually prefer soul OTHER than trad northern, like me. If that traditional northern soul sound is all you want then there's a whole nostalgia scene for you, maybe it's time to accept it. maybe, as an upfront scene, northern soul IS dead, but soul lives on, in all it's forms. That's progress.

I used to play them together years ago funnily enough

Two versions, hope you got the longer one

sandy golden - your love is everything ...influenced by? young rascals - groovin

Jesus, look at all the crappy '2nd presses' on that site, how depressing