A whole heap of recent threads on S.S. have lead me to believe that it's currently much more fashionable to ridicule success of any sort and applaud failure.

Why is that?

Some recent instances could include the following examples:-

1) Take such phenomenonally commercially successful Northern Soul records such as "This Old Heart Of Mine" - The Isley Brothers or even the completely reviled "Do I Love You (Indeed I Do)" - Frank Wilson. Both records are absolute pinnacles of everything a Northern Soul record should be, yet because the Isley Brothers was eventually a UK Top 10 hit and because Frank Wilson has become something of a cliche on the scene, both records are scorned and treated with disrespect compared to a no-hoper recorded in a shed in Carolina which always had little or no chance of any success.

2) Previously phenomenally successful Northern Soul venues such as, for the sake of arguement, Wigan Casino, which arguably did more to spread the popularity of Northern Soul then any other venue ever, are derided because of their success and the influence they had on the scene at the time. Likewise certain DJ's from certain eras.

3) Certain promoters who have had a long time career (in some cases all their lives) being involved in Northern Soul are derided for catering to large audiences, being commercially successful and essentially making a success of their efforts.

4) Even Berry Gordy, arguably the most influential person in Northern Soul history, is looked upon with suspicion because he was a successful businessman first and foremost and thus not so fashionable when it comes to icons of the scene.

The consistant thread which comes out of all this, is that it would appear that anyone who has any kind of commercial success within Northern Soul circles is treated with suspicion or dread.

Which is weird. Why on earth would anyone decry success in a given field?

So my theory is that failure is fundamental to the popularity of certain areas within Northern Soul circles. Success is frowned upon whereas failure is applauded. Would this be an accurate statement?

Ian D

Edited February 26, 201015 yr by Ian Dewhirst

I just feel so born flippin lucky . It feels like a golden thread running through my "grim up north" life . And im so thankful for it and it feels so kind of precious to me , even , and maybe especially , the corny bits and crappy tunes that we all laugh about now . Am i cheese on toast or what ! ha ha :-]

I just feel so born flippin lucky . It feels like a golden thread running through my "grim up north" life . And im so thankful for it and it feels so kind of precious to me , even , and maybe especially , the corny bits and crappy tunes that we all laugh about now . Am i cheese on toast or what ! ha ha :-]

I'm exactly the same. Whenever anyone asks me where I'm from and I tell 'em I spent all my formative years and youth in a mill town in Yorkshire called Mirfield and they say, "Oh my God. That must have been awful", I give them an enigmatic look and say, "Au contraire my friend, it was the eighth wonder of the world".......

Thing is, it was! We were lucky enough to be there and get on the ride.........

Ian D

I think it was more the term northern soul was not underground, very much a common word and many knew something about it.. Northern on the play list at our youth club and then the early teenage discos for 14/ 17 year olds.... Lots of my mates would dance along but never took it any further in the future... Maybe only a few thousand full timers but many many many more who dipped a toe in now and again...

Many mates would always want to hear the classics but some of us had moved on to more underground sounds that the disco did not play...

Bang on.

In reality, the scene was fairly well known about and the term 'Northern Soul' is usually met with some type of varying acknowlegement from anybody who was a teenager in the 70s. Yeah, many, many thousands of toe-dippers for sure....At the end of the day it is the huge reservoir of records that have been turned over in the past 30 years that constitute the real 'underground' status. The music rather than the scene itself which in truth was penetrated by thousands of curious 70s Time Travellers

Now we've exceeded 100 postings, this fascinating thread is getting a bit too mainstream and successful for me.

I'm off to find a more exclusive thread so I can become part of a secret underground movement.

Now we've exceeded 100 postings, this fascinating thread is getting a bit too mainstream and successful for me.

I'm off to find a more exclusive thread so I can become part of a secret underground movement.

Ego Booster!

Ian D

I'm back already.

This thread is just too good to miss, even though some people have wandered a bit off-topic ...I won't mention any names in case I implicate myself !

So who else grew up in a town where 'northern soul' was pretty mainstream rather than underground ?

Grew up in Widnes,where the coolest lads and the most gorgeous girls were into it......You're dead right about Newton Aycliffe though,mate!

It's strange that Newton Aycliffe was such a big soul town yet other nearby towns were just the opposite.

I realise now that because it was a newish town with mostly young families, there were thousands of kids of similar ages and they all had to attend the same two large schools and the same large youth centre which were all next to each other in the middle of town. So they were all exposed en masse to the same music at the same time.

It was like a huge captive audience.

When I was about sixteen (1974) I promoted a licensed event at the new Recreation Centre (even though I wasn't old enough to drink) and I got into huge trouble with the Town Council because too many people turned up! They freaked out about security and fire regulations etc.

My mam thought I was gonna be rich when she saw how many tickets had been sold! It was more money than my parents earned in a month.

Of course it turned out there were soul fans all over the north east, just not all living in the same towns.

So it really does depend on where you grew up.

Do you think it was cos Aycliffe(we'll drop the Newton bollocks now,mate!!) was/is so Working-Class that it took off there...There were quite a few in Darlington but very sparse elswhere in the North-East......wasn't it!?

No doubt the working-class thing had something to do with it, Phil, but Aycliffe was modern and quite prosperous; at least everyone had decent homes and jobs in those days.

Darlington was a well-established big town with many schools, pubs and clubs scattered around so things weren't condensed as they were in Aycliffe. That's the big difference, I think.

Lots of people from Darlington came to Aycliffe for soul discos. In fact I reckon it was the "soul brotherhood" spirit that really put an end to the troubles between Aycliffe and Darlington lads. We were all skinheads / suedeheads in those days but the music brought us together in the end.

A good example of the power of music.

Sorry if this has wandered a bit off-topic but it does show that soul music certainly wasn't exclusive where I grew up. Just the opposite.

To me Northern Soul has been a hit since i am sure a lot of people had been into soul music and then start getting into more and more obscure stuff we known as Northern and before you know it, that scene is a big one.

Now a lot of it call it a failure for same old same old and nothing new and there is nothing coming into not even kids or less of them wanting to be associated

plus there is the divide of Northern vs Modern which gets on my nerves