I see Pat Brady has one of these up in his 'Northern Soul - Old Skool Pressings, Re- Issues & Lookalikes/UK 1st & 2nd issues' section for £40 which suggests it's a boot. How do you tell an original from a boot? I've asked this one before but never managed to bet a definitive answer.

original 45.

label is smudge free and a darker yellow. original deadwax reads : 196 Superdisc TBS - 1001 - A deadwax matrix is 13.2mm wide

COUNTERFEIT repro. Label has poor reproduction with the red lettering causing occasional light red smudges on the yellow.deadwax matrix reads TBS 1001 A - 196 SUPERDISC the "U" in "superdisc" resembles an O and the "I" resembles a j

Edited December 16, 200618 yr by john manship

Are these not the 're-issues' you find on ebay for about a tenner? I thought they were just blatant bootlegs. ?

Rich

Are these not the 're-issues' you find on ebay for about a tenner? I thought they were just blatant bootlegs. ?

Rich

S`pose its if you buyin`or sellin`,dealer ethics........

original 45.

label is smudge free and a darker yellow. original deadwax reads : 196 Superdisc TBS - 1001 - A deadwax matrix is 13.2mm wide

COUNTERFEIT repro. Label has poor reproduction with the red lettering causing occasional light red smudges on the yellow.deadwax matrix reads TBS 1001 A - 196 SUPERDISC the "U" in "superdisc" resembles an O and the "I" resembles a j

John...I've had so many different answers on this one before. Is the matrix number thingy definative?

John...I've had so many different answers on this one before. Is the matrix number thingy definative?

definative?

Matrix numbers are always definative as they are the original inscription added to the master stamper at the time. The only time it's different is if the record has two or more masterplates and is pressed in different areas.

the info is as definative as it gets. I always log the exact info when I have both BOOTLEG and ORIGINAL in stock at the same time.

The bootleg was sold as an original when it first appear on the market.. but the label is messy. If you have the two records at the same time the difference is very nobvious.

Edited December 16, 200618 yr by john manship

definative?

Matrix numbers are always definative as they are the original inscription added to the master stamper at the time. The only time it's different is if the record has two or more masterplates and is pressed in different areas.

the info is as definative as it gets. I always log the exact info when I have both BOOTLEG and ORIGINAL in stock at the same time.

The bootleg was sold as an original when it first appear on the market.. but the label is messy. If you have the two records at the same time the difference is very nobvious.

The reason I said definative isI've heard different opinions on whether this 45 was pressed at different plants and therefore had different masters. I don't know whether the confusion is caused partly because of the blurred labels or something.

How do you tell an original from a boot?[/quote]

Most of the Boots I Have heard playing are slightly off centre & don't sound right ! ! ! !

Jon Buck

The reason I said definative isI've heard different opinions on whether this 45 was pressed at different plants and therefore had different masters. I don't know whether the confusion is caused partly because of the blurred labels or something.

These bootlegs are COUNTERFEITS pressed to decieve the collector. They have copied the matirix info ie both 45s have at "SUPERDISC" in the deadwax, SUPERDISC did the mastering on the original.

You do often encounter, excuses why a bootleg ought to be an "original" usually made by the owner or seller of a counterfeit.... if you get my drift.

Edited December 16, 200618 yr by john manship

nobvious.

What a great new word....

I see Pat Brady has one of these up in his 'Northern Soul - Old Skool Pressings, Re- Issues & Lookalikes/UK 1st & 2nd issues' section for £40 which suggests it's a boot. How do you tell an original from a boot? I've asked this one before but never managed to bet a definitive answer.

Hi Simon,

Got an original of the Pages & everybody says it's a boot when they see it until they check the matrix. Like John says thats the only definite way to tell. A lot (but not all) of originals have offset labels so the centre hole cuts into the title. Mine dosen't so thats why folks think it's a boot. Also not all the boots are that smudgy so be careful.

Funny thing is over the years i've seen more originals than boots so i'd say the boots are pretty scarce.

Another one that throws a spanner into the works is ZZ & Co & to this day i still don't know the difference. Heard the so called boots were in fact originals & the so called originals were 2nd issues. Look very similar to the Pages boots.

Any connection John?

Can anyone tell me the difference between an original and a boot.

I know it's got something to do with the Colour of the label??

And how do the letters appear in the run out groove on an original in what order??

Thanks

It's like telling the difference between Stork and butter - they say you can't but if you know, you know

Seriously, this has already been explained, at least once, since I've been on here (which is les time than you have). I'm sure that some kind Sourcer will put up the link in due course.

TONE

I'm sure that some kind Sourcer will put up the link in due course.

TONE

Here you go Phil - you have to be careful with this one.

https://www.soul-source.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=39199

Brian

Here you go Phil - you have to be careful with this one.

https://www.soul-source.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=39199

Brian

Thanks Brian..... just as i thought.

See you soon

Phil

Hi Simon,

Got an original of the Pages & everybody says it's a boot when they see it until they check the matrix. Like John says thats the only definite way to tell. A lot (but not all) of originals have offset labels so the centre hole cuts into the title. Mine dosen't so thats why folks think it's a boot. Also not all the boots are that smudgy so be careful.

Funny thing is over the years i've seen more originals than boots so i'd say the boots are pretty scarce.

Another one that throws a spanner into the works is ZZ & Co & to this day i still don't know the difference. Heard the so called boots were in fact originals & the so called originals were 2nd issues. Look very similar to the Pages boots.

Any connection John?

the connection is you've all been stiffed by the same guy for years.

The Z.Z. Company ORIGINALS have better sound quality, better labels! the counterfeits were sold as originals BUT are definately not. I found originals in a shop in Riochmond N.Y. years ago so I know the real deal when I see it.

But if you were the guy who sold them as originals, I'm sure you'd tell people the other ones (better sound and sharper label) are actually the bootlegs..now that's a new slant on counterfeiting..you actually make it better....uuuh!

definative?

Matrix numbers are always definative as they are the original inscription added to the master stamper at the time. The only time it's different is if the record has two or more masterplates and is pressed in different areas.

the info is as definative as it gets. I always log the exact info when I have both BOOTLEG and ORIGINAL in stock at the same time.

The bootleg was sold as an original when it first appear on the market.. but the label is messy. If you have the two records at the same time the difference is very nobvious.

"nobvious" Such a brilliant new word of advice, assisting in the afford to describe the dicks trying to rip people off.