Its over 40 years now that we have had some sort of Northern/Rare Soul Scene in the UK.

Soul music was, on the whole, vastly under rated & over looked in its country of origin - particularly the plethora of obscure non commercial output, from a multitude of areas, labels & artists, aswell as musicians, producers, writers & back room players.

What started as a localised under ground music scene in the North of England, has blossomed into a truly world wide phenominum. The music of black america, has inspired a generation of British teenagers. Some of which, have made a whole life times career, out of the promotion of obscure black dance music from America - releasing material from said artists, seaching out the artists & bringing them to our shores to entertain & enthrall a whole new audience, which they could never have imagined when they first laid there soul to wax.

Artists careers have been rejuvenated, with records being re - issued & even successfully & comercially entering the the British pop charts, as a consequence. Other artists have been pulled from obscurity, artists who may never ever have been recognised in a any way what so ever, if it had not been for an underground dance scene in the UK hungry for fresh vintage black dance records, ever diggin deeper for that unknown/obscure gem with 'that' beat, to keep the dance floors of the North of England & then further afield & now internationally full every weekend of the year for over 30 years.

Northern Soul continues to leave a massive positive legacy, that has not only made a difference to many peoples lives in the UK, but has had a positive influence on Black American music makers, who some times even benefit financially as a result of a once small but vibrant & exciting dance scene, that rose out of the working class white teenagers in the North of Englands passion for Black Vintage dance music, from a far away land, most could never even imagine - how the hell did that happen ?....but it did & it still continues to this day.

Northern Soul - a positive legacy - an upbeat discussion about the positive influence that NS has had on the music of black america & the British enthusiasts that created a scene to dance to it !!!....discuss.

Best Russ

Interesting that you heavily stress that it's a scene playing black American music Russ, because as we all know a lot of northern soul isn't black, some isn't American and a fair percentage isn't soul either. Nothern Soul has always been about the dancing, it's primarily a dance scene, and uses whatever music fits the bill as opposed to following one type of music. To be honest that's probably why it's survived, it's adapted and taken on board Latin, RnB, funk, jazz, rock, pretty much everthing over the years.

...in my opinion.

Point taken, but the vast amount of music played over the years has been black American - & as the primary point of reference, the generalisation for the sake of this thread is validated Im sure...

Best Russ,

Actually it's well over 40 years now Russ, since the 'Northern' scene actually started in the late 1960's..........

Ian D

Actually it's well over 40 years now Russ, since the 'Northern' scene actually started in the late 1960's..........

Ian D

Yeah, your right Ian, my Math aint great first thing Monday mornings - another NS legacy .

Best Russ

Interesting that you heavily stress that it's a scene playing black American music Russ, because as we all know a lot of northern soul isn't black, some isn't American and a fair percentage isn't soul either. Nothern Soul has always been about the dancing, it's primarily a dance scene, and uses whatever music fits the bill as opposed to following one type of music. To be honest that's probably why it's survived, it's adapted and taken on board Latin, RnB, funk, jazz, rock, pretty much everthing over the years.

...in my opinion.

Very true, however I'm (almost) sure that the majority would rather see The Dells or Bettye Lavette in concert, than say Paul Anka or Guy Darrell.

Tony

Very true, however I'm (almost) sure that the majority would rather see The Dells or Bettye Lavette in concert, than say Paul Anka or Guy Darrell.

Tony

Oh I dunno, nothing surprises me any more about people's tastes on the northern scene.

Interesting and nice sentiment but I think you're overplaying the significance of a Northern Soul legacy. Certianly in the last 30 years the Northern scene has been about the retrospective appreciation of black american music (and second hand copies) that was so undervalued in it's country of origin - but I'm not convinced that much of this has trickled down to artists. Music publishers and record company execs might have a better story to tell on those that were licenced for comps or reissues.

You could also say the same about House and New York disco (The Loft/Gallery/Paradise Garage) scene that flourished after the demise of 1970s disco boom - ignored outside black gay club scenes in New York, New Jersy and Chicago but lapped up over here. A little bit of history repeating itself?

And what's more ironic is that those very artists appreciated so much on the Northern Scene were still recording and largely ignored by the NS scene in the 1970s and 80s because black america had left the sixties sound behind.

I think the 'legacy' remains with the dancers and people who still buy the music - mainly on this side of the pond (myself included).

Whilst I respectfully take your comments onboard & agree to some extent, I think you do the NS scene a massive injustice, artists & groups have had commercial success with re issues on the strength of NS plays back in the 7ts & artists & groups have toured the UK on the back of same plays. Also its not just about the financial gains, but the recognition artists have received from the NS scene, recognition which would never have happened other wise.

I could go on & on, but, its about time the scene took some kudos from its facination & passion for this music, I get pissed off when ignorant people make incorrect judgements about the scene (not you BTW). Many outsiders find it amusing to poke fun at some of the aspects of NS & ridicule it, but there have been far more positive aspects than the negative, which have had a knock on effect for the artists & for soul music in general.

Its like pulling teeth with you lot some times, cant even take a pat on the back & add your own positive thoughts, stories, come on for gods sake, take some credit for this passion of ours for over 4 decades .

C'mon, lets hear it for the UK soul scene, past & present......

Best Russ

Northern soul scene is alive in the present because we are alive,

not so sure we will leave a 'legacy', not sure in 50 years time when we are all gone,

that the Northern Soul scene will still be here.

3 cheers for past and present, but 'Legacy', not so sure.

Perhaps another debating point

Northern soul scene is alive in the present because we are alive,

not so sure we will leave a 'legacy', not sure in 50 years time when we are all gone,

that the Northern Soul scene will still be here.

3 cheers for past and present, but 'Legacy', not so sure.

Perhaps another debating point

I agree Dekka,

We shouldn't be thinking of a legacy but living it in the here and now. If it is picked up in the future then so be it but we haven't an obligation to 'leave something behind'

The scene is a massive testament to the UK's Soul boys and Girls and their undying love for the music. In the States they are all for now and don't dwell on the past, you've had your day now it's someone else's turn !!

I believe it will die with us. There are a few kids into it but not enough to sustain it in the way we have it now. Maybe an odd do here and there occasionally but .. Lets hope it catches the imagination of the youth as it did with us.

Northern soul scene is alive in the present because we are alive,

not so sure we will leave a 'legacy', not sure in 50 years time when we are all gone,

that the Northern Soul scene will still be here.

3 cheers for past and present, but 'Legacy', not so sure.

Perhaps another debating point

I pretty much think along the same lines, there may well be a northern scene in 50 years time, but it won't be recognisable when compared to today's scene, just as today's scene isn't the same as the one most of us arrived on 30/40 years ago, it's forever morphing

Great idea for a discussion Russ.

I think you can also make a lot of the camaraderie found on the scene.

Back in the 70s when I first heard about Northern Soul, if you went out of your town, you kept your wits about you. Whether it was to go to a football game or a stag night. How many times have you seen a fight preceded with the words - You're not from round here are you?

At Soul nights and allnighters we would meet people from all over the country and sometimes beyond. We'd meet people of all different colors. I met the first openly gay people I'd ever met at Northern Soul nights. And the comparison with 'the real world' was, and still often is STARK.

One of the things that really attracted me was feeling safe, wherever I'd gone to hear the music I liked. At a boozer before a football match or a stag night in a night club. You'd wait for someone to be glassed and pray it wasn't you or your friends. At a soul night the worst that could happen is someone taking the mickey when you had an attack of early morning paranoia. The late 70s (and I'm sure before) saw trips to the seaside end in fights cos you had the wrong hair, mode of transport or whatever. It was a different world to what it is now. I think the real world has only just started catching up to the kind of world we found in our clubs.

I also believe the soul scene made me a better person on that front. More open minded about meeting people from elsewhere, or gay or a different color. Growing up, all those things were reasons for 'hating' or ridiculing someone. There but for the grace of god.......

Great idea for a discussion Russ.

I think you can also make a lot of the camaraderie found on the scene.

Back in the 70s when I first heard about Northern Soul, if you went out of your town, you kept your wits about you. Whether it was to go to a football game or a stag night. How many times have you seen a fight preceded with the words - You're not from round here are you?

At Soul nights and allnighters we would meet people from all over the country and sometimes beyond. We'd meet people of all different colors. I met the first openly gay people I'd ever met at Northern Soul nights. And the comparison with 'the real world' was, and still often is STARK.

One of the things that really attracted me was feeling safe, wherever I'd gone to hear the music I liked. At a boozer before a football match or a stag night in a night club. You'd wait for someone to be glassed and pray it wasn't you or your friends. At a soul night the worst that could happen is someone taking the mickey when you had an attack of early morning paranoia. The late 70s (and I'm sure before) saw trips to the seaside end in fights cos you had the wrong hair, mode of transport or whatever. It was a different world to what it is now. I think the real world has only just started catching up to the kind of world we found in our clubs.

I also believe the soul scene made me a better person on that front. More open minded about meeting people from elsewhere, or gay or a different color. Growing up, all those things were reasons for 'hating' or ridiculing someone. There but for the grace of god.......

The northern scene has always embraced 'gingers'

The northern scene has always embraced 'gingers'

Deep

Deep

I like to think I've widened Russ's original discussion point Barry

The northern scene has always embraced 'gingers'

Its a curse !!

The only place I feel accepted !!!

Oh I dunno, nothing surprises me any more about people's tastes on the northern scene.

I did qualify it a bit

Tony

The northern scene has always embraced 'gingers' :)

That took longer than building the Great Wall