Chalky

Here is a previous topic where Soul-Slider first suggests who Carol may be, a day later it is mentioned on soulful detroit, coincidence!

Don did have memory of Cheatin Kind ad he told us when we went for dinner he sent a tape down to Vanleer and that he never heard back. But you are right the industry, especially back then was full of unscrupulous people, companies and crooks. Knowing Popcorn, if he though some wrong was done he’d have gone after them? I would imagine Vocallion did a deal in good faith and Vault had the rights to license. Unless we see the contract it is all speculation.

I’ve said elsewhere on here that my belief is it is Carol Bayer Sager with a new partner. Given the numbering of Carol and Sherry and Carol and Gerri logic would suggest it is. I did email Carol a few years ago to ask but she didn’t respond, probably a time she doesn’t wish to reflect upon or she didn’t get the mail. I did send it through her site as well.

He did by the looks of it, Ala King is Popcorns publishing company and it is shown on the Vault release as well

Did Popcorn own the rights though?

https://www.rarenorthernsoul.com/x-16503

fantastic shots Steve

I voted keep but only because I know it would never work in none room today, as much as I'd like it to

Definitely some who got into the groove they left and had the thirst for new stuff. Some moved on later to new stuff but I found the majority were just stuck in the retro trap. I hope that is the case mate but I feel for the majority this past year will be as it never existed and be right back where we left it 🤣

It started before then but yes the grand return accelerated it. Most of the returning are brought up on new discoveries, unless they only went for two weeks like many, yet upon their return all they wanted was familiarity. The majority didn't move on as you would expect to wanting something new.

And that is the trouble though, promoters want Billy Big Bollocks who has spent a fortune, wants only what he knows and not what else might be in his collection. Side rooms are an simply to get 30 or 40 others in who they wouldn't normally get in. I've always played some new or recent;y unearthed from the vaults releases. Precisely what Is I said earlier, no patience for anything they do not know and are totally unwilling to give anything a go. What happened to the mentality everyone had at some stage, new stuff throughout the decades, Torch, Wigan, Mecca, Stafford, Blackburn etc

The scene is simply far too diverse now with a crowd with little patience for what they don't want to hear. I stand by what I said in the topic this discussion was derived from that the new releases that are pretty prolific these days are seldom played. They may get played at smaller niche events but I don't know one promoter who will book a Dj to play a set of new releases, be then new old from the vault 45s or brand new soul. I know some Djs play one or two releases but they are more often than not the more acceptable releases. For a start far too many though are pretty inferior. Many aren't "northern" enough either for the main rooms. There is a musical snobbery amongst the Djs, in particular the cheque book Djs that pretty much are the promoters first choice these days, not so much for what they play but for how much they are spending. New releases are still frowned upon by many even though many sell out in days and fetch 3 figure sums within weeks of release. I've spent a lot of time in the second room and for some who Dj in this rooms they simply stick to tried and tested for fear of not getting people up dancing and simply don't get what those rooms are there for....as an alternative to what is being played in the first and to dig deep into collections and play the rarely heard. I'd like nothing better than to return to one room affairs but it will never happen. The second room was probably started by After Dark (Steve Croft) at Cleethorpes etc, I Know Wigan had Mr M's for oldies but the main room anything still went. In the early 80s (circa 1983) there were many complaints about not enough or too much 60s or modern as it was then. Places like Stafford still promoted the one room affair but the split between northern and modern was starting to happen and it was down hill from then onwards. Today it isn't simply a case of Northern and modern. We have R&B, crossover, funky stuff and so on, far too diverse for one dance floor.

Yes I know you do but they are the more niche kinda venue I mention. I have always tried to play and always support new releases, particularly those I thing will suit a northern style event. But I do more “other” rooms than anything and can get away with a bit more. These kinda releases are still frowned upon, mainly by the cheque book DJs.

This topic looks to be turning into a list of records released in the last 5 years rather than records played at (Northern) soul venues. Truth is very few new or recent get plays at mainstream venues. Promoters will not book Djs who play these releases. Its a shame as it is a scene crying out for new sounds. 99% of these mentioned will not or have not got played. Little niche events maybe.

Butch’s copy is a US test press or acetate

Still twice as much as it should be, was a tough sell for years

and they pay no tax on promos

When you think of the size of the country and the amount of radio stations, Djs, pluggers etc, 20.000 would soon be gone.

Not sure about the 600 unreleased in the vaults notion, probably many more than that

Another over inflated price, plenty of copies for sale in recent times of each. Who is buying these at these daft prices. You could get this for a then over inflated price of around £700 just a short while ago. What makes some fool pay almost twice as much?

There was far more than 200 pressed. They were given away at a launch party for the CD set The Master if memory serves. Many were discarded, thrown on the floor. I know one who went round picking copies up. All had picture sleeves to begin with.

Are they? They shouldn’t be. Most black issues are more expensive than the demo.

Spot on mate

There is nothing odd about it. Given the size of RCA they will massively promo a release, just about every radio station getting copies. If feedback wasn’t good and initial sales poor then the 45 would be dropped. Many RCA releases of interest to us are rarer on issue

from the sleeve notes of Dave Hamilton's Detroit Dancers Vol 2.... Al Johnson managed the group Lead vocalist and guitarist was Joe Anderson The tape boxes suggest the proper group name is Ravens and that the "I" is a misspelling by Dave Hamilton @Ady Croasdell might be able to help a little more