I am pretty new to the scene, but have always been a fan of soulful music (Reggae mainly).I have spent the weekend on a popular file sharing program downloading rare soul and I have just totted up, I've got about 20 Grands worth of tunes.

How do people feel about this?Do you use file sharing programs?If so which ones?Is file sharing harming the scene?

I am really enjoying all this new(old) music i am hearing and hope to get out to a few do's very soon!

Northwich all dayer on bank holiday monday anyone?

I'm waiting to see the response to this?

I'll admit to downloading no more than half a dozen tracks. But on the whole, I don't see why you don't just go to a site like Soul Club and just play the tracks, without actually downloading them.

Or in the case of say John Manships site, small clips of a track to encourage you to buy the record. I have a tape from Scenesville with samples on, of tunes played there, and they have purposefully not recorded the end of the tunes to deter bootleggers.

The problem being with the internet nowadays, is that it's a case of stable doors and horses!

I have just totted up, I've got about 20 Grands worth of tunes.

No mate you havent!!!! and it doesnt look like anybody wants to discuss this subject. "KEEP IT REAL" ;-) XXX

File sharing and all the sites that are full of soul are maybe making the music too accessible?????? Maybe if the RIAA and the BPI (or whatever it's called) shut them down it will make folk go out again to hear the music again? ;-)

I have over the past few years been given cd's with unissued stuff on them and when I used to go to a do I would be bored with hearing the same stuff heard every day in my car! I now no longer listen to soul music in the car on my way to a do as it just ruins the night for me

File sharing is giving me access to tunes i couldn't have heard if i had spent 100's on cd's or 10,000's on original vinyl copies. I am doing Kev Roberts' top 500 cos i assumed this would be a good place to start.

I am completely new to northern soul but have been a record collector in the past and totally understand the passion you can have for a piece black plastic, My job in a record shop spoiled me with seeing and listening to all the latest new stuff.

Since hooking up to the web i have been very busy seeking out all the songs (in all genres) that i have ever wanted. I see file sharing as a valuable tool for every fan of music, to find the music they love and seek out new music they might not listen to if they had to buy it.

Kazza and Win Mx are very large concerns and as such atrract a lot of attention from the authorities due to their large user base, there will always be some way of mutually swaping files on the internet , so i have no fear of the RIAA or BPI....Filesharing will never die!

I urge you all to give https://www.slsknet.org/ a try, very small, very underground, good place for reggae, modern soul, hip hop and northern/rare soul , it has no ads and a friendly community, i was chatting to a soulie in Sweden yesterday!

If you love music and are online, file sharing is a must, KTF!

How can you have the pretention to say KTF and condone this thieving practice? More like KFC woudl be appropriate.

I long for the day that the BPI catch up with you and your sort.........

how welcoming the soul community is!

I will be the first to agree the colonel does make some tasty treats and seems to have a good taste in music.Surely anything that opens up the music to new ears is a good thing , you can sneer now because y'all have 30yrs of collecting under your increasing waistband.

Maybe it's like picking on the first years at school, a cyber head flush, but how's about guiding the fool rather than egging him huh?

I think Frank asked a very honest question and it's a real shame that we can't have an honest debate without the bile that has started to be dished out here.

Can't the Northern Soul community show that it is capable of a rational discussion and without anyone hiding behind anonimity or anagramatic psuedonyms.

Definitely KTF

Brian

you can sneer now because y'all have 30yrs of collecting under your increasing waistband.

Oh dear Frank you dont seem to have got of to a very good start! but instead of try to encourage us all to File Share ask about some good cheap originals/reissues to get you started and as for your comment above its not the cyber flush for you mate it will be a swift kick in the nads!!!!!!!!! from a 37 year old size 10 ;-) xxx

I've come to the conclusion that the elitist soulies amongst this forum are terminally argumentative, just because someone has downloaded recordings for his own education of the Northern/Rare Soul scene they take umbrage and go off on one. I remember when I first heard Northern Soul being played at a youth club in 1972, and loved it so much at the age of 13 I applied for a membership to Wigan Casino. I was petrified my first time there, but soon met others who were friendly, knowledgeable and welcoming, isn't it a shame it's not true of the scene now. Trying to KTF meant something to me then, and recordings made live at Wigan were what saw me through the week. KTF DavidC

Isn't file sharing little different than tape swapping - but just an alternative medium in the year 2004?

Haven't we all got tapes of a friend's records and haven't we done tapes of our records for our friends - or are some of us so pure and clean that we refuse to accept them or record them?

Let he (or she) who is without guilt throw the first stone.

Brian

Respect!Thanks for the support and sorry if I offended you louise!

David C - Spot on,every night is newies night at our house,hearing Yvonne baker for the very first time!Magical!

Brian - It is tape swapping, i just want to get a good overview to see what styles i like , and to make a top ten of course!!!

On the whole i have found soulies to be really nice and eager to share information and stories,I think thats why it's such an appealing scene!!

Respect!Thanks for the support and sorry if I offended you louise!

Dont worry! i enjoy the banter, we are really a friendly lot its just some things tend to ignite us more than others!!! just please dont start a debate about bootlegs or playing CDs at niters LOL !!!!!!!!! ;-) xxx

There's legally absolutely no difference between downloading files from the internet and home taping (remember the skull-and-crossbones and 'Home taping is killing music' all over LP bags in the 70s/80s?) Ultimately, no-one has the right to copy or reproduce any music for any third party without the express permission of the copyright holder.

The practical difference, however, is massive. No-one knows if you copy stuff in your bedroom and pass it on to a mate. If you download stuff from an internet site, your electronic fingerprints are all over the track like a cheap suit.

In moral terms, I can see the difference between copying northern sounds - where a large number of the artists are untraced and unknown, and therefore couldn't be paid royalties even if you wanted to pay them, and where, additionally, you may not physically be able to get hold of the original 45 - and copying Robbie Williams' latest release...there is a real live 'artist' whose earning potential is being damaged by your actions.

Any northern fan with tapes or CDs of music in their possession for which the copyright holder was not paid - ie ALL OF US - is comitting the same offence as the downloader so it ill behoves us to get too high and mighty about this.

By the way, is it just me or is there something odd about this thread? Is someone on a fishing expedition...?

interesting thread - though reckon getting file sharing as in p2p with kazzo, soulseeker winmx and rest mixed into those illegal sites who ask for donations, sell cds of tracks etc etc

my thoughts on it all

David c you wanna chill out,

Frank Wilson - (do us a favour choose another name:) ) you may or may not be aware that cause of the actions of a few, many feel strongly about the way some have took this file sharing thing, which should and was a benefit of internet and turned into a pure "save/make money" thing with no concern at all for their actions

Cause of strong feeling, which as said may or not be aware (the jurys still out on this) your posts could be taken by some as "advertising" this sort of thing and thats maybe why didnt get showered in flowers on posting.

Along with banging on about how downloaded £1000s worth of tracks which are all available on cd already, a dodgy name etc etc, some might have thought you were yet another dodgy poster.

Pass on my view on post and thus file sharing as had some off list stuff bout this thread.

As been said file swapping can be like tape swapping and a good thing, but ..... as with all things worthwhile, there's people who just take the piss, such as dishing out full high quality mp3s of complete Kent and other legit cds , others trying to sell custom " pick your own" cds and all the rest.

usual questions....

Has it had a effect on kent and all the other companies who do so much to release rare and unissued tracks ?

what if they decide to call it a day?

While the royalities situation is not ideal, its good as it gets and surely better than nought?

how much the artists featured recently in kfc have lost out eithe ron royalties or recogontion, due to so called "soul sites" offering their tracks in full?

Why do some think that offering 10000s should be acceptable ?

On site stuff, few changes to way forum is run in near future, try and avoid stepping in, due to .....perm 1 of 3

as usually can't be arsed , or too busy, or enjoy a good scrap

but this time as had complaints about the posting up soulseeker link, will just give an "forum" view/explanation why its still there

have left up as as with kazza and other similar it seems they are acceptable "legal wise"( unlike some others that have been posted recently)

thats all

make what you want out of it, forum is all about enjoying soul

thats what I do

mike

I think there's probably two sides to downloading - specifically northern type music. While putting proper CD releases on download sites affects the artists / labels through lost royalties and should be discouraged, what about the stuff not available anywhere else. I'm thinking about rarer things that might be selling for hundreds of pounds. The artist doesn't profit out of the price their records fetch, equally they don't lose out if someone downloads an mp3 of it. The scene was built on buying and selling rare records. How many dealers offer the artist a percentage of the profit when they sell a biggie? Are we not being a bit hypocritical?

Apart from this moral argument, what other problems are there in downloading?

Best

Andy

I'm thinking about rarer things that might be selling for hundreds of pounds. The artist doesn't profit out of the price their records fetch, equally they don't lose out if someone downloads an mp3 of it. The scene was built on buying and selling rare records. How many dealers offer the artist a percentage of the profit when they sell a biggie? Are we not being a bit hypocritical?

I for one totally agree with you Andy. Too many collectors think that because they pay alot of money for original copies of old records they have the higher moral ground.

As those of you who have been down to our George jackson nights will know, I also have rare original copies of valuable records. I have also paid alot of money for records.

However I am not about to take the moral high ground because of it, and I would not kid myself for one minute that any of that money has ever gone back to the artists who made those records.

Sorry if i sounded like i was advertising a p2p , it's just my favourite!

My real name is covered up so i remain obscure and valuable!

I posted to find the feelings of the community on a technology that i find indispensable,I am no capitalist zombie.

Hooray! Just took delivery of "The Strange World Of Northern Soul"DVD.

Don't you just love having a week off?My exposure to the music made me want to buy it....So filesharing has created at least one sale!

Don't want to advertise but you can get it from DVD source for 29.99

I'm gonna put the kettle on and get some soul self satisfaction

Be interesting to hear your views on it, as a relative new comer to Northern Soul. How about posting a review. Not to be criticised, just to get a fresh view on it.

The Strange World of Northern Soul.

Having seen the video (but admittedly not the DVD - is there much difference?) please do not think that the world of Northern Soul is as strange as portrayed by Mr Levine.

All the psychadelic and kaleidascope effects, the abysmal lip-synching and the tecno backing tracks have just about nil relevance to Northern Soul. In most cases it was good to know what these artists looked like now (but in the words of Frederick Hymes III 'Time has done them no favours'!) - but sometimes seeing a soul artist's face for the first time can destroy a teenage myth.

Would also like to know what you think of the DVD, particularly, as Mikey says, from the standpoint of a relative newcomer to the scene.

Brian