Tlscapital

Now 4 slight label variations, thanks to Russ for the last presented copy, attesting at least 4 batch of pressings to satisfy a growing public demand. The revised label informations might have a story to tell behind... At least for the VAPAC publisher credit removal or addition if the story unveil that the other way around.

misspelt Cay no records - correct Clay and records under Flash - VAPAC publisher's credit disappear

OK Russ, but aren't all of those FLASH records not bearing the VAPAC publisher's credit the same as yours ? The Discogs entry for this release's matrix tells like yours; scratched in 'MR SHY' & 'FOMK' in run out groove. It's only recently that I've find out on those small variations on this long time owned record. If I can dig out mine, I will tell if it's either this one or the one with the timing on the left and with the VAPAC publisher's credit. Since I have few friends here who want a copy, I just purchased for the first time a bold logo FLASH (without records) and the 'misspelt' Clay name missing the 'L' as Cay for myself. I'll see then which copy I'll keep. Comparing the label variations here lead me to believe that this 'misspelt' copy to be the first. Then the records logo with the timing on the left second then the one without VAPAC and the timing on the right in third in place. Those 3 releases come from the same pressing plant and so came in a chronology with a public demand growing and growing. Maybe Robb could give us some insights and tasty testimony bits around this record 😉

Yes please, especially since it's one of Robb's favorite Can I leave you the honor to start it up ? I'm most curious as to what your copy variation is... Although it's Sunday, I only came back on the computer to have a sip of coffee before going back and do some more very dusty work in the back house.

3 presses... 😉

Looking closer on those red Alteen labels I noticed the same as you. Recently acquiring a record of Billy McGregor I did not know before that is now a firm favorite of mine on Palos; 'we've been in love much too long' made me more attentive to 'Mr Shy' contribution into other musical projects 😉

Thanks to all who did participate in this 'Anotak's' quest. This all allowed to differentiate more precisely the pressings, put them in chronological order and draw some hypothetical deductions around them. If Bill Meeks expected his new release of Sunday on his label Alteen to get it's success with 'where did he came from' side, the enthusiast public response actually happened with the flip side 'ain't got no problems'. In the process for a rush release swapping 'A' & 'B' sides, some information got corrupted and arranger Thompson became Thomas, the catalogue number vanished and got the pressing plant code instead. The success of the public acclaimed 'ain't got no problems' grew even bigger and wider and so a third batch of pressing was ordered and got a distribution deal. The 2 previous pressing batches were self distributed. The record was then eventually picked-up by Chess records. Hence the 'office' copy baring the Chess text in place of Alteen. Indicating at this stage that the success of Sunday then caught the attention of Chess records. The Chess deal allowed Meeks to still 'locally' sell and distribute his Sunday Alteen releases. Leaving the broader national promotion and distribution to Chess records. Meeks ordered 2 more batch of Alteen presses. This time with a slightly re-designed logo featuring a smaller 'AL' in Alteen. Likely the following release number on Alteen of the Johnny McCall used and finished the initial first label stock and new ones had to be ordered.

Supurbs evidently... And THEY meant Superbs. 😉

Yes and how many VG- and below Chess stockers compare to same and lesser conditions Alteen copies ? I mean to show how many were actually purchased, owned and played. 1:5 ?

ValueYourMusic is not for me as it requires to disable my AdBlocker 😬 But just from recollection, I remember seeing more Alteen copies to this day (most in bad shape) than Chess (most in good shape) and a lot of them Chess were promos even. That which with Chess indicates a lot of promotional expectation from a record. Meaning that the ratio for the Chess actual sales of the Sunday 45 should be poor in comparison I believe.

It's the sole example of a 'RADIO STATION COPY' (funny enough to make me want to own one for that) for the label. The Suburbs apparently have a promo copy but I don't know for real or better...

1) big 'AL' logo HP N°, 'B' side & previous address arranger M. Thompson 2) big 'AL' logo AL N°'A' side & new address arranger M. Thomas 3) big 'AL' logo AL N° 'A' side & no address arrangers M. Thompson and J. Powell 4) small 'AL' logo AL N° 'A' side & no address arrangers M. Thompson and J. Powell 5) small 'AL' logo HP N° 'A' side & no address arrangers M. Thompson and J. Powell The last 3 releases shown here are from the same pressing plant. The main differences with the others is that two last have that smaller 'AL' logo labels as Russ pointed out. And this indicates another press run of labels. The first 2 are from other distinctive pressing plants... On Discogs (not that it says a lot but only the last 2 here are displayed as 'entries') and on popsike there's 5 pages of Sunday on Alteen... Too much. The Chess is rarer. Could it be that the Chess promotion and sales for Sunday were deceiving some and that some more Alteen copies were repressed after the deal to try still to cash on in the record ? Johnny McCall is the big 'AL' logo...

Yo ! -re right. And mentioning that so is mine then 😉

How to make sense when there's none anyway. I know... Now I've just point out two factors that may be relative to the a story yet unfold. With new scans and my own pilled out copy (no good images of it on the net). On the bottom/right HP3001 press which has 'where did he came from' as the 'A' side and that's the sole copy as is and it also has the address on the label like the previous releases with the 8208 Stony Island number... But on my copy here at the bottom the AL9631 as shown here, the number changes to 8204 ! And the 'A' side is now 'ain't got no problem' just like all other following copies. So the 'hit' side changed likely due to 'air play'. Could it be that the HP3001 with 8208 address is first then AL9631 with 8204 second ? Then what ever. That since the following number on the label; Johnny McCall with the same label design has no address printed on.

Hi Russ, this is the top left one 😉

Thanks for all that Robb and that slice of life share bit is always a real treat. Well I did put the AL 9631first as it was the one issu that have seemingly been used for promotion. After visualizing the numbering system at first with the pressing plant codes, then coupled with a catalogue number, then solely again with a pressing plant code and finally the 3 last releases with a catalogue numbers. It seemed logic somehow. If it ever was that is. Alteen AL769221 Buster Benton Alteen AL8624 Robert Taylor Alteen AL3000 (8625) Drake & Ensolids Alteen AL8652 Drake & Ensolids Alteen AL9631 Sunday Alteen HP3001 Sunday Alteen AL3002 Johnny McCall Alteen AL3004 Supurbs Winner W0742 (3003?) Elvin Spencer

Calling all Anoraks ! 4 label variations and 3 pressing plants for this Alteen release beside the Chess issues. No "real" promotional copies although those seemingly used for promotion sometimes baring DJ handwritings, XOL and/or promo stamps and even the Alteen logo covered-up with 'Chess' are the copies as pictured top and bottom left with the AL-9631 numbering. The copies with the HP 3001 numbering do not bare such occasional yet typical promotional WOL/stamps. Should this indicate that the 'AL' copies were first in circulation somehow ? Although maybe not. Anyhow anyone knows better and then why this numbering change from AL to HP for this Alteen 45 then back to AL for the 2 last releases on the label ? Alteen numbers chronology indicates order of release; Alteen AL769221 Buster Benton Alteen AL 8624 Robert Taylor Alteen AL3000 (8625) Drake & Ensolids Alteen AL 8652 Drake & Ensolids Alteen AL9631 Sunday Alteen HP3001 Sunday Alteen AL3002 Johnny McCall Alteen AL3004 Supurbs

It's an "old'n'dusty" sound thing that is plain good. So not necessary able to reach all the hipster's ears. Not in the top 500 either nor "funky" enough. It's almost a 'connoisseur' or remaining a collector's record.

OK, would you be so kind to tell me if the tracking from Carolina Soul from Miami to your doorstep showed the progress or did it remained frozen since and once it arrived at the Miami international distribution center ?

Think it is only instrumental. Only got to see the instrumental Canadian the few times I did. Never a vocal. Yet...

Had one of these for ages stuck into my sales box a lot cheaper that I proposed to many and advertised for what it was; 'an instrumental'. Still that didn't even invite the most adventurous DJ's or collectors. Must admit that even I who love my instrumentals when they are a 'tune', standing on their own, I didn't fancy that instrumental one bit. Maybe it's stil there in the 'junk' pile... a 99 cents to 99 dollars jump !

Yes it is the Canadian Bell 45 that features those mindless instrumentals on both sides. Sounds more like the vocal channel issue is just down due to a miss hap in the process.

How much I've always love Motown as a label... But when we're talking 'bout the typical 'Motown Sound' (1964-1969) that made their 'trade mark' and fame stronghold, to hear too much of these sound/tunes in a row can be bloody tiring to my ears before hitting on my nerves. It still is a 'banging' sound !!! Remember late 90 seing a Motown 'revival' upcoming on the UK northern soul scene with promotions for such orientated 'special events' flowering up and thinking to myself 'I couldn't survive in such a night'. Nor would I at a northern soul night where one could expect creative DJ's (if ever) to spare us that. The "scene" then was talking a turn. A bit like when I first heard 'mod/pop-corn' being played at the 100 Club cringing to myself this is the beginning of the end. Lord 'aw mercy. Admitting that I didn't commit myself into "IT" much more than that. Only attending and enjoying what I felt was the best of it. Some 3 years ago I did a 1 hour podcast of Motown for the commemoration of a Motown fan. Hopefully I could go down the Motown road with 'early' sounds, 'ballads' and non-Motown productions but leased to vary the sound, beat and feel. Still presenting that singular Motown spectrum but in shades and variations. Without the urge of being pressed to please a 'dance floor' and keep it going. Because evidently that Motown "easy" soulful 'clean' pop is danceable. My guess as to why some promoters went down that road. And with a "broad" public, nothing like the old 'rare' souls or 'connoisseurs' out there, a safe recipe for ongoing dance floor action. So yes, I got instantly the OP's intention on his very quest. And yes, too much Motown kills the Motown. Even it's 'lover' in me.

And there you were 'hanging in' there (framed) above my head all this time... Thanks and Bless you 'where (ever) were you' Eugene +

Welcome on here and thanks for all that Naim. Really appreciates all your insights around and on this peculiar 45 although far from being a favorite of mine. A bit like you maybe 😉 Informative as tasty with 'crunchy' details. Memories are crucial but are often 'tainted' and pictures as written testimonies can confront them and not necessary in the way one can/would/should expect. This is true for each and every soul in the universe. OK that sounds presumptuous as to implied I would know the universe. But not. Just consider planet earth for the moment 😉 And so all is concretely proving that this 45 was issued late 68 or early 69. Undeniably that is and arguably, such musical production and arrangements to my ears sounds nothing like Ollie McLaughlin did by 1967 or even early 1968. It is really in phase with the rest of his then productions and so studio sessions. Now as you explain the composition or "making" of the tune (riffs and lyrics also by you) might pre-dates that. The final credentials are often given to the one who laid it on paper last. Unfair as it is said; history is written by the victors. A record release's date is the day it to comes out of the pressing plant. Radios write the date it got dropped in the mail box and the day it reaches a position in the BillBoard Charts is even another date and so on. This might all seem pretty nerdy, but we are that. A little ? A bit more than that ? Some ? Who cares, we are very enthusiastic and passionate materialistic people who love to own and enjoy our records, the music on them and all that got involved in the making of them. And to go in-depth of all we shy not in front of compromise to challenge our mental or emotional confort and rock our boat for revised history since we know who 'made it'.