Paul Wagnar The World I Knew on Cobblestone

[Guest maestro]

Is this the same as Paul Wagner on CJ? Anybody know anything about this record?

[Roburt]

It seems to be the same track ... the mastermind behind the CJ 45 was Stan Vincent (the guy also behind the Crow 45 on Inner Ear) ... Stan worked out of New York and was a staff member at Buddah Records around 1968/69/70 (an in-house producer/arranger and songwriter). Joe Fields Cobblestone Records was distributed by Buddah at that time and was on the look-out for 45's to license ... guess that's where the link originated.

There's guys on here who have met / talked with Stan, so maybe one of them knows more about this. 

Edited July 15, 2018 by Roburt

[Guest maestro]

Thanks. That makes sense. Stan Vincent is credited as song writer on both sides.

[Chalky]

I've never seen the Cobblestone 45 but believe it to be demo only.

[Guest maestro]

I haven't heard the CJ version, but I'm guessing it's the same even though the title is slightly different.

Edited July 16, 2018 by maestro
sucessfully uploaded pictures

[Roburt]

I'd put up scans of the CJ 45 ... but it seems I'm currently unable to post jpegs on here   ...

. . . . . . .   it's working now ...

Edited July 16, 2018 by Roburt

[Guest maestro]

I'm curious if they were on different labels because they were meant for different regional distribution? I'm in southern California, so I wonder if the cobblestone demo copies were just the few that were sent out to promote the single?

[Roburt]

The Cobblestone 45 would have escaped some time around August 68 ... at that time, Stan Vincent was mainly working on tracks for Bang, Kama Sutra & Buddah Records  .... BUT his work for those labels was all tagged as either for Progressive Media Inc (PMI) or for Music Dynamic Corp. not for G.S.G., the production company this release is badged up with ... JUST MAYBE, the CJ 45 came out earlier and the Cobblestone release followed on afterwards.   

The music piublishing on the CJ 45 is also different to the Cobblestone release (on which it's assigned to Kama Sutra Music), again this leads me to think that the CJ release is from a bit earlier. "She Must Have Heard" is still registered with BMI, via Kama Sutra Music.

Edited July 16, 2018 by Roburt

[Garethx]

The CJ release is mastered and pressed by RCA and the mastering code indicates the second half of 1967.

[Roburt]

12 hours ago, garethx said:

The CJ release is mastered and pressed by RCA and the mastering code indicates the second half of 1967.

I guess that when Stan Vincent signed to work with Buddah / Kama Sutra, they gave him the 'gift' of putting his earlier 45 out on Cobblestone (though only as a promo copy to go out to radio stns). Wonder if any radio stns programmed the Cobblestone 45 for actual airplay ??

The Cobblestone 45 must be RARE although it is the 2nd issue.

[Davebanks]

Has this track been issued on a CD ever?

 

Dave Banks

[Ian Dewhirst]

Either way, what an incredible production. 

Ian D

 

[Robbk]

I always wondered how that New York C.J. Records chose their name without knowing about Carl Jones' Chicago-based C.J. Records, which was still going strong in 1967 and into the 1970s.  I guess it was because The New York C.J. operation was a Pop rather than R&B/Soul-oriented label, and wouldn't know about Jones' Midwest operation, which only distributed to The East Coast (NY/Phil) when they had a major regional hit, like they did with Betty Everett, and a couple others.  As neither CJ labels had a major National hit while they were operating simultaneously, no problem came up.