Carty

Ok, First of all , the fact that he offered you a lower price and then tried to get the postage free does not make him a bad buyer in my book, he is a Haggler . nowt wrong with that is there? you have the right to say no ( like you did )and if you are not up for this kind of stuff , you could advertise as No offers ! S econdly, he said there was a crack in it and when he sent it back there was no crack . So he has returned the item intact. Was it the record you sent him ? the exact same copy ? if so , wheres the scam , ? what has he made out of that ? if he had sent you a different copy back or a different copy with a crack in it then fair enough , i,m with you, but in this instance , i really dont feel the guy deserves Naming and shaming. B.T.W . I have no idea who the guy is so am not writing this as a friend or associate .

For me there is an allure in both, As you rightly say the idea of someone buying the U.S.stuff back in the day and its otherworldly feel , this is stuff i identify strongly with, British releases also have a magic about them do they not , although different in nature to the feelings American stuff creates ( who feels it ,knows it ) possibly even more potent, not exactly sure why , but there is something about the font used on the early tmg releases that does it for me They have a beauty and physical quality of production that deteriorated all the way to the mp3 , its a lot more than that i know , and it applies to releases other than motown of course. There is for me also an otherworldly feel about the U.k 45s after all for me they were released a few years before i became aware of them, probably played at hip clubs in swinging sixties Britain,or whatever, Put a u.k. tamla motown 65 release alongside say a 72 release and its Bond street against Primark. like i say am not exactly sure why , but its there . Of one thing there is no doubt , the U.S. 45S are cheaper.

Daptone records .

The thread prompted me to seek out Curtis Mayfield , The other side of town. on a 45 , just bought it for £ 2.55.on e bay , made my night !

real bargain for somebody, 0.50p each!

Yes Exodus was massive in 1975 .

CORRECTION: That should be The Other side of town by Curtis , ( still in a completely different league than the other one. )

Give " The wrong side of town" , Curtis Mayfield a revival , not a dancer but a great atmospheric soul track , was it ever on 45?( you guys are bound to know )

Youve been in love too long / love makes me do foolish things , motowns best double sider??????

I have continued finding fantastic stuff that is new( to me) on this forum amongst other places , Also, for a youngster starting off , is it not all new ( to them) ? They dont have the personal experience at that stage of feeling that a song is played out , apart from older people telling them that it is . Imagine hearing Williams and Watson, Jackie Edwards ,Willie Tee etc, etc, for the first time , would it matter if people were saying they are played out if you really liked them ? If so , i suspect they are more interested in fitting in than having a true appreciation of the music . One of the great gifts of getting older ( and there dosent seem to be many ) is the decreasing concern of how you are percieved by other people.

What label had the most Wigan Casino plays? Wouldnt bet against " EMIDISC"

I also remember the guy with the pipe and glasses , he used to stand on the stage sometimes taking it all whilst puffing on the pipe , having a condor moment perhaps?

Agree with what Swifty just said, the white U.S . demos do seem remarkably affordable .

As you asked for advice, here,s mine , only buy the stuff you like ,( there will be hundreds ), for me i go for the 63 to 67 period , you may like the later ( or earlier) sound As has been stated earlier , lots of brilliant stuff can be picked up cheaply , depends how deep your pockets are i suppose , U.S. issue ? U.S. demo? U.K. issue ? U.K. demo? of course if i won the lottery i would love the stateside stuff and the 500 series tmgs on red and white demos,however having the original U.S issue is good too and so much more affordable . Finally , the rare northern stuff may have long since dried up in the states ,this is not the case for motown , if you ever get the time and opportunity give that a go ,i,m sure you wont be dissapointed , all the best , Mike.

Otis Clay, show place gets several mentions earlier on in the thread, great record, but the other side, thats how it feels ( when you,re in love ) ,blows me away every time i hear it.

Oldies night perhaps ? Thanks for putting them up Barry , great pics,very clear, would love to see more, 500 similar have been lost ? thats a great pity , they would have made a book or a permanent exhibition of some kind if they were all of this quality .

I mildly enjoy the illegality of the bootleg.

Soul Galore ! yes i remember now, thanks for that , Junior Walker played at Fagins in 1980, ( the posher club above rafters ) Harlem Spirit were the support act , great night .

The Hard rock in Stretford held a few Northern all dayers on Sundays in 1975, remember Colin Curtis there and vaugley remember double decker drum like dance areas , the second floor was opaque so if you looked up you could see the dancers feet above , Brewsters was on a Tuesday night i think in 1981, Brian Rae was involved, Who ran that record stall in the Oasis market round about 72, 73 ish? was about 14 at that time and used to go to Spin inn , Ralphs ,Hime and Addison etc, but this place had a real buzz to it, especially on a Saturday afternoons, first time i saw cover ups , remember there was one behind the counter that said " secret sound" £ 30.00 , The licencing laws would not allow all nighters in the City centre throughout the seventies, first one i remember was Easter Sunday All Nighter at Pips in 1980, Then Martin Christie was putting them on at rafters on bank holiday Sundays about 82 ish

Re Sobers club on Great Cheetham street , Yes i t opened as an alcohol free club,I was at the opening night, guest of honour , Jimmy Saville ! They had Saturday night soul and funk all nighters for a couple of months in 1975, which usually had a live act on, think sweet sensation played once, these were quite poor as by 3.30 ish almost everyone was asleep ! also there were a few northern all nighters a few months later , these were better , a guy called Carlos djed ( same Carlos that used to do Carolines on a Tuesday) the place lasted less than a year , most things that set up there didnt last too long , In its time it was the Lower Broughton Assembly Rooms, The Whisky A Go Go, The Riverboat club, Sobers , a roller skating rink , then back to a nightclub before being bulldozed to make way for a Macdonalds . Just to clarify Steve, its Martin Christie who is the Barrister and not me ( in case you were wondering )

Yes , those pressings , think they sold for three quid each, i bought the salvadors and the international gtos , they were really good quality , also paid a fiver around 78 for natural four abc demo ,

Tony ! ( mad ) just writing similar , must have been at the same time The John Bull also known as Shorts for a time about 74 to 77

Rowntrees sound was a pub with a small disco behind that opened thurs to sat playing current soul and disco sounds of the day, The pub was THE main meeting place for the Manchester soul crowd, regulars included Jonah, Johnny Mac , Steve Proudlove , Zan, Gordon Thompson , Ricky Warburton Barry Big eyes , Steve Dodd, Mad Tony, Eddie Battin, and many many more , Most trips to Wigan started here and also the out of towners on route to Wigan would call in as it was near to the train station , underneath was another club that at one point was called Rufus playing current imported soul mainly , Dj, Mike Shaft, who was also a regular in Rowntrees , Have read threads and stuff in books recently talking about the intimidating heirachy they encountered at some northern venues ,believe me, if you could handle Rowntrees , you could handle anywhere . Still pass it regularly , sad to see it now as some soulless wine bar , Zinc i think it is called .

Would like to see Jimmy Ruffin, On the Avenue ( in the neighbourhood ) and the Holland and Dozier ,On the Avenue, ( in the neighbourhood ) , back to back .

Think your instincts are right Ian, as i read it you are not stating for definate what the origins or history of this record are , however many points you have made have got me thinking, fascinating stuff , hopefully time will tell .