Hope this doesn't sound pompous or negative - it's not meant to be.

Here's the thing...

I guess I was lucky enough to be on the Northern Soul Scene in the golden years... early to mid seventies. For what its worth, I think 1973 was the absolute peak, so many goodies.

So... how many post Wigan era discoveries stack up against the best of the best? I'm probably showing a huge amount of ignorance, so forgive me. But which of the latter day discoveries would have or could have been as big as say The Tomangoes, Morris Chestnut or The Salvadors? Let alone countless Torch classics...

In a nutshell, I've been away for over 20 years. Did I miss anything!? The stuff I've heard on various compilation CD's has been ok, but hasn't exactly blown me away.

I hope I'm not offending anyone by the clumsy way I've expressed this. Its a genuine question. Narrow it down if you like. Anything discovered this century that could have been spun next to The Younghearts.. and packed the floor a little tighter still?

jesse james love is allright,sherrys/cindy scott world of happiness,adeys rca stuff,jackie day naughty boy,all the umissued motown stuff,plus hell of a lot more theres a ton of stuff broken on the sceane since the end of wigan,too much to list ,but also styles change a lot of the stuff played in the last twenty years would not have gone down well at the torch or wigan as a lot of the stuff played then would not work today. thanks hud .

The best discovery in the last 20 years??? easy that one, Butch's Mello Souls - We Can Make It on Mello. Formerly known as The Del-Larks Just You And I, simply awesome, Northern Soul as good as it gets IMO.

Close behind Butch's Diane Lewis c/u " You Ain't Got A Chance" and again Butch's JJ Jackson "Too Much love" c/u.

Lots more but these 3 top the pile for me.

i think just about eighty percent of butchs exclusives would have big in any era,temptones,g.davis and r. taylor ,martha jean love,gerri taylor c/up,butlers[chesterfields],jerry williams be with me c/up[does he still play this ,excellent],and all the others,did i once hear someone say good sounds dont turn up anymore,oh yes they do. cheers hud

Thanks for the replies and for taking the question in the spirit it was intended. I guess I realise that times have changed, but I'm keen to hear those songs you've recommended... I should get out more often! Where does Butch play?

Any more recommendations anyone?

i think just about eighty percent of butchs exclusives would have big in any era,temptones,g.davis and r. taylor ,martha jean love,gerri taylor c/up,butlers[chesterfields],jerry williams be with me c/up[does he still play this ,excellent],and all the others,did i once hear someone say good sounds dont turn up anymore,oh yes they do.          cheers hud

Jerry Williams "be with me" .....trying to remember... not the "Ordinary Girl" the one Carl F spins too. Female intro singing "I'm Just An Ordinary Girl" before male vocal kicks in? Spins it still awesome record. Can stick a little soundbit up later when I dig it out, got it on a live 100 Club recording.

Thanks for the replies and for taking the question in the spirit it was intended.  I guess I realise that times have changed, but I'm keen to hear those songs you've recommended...  I should get out more often!  Where does Butch play?

Any more recommendations anyone?

Butch is without doubt the best DJ ever IMO. Would have been massive with his records in any era. Whereas DJ's of old had the pick of records when they were plentiful Butch continued to find them throughout much harder times and still does.

His main venues nowadays are the 100 Club and the Lifeline al-nighter at Sheridans. Sheridans just happens to be this Saturday :-)

Also dont forget that Butch is a resident at Mick Smiths Keele Allnighter next one July 10th ;-) xxx

Mate, better check out the 100 Club or the Wilton. It took me years to work out the former's existence, and I haven't turned back since. The incredible one-offs from the few people who really hunt for the exclusives are records beyond reason. I heard my fave dancefloor track there (Butch's Martha Jean Love - Old Time Lover) and I know it's more or less the only place I can hear it. We're now in the grateful position that there are more incredible 'newies', one-offs, oldies (gasp) than ever before, which gives us a massive wealth of tracks from which to drag punters into a non-stop dancefloor heaven. It's all there if you look hard enough. And, in theory, it ought to be better than ever before....

Mate, better check out the 100 Club or the Wilton. It took me years to work out the former's existence, and I haven't turned back since. The incredible one-offs from the few people who really hunt for the exclusives are records beyond reason. I heard my fave dancefloor track there (Butch's Martha Jean Love - Old Time Lover) and I know it's more or less the only place I can hear it. We're now in the grateful position that there are more incredible 'newies', one-offs, oldies (gasp) than ever before, which gives us a massive wealth of tracks from which to drag punters into a non-stop dancefloor heaven. It's all there if you look hard enough. And, in theory, it ought to be better than ever before.... Matty.

Mate, better check out the 100 Club or the Wilton. It took me years to work out the former's existence, and I haven't turned back since. The incredible one-offs from the few people who really hunt for the exclusives are records beyond reason. I heard my fave dancefloor track there (Butch's Martha Jean Love - Old Time Lover) and I know it's more or less the only place I can hear it. We're now in the grateful position that there are more incredible 'newies', one-offs, oldies (gasp) than ever before, which gives us a massive wealth of tracks from which to drag punters into a non-stop dancefloor heaven. It's all there if you look hard enough. And, in theory, it ought to be better than ever before.... Matty.

Mate, better check out the 100 Club or the Wilton. It took me years to work out the former's existence, and I haven't turned back since. The incredible one-offs from the few people who really hunt for the exclusives are records beyond reason. I heard my fave dancefloor track there (Butch's Martha Jean Love - Old Time Lover) and I know it's more or less the only place I can hear it. We're now in the grateful position that there are more incredible 'newies', one-offs, oldies (gasp) than ever before, which gives us a massive wealth of tracks from which to drag punters into a non-stop dancefloor heaven. It's all there if you look hard enough. And, in theory, it ought to be better than ever before.... Matty.

I would go along with everything that Chalky has said, but would also like to add that aswell as Butch there are quite a few DJ's who continue to push the boundaries Andy Dyson, Kitch, Dean Anderson, Adey Croasdell, Soul Sam, Carl Fortnum, Keith Money, & many others.

There are also loads of lesser known DJ's & collectors who continually strive to find & play new or lesser known discoveries, they don't alway's receive the credit they deserve, but we love & appreciate thier efforts as without them, the 'real' rare soul scene would not exist today.

As long as you find 'em we'll dance to 'em, long live the 'real' progressive rare soul scene.

Russ Vickers

would also like to add that aswell as Butch there are quite a few DJ's who continue to push the bounds - Dean Anderson, Adey Croasdell, Soul Sam, Carl Fortnum, Keith Money, & many others.

Russ Vickers

Don't forget Roger Banks - a lot of his R'n'B stuff may not be to many's liking but he was the lad who monstered in recent times, amongst many others, the sublime and soulful, Rhetta Hughes 'Cry myself to sleep'.

RichS

the jerrywilliams c/up is the record chalkymentions ,at a guess it could be called be with me or dont play the roll,awesome track ,remember being at the hundred club when he first played it about five years ago ,have not been out much since,theres some top djs playing top newies but for me butch always seems to pull that extra special newie out of the bag and hes been doing it for fourteen years or so.

Russ,

Of course you big name DJs love us "small-timers", don't you!! And you're right - those of us who play new discoveries don't get anything near the credit we deserve.

Take for example, my spot at a niter in 1986. I had just purchased "Time Will Change" by the Inverts on Broadway as an unknown from Max Rees. I first played it at the 100 Club in November that year. While it was playing, a big newies DJ of the time (name witheld) came rushing up to the decks to find out what it was. "F***ing excellent mate!" were his words. He told another newies DJ of the time who was there (name also witheld) who was just as keen on it. Within two months, his DJ mate was playing it as one of HIS "new discoveries". No thanks to the underdog (yours truly) who played it first, without whom it still may only be a £20 record (instead of appearing in John Manship's "Rarest of The Rare" list)!! Same thing happened to "You're So Wonderful" by Geraldine Curry on London House a few years later.

Call it exploitation if you want - I tend not to take it personally; it's nice that they gained recognition on the scene. But just how many other unsung heroes are out there who have had their glory nicked off them in the same old way? Not fair really; we spin 'em first, and the big boys take the credit!

You can hear snippets of both these tracks on John Manship's "Rarest Of The Rare" part of his website.

Here endeth the sermon.....

(Rev) Gene-R.

70s WISE- TRUE IMAGE & ERIC LOMAX.

60S WISE-MELLOW SOULS & JESSIE JAMES.

Well in response to Louise's post both Butch & Mick Smith are both again due on at thr PLINSTON in the near future,and again they both will dig up something very exclusive to play.

About time I mentioned my fave discovery from the past couple of decades:

"Why You Wanna Treat Me The Way You Do" - The Hyperions

Gene

Butch's Mello Souls - We Can Make It on Mello.  Formerly known as The Del-Larks Just You And I, simply awesome, Northern Soul as good as it gets IMO.

For me the best record ever played on the scene.

Has to be the Mello Souls - We Can Make It - Mello, with out any doubt the finest find ever made on the soul scene, once heard never forgotten.

Other 45's that need a mention have to be J.D. Bryant - I Won't Be Coming Back - Shrine, Jimmy Bo Horne - I Can't Speak - Dade ( Thanks Dean Anderton )

Loads of unsung folks on the scene, collectors and local dj's, should also be given some credit for the time and effort they put in looking for those elusive 45's, without them the soul scene would not survive.

Andy

Mello Souls.......pah !

Toytown Soul compared to The Magnetics - I Have A Girl - Ra Sel

Of course I do admit to being slightly partial to The Magnetics

Mello Souls.......pah !

Toytown Soul compared to The Magnetics - I Have A Girl - Ra Sel

Of course I do admit to being slightly partial to The Magnetics

Well it does say in the last 20 years Dave :-) Wasn't Magnetics played at Wigan although better known for spins in the 80's??????

Thought it was post Wigan ?

Although I do concede it was early Eighties so might fall outside the 20 year bit. Mind you Mello Souls has got to be getting on for 15 years now.

Ok then I'll have another go...........

How about....The Four Vandals.....

I'll get my coat

Thought it was post Wigan ?

Although I do concede it was early Eighties so might fall outside the 20 year bit. Mind you Mello Souls has got to be getting on for 15 years now.

Ok then I'll have another go...........

How about....The Four Vandals.....

I'll get my coat

Mello Souls was 86 or 87 so qualifies. Sure someone said Magnetics first got a spin or two tail end of Wigan. Better known from the Stafford era though.

Which Four Vandals ;-)

Just in case there's anyone out there reading this and wondering why some of us are wetting our pants over the Mello Souls!

(Sorry, there are drop outs' as I don't want to pee anybody off. Don't download it if that's going to annoy you)

I can't find the tape but I think it was around 1986 when I first heard the "Delarks - Just You & I" being played out some where groovy like The Drill Hall in Lincoln!

Hi there Hippo - thanks very much for posting that mp3... its the first chance I've had to hear that. What a nice record.

Back to my original question though.... would it have rammed the dance floor at the Torch?

From my perspective, with a 20 year break from the scene, I would say probably not. In fact, I'd stick my neck out and say that, had it been discovered in '72, Mello Souls would have been a marginal record at best.

Maybe its a grower, but I guess I was praying for another Sandi Sheldon or Yvonne Baker. Ah well...

HI DAVE, IT'S A SHAME YOUR MAGNETICS ARE A WHITE GROUP ME THINKS. NOT THE SAME AS THE CHICAGO/DETROIT GROUPS WITH THE SAME NAME-STILL A GREAT RECORD OF COURCE AINT GOT IT NEVERMIND. MICK.

I know the tempo has changed, but here's a supplementary question.

Does that mean that if Terrible Tom had been discovered this week on, say, an unreleased acetate, that it wouldn't get played?

We also had a healthy regard for poppy records with the right beat. Someone I know rates Paul Anka as the greatest Northern Soul record of all time. - and it's hard to argue with. So what if that was a 2004 discovery? Would it be big today?

I know it wasn't all roses in the glory days. I mean, "Don't say maybe maybe" was a well known record to collectors from at least 1971, yet I don't recall it ever being a "big sound". But, Beverley Ann certainly was.

Whats my point? I'm not sure! lol Perhaps we were just soooo spoilt.

.

THE CAPITOLS WAS PLAYED IN THE VERY EARLY DAYS AT THE 100 CLUB BY ME.-GREAT FORGOTTEN OLDIE NOW.

Who could I get a copy of the Mello Souls from? I NEEEEEED that record!

For me it was discovering that I could handle the Cleethorpes Weekender without being a jibbering wreck for the next week.

For my mates, it was discovering that if they avoided me for a week after Cleethorpes, they wouldnt have to put up with a jibbering wreck!

Oh and I really loved the version of Hold On by Judy Clay that Greg used to play, and both of Flynnys September Jones'

Sorry Trouble didnt mean to ignore your question. Just missed it. AND I havent a bloody clue anyway ;-)

Patrinell Staten-"Little Love Affair"-Sepia, Butchs' Jean Carter -"I Wanna Know", The Saints as played by Butch and Arthur Fenn...

DAVE WELDING ALSO PLAYS THE SAINTS TONY.

Who could I get a copy of the Mello Souls from? I NEEEEEED that record!

What on vinyl????? ask Butch, Kitch or Kenny Burrell, they have the only known copies ;-)

DAVE WELDING ALSO PLAYS THE SAINTS TONY.

I'm sure i've seen "I'll let you slide" on Andy Dyson's playlists as well bloody marvelous record IMVFHO ;o)

John

BTW Trouble Join the queue for the Mello Souls it's a long one and you will need deep pockets ;o))

Hi MICK & TONY.Are you two brothers ha ha.Just a little chuckle before dinner.

HI DAVE, IT'S A SHAME YOUR MAGNETICS ARE A WHITE GROUP ME THINKS. NOT THE SAME AS THE CHICAGO/DETROIT GROUPS WITH THE SAME NAME-STILL A GREAT RECORD OF COURCE AINT GOT IT NEVERMIND. MICK.

You're perfectly correct Mick, they aren't the same as the Chicago, or Detroit groups with the same name, they're from Philly. There is nothing to suggest they are white though, other than your sense of humour in trying to wind me up !

There are actually several other groups called 'The Magnetics'. Here's a discography for all the groups and recordings that I'm aware of. If anyone can add anything feel free:

The Magnetics

Rather a mish mash of a discography this one. There are at least five different groups using the name The Magnetics, so all are listed below.

The Magnetics (From Philadelphia)

Ra-Sel R7-104 - I Have A Girl / Love And Devotion - 1967

The Philadelphia Magnetics have as far as I know only the one release, although other releases on the Ra Sel label exist. John Anderson at Soul Bowl is rumoured to have several unreleased acetates by the group.

The Magnetics (From Detroit)

Bonnie 107374 - Lady In Green / Heart You're Made Of Stone - 196?

The Detroit Magnetics are possibly the same group that recorded on Allrite (Because of the Detroit association of the label). However, according to Dennis Coffey (Who played on both group's sessions) are NOT The Volumes recording under a different name as was once thought.

The Magnetics (No idea where from although I would suspect Detroit, so it might even be the same group)

Allrite 620 - Where Are You / The Train - 1962

The Magnetics (From Detroit)

Hitsville Acetate - Father Time

Histville Acetate - Please Don't Go Away

The second Detroit Magnetics are definitely a white sounding girl group, which according to Andy Rix, are not particularly good, which would account for the tracks never gaining an actual release.

The Magnetics (From Chicago)

Sable 102 - When I'm With My Baby / Count The Days - 196?

J-V 2501 - Oh Love / Wasting Time - 1969

The Chicago Magnetics releases have Lee McKinney as the lead singer, so are all the same group.

Lee McKinney & The Magnetics (Same group from Chicago)

Sable 104 - I'll Keep Holding On / ? - 196?

The Magnetics (No idea where from, but definitely a different group)

Sound Trap 30391 - Let Me Comfort You / Good By My Love - ?

The group on Sound Trap are a complete mystery to me. Help anyone ?

trammels blessed with a love,little ann who are you trying to fool,mello souls,diane lewis,temptones thats when you know your in love,lancaster johnson c/up[is it hank hodge],just bros.go on and laugh,antellects,j.j.jackson c/up,soul inc.my proposal,jean carter i wanna know,jesse james,all versions of world of happiness,martha jean lovec/up,mac staton.....

What on vinyl????? ask Butch, Kitch or Kenny Burrell, they have the only known copies ;-)

Someone else claimed to have a cracked but playable copy.

What on vinyl????? ask Butch, Kitch or Kenny Burrell, they have the only known copies ;-)

I also heard a rumour that the copy that changed hands some time back sold for £15.000. Is this true?

MELLO SOULS - MUST BE MORE OF THESE SURELY LYING AROUND IN SOME DUSTY WAREHOUSE

I also heard a rumour that the copy that changed hands some time back sold for £15.000. Is this true?

Kenny Burrell. £15,000. Are you not getting confused with a different record? ;-)

Kenny Burrell. £15,000. Are you not getting confused with a different record? ;-)

Mello Souls was £10,000, Shifty's old copy.

I'm sure i've seen "I'll let you slide" on Andy Dyson's playlists as well bloody marvelous record IMVFHO ;o)

John

You have.

I echo what many correspondents have written here about the quality of Butch's stuff. They would stand up in any era and if we cross reference this debate with the other one raging on this site about "worst records", the difference with Butch's spins and the rock 'n' roll/country 'n' western crap some people pass off is that what he plays is SOUL and it is NORTHERN (whatever that means).

what about walter and the admirations man o man ,this must count ,i know patbrady played the flip ,life of tears, at wigan but it was butch,yet again,who made man o man the record it is ,which fits in the last twenty years time frame,would the same go for esther grant. agree with the saints ,top tune ,about time it went big.

SHIFTY plays MELLO SOULS doesnt he.Also MARK HANSON has a copy (told me personally...DREAMTEAM must be up there as new monsters.Anyone like to add to this comment just to keep it going...

oops.I have just scrolled up & down and read that KEN BURRELL now owns SHIFTYs copy of MELLO SOULS.Sorry everyone.MICK SMITHs CELEBRITIES-I CHOOSE YOU is a monster.How many times have you heard anyone else play it?.What about a one off called HURRY BACK played by TONY SMITH think its by TONI ROSS.Tell me if im wrong someone.

SHIFTY plays MELLO SOULS doesnt he.Also MARK HANSON has a copy (told me personally...DREAMTEAM must be up there as new monsters.Anyone like to add to this comment just to keep it going...

Shifty did play the Mellow Souls, sold it to Kenny B couple of years ago.