I have a question about the two title variations of this record. I know "sugar ain't sweet" only exists on DJ copies. My question is -- are there both promo and stock copies with "what I want" or does "what I want" only exist on a stock copy? If promos do exist with "What I want", is "sugar ain't sweet" still definitely first? Thanks in advance.

I have a WD of What I want.

I have a WD of What I want.

 

 

I had one years ago, issue now.  Why Girl on the flip of both if I remember rightly.

Hi Bob

 

I have "What I Want" / "Why Girl" on two different WDJ designs.

 

One is a styrene press with the two vertical lines on the left hand side of the label.

 

The other is a vinyl press without the two vertical lines.

 

The WDJ of "Sugar Ain't Sweet" (which I don't have unfortunately) is the second plain label design described above without the two vertical lines.

 

Interestingly, the SI-C10027 matrix number printed on the labels is the same for both "Why Girl" and "Sugar Ain't Sweet".

 

Cheers

 

Richard

Not wanting to steer away from Bob's original question, but I, as I'm sure you you all do, absolutely love 'What I Want"  so here's the slightly lesser know version by Gloria Taylor, took a while to get this and luckily it came from a mate at a great price. Funny one, I've asked major dealers for it over the years and they have have all said they had never had it, maybe it a 45 that gets more attention from the Funk scene, dunno but sound and production wise its very much like the selector sound LP, that rare one, most probably recorded in the same sessions...

 

Bit of Dale Warren brilliance...with a very different take on the song... as for Sugar aint sweet, its ok, its a bit all over the place for me, you do have to try to with it dont you...

 

Malcolm

Edited May 17, 201411 yr by Mal C

I have the gloria taylor 45, didn't realize it was rare. My copy is kinda beat when my other ones of hers on selector sound are clean so maybe it is, i don't know. The really rare gloria taylor is the one on houseguests.

 

I'm still confused, can anyone tell me whether Sugar and Sweet was the first press or second? I agree it is a mediocre track but it is stupid rare.

I'm still confused, can anyone tell me whether Sugar and Sweet was the first press or second? I agree it is a mediocre track but it is stupid rare.

 

Hi Bob

 

I think it's safe to assume "Sugar Ain't Sweet" was the first.

 

It only got to promo stage and was not released as a stock copy to stores. In comparison, "Why Girl" got released for public sale as a stock copy, and was also on at least two different label designs suggesting it was pressed in at least two locations/batches. Why would Drew press-up a promo of "Sugar Ain't Sweet" if "Why Girl" had already come out on that release number (and had achieved reasonable sales and success)?

 

Plus, there was a pressing error on some/all of the copies of "Sugar Ain't Sweet" - also suggesting that it was initially withdrawn at promo stage due to the defect.

 

The sleeve notes for the Precisions CD on JoeBoy help here and say:

 

"The second single was scheduled to be a coupling of 'Sugar Ain't Sweet', a Dennis Gilmore composition produced and arranged by Dale Warren, backed with the up-tempo dancer 'What I Want', but initial promo copies arrived from the manufacturing plant (owned by Sidra) pressed off centre.

 

The problems could easily have been solved by remastering the 45, but by this time George McGregor had been installed in his new job at Sidra and he recognised the need to build a distinctive sound around the lead tenor of Billy Prince backed up by sweet harmonies from the rest of the guys. 

 

"It was my job to find the right songs for them so I co-wrote something based on their abilities" he recalls.

 

Indeed he did. The new song "Why Girl" was an exquisite catchy up-tempo workout bringing out the very best from the group. It reached 28 in the Billboard R 'n' B chart and spread the word about their sound - and their dynamic live shows which featured them touring with the likes of the O'Jays."

 

The copy of "Sugar Ain't Sweet" that I have seen was certainly badly pressed off-centre on the "Sugar Ain't Sweet" side.

 

Based on the above, I reckon it's clear that "Sugar Ain't Sweet" came first.

 

Cheers

 

Richard

Edited May 18, 201411 yr by Premium Stuff

Not really relevant to the original question, but thought I'd put this one up.

 

 

... and yes, "Why Girl" is on the flip.

 

Cheers

Mick

Cool color vinyl copy. Weird.

 

Richard, thanks for the sugar ain't sweet explanation. Is there even more confirmation via matrix numbers, e.g. sugar ain't sweet has an earlier one than "what I want"? Thanks again.

Cool color vinyl copy. Weird.

 

Richard, thanks for the sugar ain't sweet explanation. Is there even more confirmation via matrix numbers, e.g. sugar ain't sweet has an earlier one than "what I want"? Thanks again.

 

Hi Bob

 

In part see my post #4 where I said:

 

Interestingly, the SI-C10027 matrix number printed on the labels is the same for both "Why Girl" and "Sugar Ain't Sweet".

 

Matrix numbers are:

 

"Sugar Ain't Sweet" - SI-C10027

 

"Why Girl" - SI-C10027 (same as above)

 

"What I Want" - SI-C110028

 

Cheers

 

Richard

Edited May 18, 201411 yr by Premium Stuff

What about the stamp in the run out.  ZTSC 126028 2A (Why Girl)  ZTSC 126029 2A (WIW), What is the ZTSC number  Sugar Ain't Sweet?

Hi Bob

 

In part see my post #4 where I said:

 

Interestingly, the SI-C10027 matrix number printed on the labels is the same for both "Why Girl" and "Sugar Ain't Sweet".

 

Matrix numbers are:

 

"Sugar Ain't Sweet" - SI-C10027

 

"Why Girl" - SI-C10027 (same as above)

 

"What I Want" - SI-C110028

 

Cheers

 

Richard

 

Thank you, sorry I didn't fully process the info. I meant the deadwax info as Chalky said though. Thanks for your help!

What about the stamp in the run out.  ZTSC 126028 2A (Why Girl)  ZTSC 126029 2A (WIW), What is the ZTSC number  Sugar Ain't Sweet?

 

 

Thank you, sorry I didn't fully process the info. I meant the deadwax info as Chalky said though. Thanks for your help!

 

The info I have that was taken from an original "Sugar Ain't Sweet" is that the matrix details on the label are the same as the deadwax markings - plus that the matrix details are:

 

S1-C10027-A

 

S1-C10028-B

 

The above seem sure to be the deadwax markings due to the addition of the A and B side suffixes which are not on the labels.

 

Chalky - looks like you have taken those matrix details from a styrene copy with the ZTSC stamped matrix and the two vertical lines on the label.

 

I would say that the copy to compare with "Sugar Ain't Sweet" is the vinyl copy of "Why Girl" with the plain no-vertical-lines label (same design as "Sugar Ain't Sweet").

 

I have found four copies here of this 45 - one blue styrene issue, two blue vinyl issues, one vinyl white demo (sure I have a styrene white demo too somewhere):

 

STYRENE BLUE ISSUE - two vertical lines - ZTSC stamped:

 

"Why Girl" side stamped ZTSC126028-2A plus a small TI scratched in

 

"What I Want" stamped ZTSC126029-2A plus a small TI scratched in.

 

VINYL WHITE DEMO - no vertical lines:

 

"Why Girl" side - ZTSC125028 scratched in (yes that's a 5 not a 6!!) plus WHY scratched in.

 

"What I Want" side - SI-C10028B scratched in, SOUND INC. scratched in, and ZTSC126029 scratched in.

 

VINYL BLUE ISSUE - no vertical lines:

 

Identical to vinyl white demo as above.

 

VINYL BLUE ISSUE - no vertical lines:

 

"Why Girl" side only has WHY scratched in and no other details as described above on other copy.

 

"What I Want" details as per previously described vinyl versions.

 

Think that shows that there were several pressings of "Why Girl" and that "Sugar Ain't Sweet" was still the first.

 

I need a lie down after all that   

 

Cheers

 

Richard

Edited May 18, 201411 yr by Premium Stuff

thanks a lot!

Mick Holdsworth, on 18 May 2014 - 4:57 PM, said:

Not really relevant to the original question, but thought I'd put this one up.

 

precisionsgreen.jpg

 

... and yes, "Why Girl" is on the flip.

 

Cheers

Mick

I can add these.

BLACK VINYL copy.

STYRENE copy.

 

Edited May 18, 201411 yr by SebDK