Just been watching the BBC Deep Soul programme, as much as I love these fantastic artists (and I do), why again do we have a Soul TV show aimed at an audience that does not exist.

Anyone who has taken Soul music into their lives and comes from this bizarre island we call home, will I am certain become bewitched by the Obscure/Rare/Northern version of this genre commonly known as Soul. Ask any self respecting Soul fan you know and they will tell you about artists that these TV journalists have never heard of ! Good God in heaven why can't somebody represent the most incredible music of all time without having to drag those old news reels of Sam & Dave up (hell I love it, but please I'm trying to make a point). Guess I'm just a bit miffed at seeing yet another representation of "SOUL" being hashed out with Aretha,Otis,Sam etc (these people are legends, I well know) but to present a chronicle of Soul music to a British audience and somehow airbrush out the most vitriolic and passionate obsessives that I for one have ever met, is nothing short of sacrilege.

Edited May 28, 200519 yr by Brett

I agree that records like Baby Love have no place on the rare soul scene, but for quite different reasons. Basically, you can hear it on the radio, at home, at "normal' discos etc etc. Therefore it becomes MOR.  But musically and the reason it was produced is imo one and the same as Jackie Beavers on Revilot.  You think the Solid Hitbound Team or the folks at Pied Piper did what they did for the love of it?? Read Jack Ashfords book. Kinda puts things in perspective.

If you speak to artists still involved in the business, they STILL see the $$$ when you discuss their current projects. (ie. What's in it for me? This is how I make my living), and quite rightly so. You wouldn't ask a plumber to fix your leak for nothing would you. No difference imo.

"Aimed at white audiences as that's where the money was". Too right Chalky lad. And thank God they did eh?

Nice talkin' to ya....

Regards,

Dave

www.hitsvillesoulclub.com

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Revilot and other smaller labels I agree they wanted to make money but can you honestly say that some of the releases onn the smaller local labels were aimed specifically at the mass white audience the way acts like the Supremes was? There are many labels that aimed there output specifically at the local black buying market. You can't say that about many of the Motown Corporations major sellers.

I also agree about the artists and that they are in it for the money. I bet half of them didn't or wouldn't give a shit what style they sang as long as it made them rich

I've read Jack Ashfords book and it still doesn'ty change my thinking about Motown.

With respect, this programme isn't really aimed at the hardcore fans of Rare Soul. It's aimed at the Observer Music Monthly demographic. It's a pretty good effort considering the limitations on archive material etc. that the producers must have had to put up with.

Could a Rare Soul version of such a programme ever be made? I'd be surprised if it could. Scene politics would make it very unlikely, let alone the extremely specialist nature of the subject being deemed commercial enough to get an airing on even  a channel such as BBC4.

Seeing as TV is a visual medium, how would you fill the time, without artist footage, or even artist interviews? it's a scene that's so esoteric and based in abject failure that there's not much visual that ever got recorded to support a TV Series.

Let's not forget that most attempts there has been to represent the Rare Soul scene in media has been mostly met with derision, suspicion or indifference by the "Hardcore fans". You get a lot of people telling you what's wrong with it, but not many willing to put their money where their mouth is and make something better. Look at the grief Levine got for SWONS, for example.

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Here,here this is by far the most constructive reply here, i agree with every point made, Northern Soul is very often given a very bad retro nostalgic overview by the mainstream media, i don't think there has ever been a decent full story told so far, Levine had the chance and blew it in my opinion.

There is some footage out there which could be used with interviews etc. to make a worts and all documentary but again it would not have commercial mainstream appeal.

I think to be honest it's best left alone as often tv people and production companies think they know best and we know that this far from the truth, so we will have to put up with the 'keep the faith'. 'brothers and sisters' kind of vibe or nothing, there really seems to be no middle ground on this one, it's always gonna be the 'Wigan Casino' as the heyday period, baggie trousers,flat caps and whippets it's how it is.......

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

I think to be honest it's best left alone as often tv people and production companies think they know best and we know that this far from the truth, so we will have to put up with the 'keep the faith'. 'brothers and sisters' kind of vibe or nothing, there really seems to be no middle ground on this one, it's always gonna be the 'Wigan Casino' as the heyday period, baggie trousers,flat caps and whippets it's how it is.......

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

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This maybe true in UK and imo it's too ingrained in the publics perception of "Northern Soul". However..............Northern/Rare Soul is now a worldwide phenomenon and the "foreign" scenes have two advantages:

1. There's no hang up about the 70s and all it's complications to wrestle with. The "Foreign" scenes didn't exist then.

2. The experiences of Ex Pat UK fans coupled with the expertise and enthusiasm of local fans breathes "fresh air" into a "fledgeling" scene. The "mistakes" of the UK scene can be avoided, whilst the positive aspects can be enhanced, and all this with no "politics" undermining everyone's efforts.

The collapse of the VegasShuffle event was a perfect example of how 'importing" the UK scene doesn't work, unless you bring your own punters, DJs, scene, with you.

So...........watch this space.....

Regards,

Dave

www,hitsvillesoulclub.com

This maybe true in UK and imo it's too ingrained in the publics perception of "Northern Soul". However..............Northern/Rare Soul is now a worldwide phenomenon and the "foreign" scenes have two advantages:

1. There's no hang up about the 70s and all it's complications to wrestle with. The "Foreign" scenes didn't exist then.

2. The experiences of Ex Pat UK fans coupled with the expertise and enthusiasm of local fans breathes "fresh air" into a "fledgeling" scene. The "mistakes" of the UK scene can be avoided, whilst the positive aspects can be enhanced, and all this with no "politics" undermining everyone's efforts.

The collapse of the VegasShuffle event was a perfect example of how 'importing" the UK scene doesn't work, unless you bring your own punters, DJs, scene, with you.

So...........watch this space.....

Regards,

Look forward to it Dave, thought the Vegas Shuffle thing going up the pictures was more to do with the financial backer getting cold feet, still i take your point and agree, also given your website a big shout on my Solar radio show this coming sunday via an email from Dave Ferguson, great site by the way hope it all goes well.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

Look forward to it Dave, thought the Vegas Shuffle thing going up the pictures was more to do with the financial backer getting cold feet, still i take your point and agree, also given your website a big shout on my Solar radio show this coming sunday via an email from Dave Ferguson, great site by the way hope it all goes well.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

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Cheers Mark, we listen on the East Coast on Sundays. Great Job.

Best,

Dave

www.hitsvillesoulclub.com