Garethx

Thanks for clearing that up Bob. Does this mean that Bob Lee had an interest in Jerhart himself? Do you know the answer to the original question? At what point was the Mica version cut and was it simply a cash-in? Could it be a case of Impression selling the master of the 'classic' version to Jerhart and Robins himself selling the master of the other version to Al Benson? Robins released records on a multitude of labels, with only really Federal (four or five singles) seemingly having him as a contracted artist for any period of time. The majority of his other records seem to have been one-off leasing deals to the likes of Convoy, Kent, 20th Century, Tangerine etc. It's a shame that he could never really commercially capitalise on the success of "I Just Can't Please You" as his recorded body of work places him as one of the great underground soul voices.

I'm not so sure about that at all. Jimmy Robins was based in California at the time of the recording of "Just Can't Please You" (and in fact for most of the 60s). The original release of the record is on Impression, which was basically a pop/garage label from Los Angeles. The Jerhart release is a straight 're-issue' of that take of the song. Because the tune had the classic sound of Chicago hard soul in the Harold Burrage/Otis Clay vein it became a hugely popular radio record in Chicago and eventually a big seller all over the country. I wonder if the Mica version wasn't an attempt to sneak a version out for the Midwest before the Jerhart deal to release the record was officially signed. Mica and Jerhart were both Bob Lee owned or operated labels I think I'm right in saying. The fact that there's a different artist on each side of the Mica release leads me to believe it might have acted as a kind of promo, but with it being a different version wasn't persevered with once the tapes of the 'proper' version turned up. As an aside a light blue label copy of the Jerhart 45 turned up on ebay last week which was stamped 'DJ COPY' and was accompanied by it's original "Angie Promotions" stamped mailer. An interesting artifact. I know some people prefer the Mica version but in my opinion it's nowhere near as good. Plus it doesn't have the incredible "I Made It Over" on the flip. No disrespect to Roy Wright but he couldn't really replace one of the very greatest soul records made by anyone, ever.

I don't know that this particular thread is the correct place to state that you think the record is substandard. When the artists behind the music have taken the time and effort to come into our world I think it's actually really bad manners to stroke one's own ego by stating that you consider their work to be "pants" in what is in essence a conversation between strangers. This thread is a way of welcoming one of the artists who provided the music that keeps our scene going. Who could blame them for feeling confused when the elation of finding out that forty years after that music is made it is appreciated half a world away turns to something else when there are dissenting voices. Yes, it is a forum and differences in opinion are what makes it hang together, but there are ways of doing things which sometimes leave a bitter taste in the mouth. For what it's worth I think it's a really good record and one which stands out when played in clubs. It has presence and that's important. If you've ever sat down and played one hundred obscure and unknown soul records one after the other you'd appreciate that this is actually more than a pretty good record: the singing is truly excellent and the whole thing has a personality and charm all of its' own.

George Jackson on Mercury is by no means a rare record. Bearing in mind the title of the thread I've seen more of these than US copies of "My Desires,,," on Fame.

Fantastic stuff Dave. Thanks for sharing it with us.

Classic. I love the description: "Doesn't skip or jump on either side, as easily removable price stickers keep the record lined up to track correctly."

Indeed. It seems like many sellers are currently adopting this business model. But without the catchy names. For what it's worth I'll happily buy a trashed record if it's priced accordingly. Sometimes when I've upgraded to a better copy of a record I'll miss the pops and clicks of the older copy. On a wider note do people outside of 'collectors' still trash records with everyday use? I know less people still play records these days but I often marvel at quite how beaten-up records used to get 'back then' as it were. Even only a few months of owning a record, playing it and taking it to parties used to result in some quite remarkable wear. I notice on the few occasions I see fairly recent second-hand reggae records that they can get absolutely battered within a few months of release.

Or start specialising in collecting such records and open an ebay store.

I may have got my full use out of this now, so might be tempted by a realistic offer. Couple of things to bear in mind: it's a relatively rare and brilliant record, and it's in demand beyond the realms of the UK soul scene.

Will the dubs play at 78rpm?

From a moral point of view this is the crux of the matter.

Records have historically been covered up for a variety of reasons. They've always been fair game for 'uncovering'. Often the amount of respect given to a particular deejay's covered records is in direct proportion to that person's standing on the scene: think of how long the paper remained on many of Searling's biggest spins despite their identity being common knowledge to some for decades. Covering something you can buy from amazon.com is fraught with difficulty, I would have thought, particularly if the person doing the covering-up has in the past been prone to having a confrontational stance with regard to scene politics or etiquette. This record is released on a Finnish label I understand and is in a consciously retro style, so nothing really materially different from playing a Nicole Willis track or anything else on Timmion. For what it's worth I think it's a pretty fair stab at recreating the sound it's aiming for, and I can imagine the artist involved being good fun to see live. For me there are enough underexposed old American soul records out there to not have to resort to playing a track of this nature, but I stress that's a choice made from a purely personal perspective. Others will clearly disagree with me as is their prerogative. A few people have said they like it, though, so in creating interest in a record which people might otherwise not have been exposed to Beeks deserves a bit of credit in some ways. Had he been able to do that without the cover-up is debatable, but like I state at the top records have been historically covered for a plethora of reasons, some of which are often quite complex.

What was it the Ancient Chinese Philosopher once said: Open your door and flies will come in.

The musical equivalent of a Crockett & Tubbs suit with its crashing syn-drums and keyboard bass line. The pure soul of The O'Jays shines through though. I love the stuff Keni Burke produced for PIR at the time. The Jones Girls' Keep It Comin' and Ah, Ah, Ah, Ah still sound great. The latter mentioned is one of my alltime favourite records. The overall song structure is magnificent and the ending with massed harmony is phenomenal.

I've played it out a couple of times at various events in the last few years and it usually goes down very well: as it should because it's a great record and evokes happy memories of a time when a record like this could be played as a new release in 'rare soul' clubs and become massive.

Here's a scan of the original label. As the guys say above the pressing is on a red label. Never been that keen on 'Prove It' (preferring Dan Brantley's great original on Federal) but must say that I Can't Lie To My Heart would never be far from the top of any personal soul chart, a simply phenomenal record.

The real one that went through ebay about eighteen months ago was a thing of great beauty although, as Ernie says above, practically unplayable through missing a great deal of its surface lacquer. A valuable piece of soul music memorabilia I would have thought.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sG7j8M7Y-98 Here's the red label Gene Williams for comparison. Vocally and arrangement-wise my favourite version by a country mile. Often referred to as the 'live' version but I don't think that means before a live audience, rather that it's rough around the edges in a 'one-take-one-track' kind of way. Is it just my ears or is this the same group of musicians as on currently-hot Kansas City indies like Theron & Darrell and L.T. & The Soulful Dynamics on Solo?

Took me a long time to get all six sides on US 45, which I now have. Slight problem with the earlier two singles is that while both were/are mint they suffer from a bit of styrene roughness, leading to a lot of distortion in the louder passages which means I don't actually play them as often as I should. This seems to be quite a common problem across much of the London distributed Hi catalogue. The later Cream-distributed singles are mostly on vinyl for issue copies, styrene for some demos. A shame as the music is truly superb. A small but significant body of work to rival anything on the label. US hip hop producers clearly think the same as there are a plethora of tracks which sample liberally from Ms. Plum's output. Also worth checking out her unissued at the time "Loneliness" which appeared on the CD anthology she shared with Veneice Starks some years back.

The site above does indeed confirm him as playing on at least one side of that 45, recorded at Starday in Nashville.

An excellent read. Thanks Mike. A couple of things are apparent from the site with regard to the soul world: Hendrix recorded a few things with the Isleys on Atlantic and the very early incarnation of their T-Neck label. The pictures of Hendrix playing with Wilson Pickett were from a one-off New York club date to promote Percy Sledge's first Atlantic LP to the music industry. Along with King Curtis & The Kingpins Hendrix backs not only Pickett, but Sledge and Esther Phillips too. As a sometime member of Don Covay's Goodtimers Hendrix participates in the recording of Little Richard's "I Don't Know What You Got" on VeeJay: one of the greatest of deep soul records. The chronology of Hendrix's involvement with Johnny Brantley's Vidalia productions is very interesting: he's supposed to feature on the rare George Scott album on Maple, which includes Scott's vocals over a couple of earlier Icemen and Jimmy Norman backing tracks which Hendrix does definitively play on (including the Icemen's Ole-9 single). Brantley later issued a number of recordings supposedly featuring Hendrix backing saxophonist Lonnie Youngblood which reportedly actually feature Lee Moses playing the lead guitar parts. Moses and Hendrix were both apparently very much influenced in fusing R&B with psychedelic elements from stints with The Mighty Hannibal in Atlanta. In playing as part of King Curtis's band on the Ray Sharpe record "Help Me Parts 1&2" on Atco, Hendrix inadvertently plays on the Aretha Franklin classic "Save Me", which recycled the backing track of the earlier Ray Sharpe release. I never knew that Ray Sharpe was black, either! Regular appearances in the bands of the Isley Brothers, Sam Cooke, Little Richard and Don Covay would have meant that Hendrix was more than a mere journeyman as I unfairly stated above. He would have presumably been quite an in-demand sideman. Still this would give scant indication of what he was later capable of.

Yes. Maybe I was a little harsh, as he was clearly exceptionally talented, but maybe no more so than many other musicians who would have been his contemporaries in R&B at that particular time. I'd never seen the photos of him onstage with Wilson Pickett as used in the Rosa Lee Brooks video above. Ask yourself who the eye and ear would have been drawn to in that particular show. Had he not been enticed to the UK by Chas Chandler it might be interesting to speculate what would have become of his career. My guess is that global superstardom with a 'black' band, black management and so on would have been much harder or him to realise.

There is a huge amount of web stuff out there on Hendrix before he came to the UK, formed the Jimi Hendrix Experience and recorded for Polydor. The Motown rumours are just that: rumours. He did play in bands which would have backed the Isley Brothers in a touring incarnation before they actually joined Motown, but by the same token this band would have backed twenty or thirty vocalists or vocal groups in a given year. The idea of self contained bands who would have backed the same vocalist on every gig and in every recording session was limited to very big names only: even Bobby Bland, Ray Charles and James Brown had a couple of bands who would have performed these duties in different parts of the country. As James mentions a small part of Jimi's career was spent with Johnny Brantley in New York and New Jersey at the same time as Brantley was working with Lee Moses, Hermon Hitson, Gloria 'Towanda' Barnes and the Ohio Players etc. Quite how much recording he did was open to question and Brantley was not averse to cashing in on Jimi's later notoriety by re-issuing instrumental tracks as 'Jimi Hendrix masters' whether Jimi played on them or not. Bootlegs and semi-legal recordings have surfaced where the guitarist might be Hendrix but might equally have been Lee Moses or Hermon Hitson. The three guitarists certainly had a lot in common in their use of effects and general showmanship. The 350lb Lee Moses had much less chance of becoming a global superstar of course. It's worth bearing in mind that while Hendrix was something of a revelation to a white 'pop' audience (this was really before that audience became a 'rock' one which Hendrix would help to define) his use of stagecraft like playing guitar with his teeth and behind his head, his use of effects pedals and feedback was kind of standard for touring R&B showmen going back to Johnny Jenkins and beyond. In the R&B world Hendrix was simply a journeyman. Taken out of that world and marketed as something exotic he was to become a phenomenon. The youtube clip of The UT above is Rose Brooks of 'I'm Moanin'" fame by the way. She was a sometime girlfriend and signed to the big time (Liberty/Soul City) before Jimi himself. For what it's worth I hear a lot of 'soul' in the recordings of The Jimi Hendrix Experience: he had a limited but undeniably charismatic voice and more than a few of the downtempo tracks have pleasing echoes of Curtis Mayfield, James Brown etc.

I'd love to see footage of the original Embers in their heyday: I wonder if any exists?