I've just been reading the John Manship Auction post - his sales blurb is fantastic and surely must help to get him the high prices he regularly achieves.

 

I particularly liked his description of the Linda & The Vistas on Shrine - then I remembered that there was an alternate version of Linda & Pretenders Believe Me which I think got played in London in 2001? I've never actually heard this version and wondered if anyone had a sound clip or CD of it?

 

 

The alternate take of Linda And The Pretenders (Believe Me) was played by Andy Rix and Rob Thomas.

I think I'm thinking about the same record...it's on the Assault label...got it off ebay circa 2004

I think I'm thinking about the same record...it's on the Assault label...got it off ebay circa 2004

yes

I think I'm thinking about the same record...it's on the Assault label...got it off ebay circa 2004

 

It is but Andy/Rob have an alternate take.  

 

I remember being in the Dome (CSC) when there was 4 copies for sale same night.

Yes that's it - the Dome - I remember seeing some playlists at the time and that was on it - but how can I hear this alternate version?

It is but Andy/Rob have an alternate take.  

 

I remember being in the Dome (CSC) when there was 4 copies for sale same night.

 

Does that mean mine was worthless then because there were so many copies?

It was played before the Dome, Guy Hennigan's Frankie & The Classicals cover up mid 80's

Don't think any of those four were particularly cheap Pete.

Edited April 8, 201510 yr by chalky

Does that mean mine was worthless then because there were so many copies?

 

Goes for about 500 these days Pete quite a toughie I think. Brilliant record often play it at Solid Hit.

 

Steve Green had the alternate version at one time though pretty sure he sold it on, was it that different ? Thought it was just "extra" drums or something or am I just imagining that ?

Yes that's it - the Dome - I remember seeing some playlists at the time and that was on it - but how can I hear this alternate version?

 

Yes must have been played a bit at the Dome as it was on one of the give away tapes but I don't ever remember hearing it  & I went to almost every nite at the Dome. Mind you I always thought the beers pipes were never rinsed through properly & I think the beer & cleaning chemicals may have gone to my head, always loved it there though 

Goes for about 500 these days Pete quite a toughie I think. Brilliant record often play it at Solid Hit.

 

Steve Green had the alternate version at one time though pretty sure he sold it on, was it that different ? Thought it was just "extra" drums or something or am I just imagining that ?

 

Ah, that was who I sold my copy to, Steve Green, drove to Worcester to meet him to do the exchange

Goes for about 500 these days Pete quite a toughie I think. Brilliant record often play it at Solid Hit.

 

Steve Green had the alternate version at one time though pretty sure he sold it on, was it that different ? Thought it was just "extra" drums or something or am I just imagining that ?

 

The vocals are different too.  Same lyrics just not as polished if you know what I mean.

Just had a listen, it is longer and the singing and is at a faster tempo.

Does anyone know how I can listen to the alternate version?

Just had a listen, it is longer and the singing and is at a faster tempo.

 

Where did you listen to it Chalky, do you have a recording of it ? Any chance of a soundfile please ?

This is all I have..

Thanks for this clip. Even though it is brief it is apparent IMHO that they released the better of the two versions.

This is all I have..

 

Thanks for this clip. Even though it is brief it is apparent IMHO that they released the better of the two versions.

 

Blimey ! Thanks for that Chalky, quite a bit different 

 

Agreed gtagg but I would love a full length clip of the unissued version, to my ears sounds great & sufficiently different to have it on an mp3   

I'm a bit late coming to the discussion ....

 

There are two alternate versions of 'Believe Me' prior to the version which eventually gained release on Assault Records.

 

The first version, under discussion here, was recorded at Herb Abramson's A-1 Sound Studio located at 234 West 56th in Manhatten.

 

I got this version from Jim, the studio engineer, who did this session alongside 'She Went Away' c/w 'Bad Apple' that eventually became the first Shrine release after Eddie Singleton had relocated to Washington D.C. ... Jim still had his copy of the Shrine 45 signed by Linda.

 

This is what Harry Bass recalled about the events "Yes A-1 studio. Think it was located at 1650 Broadway. Been there many times. As a matter of fact I remember being there for Believe Me and for He Went Away recordings; both written by Eddie, as I recall. Although, Linda may have had a hand in the penning of one of the tunes. 'Believe me... "believe me when I tell you. Believe me... believe me when I say"  It has a Moderate tempo etc. 'He Went Away' is a bit slower in tempo. Well I wrote Bad Apple for Linda and it was actually the first Shrine Release. Can't recall just what was on the other side of that record. I think that I went up to A-1 with J.J. Jackson when we had penned a tune called "Just Friends". We put the song down on tape as  a demo. But we scrapped that one. Later J.J. would go over to Mercury and the folks over there would release It's Alright (Alright Girl)for J.J. .... I had nothing to do with that ! Now that is one of the most played oldies ever! .... Linda sang like a rare beautiful bird"

 

It is quite different in it's arrangement and the male backing vocals are more prominent ..

 

The second version was a new recording done at Bell Sound on 27 March 1963 and the annotation on the acetate indicates it was scheduled for release on Pawn .. this was a label owned by Eddie. This version is not really that much different to the last version that gained release on Assault. I never did ask Eddie why there was a change of plan concerning its chosen label for release.

 

This is what Harry said "Ok this mix done at Bell .... when you compare this with the earlier version you can also hear that the background vocals jump right in from the beginning ,unlike the original. Echo has been turned up a notch or two and I want to say that  the tempo is down a notch. In my opinion this is just a better rendition more relaxed singing. As I recall Linda was nervous the first time in the studio. The cat playing the flute was a studio musian named Zane who worked with Jimmie Tyrell whose label I appeared on with the Toreador's "Nothin But Rock N' Roll" .... I think Jimmie is playing Bass for this recording. Zane was a slightly built white guy with a moustache who always wore a bee bop tam and could play every woodwind instrument known to man. A soft spoken trooper was he. We were quite a family Andy. You can also hear Zane on some of Eric Gales Sr.'s  jazz recordings. Those cuts came along in the late 70s and perhaps 80s. Richard Tee was also involved with those cats. Together and/or separately they made much music"

 

I believe Linda died a few years ago but I don't have definitive proof

 

Hope that is of some use

 

andy

Great info as usual Andy   Had Rob round the other night , he doesn't change does he 

 

Swifty

Great info as usual Andy. 

Thanks  for the article Andy - very illuminating. I wasn't aware that there was yet another alternative take - I'd love to hear it. There was bit of banter between Jim Reeves (Engineer) and Linda on a Youtube post a few years ago - may still be there.

Now we just need some enterprising soul to release an ep with her 5 tracks.

Thanks  for the article Andy - very illuminating. I wasn't aware that there was yet another alternative take - I'd love to hear it. There was bit of banter between Jim Reeves (Engineer) and Linda on a Youtube post a few years ago - may still be there.

Now we just need some enterprising soul to release an ep with her 5 tracks.

Do you have a link for that ?

 

Andy

Looks like her daughter makes a comment on this upload.....

 

Jim and Linda on this one Andy.....