Just seen a post in another thread which reminded me of an earlier post I made which was buried away in another subject so I thought I'd revive it just out of curiosity.

Namely: does it make any sense to play highly rare and valuable original records @ different venues these days?

Surely it doesn't make a lot of sense to play impossibly rare records out at every gig these days does it? It's one way to wear your records out too fast. Especially styrene pressings - I ruined 2 copies of Morris Chestnut, 2 Tobi Legends, 1 Gerri Grainger, I Al Jones and countless others that way, so if you now have 'em in your collection and get annoyed from the hiss and spluttering at the beginning, then you probably have a deejay's old copy!

Also, the way things are moving these days, even CD's are becoming out-of-date - the growth is now in digital formats as much as it kills me to say it. But, from a personal point of view, I think it makes more sense for a DJ to have 10,000 songs at his disposal so he can play what he wants without being limited to a single box of records. Maybe that could be one way to brighten up the playlists possibly?

I know the Northern scene is naturally dominated by records but I'm not sure how relevent actually owning the original vinyl is going to be in years to come. Right now it's like a 'badge of honour' to own the original vinyl but how many of the crowd would be aware whether a track was played on the original vinyl or on CD? Less than 1% I reckon.........Also, the CD version would probably sound better than a well-played vinyl copy I'm saddened to say.....

Don't get me wrong - I love vinyl as much as anyone - I still have a couple of rooms full of it, but I don't see what's so wrong with having the choice of playing both vinyl and CD/Digital. Does it make, say, an unreleased Kent track any better by playing an acetate of it, when it was probably cut from a CD in the first place? Also, I notice that several DJ's on other scenes are playing custom-pressed double-sided copies of their own rarities on bespoke one-off new vinyl pressings. So they're not playing the originals, they're playing re-dubbed versions of their own rare records on a newer piece of plastic. Well, if you do that, then surely it's got be easier to carry 10,000 tunes on a laptop hasn't it?

I notice this is happening more and more with DJ's who play internationally. Freight charges, customs and even foreign Taxes are killing 'em if they carry vinyl these days. Also, it's a risk - would you risk your vinyl collection to baggage handlers around the world? Especially Northern collections! Or do you take 100 records only and limit your choice?

I'm writing this at the time when, in the mainstream market, commercially, the vinyl format is now just about dead and the CD will be dead from mid next year in my opinion (going by the annual declines, store closures and distributors going bust).

This'll be a hiding to nothing here, but is it really worth playing that mega valuable rarity out and diminishing it's quality and lifespan with every play? At least when I wore out my vinyl copies in the mid 70's I could replace 'em a lot cheaper than now........

So, as probably the pre-eminent vinyl collectors forum in the world, what are the views of Soul Source members?

Ian D

i can understand your point completely but i don't think it would solve the playlist problem as the unimaginative (in my opinion the majority) would just play the big money tunes that they previously couldn't afford .

as it stands and this is only an opinion vinyl prices and collections act as a filter to what would be a deluge of "dj's" if mp3's were the acceptable format

Good thread, you both have valid point's, let's here some more opinions.

Willie

i can understand your point completely but i don't think it would solve the playlist problem as the unimaginative (in my opinion the majority) would just play the big money tunes that they previously couldn't afford .

as it stands and this is only an opinion vinyl prices and collections act as a filter to what would be a deluge of "dj's" if mp3's were the acceptable format

Mmm. I see your point, but on the other hand it seems to me that you'd need at least £100K to be a top jock these days based on values alone wouldn't it?

The bigger choice option would surely widen the playlists and then it would be down to someone's impeccable taste that decides whether they're successful or not surely?

Ian D

why not just buy a load of boots and at least it still looks like what the scene should be about,

Just put a Laptop on radom play with voice edits like " Stafford Monster " and "Wigan Stomper" , no need for DJ's with collections The laptop can do the lot

Edited November 21, 200717 yr by Simon M

why not just buy a load of boots and at least it still looks like what the scene should be about,

Yeah but boots are already established 'cos they've already been bootlegged. Plus, judging by most of the threads on here, there's only so many times that people want to hear the same old stuff. I'm really talking about mega rarities which haven't been booted if you see what I mean.........

Also there is that side of me which knows that if you play a rare record on 50 different decks it will get trashed eventually..........

Ian D

Just put a Laptop on radom play with voice edits like " Stafford Monster " and "Wigan Stomper" , no need for DJ's with collections The laptop can do the lot

Mmm. A much cheaper option and gets rid of human error perfectly!

Now if we could only find a laptop which could dig out unknown rarities........

Ian D

Being that the scene is based on obscure, rare, hard to find records is not the whole ethos of Rare Soul DJ'ing in the true sense of the word simply based on playing authentic original records? I take your points about spoiling records by playing them on sub standard decks etc. but in this day and age there should be no excuse for second rate equipment to be used anyway, a decent set of 1210's with top of the range Stanton's does help.

I still think vinyl is king for most of the scenes DJ's, although this might sound rather glib in my opinion records are for playing rare or not otherwise what's the point in collecting them in the first place? Of course it's important to preserve them but sorry I can't just look at them in boxes totally pointless.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

Mmm. A much cheaper option and gets rid of human error perfectly!

Now if we could only find a laptop which could dig out unknown rarities........

Ian D

Just hook it up to Grid computing and Butch's pc , hes got some software now

Being that the scene is based on obscure, rare, hard to find records is not the whole ethos of Rare Soul DJ'ing in the true sense of the word simply based on playing authentic original records? I take your points about spoiling records by playing them on sub standard decks etc. but in this day and age there should be no excuse for second rate equipment to be used anyway, a decent set of 1210's with top of the range Stanton's does help.

I still think vinyl is king for most of the scenes DJ's, although this might sound rather glib in my opinion records are for playing rare or not otherwise what's the point in collecting them in the first place? Of course it's important to preserve them but sorry I can't just look at them in boxes totally pointless.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

I hope you're not playing yours on the Starpoint decks Mark!

I know what you're saying 'cos I felt exactly the same when I playing in the 70's - I even used to get sniffy about playing acetates back then.....

However, we do have a choice these days and most people have a good idea who has decent taste (I hope). So would you get lynched if 80% of your set was on rare vinyl and 20% of well-chosen but impossible to find killers on CD/Digital.....?

I dunno but I can guess LOL.......

Ian D

Yeah but boots are already established 'cos they've already been bootlegged. Plus, judging by most of the threads on here, there's only so many times that people want to hear the same old stuff. I'm really talking about mega rarities which haven't been booted if you see what I mean.........

Also there is that side of me which knows that if you play a rare record on 50 different decks it will get trashed eventually..........

Ian D

I get where your coming from now Ian, and if im honest my answer is NO, the people that have these big rare tunes have either been lucky in life with money or they have worked their bloody socks off to either find them or build up to them over many a year, by playing them on laptop/mp3 is saying its the same as bootlegging them onto vinyl but in digital format and then any one can play them and then for me they wouldnt be rare and everwhere you go someone who is good with a laptop can be a bigtime dj for the overall cost of naff all, its a rare soul scene and if you got the rare records then thats up to you if you want to wear them out or not, keep it real and respect those that have fought to get what they ahve got,

well thats me up for another slaughtering i suppose for having an opinion

Just hook it up to Grid computing and Butch's pc , hes got some software now

Maybe we could hook up Butch's PC with the HMRC people then we'd all be happy LOL

What's Butch's take on this?

And would he get lynched if he turned up at a gig with a laptop with people KNOWING that he has the originals?

Ian D

The original vinyl ideal is a nice one but the scene has changed so much since 'the rules' were handed down on stone tablets that I'm not sure it makes much sense any more.

The proportion of deejays to punters must be so much higher now, than say 1975, that it's actually ridiculous. Out of that vast community of deejays the proportion who try to play sets of shall we say "lesser known" records is actually miniscule. It takes about five years to make a previously unknown record massive on a national scale whereas in 1975 it could often be done in the course of a weekend. The end result: lots of deejay spots revolving around the sounds that the top deejays were playing five, ten, fifteen, twenty, twenty-five years ago and wrist-slashing ennui.

Records themselves are now ridiculously expensive. No disrespect to the guy selling Mel Britt, Cecil Washington etc. on ebay right now, but someone could buy all those for a great deal of money and produce a deejay spot which could bore the scene to tears for decades on end.

My answer is as stated before on Soul Source. It's radical: less events, less deejays, an emphasis on deejays trying to entertain and strive for the best within a framework of the scene's true ethos. That ethos has been re-shaped to suit peoples' need to deejay. The original vinyl thing has become a bit of a red herring in that realignment. Let's face it, all you need to be a deejay these days is money. What you need to be a good deejay cannot be bought with money. It's called taste.

Edited November 21, 200717 yr by garethx

You come on here after years of being away and preach revolution, steady on old boy. People have been flogged for less.

I hope you're not playing yours on the Starpoint decks Mark!

I know what you're saying 'cos I felt exactly the same when I playing in the 70's - I even used to get sniffy about playing acetates back then.....

However, we do have a choice these days and most people have a good idea who has decent taste (I hope). So would you get lynched if 80% of your set was on rare vinyl and 20% of well-chosen but impossible to find killers on CD/Digital.....?

I dunno but I can guess LOL.......

Ian D

Lol no Ian I record my shows on...well the head cost more than the deck...lol no you would not perhaps get lynched for playing 80% rare vinyl to 20% of well-chosen but impossible to find killers on CD/Digital but what about the DJ's/Collectors who actually may own and have in their boxes and collections those 20% impossible to find killers, perhaps more to do with getting the DJ balance right in the first place who might be able to provide that magical 20%? rather than having to go down the CD/Digital route?

Is this not the same as the Original versus Bootleg debate instead the Boot has been replaced with the CD/Digital format as the sound carrier?

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

I get where your coming from now Ian, and if im honest my answer is NO, the people that have these big rare tunes have either been lucky in life with money or they have worked their bloody socks off to either find them or build up to them over many a year, by playing them on laptop/mp3 is saying its the same as bootlegging them onto vinyl but in digital format and then any one can play them and then for me they wouldnt be rare and everwhere you go someone who is good with a laptop can be a bigtime dj for the overall cost of naff all, its a rare soul scene and if you got the rare records then thats up to you if you want to wear them out or not, keep it real and respect those that have fought to get what they ahve got,

well thats me up for another slaughtering i suppose for having an opinion

Not at all mate. Having an opinion's what this forum is all about. And I understand your point entirely. But you could still have exclusive MP3's couldn't you? Or MP3 cover-ups for that matter. The tunes would still have to be discovered in the first place.

I just think that I'd rather have my entire collection to choose from on a laptop, then I could play what I wanted, whenever I wanted and not be limited to just a box of records if you see what I mean...

Also it could be a prudent move to think about the future. How many decks do you see these days which still have the 78rpm option? I know Blues Collectors who refuse to listen to any other format but they'd be hard-pressed to find any equipment to accomodate 'em these days LOL....

Ian D

You come on here after years of being away and preach revolution, steady on old boy. People have been flogged for less.

It wuz that Pointer Sisters boot thread which got me going! Honest Guvnor!

The original vinyl ideal is a nice one but the scene has changed so much since 'the rules' were handed down on stone tablets that I'm not sure it makes much sense any more.

The proportion of deejays to punters must be so much higher now, than say 1975, that it's actually ridiculous. Out of that vast community of deejays the proportion who try to play sets of shall we say "lesser known" records is actually miniscule. It takes about five years to make a previously unknown record massive on a national scale whereas in 1975 it could often be done in the course of a weekend. The end result: lots of deejay spots revolving around the sounds that the top deejays were playing five, ten, fifteen, twenty, twenty-five years ago and wrist-slashing ennui.

Records themselves are now ridiculously expensive. No disrespect to the guy selling Mel Britt, Cecil Washington etc. on ebay right now, but someone could buy all those for a great deal of money and produce a deejay spot which could bore the scene to tears for decades on end.

My answer is as stated before on Soul Source. It's radical: less events, less deejays, an emphasis on deejays trying to entertain and strive for the best within a framework of the scene's true ethos. That ethos has been re-shaped to suit peoples' need to deejay. The original vinyl thing has become a bit of a red herring in that realignment. Let's face it, all you need to be a deejay these days is money. What you need to be a good deejay cannot be bought with money. It's called taste.

Bloody hell Gareth, that is one of the best things I have read on here, sure said that to you about 3 years ago, but this is the one.

Sadly lots of people wont get this, lots more will say I am a snob for saying that, I have now come to the stage where I am happy being a snob when it comes to this, bring on the revolution!

Beer on me next time I see you young man, hopefully soon!!

The original vinyl ideal is a nice one but the scene has changed so much since 'the rules' were handed down on stone tablets that I'm not sure it makes much sense any more.

The proportion of deejays to punters must be so much higher now, than say 1975, that it's actually ridiculous. Out of that vast community of deejays the proportion who try to play sets of shall we say "lesser known" records is actually miniscule. It takes about five years to make a previously unknown record massive on a national scale whereas in 1975 it could often be done in the course of a weekend. The end result: lots of deejay spots revolving around the sounds that the top deejays were playing five, ten, fifteen, twenty, twenty-five years ago and wrist-slashing ennui.

Records themselves are now ridiculously expensive. No disrespect to the guy selling Mel Britt, Cecil Washington etc. on ebay right now, but someone could buy all those for a great deal of money and produce a deejay spot which could bore the scene to tears for decades on end.

My answer is as stated before on Soul Source. It's radical: less events, less deejays, an emphasis on deejays trying to entertain and strive for the best within a framework of the scene's true ethos. That ethos has been re-shaped to suit peoples' need to deejay. The original vinyl thing has become a bit of a red herring in that realignment. Let's face it, all you need to be a deejay these days is money. What you need to be a good deejay cannot be bought with money. It's called taste.

Superb reply, things have changed that's for sure....respect sir.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

The original vinyl ideal is a nice one but the scene has changed so much since 'the rules' were handed down on stone tablets that I'm not sure it makes much sense any more.

The proportion of deejays to punters must be so much higher now, than say 1975, that it's actually ridiculous. Out of that vast community of deejays the proportion who try to play sets of shall we say "lesser known" records is actually miniscule. It takes about five years to make a previously unknown record massive on a national scale whereas in 1975 it could often be done in the course of a weekend. The end result: lots of deejay spots revolving around the sounds that the top deejays were playing five, ten, fifteen, twenty, twenty-five years ago and wrist-slashing ennui.

Records themselves are now ridiculously expensive. No disrespect to the guy selling Mel Britt, Cecil Washington etc. on ebay right now, but someone could buy all those for a great deal of money and produce a deejay spot which could bore the scene to tears for decades on end.

My answer is as stated before on Soul Source. It's radical: less events, less deejays, an emphasis on deejays trying to entertain and strive for the best within a framework of the scene's true ethos. That ethos has been re-shaped to suit peoples' need to deejay. The original vinyl thing has become a bit of a red herring in that realignment. Let's face it, all you need to be a deejay these days is money. What you need to be a good deejay cannot be bought with money. It's called taste.

spot on that bit is

Anyway the scene holds many different ideals for so many, each to their own and all that but to say that its ok to play mp3s of really rare records would be even worse to the scene wouldnt it, if you want to hear the golden oldies you know where to go and if you want to hear rare you know where to go too but accepting mp3s would encourage even more wannabe djs wouldnt it and then creating even more events and a definate overkill and is that really what we all want

Not at all mate. Having an opinion's what this forum is all about. And I understand your point entirely. But you could still have exclusive MP3's couldn't you? Or MP3 cover-ups for that matter. The tunes would still have to be discovered in the first place.

I just think that I'd rather have my entire collection to choose from on a laptop, then I could play what I wanted, whenever I wanted and not be limited to just a box of records if you see what I mean...

Also it could be a prudent move to think about the future. How many decks do you see these days which still have the 78rpm option? I know Blues Collectors who refuse to listen to any other format but they'd be hard-pressed to find any equipment to accomodate 'em these days LOL....

Ian D

Sorry Iain but read Gareths response 100 times before going to bed, massive respect for what you have done and for what you do in the wider music world, but sorry this to me says you are looking for the easy way back in.

Maybe we could hook up Butch's PC with the HMRC people then we'd all be happy LOL

What's Butch's take on this?

And would he get lynched if he turned up at a gig with a laptop with people KNOWING that he has the originals?

Ian D

not sure .. .. but I think you'd have to hold the original up to the crowd and then play through the mp3 ,maybe the next rev or Finyl scratch will do it

Edited November 22, 200717 yr by Simon M

The original vinyl ideal is a nice one but the scene has changed so much since 'the rules' were handed down on stone tablets that I'm not sure it makes much sense any more.

The proportion of deejays to punters must be so much higher now, than say 1975, that it's actually ridiculous. Out of that vast community of deejays the proportion who try to play sets of shall we say "lesser known" records is actually miniscule. It takes about five years to make a previously unknown record massive on a national scale whereas in 1975 it could often be done in the course of a weekend. The end result: lots of deejay spots revolving around the sounds that the top deejays were playing five, ten, fifteen, twenty, twenty-five years ago and wrist-slashing ennui.

Records themselves are now ridiculously expensive. No disrespect to the guy selling Mel Britt, Cecil Washington etc. on ebay right now, but someone could buy all those for a great deal of money and produce a deejay spot which could bore the scene to tears for decades on end.

My answer is as stated before on Soul Source. It's radical: less events, less deejays, an emphasis on deejays trying to entertain and strive for the best within a framework of the scene's true ethos. That ethos has been re-shaped to suit peoples' need to deejay. The original vinyl thing has become a bit of a red herring in that realignment. Let's face it, all you need to be a deejay these days is money. What you need to be a good deejay cannot be bought with money. It's called taste.

Beautifully put Gareth.

I'm not really qualified to put it quite as strongly 'cos I haven't been on here for that long and it's 30 odd years since I deejayed Northern every week, but this is kind of what I was getting at....

It would be a shame if it was just about money but I'm sure that has an effect. The bidding war I had on the only Bernie Williams back in '75 made me decide to go to the States and find 'em myself. And that was only £150 LOL........

Ian D

Not at all mate. Having an opinion's what this forum is all about. And I understand your point entirely. But you could still have exclusive MP3's couldn't you? Or MP3 cover-ups for that matter. The tunes would still have to be discovered in the first place.

I just think that I'd rather have my entire collection to choose from on a laptop, then I could play what I wanted, whenever I wanted and not be limited to just a box of records if you see what I mean...

Also it could be a prudent move to think about the future. How many decks do you see these days which still have the 78rpm option? I know Blues Collectors who refuse to listen to any other format but they'd be hard-pressed to find any equipment to accomodate 'em these days LOL....

Ian D

Having your collection on mp3 and all on laptop is brilliant but even if you had 10,000 tunes to choose from you can still only play 25 in your hour set so wether you take a 100 box you still cant play them all unless your doing an all dayer/nighter come weekender on your own then i understand, the fun of it is sorting your record box out and having a good think the days leading up to your spot what you think the venue would love from your collection, If you got the tunes on original and want to preserve them then i understand but will it be accepted by a promoter that might book you let you play MP3s, if they know in advance then no problem but as the scene is how it is the paying punter should be let known that this will happen then they themselves can decide if they care on not by paying there money.

tough one but its a promoters problem too i guess.

BTW there are lotes of decks that play at 78rpm, mine doo and they are brand new,

interesting thread though Ian

It would be a shame if it was just about money but I'm sure that has an effect. The bidding war I had on the only Bernie Williams back in '75 made me decide to go to the States and find 'em myself. And that was only £150 LOL........

Ian D

The original vinyl ideal is a nice one but the scene has changed so much since 'the rules' were handed down on stone tablets that I'm not sure it makes much sense any more.

The proportion of deejays to punters must be so much higher now, than say 1975, that it's actually ridiculous. Out of that vast community of deejays the proportion who try to play sets of shall we say "lesser known" records is actually miniscule. It takes about five years to make a previously unknown record massive on a national scale whereas in 1975 it could often be done in the course of a weekend. The end result: lots of deejay spots revolving around the sounds that the top deejays were playing five, ten, fifteen, twenty, twenty-five years ago and wrist-slashing ennui.

Records themselves are now ridiculously expensive. No disrespect to the guy selling Mel Britt, Cecil Washington etc. on ebay right now, but someone could buy all those for a great deal of money and produce a deejay spot which could bore the scene to tears for decades on end.

My answer is as stated before on Soul Source. It's radical: less events, less deejays, an emphasis on deejays trying to entertain and strive for the best within a framework of the scene's true ethos. That ethos has been re-shaped to suit peoples' need to deejay. The original vinyl thing has become a bit of a red herring in that realignment. Let's face it, all you need to be a deejay these days is money. What you need to be a good deejay cannot be bought with money. It's called taste.

Gareth your right on the money there.

Some of the worst dj's ive heard have been those with 1000's of £'s worth of vinyl in their play boxes , one of them even has a Frank Wilson .

Derek

Sorry Iain but read Gareths response 100 times before going to bed, massive respect for what you have done and for what you do in the wider music world, but sorry this to me says you are looking for the easy way back in.

You misread me Jocko. Much as I love Northern I really have no desire to return to Northern deejaying these days - I kinda felt I left at a good time and the scene has changed a great deal anyway. I'm honestly curious as I'm digitising my own collection for other reasons and different gigs anyway and I was just wondering whether the same ethos could ever work on the Northern scene.......

Ian D

BTW I think there is laser decks now , not 100 % but they do not damge the record ?

The influential Dj's have the confidence in their taste to play tracks that are overlooked/unknown and are likely to be less expensive.

The sheep come along later and have to pay the big bucks.

Hasn't it always been that way?

Derek

its not just about money although it is a factor , unkowns can come cheap if you do find em .. I did have that chat with Butch at lifeline

its not just about money although it is a factor , unkowns can come cheap if you do find em .. I did have that chat with Butch at lifeline

I should have added knowledge to the qualities which money alone cannot buy.

BTW I think there is laser decks now , not 100 % but they do not damge the record ?

Haha LOL. Try asking the average Northern Promoter for Laser decks and see what the response will be!

I'll tell yer what though, if I had a few multi-thousand pound rarities I'd definitely get a set of those decks, that's for sure. It would certainly preserve the value of the records better if they ever wanted to sell them in the future. People are so picky about condition these days that you're fighting a devaluation battle if you've even played a record out a few times.....

Ian D

The influential Dj's have the confidence in their taste to play tracks that are overlooked/unknown and are likely to be less expensive.

The sheep come along later and have to pay the big bucks.

Hasn't it always been that way?

Derek

Long as I've known it!

Mmm. A much cheaper option and gets rid of human error perfectly!

Now if we could only find a laptop which could dig out unknown rarities........

Ian D

See the tax office.

Haha LOL. Try asking the average Northern Promoter for Laser decks and see what the response will be!

I'll tell yer what though, if I had a few multi-thousand pound rarities I'd definitely get a set of those decks, that's for sure. It would certainly preserve the value of the records better if they ever wanted to sell them in the future. People are so picky about condition these days that you're fighting a devaluation battle if you've even played a record out a few times.....

Ian D

Well first you gotta try asking the Promoter about laptops Ian , ..needle less decks may have a chance in the future !!

Well first you gotta try asking the Promoter about laptops Ian , ..needle less decks may have a chance in the future !!

Yep, one thing at a time ay!

Yep, one thing at a time ay!

Well with the lastest software ,I can now do four things at a time ... maybe more one day

https://www.audioturntable.com/index.html

even Bearsy will like one of these !! hes got some styrene that boy

Its hard to stomache but you are predicting our future(or lack of it)We are all drinking in the last chance saloon.It will get so easy that no one will bother about it.Having your records delivered to a gig by securicor is mad though.Im suprised at how many of these big spending jocks do not carry their own stylus and headshells.Also i dont think i like the compressed sound from a laptop(or am i doing it wrong?)

https://www.audioturntable.com/index.html

even Bearsy will like one of these !! hes got some styrene that boy

they do look a great option and something worth thinking about, but then what would we do without that wonderful cue burn effect

Its hard to stomache but you are predicting our future(or lack of it)We are all drinking in the last chance saloon.It will get so easy that no one will bother about it.Having your records delivered to a gig by securicor is mad though.Im suprised at how many of these big spending jocks do not carry their own stylus and headshells.Also i dont think i like the compressed sound from a laptop(or am i doing it wrong?)

You're dead right Nusha and it's a real shame. It's killing me at the moment 'cos I work in the Music Biz and right now it's dying on it's arse.......

And you're also right about the sound to an extent. Nothing can beat the warmth of vinyl in my opinion but todays audiences - especially the youngsters, don't seem that bothered. It's the instant gratification and convenience generation! But gotta move with the times I guess........

The vinyl lover is a dying breed and can be found 24/7 right here on this forum. This could be the last bastion of a beautiful age..........

Ian D

they do look a great option and something worth thinking about, but then what would we do without that wonderful cue burn effect

That wonderful cue-burn effect cost me a couple of grand back in the day!

Ian D

Mmm. I see your point, but on the other hand it seems to me that you'd need at least £100K to be a top jock these days based on values alone wouldn't it?

The bigger choice option would surely widen the playlists and then it would be down to someone's impeccable taste that decides whether they're successful or not surely?

Ian D

I can't disagree that it might become too tempting for some to just hit the 'PLAY' button against a 60 minute collection of big hitters, but where's the imagination and fun in that? Most people would see straight through it.

In response to your initial comment I have to disagree though. Who wouldn't like to have a £100k DJ box to pick from? But you certainly don't need one. Using the right records, presented professionally and mindful of the crowd you are seeking to entertain, it's easily possible to put together a box of records with no single 45 costing more than £25, and still give a good account of yourself in most venues.

That's what sets apart a DJ from someone with a laptop and a wish-list.

Neil Jones

I didnt know there was a music biz left.How do you sell anything?Hip hop and RnB looked to be a safe vinyl bastion til SORATO killed it overnight.

Just seen a post in another thread which reminded me of an earlier post I made which was buried away in another subject so I thought I'd revive it just out of curiosity.

Namely: does it make any sense to play highly rare and valuable original records @ different venues these days?

Yes and some promoters should insist on it!

respect to the artists and paying customers!

Edited November 22, 200717 yr by soul45s

My answer is as stated before on Soul Source. It's radical: less events, less deejays, an emphasis on deejays trying to entertain and strive for the best within a framework of the scene's true ethos. That ethos has been re-shaped to suit peoples' need to deejay. The original vinyl thing has become a bit of a red herring in that realignment. Let's face it, all you need to be a deejay these days is money. What you need to be a good deejay cannot be bought with money. It's called taste.

Sounds a bit like the plot of a Kevin Costner flop in the mold of 'Waterworld' or 'The Postman'. Haven't deejays always striven to entertain? What actually is the scene's true ethos? And even if if such a distinctive spirit exists in reality,is it not simply antagonistic to the entertainment rationale? Also, if this perceived realignment has rendered vinyl a red herring, then how can money have become the sine qua non of the abilty to deejay? I would have thought that if you indeed want to stay within the scene's true ethos, and continue to entertain , then taste alone will no more allow you to be a good deejay than a beggar's fondess for filet mignon will put the stuff in his bowl. It' only by kicking the scene's true ethos - which really belongs to another time and another place, and really has little relevance today - into touch that you can begin to forge this soulful brave new world.

Firstly, the hard work was done by real dj's years ago, when dancers danced and others had the good fortune/summat else innem to do what was required to be that man, we all know the names.

Personally, I have spent my money an soulful music from all era's, and if I'm honest the money I've earned from them outweighs what I've spent (cue, it's not about the money replies).

The wedge you lay out for a tune, whatever it is, should be irrelevant - it's between you, your soul and that record...yes, I understand the histrionics of it, the more you play your rareity, the less its longevity....but, to me it's organic....there should always be the pain factor, the honesty of going without to prove to others what that record meant to you....and it always is appreciated.

Ian, your point about having a laptop full of 10,000 tunes at your disposal is a valid one but isn't having the weight, mentally, behind you before you turn out and pack your box always going to prove you're the better man in the long run?

I don't want to turn this thread into a negative one by my reply btw, it's just that the way technology has gone and the ease of access to this music nowadays, I feel that knowing tracks and when to play them isn't the same as growing up with them and doing enough with your finances to eventually own them (the truth behind loving a track, that an ever responsive dancefloor will respond to - we all know this scene responds to more than the sound).

I don't want to be offensive here but do you not think with this train of thought that a Northern night would just end up like bars have in cities whereby musically uninterested and egocentric tits would end up playing anything that would be a crowd pleaser?

That last line alone, in reality, is ridiculous as it asks, 'Why not?'....but the NS scene is so much more - No?

Edited November 22, 200717 yr by Barry

You can actually save pixels with threads like these. Instead of typing out that long title and introduction you could simply write:

14?

*** super thread ***

Godz

link mended hopefully

Edited November 22, 200717 yr by Godzilla

I didnt know there was a music biz left.How do you sell anything?Hip hop and RnB looked to be a safe vinyl bastion til SORATO killed it overnight.

There isn't a music biz left - I reckon the CD is on it's last Xmas this year. Hip-Hop/RnB and a few dinosaur acts acts are keeping it running but the physical format, namely CD's and Vinyl will almost be gone by the end of next year IMHO. The biggest vinyl distributor in the world went down last Thursday and you can now get most back-cat CD titles for less than £3.00 now. I'm trying to sell some good CD titles @ 30p each with difficulty right now so you can see how bad it is.

Hence the thread!

Ian D

Sounds a bit like the plot of a Kevin Costner flop in the mold of 'Waterworld' or 'The Postman'. Haven't deejays always striven to entertain? What actually is the scene's true ethos? And even if if such a distinctive spirit exists in reality,is it not simply antagonistic to the entertainment rationale? Also, if this perceived realignment has rendered vinyl a red herring, then how can money have become the sine qua non of the abilty to deejay? I would have thought that if you indeed want to stay within the scene's true ethos, and continue to entertain , then taste alone will no more allow you to be a good deejay than a beggar's fondess for filet mignon will put the stuff in his bowl. It' only by kicking the scene's true ethos - which really belongs to another time and another place, and really has little relevance today - into touch that you can begin to forge this soulful brave new world.

Hence the thread Billy! I suppose a lot of people are saying how will the scene mutate and survive into the future unless new technology is embraced at some point.

I'm probably one of the few people who could ask the question because I'm not really on the scene on a regular basis these days, I work in the music biz which is dying on it's arse and I can take an overview on things which may not be possible for people who are more involved in the scene.

Some really interesting viewpoints coming out though and definitely food for thought.....

Ian D