Rick Cooper

Thanks Dave and Steve, Have done ,will do , Dave Rick

Maybe this has come up before when ''Tear Stained Face'' on Veep gets mentioned but it may help. The attached scans are from the inner booklet from a Japannese LP ''I'm Wondering- Veep Singles Collection'' issued 1980 on UA/Veep. It looks like it is a fairly detailed essay on Veep but only the artist and titles are in English. The first column lists Veep 1296 ''Meet me in Church''/ ''Tear Stained Face'' so there must be some info about it . TSF isn't on the LP . So does anyone know if it has been translated before or can anyone translate it for me? The scan isn't very clear but I may be able to get it better if anyone wants it. Another thing I remember is that Ian Levine had TSF on Veep on his wants list in the mid 70's so it was known about then so why has it never been seen? Rick

Having sold most of my records years ago this is one I've held on to . Not sure how common it is but Sue white demos don't seem to be around in large numbers. I once had a sort through the remains of Soul Bowls Sue/Symbol/Eastern stock but out and there were no white demos. Is there a demo for James Fountain ''Seven Day Lover'' on Peachtree? I asked a while ago and got no reply or answer so maybe there wasn't one but can anyone confirm. Rick

Around 1974 to 76 I used to buy records from Bob Catteneo aka Daly City Bob / Soul Odysey of Daly City ,California. At first he didn't know which records were wanted over here so he would get me records from my want list. He would let me know what he had for me and sometimes other stuff he thought I would want. I still have most of his letters and found one postmarked 30th September 1974. In this he lists what he had sent and lists some titles he had got . One of these is ''Double Cooking'' which he adds as a note- 'may have been bootleged by S. Soussan as Checkerboards or Bob Wilson Strings a go-go' Another letter I found then lists what he had sent, this includes Double Cooking for £3. When I got it I remember it had been bootlegged on Soul Fox not long before, maybe a few months but it was still played as Strings a Go-Go as that what everyone knew it as. I don't think most people knew or cared what it was really called. So basically it was revealed about the same time it was for sale as Bob Wilson but maybe it was later when the Villa boot was done that it became well known as Double Cooking. These letters make interesting reading as Bob would rant on a bit being accused of bootleging or such. I never met him but heard he was somewhat ecentric . Along with Double Cooking other titles in the parcel were Cindy Scott-Love You Baby, Nancy Wilson-End, Carstairs -Girl demo, Servicemen- Helping Hand, Casanova 2- Calvin Grayson, Coasters, Magicans , most £1 or £2 each. What would they fetch today? and why didn't I keep them ,sob sob....... Rick

Hi Julian No,never seen one on issue. I got a demo from Bradford market circa 73. They never had it in quantity nor on issue which seems strange. Played it at (not ''out'') Leeds Central which caused Swish to nearly fall down the stairs in his rush to demand that he buy it. Rick

Dave I havn't seen the Moses Smith youv'e got but I remember other boots from around late 70s that were quite thin and tended to have thin sharp edges and often warped. As i said Jamie would have access to original labels so a lighter colour points to a boot. Making a boot a white label demo got round the colour match problem but at the time most buyers only wanted to listen to a record not put it under a microscope. Rick

Rod If it looks like a boot and sounds like a boot it is a boot, simples. The point I was making about dead wax is that originals could have different letters or numbers but eveything else should be right. Rick

I don't have a copy of Moses Smith anymore but thought the following background info may be of interest to those who think it matters. Some of this maybe common knowledge or repeat stuff I've posted before. When I was working at Global Records from 72 to 76 we placed orders with Jamie/Guyden or to be precise their distribution company, Chips Distibutors at 2750 North Broad St, Philadelphia.They stocked a few oldies that sold well, mainly Duanne Eddy and the Showstoppers. Global had a warehouse a few blocks away so Ed Balbier ( Global's owner) would pick the orders up on his monthly buying trips. One time , mid 72 I think, he came back with a 100 copies of Moses Smith as the guy at Chips told him some UK buyer had bought some. The record wasn't that big at the time so the copies were offered to dealers, but not many knew it. I don't remember getting anymore after the initial lot had sold. These were definately originals as they came from the label owners and were not styrene re-issues. I don't who else bought them from Chips but it was probably Soul Bowl. They would have bought quite a lot if they could so there must have been quite a few around. As the record became a big oldie in later years Jamie/Guyden could have re-pressed some using the original masters and labels. It seems unlikely that anyone would have done a look a like boot in the 70s as Jamie would be willing to press some and it would be a bit risky to boot a Jamie title. You could end up swimming with the fishes. At that time Global had a list from Jamie/Guyden of all the labels they owned. These included Arctic, Dionn, Vent, Phil LA of Soul. They would have some in stock still such as the Ethics and Showstoppers plus pop hits but any other title could be ordered in a minimum of 1000 copies. I should have tried ordering a few of everything just to see what was on the shelves. I don't recall Jamie stuff turning up as drilled deletions by the thousands so I think unsold stock tended to be kept. This was probably the case with the Moses Smith copies. There were two or three Barbara Lynn Jamie records that were big in Holland so Global had these re-pressed. They were on styrene (I think) and the label was that used for Duanne Eddy hits but were the same record numbers. As for the lettering in the dead wax maybe some people get a bit worked up about this. From my experience of getting records pressed in the UK for Global's Cream label the marks on the dead wax aren't anything sinister. I don't know if eveyone knows how records were made but its roughly this; From the tape a master is cut on a cutting lathe. This is skilled and expensive and some engineers would put their name or initials on the master as well as the matrix number. Anyone remember '' Porkys Prime Cuts'' on UK Virgin. A ''mother '' was then made from the master, followed by a set of stampers to press the records The stampers would have to be identified on the dead wax as they wore out after about 4 or 5 thousand copies. New stampers could be made from the mother for more copies and would have to have a different number or letter. The first stampers for the Moses Smith would probably have done the demos and a couple of thousand stock copies. The next stampers would them have done the next batch. So having different lettering on a record doesn't always mean its a boot. The labels for Cream issues were done first as sheets of Logo only on coloured paper and then overprinted and cut out for each release. The logo sheets were done in bulk and the finished labels would be done in about double what was needed as it was so cheap and if a record took off you couldn't spare the time for re-printing. I'm sure the same was done in the US. A bootlegger might not get the colour right so off colour labels may indicate something not right. A speeded up Moses Smith sounds strange to me . It couldn't be done from the master so if it definately is faster it's propably a boot, unless a Jamie reissue was done from a new master and the engineer thought it sounded better a little faster. But in the end who knows. Rick

I remember getting an original demo of Jerry Williams in the early 70s (1972 or 73) from Simon Soussan with a note saying I must have it as it was going to be the BIGGEST northern soul record of all time(this may be a slight exageration but not much). I had ordered and paid for a different record but that is how Soussan worked . In a similiar way to Jerry Williams I think Al Wilsons '' Now I Know What Love Is'' has an extra bar on the break on the US Soul City issue compared to the UK Liberty issue, or could be t'other way round. Anyone confirm this or know why (Mr Rounce?)

The UK pressing of the Mitty Collier record was done in the mid 1970s by Global Records as a custom order of 1000 copies for Millies Records in Amsterdam as it was a big record there. Another M Collier title ''Share What You Got'' was also done at the same time. A few copies of each title (about 10 or 12 ) were sold by Derek Howe at HMV in Manchester. I suppose some copies have probably come back here from the Netherlands but they must be quite hard to find now. Rick

Rob Thanks for the info on Butch Baker. I suppose stock copies of ''Batman at the Go Go'' should be non exsistant unless a few slipped through. White DJ copies of ''Fatman'' also seem to be rare. Anyone put a scan up? Rick

Rob Sorry I can't help with your search for SL 1018, but maybe you could help with my question about another St Lawrence release. Whats the story on the Butch Baker ''Batman /Fatman'' record? I had Batman on SL demo but think people said it had to be withdrawn due to legal objections and was immediately reissued on the next number as Fatman at the Go Go, although they both sound identical to me. Rick

OK you've all got some nice stuff so you can put them away now. No one had a reply to my question so can I ask again what the promo for James Fountain ''Seven Day Lover'' was? Is there one, white or red. Maybe some one could check in Manships book for me. Those who can work that facebook thingy might see if William Bell is on and ask him. Rick

Marjorie Black is one of my all time favourites but I have never got past the first few lines untill it all sounds weird. I think the producers -Bateman/Moseley- got her to slur the words as a way of getting over the emotion of the song. She sings the words on the B side clearly enough. I always thought Johnny Jones sang ''scuse me while I kiss this guy'' on Purple Haze but this should be '' Scuse me while I kiss the sky'' which makes even less sense. As it's a Jimi Hendrix song it may make sense if youre tripping. Rick Cooper

Peachtree Records had some white demos on the green label but what was the promo for ''Seven Day Lover''. Was it white or just the red label with DJ printed on or felt pen cross? Anyone seen one? Rick

At Global Records I ordered the Bit's n' Pieces and Brothers Sisters Cousins titles from Nasco when Ian Levine was playing them. The ones we got were the original coloured labels. I'm not sure how many we got but at least 600 to 800 of each. As they didn't sell out for a while I never re-ordered. The re-press copies probably were done when Wigan played it and Nasco knew the copies were destined for the UK so didn't bother with a more expensive colour label. Incidently it was possible to bulk order from the record labels quite a few early 70s indie records in 75-77 that Levine was playing as rarish records. Some I remember are Oscar Perrys on perri-tone, Danny Reed, Tradewinds, Carstairs and titles from Gooda-Mooga in Paris. Rick

Richard' Yes that's the one, thanks Rick

Richard, About the same time as ''My Mechanical Man'' was causing a faint ripple (73-75) there was another record on Magic City I remember as being quite good. I think it was credited to someone+ Chocker Campell and was the number after ''MMM'. It had one unique feature in that it was a Christmas record. The words were not too soulfull but I think the track was not bad I played it once or twice at Leeds Central around Xmas. Any idea what it is and could anyone put a scan up. Cheers Rick

Hi Richard The Duke Browner boots were on a darker red label, the lettering was smaller, the record thinner and the sound quality not too great. Global had quite a few original copies so why the boots were so bad I don't know. The Ed Crook was a yellow label which I don't remember having stars. Cheers Rick

I have only just read this posting so sorry for coming in a bit late. The Leah Dawson boots were done by Global Records in Manchester when I was working there in 73. The owner of Global Ed Balbier would for some strange reason boot titles that were never going to sell. He was possibly told by someone in the US that it was a big title in the UK. Most likely it would have been John LaMonte at House of Sounds near Philly as the quality of the pressings were really bad like the other stuff they did. Maybe Selecta-Disc didn't want them . When the Leah Dawson arrived all the likely shops would be phoned up to get orders. The price to them would be around 75 pence but within a month or two the price would drop as shops hadn't re-ordered. I remember the records as being very thin and loads of them being warped. Balbier never asked me what to boot and didn't say what was due in. He didn't trust anyone to advise him but then got screwed with these no hopers. Other Global boots were Ed Crook -That's Allright Lovettes - Little Miss Soul Duke Browner-Crying Over You (sold quite well but lots of faulty returns) Arctic Titles, but these were Jamie/Guyden re issues Rick Cooper

I suppose this is going to be the start of another media blitz around northern as these films are going to be promoted and journalists have to to do a write up. As in the past many mistakes and generalisations will distort the truth but we will have to learn to live with this. One of the constant facts that is always reported is that northern soul records were all failures. Paolo Hewitt picks on the Shrine ,Carnival and Topper labels as examples of labels that ''died on the vine''.Yet all these labels especially Carnival had many local hits and a few national chart records. This constant belittling of black american record labels of the 60's is so entrenched that it is accepted as gospel. Part of the fault for this is down to the usual experts who get interviewed write books and CD sleeve notes and want to appear as saviours for a bunch of '' failures''. Maybe it's time to give the music and artists more credit and stop calling them all failures when in reality from 63 to 68 Soul music was massive and hugely succesful. Rick.

About 15 US copies of Shane Martin turned up in a parcel of singles at Global records in the early 70s. I'd never heard it or played it so it went on the ''pop''listing sent out to dealers. Within a day Pep from Wolverhampton had ordered 10 copies. This rang alarm bells as Pep only ordered soul singles. I don't think Pep got any , well not at 22p. So Pep may have discovered it or someone in the W Midlands knew it. If Levine had played it first I probably would have known it , although Levine had records in his DJ box that he never played. UK issue collectors such as Dave Stubbs may have known of the CBS tracks before any DJs played them. Rick