Modernsoulsucks

I think I'd agree with Maria [no need to apologise Northern/Rare pretty interchangeable terms] and Ian. They say imitation is the sincerest form of flattery but it's still a mere copy. Maria pointed out that most if not all the 45s played started out over here in the clubs which I kinda figured they had but Im still open to correction if any of the jocks based elsewhere outside the UK would care to post their playlists to prove Maria and I wrong. That's not to say that jocks elsewhere are not as good as their UK counterparts or as enthusiastic and committed but Im wondering just how much of a two-way street it is. There's been plenty of commemts about the broad musical policy adopted elsewhere mixing soul and funk which again is a good thing because that establishes a seperate identity to that over here,but to pretend it is Northern Soul scene is rather disingenuous. Of course the scene here would be nothing without guys like Anderson etc but there were plenty of US guys into 60's soul whose influence and contribution are not recognised. However they never as far as I know claimed to be into Northern. When I was in the USA I met some of the guys into the Pittsburgh scene, went to loads of Beach clubs and a "Dusties" do in Chicago. If you want authenticity I'd go with those everytime over some transplanted Northern event. It's like going abroad and looking for the first place that does English cooking and serves pints. ROD

I emailed about Bonnie Brisker. No reply? ROD

I'll give you a tenor for 'em. ROD

Silk Falling in love...... NATION VG++-EX £25 SOLD Al Johnson Im back for more UK CBS £3 EX Vibrations Canadian Sunset OKEH DJ EX £3 Dynettes New guy CONSTELLATION £2.50 VG++ Lee & Leopards Come into my palace LAURIE DJ VG++ £8 SOLD Joy Fleming Are you ready for love UK DJ PRIVATE STOCK £5 nice modern Bob Wilson Suzy's Serenade SOUND STAGE 7 DJ Ex-M- £10 Misty Graham Soul Energy CRS DJ M- £5 Joanne&Triangles After the showers... VIP DJ £15 VG++_EX ABSOLUTE BOBBINS!!! SOLD Rozay Sam ISP M- £8 nice modern Detroit Isleys This old heart US TAMLA DJ EX £12 SOLD Dawn Baby's gone away ABC WDJ VG++ £15 Charades You better believe it HARLEM HITPARADE VG++ slt dishwarp and sound quality on all copies leaves a lot to be desired £25 SOLD Please PM if interested. I will take Paypal if you agree to pay the 4% fees. All 45s are in really good nick and guaranteed. P&P £1.50 for 1st recorded. Thanks ROD

I think he's been watching "The Wire". My apologies for mis-spelling "dawg" in earlier post. ROD

I like that "rockin' some heavy plates" Sutty. Is that anything like those balancing acts on Sunday Night at the London Pallidium. Whatever happened to variety,dog? Some of the dj's nowadays I wouldn't trust to wash plates!! ROD

I think the gentleman is saying that although he is willing to share information with those less knowledgable than himself he will only go so far. He is particularly exasperated at certain people who are forever trying to see what he's playing instead of relying on their own judgement. Im surprised you jiveass motherf**kers on here wasn't feelin' it, nahmean? ROD

Hey Boba I don't quite get the logic of that last post. Quantity on titles frequently turn up if you do a little digging or are lucky. The Danny Moore musta sold a few on release and others were stuck in a basement somewhere. Im not sure how many Dave and I ended up with. We had I'd estimate about 150 within a month. Im sure the pressing run went to more than that so lots of unaccounted for copies. Danny Moore was pretty rare over here and let me say that Dave told me that we were NOT the first to get to this guy. A USA "Northern" dealer had bought a few copies and sold them for big bucks. Now it may be that the guy with the 45s only had a couple when the other dealer got to him and may be that the dealer didn't think to ask if he had more elsewhere. But whatever, a few guys over here then paid a lot of money for this 45 but the source was the same. As Steve G said if you locate someone involved there's a good chance of turning up copies. I stumbled upon the Winfield Parker on P&L too. Winfield had left 5 copies in a shop in Baltimore [Roadhouse Oldies I think] and his phone number with the owner in case he sold them. It was at the time a rare modern soul 45 but Winfield had hundreds. In reply to Bearsy's question I think a lot of these 45s we pay hundreds for were around in large quantities but they disappear into collections and price does rise again. If you ask John Manship Im sure he had hundreds of Frank Dells he got from a guy in Charlotte [according to what the guy told us]. Dave Withers must have had about 150 Betty Lloyds at one time. I picked up 70 copies of that Freddie Empire and sold at £10 at the end to get rid but that's probably back up there again. I think Boba you can't really expect some of these 45s to be in the "shops" now but Im sure they were back in the 70's before guys like Anderson and Koppell started hoovering them up. I suppose "rare" doesn't actually mean in most cases only a handful pressed but difficult to locate. ROD

I have posted this before but short answer is Dave Withers and I. Got writer's name from scan of label. Massingale is an odd surname so checked Detroit phone book. Got guy's cousin or brother, forget exact relationship now. He had quite a few at first and got more in a week or so. ROD

Yes now you mention it. It's the little riff when Holman 45 starts. I guess there's only so many combination of notes you can use writing a tune and maybe it's just coincidence that your example and mine have a riff in common but can't help thinking that Northern 45s are extremely catchy and whose to say these writers/composers didn't get to hear things on the radio that stuck in their heads. Im not saying they copied but it was just there. Im certain I've got the odd 45 where you can hear bits of old standards such as Mary Wells "Dear Lover" ,the mid instr break is deffo something I recognise and Im sure another uses "Theme from a Summer Place" as the mid break. Can't remember which one though. Simon will recall "Summer Place" . He's probably still got the 70's disco version they used to play at the Mecca. It coulda been a re-working by Percy Faith. I quite liked it!! ROD

Obviously Mark my wedding tackle is secure as it would be hard to misplace such a large array. Im very very pleased with my haircut which is why I've agreed to babysit the Antichrist this Friday whilst you and Jackie have a night out. I think social workers term this small break "Respite". He does look a little cherub but then so did Charles Manson at his age. Make sure he's heavily sedated and all straps are secure please. Simon, Im sure the Saint had a productive time in France as his French is limited to "Voulez-vous couche avec moir ce soire" which he picked up from having the Nanette Workman modern soul version of Labelle 45. Im sure even he can understand "Non, Im washing my book tonight cos my cat died [in French of course!!]. It must be difficult for him. "Shall we have sex tonight,darling" and he whips out his Grapevine re-issue. Back on topic. Have either of you noticed the similarity in the two tracks I mentioned or have neither of you got any good 45s. ROD

Right I got the Remarkables today and have compared with Barbara English and whilst not quite as similar as I remember the catchy instr. intro at beginning of English 45 does seem to also be almost identical to parts of the Remarkables. Different writers,producers etc. Fishing was awful. Nothing bigger than a couple of ounces and I lost my wedding ring. My wife says that this does not mean we are now divorced so every cloud doesn't have a silver lining. Simon, I noticed Soulful Saint on "Mastermind" thread. Where was he when I needed a virgin. ROD

No Steve, it's "The love I saw..." credited to Smokey and Miracles in USA too. I have it in front of me. "I second that..." was released after "The love I saw.." and then "More love" in both countries. He was awful wasn't he. I'd have done better answering questions on modern soul but of course I would have "passed" on all of them just as a matter of principle. ROD

Im in a good mood cos I plan on going fishing tomorrow. Only fly in the ointment is that the wife says she may come. She usually just ridicules my efforts. I've explained to her that most fisherman have had the hook in the back of their shirt or their line wrapped around a tree. OK, at the exact same time does take some doing. And how was I to know that my Ralph Lauren glasses would end up in the lake and cost me £210 to replace. A mistake anybody could make. Frankly comments such as "That's not very big" and "It's only a tiddler" I can do without as I get enough of that in the bedroom. ROD

what about that LP Northern Soul 2007 Simon if you play it backwards besides the usual Black Mass incantations, you can clearly hear Levine say that at least he found a use for those tracks Take That turned down. I've just checked again and it is there, but unfortunately I've also raised Beelzebub who is demanding an offering. Cuppa tea and a hobnob will hopefully suffice. What about Barbara English "Sitting in the corner" and Remarkables "Easily misled". Got the latter arriving soon and will put on my anal retentive collector hat and see if there's any connection between the two. Im off. He wants a virgin. fat chance in Clitheroe!! ROD

"Simon like i told you on Saturday, modern soul is created by one bloke sitting at a computer and just adding different sounds as he goes along" So Bearsy has stumbled upon the awful truth. I did in fact track the guy down back in 1993. His name is Cyrus D. Smallpecker and he's a fat balding used car salesman from Ohio with as he said a finger on the pulse of what fat balding used car salesmen in the UK want to hear. As you'd expect he lived with his mother,had never had a girlfriend and had serious hygeine problems. His mother had tried to strangle him at birth but he'd hastily knocked up a tune and lulled her to sleep so he could make good his escape. When I met him he was in the final stages of quality control on his latest opus. This entailed borrowing his mother's handbag and if he was moved to dance around it, then he knew he had a winner. As I whipped out my AK-47, just one of two fearsome weapons I have upon my person, he managed to get to the decks and put a needle to the groove. When I woke up he was gone. In his haste he'd left his Frankenstein productions lying around. I of course set fire to them which explains the rarity of some modern 45s. ROD

I think Bob Mays had loads of these 3 titles at one time. He used to have a typed list in his place of stock on GW ,Wingate and Ric-Tic and he had or did have hundreds. In 79 most of those three had long gone. Think Martin Koppell got most. He did still have loads of Sunliners which is about £75 now. I bought 25 but had trouble selling so no doubt they ended up cheap in collections. Doesn't mean they were bootlegs. I have the regular issue of Tamiko Jones and it does have T1 scratched in and ZTSC matrix scratched in too. ROD

Can't see owt wrong with that. Bunch of bloody Philistines anyway American dealers. No attachment to the music other than dollar signs and now they're all long-time fans and experts. Pity there wasn't a jawbone of an ass lying around,Phil. ROD

Andy I didn't mean to criticise the running of Middleton at all but was trying to make the point that like the originator of this thread it can be just a small thing that can turn someone off a night. I guess in my case disappointment with Sam's spot. And Im sorry I can't be paying £12 admission for the wife. She'll expect it every year. ROD

So £275 it is then Mark. ROD

I've never even heard of Leon Bryant nor the De-Lite label!! Actually I don't remember going to the Clifton Hall. Is that Rotherham? Are you sure it was me? Happy is not an adjective used to describe me by that many people I know. ROD

Wish someone had offered me that option when I went to Middleton back last September and heard Sam's spot. Never been back since. For £24 for the two of us I wanna hear something a bit better than "house/garage" or whatever it's called plus mainly oldies that I used to pay a couple of quid to hear. Realise Im in a minority of one here so I hope the promoter doesn't take this criticism too seriously but it does illustrate that there's always some awkward bugger somewhere that you can't please ROD

Im just wondering if this thread is not an oversimplification to explain falling attendances. I would have thought there's many individual reasons why numbers maybe dropping although last time I went out, Burnley allnighter didn't seem to have that particular problem. I guess that would bear out what Mr.Dyson is saying that there will always be an audience for "upfront" sets, although I tend to see those nights as really just the continuation of what Northern was once all about. Choice is not a bad thing and I've no idea if there are more nights on now than ever before. Seemed to be an awful lot back when Black Echoes used to publish what was on. I suppose I am one of those who have stopped going now but it's nothing to do with too many venues. The music was always more appealing than the scene. Nowadays for two of us you're talking at least £50 at an allnighter with admission,petrol,drinks and I'd rather spend that money on 45s. I used to enjoy looking through the sales boxes but can't remember last time I actually bought anything when it's usually so much cheaper on Ebay. ROD

Isn't that London 70's issue completely different... and crap!! ROD

Classic motown record Very well-known Motown 45 I grant you but Classic I think not. 1969 and listening to Velvettes,Earl Van Dyke, Elgins,Contours,,Edwin Starr,Shorty Long,Kim Weston, etc at local soul do at the Moon in Duckinfield, never heard that. Local pub same time it was on the jukebox. Can't remember ever hearing it at the Torch, Mecca, Wigan or Stafford. I guess cos it wasn't considered to have the right ingredients, and I wasn't the only person with that opinion obviously, hence it's lack of exposure up till now. Had Mick been drinking? ROD