Robbk

Thanks, Rod. I've seen a lot of those Steiner-owned Detroit Sound records, but never one by The Detroit Vibrations. We had an old thread on the Old Soulful Detroit Forum on this very subject. Ron Murphy and a couple other detroiters who had been around in the '60s assured us that those two record companies were completely separate, with no connection. I believe that The Sequins' was the only release on Taylor's Detroit Sound.

From our discussion on Soulful Detroit, including Ron Murphy and other Detroiters who were around at the time, we concluded that The Jack Taylor-owned "Detroit Sound" was earlier, and had no relation to the Steiner-owned company with the similar name.

That doesn't sound at all like a Detroit recording to me. Furthermore, I've never heard of a group called "The Detroit Vibrations". That group name sounds suspiciously like a cover-up phoney group name for a recently-found master tape of a vinyl-unreleased song. I'll be curious to find out the source of this recording.

This one looks like a boot, as its black ink has weaknesses that appear on photocopies. I, myself, bought legitimate copies of both the white DJ and the store stocker back when that record was out, and have seen the store stocker on both vinyl and styrene, but the white DJ was only on vinyl, as far as I know.

A BMI search by me revealed that Bob Hamilton was, indeed the original writer, rather than Al Hamilton (who first sang it on a released record), and, it seems that Detroiter, Tom King was added later. It could be that King originally helped Hamilton with the writing and was angered by his being left off the credits and was added later, or that Bob Hamilton needed money later, and sold half his writer interest in that song to King for cash. Tom King was a well-known Detroit R&B/Soul songwriter from the late '50s into the early '70s. Like almost all other prolific musicians, songwriters, arrangers and producers working out of Detroit during that period, he also worked at Motown for awhile, as did both Bob and Al Hamilton. Not sure if Eugene Hamilton (Ronnie Savoy ever worked for Motown. I've never seen any evidence that he did. The latter may have been working exclusively in New York during Motown's heyday, other than the year or so he worked with Wingate's labels. I wonder if Tom King was any relation to Maurice King, who was a well-respected piano player, band leader and arranger in Detroit throughout the 1950s, and who was instrumental in developing Motown into the dominant independent Soul music label in the '60s, as piano player and director of Motown's artist development school.

That's very true. But, in this case, the two writers in question were 2 brothers, who worked together and always had a good relationship (never had a falling out). So, it was an error by a printer or record label personnel.

I don't remember Eddie Holland doing much arranging at Motown. The main arrangers in 1964, when Holland was convinced to stop his singing career, were: Johnny Allen, Joe Hunter, Hank Cosby and a few others. Eddie was mainly a songwriter and producer.

Actually, Kent's version was released in 1959. and Wilson's in 1960. I've seen this song listed as being written by Al Hamilton on some records, and by Bob Hamilton on others. On some of Jackie Wilson's issues, the name reads "Bob Hamilton" and on others, it reads just "Hamilton". In several biographies of Al Kent, he. himself is stated to be the songwriter.

That explains my not seeing it. I've spent almost no time looking for records after 1972. And I was really only looking for records made before 1970.

Here's Al singing "Am I The Man", Jackie Wilson's hit, written by Al's brother, Bob:

That rings a bell with me. I'm pretty sure I've heard another version. I'm pretty sure it was another female artist, and was released 1-2 years later than Mercer's. But, I can't remember who it was or which label (at this time). I'll keep it in the back of my mind, and do some research, and get back with the answer, IF I can.

Never seen it. And I combed the record shops and thrift and junk stores in South Los Angeles from 1965-72, when I worked down there. It must have been pretty rare. It certainly would have caught my eye, as I had liked absolutely EVERY Renfro 45 I had found (most of them) very much. And I had looked through all of Dolphin's of Hollywood, Flash Records, Crane's Records, Sam's Records, Pat's Records, Downey Records, Herman Griffith's Records, and House of Records back rooms' entire stocks before theyclosed down.

Al Kent sang Berry Gordy's "That's Why I Love You So" on Checker Records, as well as having a couple releases on small Detroit labels, and recorded for a few New York labels, as well.

Bob Hamilton was AKA "Rob Reeco", "Ronnie Savoy" was really Eugene Ronald Hamilton.

Al Kent was a producer AND a singer. He was credited on instrumental records because there was no singer, and he was, in essence, the "orchestra" leader. But, they couldn't call the ad-hoc assemblage of studio session instrument players Al Kent's Orchestra, so they simply credited him as the artist. I'm pretty sure that he, himself sang on "The Way You've Been Acting Lately". He sang in a couple groups as a youngster, and had some solo singing releases recorded in Detroit, and some in New York, before working for Ed Wingate's labels.

That's one of my all-time favourite songs, but by Otis Leavill. I've never heard of a Billy Butler version. Was it unreleased on vinyl, and taken from a vaulted master tape?

Whatever any of you call "the first Soul record" would be the first Soul record I bought.

I was around when the Gloreco record was released. I used to drive to Detroit 2 Saturdays a month, to look for records. I saw the Gloreco record several times. In all my years of flipping through millions of 45s from 1963 to 1972 (Gloreco was 1963), I NEVER saw the PG record. The type font implies that the PG record was pressed in the late '70s. So, I suspect that it is a boot, or a late '70s repressing by the owner of the master. The mis-spelling makes me lean towards it being a boot.

The singer truly DOES sound like Doris Day!

The title of the thread says "Detroit female Soul 45". It was SalvoSoul's title -not your comment to which my comment on Detroit was responding. Upon listening again, the You-Tube recording DOES sound like The Sweet Thing's 45 version. I don't know what drugs I was on when I made the first comment. That is one of my favourite songs, and I have had several copies of it played over 1,000 times. I don't know how I could think it sounds wrong one time. such a thing has never happened to me before. I guess sinility is now setting in, and I am starting to have hallucinations.

No! That's NOT The Sweet Things' 45 version. I don't even think it's a different take by them. I think it's a different group. And it's NOT Detroit. It's a Van McCoy song. and sounds like a New York recording (it's not so tight like most Van McCoy productions, so, maybe it's just another East Coast producer using a Van McCoy song.

Thanks for that information. It would have been ice to have known all this 50 years ago. But, as Mickey McCullers once sang, better late than never.

No one ever accused record companies of always meeting all the terms of their contracts and oral agreements with their artists.

Thanks for pointing that out.

They have Soul music used on commercials -just not RARE Soul (that never made it to the radio during its initial sales run. They only use songs that were monster hits. "Stand by Me" was a mega hit. They've never used unreleased cuts and songs like "Just Say You're Wanted and Needed" by Gwen Owens, and songs off acetates that were never released like The Cashmeres on HEM. They mean nothing to the average American. But then, I never thought that Northern Soul would be recognised by mainstream Britain.