I don't know how this record is so rare that nobody knew about it until Sebastian sold it on ebay but I just got a copy (sold by the family) and it definitely is an old press (and it had some light vinyl wear that could only have been from an old record), I have no doubt it's from the 1977 that the phono copyright on the label indicates. They must have circulated it even less than the original.

I know people were talking about how they dislike the "gold" side but the "down and out" is the good side IMO. I haven't done side-by-side comparison yet, but I think this record is identical to the gold label record they just pressed with "gold of my life (reprise)" and "down and out" on the flip.

This raises the other question -- was the blue label 45 that that has that "am I imposing" side originally pressed back in the day on a not-yet-discovered 45? it would be crazy to see that.

yes i think its the same as the gold copy bob.which is certainly new. the cole 45 may been pressed back in the day but where the cole family are concerned it gonna be an uphill climb for them to gain credibility back as we know they still press their 45`s up. i for one will always be suspicious before parting with any money

I don't know how this record is so rare that nobody knew about it until Sebastian sold it on ebay but I just got a copy (sold by the family) and it definitely is an old press (and it had some light vinyl wear that could only have been from an old record), I have no doubt it's from the 1977 that the phono copyright on the label indicates. They must have circulated it even less than the original.

I know people were talking about how they dislike the "gold" side but the "down and out" is the good side IMO. I haven't done side-by-side comparison yet, but I think this record is identical to the gold label record they just pressed with "gold of my life (reprise)" and "down and out" on the flip.

This raises the other question -- was the blue label 45 that that has that "am I imposing" side originally pressed back in the day on a not-yet-discovered 45? it would be crazy to see that.

Bob, 'I am Imposing' never came out back in the day like 'Gold' did. It was something that Cole recorded with the band but never put out. The first release of it about 6 years or so ago was on the blue label but it was a cronically bad mastered record, terrible muffled sound quality. I recieved a copy from I think Elijah's son and I told him what I thought of it. They then re mastered the studio tapes and got someone who knew what they were doing to produce the fantastic sounding version that we have now. I threw my 'original' away as it was so shit. Elijah's son seemed a really nice guy, he sent me a letter appreciating my comments and then sent me a couple of copies of the newly mastered version when it was done.

Jordi

Nice one Jordi, didn't realise it was you who made them redo it!

I love 'Am I Imposing' what a top tune and i think one still to have it's day once people get over the fact there are no originals and they are allowed to play it out on the $10 45 (which I certainly do!) LOL

Edited June 19, 201213 yr by Steve Plumb

Nice one Jordi, didn't realise it was you who made them redo it!

I love 'Am I Imposing' what a top tune and i think one still to have it's day once people get over the fact there are no originals and they are allowed to play it out on the $10 45 (which I certainly do!) LOL

Steve, I wouldn't like to take credit for that, I think the first edition was a 'test the water' release. I got a copy of it sent to me when I bought a copy of 'Gold' from him off Ebay. He asked me for my thoughts on the track, so I told him what a great record 'Imposing' was but how terrible the production on the 45 was. I was gobsmacked when I got a letter from him a couple of months later thanking me for my comments, with a few copies of the 'all new, crystal clear sounding' new version.

PS we'll see you at about 7.30pm tomorrow...get the kettle on!

Jordi

Bob, 'I am Imposing' never came out back in the day like 'Gold' did. It was something that Cole recorded with the band but never put out. The first release of it about 6 years or so ago was on the blue label but it was a cronically bad mastered record, terrible muffled sound quality. I recieved a copy from I think Elijah's son and I told him what I thought of it. They then re mastered the studio tapes and got someone who knew what they were doing to produce the fantastic sounding version that we have now. I threw my 'original' away as it was so shit. Elijah's son seemed a really nice guy, he sent me a letter appreciating my comments and then sent me a couple of copies of the newly mastered version when it was done.

Jordi

Yes that's what I thought, but I was just saying that I also thought the gold label record they just pressed up never came out and now I have a 45 that is no doubt from 1977 as stated and that is identical to both sides. Andy nobody knew about it until recently. And back in the day they pressed so many things that who knows if the "am i imposing" was pressed but not distributed. However, you story about the remastering does add evidence that it was not pressed back in the day. My cole 45 and the brown reissue sound identical though.

also, on the "gold of my life" side, all they did was add one person playing out of tune violin over the track which is sort of funny.

also, on the "gold of my life" side, all they did was add one person playing out of tune violin over the track which is sort of funny.

what were they thinking about bob coz it makes a good record into a not so good record

what were they thinking about bob coz it makes a good record into a not so good record

I think it's just because they needed something for the b-side and wanted to make it different than the first single somehow. it is the b-side. I just think it's funny that it has "strings" added when it's one person playing along on a violin.

Sorry for posting up a live ebay auction, but as it is highly listed I guess anybody that might be interested will see it anyway!

So, there is a copy (from the family) of the violin version on Cole at ebay right now. From the text, I cannot understand if it is an original pressed in 1977 OR an original pressed in 2012? Any thoughts?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/COLE-DOWN-AND-OUT-GOLD-OF-MY-LIFE-REPRISE-45-RPM-NORTHERN-SOUL-SUPER-RARE-/110901628968?pt=Music_on_Vinyl&hash=item19d2409028#ht_500wt_1219

/Johan

Sorry for posting up a live ebay auction, but as it is highly listed I guess anybody that might be interested will see it anyway!

So, there is a copy (from the family) of the violin version on Cole at ebay right now. From the text, I cannot understand if it is an original pressed in 1977 OR an original pressed in 2012? Any thoughts?

https://www.ebay.com/...8#ht_500wt_1219

/Johan

I saw that listing and the text is very confusing. It says one thing then another.

About the third in the last month on ebay isn't it ?......to quote the ebay listing ' SUPER RARE '...

It is not a new press. I got one and it's definitely a used record and an older record, it had some scuffs and surface scratches, etc.The vinyl is not the type of vinyl they are using for their newer presses. I'm guessing they pressed it and never distributed it at all, who knows how many they kept. I don't think they would have done the brown label repress that they just did if they had quantity on the original though.

ive never seen the Cole record here in the Bay Area except for the ones online. ive never heard of the record existing either outside of these auctions (which isnt that surprising being the amount of Bay Area records that i do not know about).

i just dont like the way the label looks. all the other records that i can think about that he released didnt have the type match or that much info on the labels. everything he released before this record (which seems to have a two year gap between 75 and when this record came out in 77) has a different appearance to me.

though i have not seen the vinyl, i have not looked at the deadwax, i have not looked at the paper used on the record.

anyway... ill leave it up to yall that own a copy and have held a copy to say if its real or not.

lastly, when i talked to him 12+ years ago i read off all the records that i thought he had been a part of and he never mentioned having a second Mixed Emotions record released on vinyl. he told me of records i didnt know about so him leaving this record off that list makes me suspicious.

ive never seen the Cole record here in the Bay Area except for the ones online. ive never heard of the record existing either outside of these auctions (which isnt that surprising being the amount of Bay Area records that i do not know about).

i just dont like the way the label looks. all the other records that i can think about that he released didnt have the type match or that much info on the labels. everything he released before this record (which seems to have a two year gap between 75 and when this record came out in 77) has a different appearance to me.

though i have not seen the vinyl, i have not looked at the deadwax, i have not looked at the paper used on the record.

anyway... ill leave it up to yall that own a copy and have held a copy to say if its real or not.

lastly, when i talked to him 12+ years ago i read off all the records that i thought he had been a part of and he never mentioned having a second Mixed Emotions record released on vinyl. he told me of records i didnt know about so him leaving this record off that list makes me suspicious.

I'll ship my copy to you to validate if you'd return it. No way is this a new pressing, and I don't think he could have faked the wear on this. I agree the pic makes it look suspicious (I was suspicious when Sami auctioned it) but it's definitely real if you see and hold it in real life.

Looking at the label and reading from it Sicmu music publishing Sicmu is just an anagram of music and 5709 sierras ave is a house not a unit or studio or office lastvsold in 1970, I just feel it is a new edit also his rant about it being the original first issue never released before just doesn't sound right, I may be wrong but I would,nt pay that sort of money for a copy.

Mark

Looking at the label and reading from it Sicmu music publishing Sicmu is just an anagram of music and 5709 sierras ave is a house not a unit or studio or office lastvsold in 1970, I just feel it is a new edit also his rant about it being the original first issue never released before just doesn't sound right, I may be wrong but I would,nt pay that sort of money for a copy.

Mark

I don't understand at all what point you are making about the publishing or the address. Additionally, this is a real publisher listed in a 1980 music guide:

Sicmo Music

5709 Sierra Ave

Richmond, CA 94805

Are you suggesting that he planned sometime before 1980 that in 2012 he would be issuing a record that needed an old publisher for credibility so he set up that company? Maybe he travelled back in time? The vinyl has exactly the qualities of an older pressing. It is totally different than the brown label record which *is* a new pressing of the cole 45 (both sides identical). If you saw the wear on the record (it's not heavy), it's not something that you could easily fake. So in addition to setting up the fake publishing company 22 years ago he also found a totally different pressing plant than he's using to press other records so that the vinyl will look like old vinyl (rather than the new moulded look on his new presses). And he figured out a way to simulate some light shop / sleeve / out of sleeve wear? And on top of that he repressed the record on a brown label with modern moulded vinyl? Why did he do that, was it part of his complicated plan to make it look like the older press which was really new was totally different?

Don't get all high and might Bob they are just my observations if you believe it to be an original that has never surfaced before then that is fine, I just looked at the label and to me it just doesn't look right and I would'nt pay that sort of money for it if it was the same price as am I imposing then I may buy it, might be me but I can only go of prior tales of the cole family.

Question - Given the history and controversy of this record - Why didnt any of these surface at the same time at the Rock-way Copies as it would have been a good time to surface them if they were original 70s presses- Just a question that needs an answer!

Don't get all high and might Bob they are just my observations if you believe it to be an original that has never surfaced before then that is fine, I just looked at the label and to me it just doesn't look right and I would'nt pay that sort of money for it if it was the same price as am I imposing then I may buy it, might be me but I can only go of prior tales of the cole family.

First of all I apologize for being a total asshole, that was not appropriate.

I really don't think your observations are appropriate either (except the one that the cole family have lied and done shady things before, which has been proven true several times over) in that they are total speculation and are in total contradiction with more precise facts (and finding that the publishing matched a real publishing company in 1980 proves the opposite point). When people make up facts based on extremely loose speculation, and then post on the internet ("publish" them), it leads to confusion or misinformation that circulates quickly. For example, when people say one singer with the same first name from the same city is the same person as another person with the same first name only because of a vague similarity and no more evidence. I overreacted because it's a pet peeve of mine.

Either way, it was totally inappropriate for me to be a dick to you in response. Again I'm sorry.

p.s. If you had this record in your hands I think you would have no doubt as to its authenticity. If you want I'll send it to you to look at and post what you think here if you are willing to send it back.

Question - Given the history and controversy of this record - Why didnt any of these surface at the same time at the Rock-way Copies as it would have been a good time to surface them if they were original 70s presses- Just a question that needs an answer!

They could have done a very small run, it could have been a test press. They could have thrown out most of the stock and only had a few stray file copies. This is actually the most likely explanation, as if you encounter producers this is what happened 95% of the time -- they don't see some future value in boxes and boxes of old records that are just taking up space.

They are also very irrational. If not one of the above, who knows what their reasoning was? Either way, they just repressed the exact same record on a brown label and it looks like their other represses. It makes less sense to do that if they managed to do a run that looked like earlier presses and have quantity of it.

Also, Gold of my Life is the b-side of this record, the a-side is "down and out", they might not even have considered it as the same record.

First of all I apologize for being a total asshole, that was not appropriate.

I really don't think your observations are appropriate either (except the one that the cole family have lied and done shady things before, which has been proven true several times over) in that they are total speculation and are in total contradiction with more precise facts (and finding that the publishing matched a real publishing company in 1980 proves the opposite point). When people make up facts based on extremely loose speculation, and then post on the internet ("publish" them), it leads to confusion or misinformation that circulates quickly. For example, when people say one singer with the same first name from the same city is the same person as another person with the same first name only because of a vague similarity and no more evidence. I overreacted because it's a pet peeve of mine.

Either way, it was totally inappropriate for me to be a dick to you in response. Again I'm sorry.

p.s. If you had this record in your hands I think you would have no doubt as to its authenticity. If you want I'll send it to you to look at and post what you think here if you are willing to send it back.

Hi bob thanks for apology none needed really my observations were based on the fact that they have been economical with the truth and also that there have been lots of counterfeits done over the years that have fooled a lot of people, I have one that I keep because I like it it was a new tune made to look old, and it did. You don't need to send me the record as long as you feel it is a real release then that is ok . Mark

Hi bob thanks for apology none needed really my observations were based on the fact that they have been economical with the truth and also that there have been lots of counterfeits done over the years that have fooled a lot of people, I have one that I keep because I like it it was a new tune made to look old, and it did. You don't need to send me the record as long as you feel it is a real release then that is ok . Mark

I don't disagree with the fact that they have not been honest in the past so it's hard to trust information that comes from them. Sorry again for being a jerk.

Didn't we discuss all this a few years ago?

I thought we'd bottomed out what was and what wasn't issued back in the day.

Didn't we discuss all this a few years ago?

I thought we'd bottomed out what was and what wasn't issued back in the day.

I never heard of the 1977 Cole press until Sami had it in auction. Do you have it Steve? Do you have a link to the thread where people talk about it? Thanks.

This will be the most recent other discussion regarding Cole....

Bob the one I have is jeanie and the valmonts change - my destiny - maximum have a look on john Manship site

Mark

This will be the most recent other discussion regarding Cole....

yeah, but this is the same discussion as this thread. I posted this thread as a follow up confirming info from the previous thread that the Cole label 45s are real. Steve said it was all discussed before, did people know about the existence of this Cole label 45 before? I assume it's even rarer than the orginal mixed emotions 45s because it was pressed, never distributed, and thrown away.