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Eugene Smiley Bootleg Alert

Posted

Firstly, apologies if this has been mentioned before,I did have a quick look but couldn't see any mention of it and I certainly wasn't aware of it before now.

It has recently come to my attention that Eugene Smiley & The Essence Of Love "Yes Its You" / "We're Lovers Day And Night" [K-City] has been re-pressed/ Re-issued/Bootlegged probably sometime in the last couple of years. I recently came across a copy and could see that it didn't look like any of the ones i'd seen before. Similar but not quite. Im not great with uploading stuff on here but bear with me and hopefully we'll get there in the end.

Below is a photo of the record in question:

post-4315-0-67877000-1414651040_thumb.jp

post-4315-0-69545800-1414651097_thumb.jp

Now, on the face of it, if you haven't seen the original copy it looks ok.

However,a quick google search for the title throws up some images of different variations of the label. Now, I know it came out earlier as just by "The Essence Of Love" and, as far as I can tell, these are all proper.

I'll try and upload the different original one so you can see clearly,the differences..

The Font used is completely different, the IRDA stamp is in a different place and the quality and whiteness of the paper just does not look the same at all. Its been done on a computer.

It was mentioned a while back on here that the Label owner [K-City] was selling copies of this for $500 through his website… It seems from the google pictures that is where the dodgy ones are coming from.

Below is a photo of the run out groove details

post-4315-0-40021300-1414651142_thumb.jp

I'll see if i can get a picture of the proper original up next,though bear with me,I'm not too good with this sort of thing

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Posted

Hi  Ivor

 

Think their was a thread on here a couple of years ago about a web site selling copies(prob repress) stateside.

 

Regards Huggy

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Posted

There was a copy on a list on here over the weekend that was snapped up in minutes at £95. I thought it was well

cheap and what a lucky chap the person who got it was, perhaps not so lucky now?

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Posted

Looks like the typeface/text could well have been done on a computer Ivor?

 

There are quite a few little anomalies when you compare it to the orig but most of all 'it just don't look right'?

 

Also, the matrix in the orig run out is 'IRDA 481B' and 'ZSSB 149083 - 1A'

 

Hope no one has shelled out big bucks for these copies?

 

Hope this helps?

 

Cheers

Steve

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Posted

Looks like the typeface/text could well have been done on a computer Ivor?

 

There are quite a few little anomalies when you compare it to the orig but most of all 'it just don't look right'?

 

Also, the matrix in the orig run out is 'IRDA 481B' and 'ZSSB 149083 - 1A'

 

Hope no one has shelled out big bucks for these copies?

 

Hope this helps?

 

Cheers

Steve

Absolutely Steve…..

Thanks for adding the original matrix details….

If you notice the photo Ive put up of the repress, the matrix details end in RE-1….

RE-1= Re-press ?

They're definitely not proper Steve….

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Posted

Looks like the typeface/text could well have been done on a computer Ivor?

There are quite a few little anomalies when you compare it to the orig but most of all 'it just don't look right'?

Also, the matrix in the orig run out is 'IRDA 481B' and 'ZSSB 149083 - 1A'

Hope no one has shelled out big bucks for these copies?

Hope this helps?

Cheers

Steve

Thing is Steve, someone is bound to have paid out a lot of money for these.....

If you look at the image of this on Google , it's linked straight to the website of K-city records.

It says they are $500 and the buyer will receive a photo of Eugene Smiley......

If you never saw a proper one, you wouldn't really know in all probability.

Eugene Smiley ?

He's Smiley all the way to the bank obviously !

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Posted (edited)

Steady on a minute here Guys

This may be a perfectly legal re-issue rather than a bootleg, if Eugene owns the masters etc (which I believe he does) he's well within his rights to re-issue his own material. What has probably happened here is that some numpty has contacted him on facebook etc and told him how wonderful he is and his record is a massive tune on the pissy arsed northern/modern scene and is worth loads of money. He then due to his total lack of knowledge and understanding of the size and nature of these scenes thinks he's got a top 10 hit in Europe. Also due to his lack of understanding about the value of a original release and a re-issue he also thinks that if he re-issues it he's gonna make the same money as a copy he's seen go though E-bay.

An all too familiar story i'm afraid.

Dave

Edited by Louise
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Posted

all been done before...us soul singer thinks he`s had a hit in europe..zz and co, foxy bloody lila, gold of my bloody life...the think them europeans ill buy em..oh look its only in the book at 200 sovs...easy money..keep on pressing em.... they no understandi ze eengleesh  :rofl:

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Posted

Steady on a minute here Guys

This may be a perfectly legal re-issue rather than a bootleg, if Eugene owns the masters etc (which I believe he does) he's well within his rights to re-issue his own material. What has probably happened here is that some numpty has contacted him on facebook etc and told him how wonderful he is and his record is a massive tune on the pissy arsed northern/modern scene and is worth loads of money. He then due to his total lack of knowledge and understanding of the size and nature of these scenes thinks he's got a top 10 hit in Europe. Also due to his lack of understanding about the value of a original release and a re-issue he also thinks that if he re-issues it he's gonna make the same money as a copy he's seen go though E-bay.

An all too familiar story i'm afraid.

Dave

Doubt very much that the artist and/or label owner thinks that by repressing this they will make a fortune, more likely that whoever has got hold of some of these and is selling them on Ebay (without divulging the info regarding the re-issue) is hoping to rake in some quick cash from innocent unsuspecting soulsters !!

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Posted

Doubt very much that the artist and/or label owner thinks that by repressing this they will make a fortune, more likely that whoever has got hold of some of these and is selling them on Ebay (without divulging the info regarding the re-issue) is hoping to rake in some quick cash from innocent unsuspecting soulsters !!

 

No. It is the artist that is selling these reissues on his website priced at $500 each.

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Posted

No. It is the artist that is selling these reissues on his website priced at $500 each.

Well blow me over ,  I'm sure his intentions are completely innocent and without any hidden agenda to make himself a few pounds from the unwary /ignorant record buyers in the UK

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Posted

Steady on a minute here Guys

This may be a perfectly legal re-issue rather than a bootleg, if Eugene owns the masters etc (which I believe he does) he's well within his rights to re-issue his own material. What has probably happened here is that some numpty has contacted him on facebook etc and told him how wonderful he is and his record is a massive tune on the pissy arsed northern/modern scene and is worth loads of money. He then due to his total lack of knowledge and understanding of the size and nature of these scenes thinks he's got a top 10 hit in Europe. Also due to his lack of understanding about the value of a original release and a re-issue he also thinks that if he re-issues it he's gonna make the same money as a copy he's seen go though E-bay.

An all too familiar story i'm afraid.

Dave

Hello Dave,

Thanks for your comments. If you read my initial post,you'll see that I wasn't sure if it was legal or not. It seems logical to me that since these are being sold through the K-City website, then they are done with the blessing of the Artist and/or label owner.

What doesn't seem to me to be in dispute is that they are trying to punt them out at $500 a pop to unsuspecting collectors as bonafide originals[which they are clearly not].

Whilst I can always sympathise with artists who,after years of never making any money from their music, realise that some of their old records, which they don't have anymore, are changing hands for enormous[to them] sums of money. My sympathy runs out though when those same artists cynically try to screw over the only people that are interested in their music.

Sorry Dave, but it is what it is whether you choose to recognise it or not. Theres been too much of this sort of thing going on in recent years[i.e. Elijah Cole with the Mixed Emotions represses, the wretch who runs Shiptown records with the Barbara Stant represses…..]

It simply doesn't wash with me that its all done in an innocent fashion. Its a blatant attempt to rip people off.

Yours sincerely,

Ivor Jones

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Posted

http://kcityrecords.com/yes_its_you/

 

Yep $500

 

Some folks saying he can do what he likes - i.e. repress a lookalike and sell at Original price. I guess he can, slightly immoral in my view - but no one is forcing anyone to buy them

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Posted

Yes.... Of course they can do what they like if they own the rights to them. That's not the point of this thread though is it ? It's that I'm trying to stop people getting duped into buying represses that are being passed off as the proper thing. In my view that's well out of order.

Also, this thing about people not being forced to buy them is true of course. However, actively trying to dupe people is not only probably illegal, it's also morally indefensible. The great thing about forums like this is that there's a lot of knowledgable people that use it and collectively, we can draw attention to dreadful practices like this. Also, don't forget this is now a global collecting phenomenon with a lot of younger and newer collectors who don't have the necessary knowledge about some of these records. Is it ok if they are ripped by Smiley and Co then?

It stinks and I can't believe anyone trying to defend it.

Bizarre....

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Posted
On 03/11/2014 at 12:39, Ivor Jones said:

Yes.... Of course they can do what they like if they own the rights to them. That's not the point of this thread though is it ? It's that I'm trying to stop people getting duped into buying represses that are being passed off as the proper thing. In my view that's well out of order.

Also, this thing about people not being forced to buy them is true of course. However, actively trying to dupe people is not only probably illegal, it's also morally indefensible. The great thing about forums like this is that there's a lot of knowledgable people that use it and collectively, we can draw attention to dreadful practices like this. Also, don't forget this is now a global collecting phenomenon with a lot of younger and newer collectors who don't have the necessary knowledge about some of these records. Is it ok if they are ripped by Smiley and Co then?

It stinks and I can't believe anyone trying to defend it.

Bizarre....

I know it's from ages ago but I am new to this site

Can I suggest for clarification on the releases Dave Thorley be asked (he is a member here) of Top Dog Records

I think it's fair to say he will know the story :)

Dave.jpg

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Posted

Your welcome!

IMG_0284.JPG

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