Here's a Northern Soul classic from the Fuller Brothers. Played at the Torch and early Wigan allnighters and other early 1970's venues.

This is a picture of a square clock true original, that is exactly the same as the demo, only without the promo text. This plays loud and great fidelity.

Now below is a picture of a murky gold label copy that is often sold as an original, but it looks very suspect to me. The sound quality is low volume and poor fidelity. Does anyone know if this suspect copy is an early bootleg or maybe a company reissue? I know there are the round clock design labels as well.

Edited March 7Mar 7 by Solidsoul

I’m no expert on deadwax, label revisions, bootleg, etc…but I guess you have info that supports the fact you have the original ( and that “the  suspect one” you show perhaps isn’t)?

i.e which is original, are they both original, is “ yours” ?

Edited March 7Mar 7 by Kenb

The first three pictures are of the definite original first issue and has the exact vinyl profile, colour, fidelity and matrix marks as the demo.

The question I'm trying to get answered is, are the murky gold label copies, pictured at the bottom, with the low fidelity originals as well? Or are they early counterfeits,  as this was a monster record in it's day. Or are they legitimate company reissues?

Edited March 7Mar 7 by Solidsoul

i understood that some had numbers in the clock face and some didn't. both pukka. i also understood that the one that without numbers in the clockface reas Moaning Growing AND Crying on the B-side instead of &.  I didn't think it had ever been booted... that's not to say there isn't a hooky counterfeit or two about.

I've got the Demo and the dirty looking gold issue. Both have Machine Stamped numbers with another small letter almost opposite. The stamps are in slightly different places in relation to each disc and the run-out grooves.

No idea if the "dirty gold" one is an official re-issue, like those small 45 OKEH's, or original.

With regard to sound quality, I have other original records which are muffled sound.

On 07/03/2025 at 11:30, Solidsoul said:

Here's a Northern Soul classic from the Fuller Brothers. Played at the Torch and early Wigan allnighters and other early 1970's venues.

This is a picture of a square clock true original, that is exactly the same as the demo, only without the promo text. This plays loud and great fidelity.

Now below is a picture of a murky gold label copy that is often sold as an original, but it looks very suspect to me. The sound quality is low volume and poor fidelity. Does anyone know if this suspect copy is an early bootleg or maybe a company reissue? I know there are the round clock design labels as well.

Is there an "H" stamp in the deadwax (Hollywood) pressing

According to Manships bootleg guide the gold label is the first press

 

Square clock design images of the Fuller Brothers demo and issue SC105. Also the release before SC104 and the release after SC106. The colours do differ slightly but they are taken from different sources.

Edited March 10Mar 10 by Solidsoul

My mate Steve Mercer (a DJ in the late 60's / early 70's at various Hull soul clubs) had the 1st copy I ever saw. He played it for me in 1969 & I instantly fell in love with it. It still wasn't easy to get hold of import soul 45's back then -- apart from bidding for them on mailed out lists from around the UK & this 45 never appeared on any of the lists I was sent. So I went searching for info on the group & the label. At the start of 1970, I wrote into Blues & Soul asking about stuff I was chasing on labels such as Soul Clock & Original Sound -- suggesting they did articles on such small US indie soul labels. They got my letter & reacted to it by publishing it (& a reply) in the April 1970 edition of the mag. Steve Mercer decided he needed a car more than his 45 collection around 1972, so gave up DJing, sold up and bought the car he wanted. He can't remember these days who ended up with his Fuller Bros 45. 

P.S. back at the time I wrote my letter, Invictus & Hot Wax didn't have a UK outlet yet -- that came about in mid August 1970.

Edited March 10Mar 10 by Roburt

Slightly off topic but not and once again without name dropping. Whilst visiting James Bell at his home in Indianapolis (Amazing love - The love of my girl - The funky 16 corners) He took us to meat his mate, lead singer of The Hamilton Movement. He kept his records in a plastic bucket without sleeves. He had one copy left off She’s Gone and that was not for sale. 
Back to the thread - I did buy Times A Wasting out of the bucket and  Nolan Porter - if I could only be sure. 

On 10/03/2025 at 10:24, Modularman said:

According to Manships bootleg guide the gold label is the first press

 

3 of the "Demand" bootlegs have just sold recently on Ebay for around £50. They must be quite rare

If anyone is interested in buying a classic Northern Soul record in great condition, Darren Brown (Rare Soul45s) has this first issue for sale on his web site. I would buy it myself if I didn't already have it! £100. raresoul45s.co.uk

This copy for sale is the bright label design with square clock and has great loud sound reproduction.

As opposed to the murky dark gold label copies, that do have the square clock, but play with poor low fidelity.

Edited May 16May 16 by Solidsoul

Always presumed the square clock were originals and the other design pictured were the boots/repress

I'm not too sure if the other label variations are boots. Soul Clock started out with Galaxy Records distribution (after going it alone at first & leasing a 45 out to Bell). This (Galaxy distribution) was the set up when "TIMES A WASTIN" was released. Galaxy were a well established organisation & had pressing deals with RCA ... I believe that they got RCA to press up copies of that run of Soul Clock 45's (#104, 105, 106) at different plants (east coast, west coast, etc.). Those 3 x 45's certainly got a big push, with a national ad being placed in the music press. The other two 45's did quite well (Whispers & Sugar Pie) and made quite a few radio charts. The Fuller Bros 45 didn't fare as well, though other of their singles got radio exposure. The Whispers 45 (#104) comes in 3 different versions -- all square logo versions but different colours). This 45 was issued some time before the other two (over 4 months earlier). Sugar Pie's (#106) just seems to come versions in 2 colours. The first Whispers 45 to feature the round logo (to my knowledge anyway) came out around 6 months after "Times A Wastin" -- but MAYBE Soul Clock tried again with this single as they believed it should have done better. They were certainly still pushing the 45 in June 69, a good while after it had first been released (perhaps the round logo dates from a June / July re-press to re-service radio stns).

Anyway, 6 months after the 45's had been released (#104, 105, 106), Soul Clock seemed to fall out with Galaxy & their deal withered (after #109). Next up, early 1970, the label came back but now distributed by Canyon Records. Unfortunately, Canyon outreached themselves and soon went under (less than a year later).

Edited May 16May 16 by Roburt

Original 1st press

Yes mine as got the sound distortion

Edited Saturday at 13:255 days by Kev John

On 16/05/2025 at 11:24, Mach said:

Always presumed the square clock were originals and the other design pictured were the boots/repress

2nd press better sound quality all round

This design was bought by Dave Rivers to the Torch,Keith Minchull played it rest is history

3 hours ago, Kev John said:

2nd press better sound quality all round

This design was bought by Dave Rivers to the Torch,Keith Minchull played it rest is history

This one with the lighter coloured label is the same as the demo, it has great sound reproduction like the demo.

Edited Saturday at 19:125 days by Solidsoul