Have taken on board the comments made by quite a few of you, both here and via email, and have decided that the Main Hall will be, as requested, a 100% Northern Soul room, keeping the Modern upstairs. Now the fun will begin when we play something like Flame N King, Ann Sexton etc in the Main Hall To me, it's 70's Northern

Ask yourself a question, and this doesn't apply specifically to the Plinston or any other two room event, but...

How would the punters in the modern room react if I went in and played a Sixties set ?    

Probably very, very upset to say the least, so why should anyone have to defend themselves for saying Northern rooms shouldn't play modern. Modern rooms don't play Noerthern.

No grey area about music policy at all when you look at it from that angle, of course you still have to decide what is northern and what is modern................but the DJ should be able to decide that for themselves if people aren't dancing 

link

made this point earlier dave and totally agree with you. 2 rooms keep them separate.some people do like to move between rooms for many reasons but i ain't getting into that now.

All modern rooms should be playing new sounds as a matter of course imvho. Trouble is, many of the DJ's booked either don't have or know the newer sounds.  Not a criticism of anyone, just an observation.

Roger

link

Agreed 100% about playing new sounds. I think sometimes dancefloor reaction (or lack of) sometimes means the old faves come out of the box at bit too quick.

Jacko

Ask yourself a question, and this doesn't apply specifically to the Plinston or any other two room event, but...

How would the punters in the modern room react if I went in and played a Sixties set ?    

Probably very, very upset to say the least, so why should anyone have to defend themselves for saying Northern rooms shouldn't play modern. Modern rooms don't play Noerthern.

No grey area about music policy at all when you look at it from that angle, of course you still have to decide what is northern and what is modern................but the DJ should be able to decide that for themselves if people aren't dancing 

link

Spot on Dave. It doesn't happen does it.

BUT 70's stuff was played alongside 60's at most venues including Wigan, Cleethorpes (Pier), Stafford et al, including new releases.

The 'Modern' scene hasn't been through the mix of styles that 'Northern' has.

Again, we're back to classification. You can't say that 70's wasn't part & parcel of the scene because it was. But 70's Northern and Modern are worlds apart (Providing I've got my terminology correct )

I think any venue wanting to play 60's only should specify that. Otherwise you will then alienate the people who currently say nothing because they are happy with the mix.

Again, all IMVHO

Jamie

Ask yourself a question, and this doesn't apply specifically to the Plinston or any other two room event, but...

How would the punters in the modern room react if I went in and played a Sixties set ?    

Probably very, very upset to say the least, so why should anyone have to defend themselves for saying Northern rooms shouldn't play modern. Modern rooms don't play Noerthern.

No grey area about music policy at all when you look at it from that angle, of course you still have to decide what is northern and what is modern................but the DJ should be able to decide that for themselves if people aren't dancing 

link

I did offer to play some "stompers" at the "modern night" and the Big O told me to go and spin on my head, or summat like that

Ask yourself a question, and this doesn't apply specifically to the Plinston or any other two room event, but...

How would the punters in the modern room react if I went in and played a Sixties set ?    

Probably very, very upset to say the least, so why should anyone have to defend themselves for saying Northern rooms shouldn't play modern. Modern rooms don't play Noerthern.

No grey area about music policy at all when you look at it from that angle, of course you still have to decide what is northern and what is modern................but the DJ should be able to decide that for themselves if people aren't dancing 

link

So black and white though Dave - its this assumption that people can't like both, and as one who has been known to straddle both sides of the fence I enjoy hearing both played together - I'm just weird like that One of the most enjoyable nights Ive had in recent years was a 40 years of soul event that Dean Johnson promoted in the High Peaks.

We got down to Robert Parker and to pre-releases & everything else inbetween. I danced to it all and didnt groan once. Now I don't for one minute think that everyone should want the same "one nation under a groove" that I hanker for, but the 60's/70's/modern-only voices do seem to shout loudest.

I'd hazard a guess there's more folks out and about on the soul scene that want it all, but because they choose a wider spectrum they tend not to be so vocal or militant about it.

The term across the board has been bastardised - and is seen as an excuse for any old populist tat as opposed to real quality soul music. As it is I'll just have to dip in and out of everything thats on offer to be assured I get my soul served up in several different guises.

Spot on Dave. It doesn't happen does it.

BUT 70's stuff was played alongside 60's at most venues including Wigan, Cleethorpes (Pier), Stafford et al, including new releases.

But 70's Northern and Modern are worlds apart

link

This is what I was saying the other day. I used to like 70's northern.

All modern rooms should be playing new sounds as a matter of course imvho. Trouble is, many of the DJ's booked either don't have or know the newer sounds.  Not a criticism of anyone, just an observation.

Roger

link

Sometimes hard Dodger if the "moddun room" doesn't have a CD player

Sometimes hard Dodger if the "moddun room" doesn't have a CD player 

link

we've got one for that very purpose steve although sam would never use it

Did Alison just say she wa a lover of stradling 2 things at the same time - SHOCKER! (but lucky old Mr Trout!!!)

we've got one for that very purpose steve although sam would never use it

link

You know the funny thing is he has one at home!

On the subject of Fingers he is a quality DJ and a good friend and thus the reason why I have always had him DJ at the club. Problem is slotting him on later, like Nathan in The Ghetto!, due to guests etc etc etc.

By the way, this was just meant to be a public announcement posting and all of a sudden it's a mass debate on the pros and cons of sixties vs modern. like Alison I am a lover of all styles of Soul, just so long as it's good so why not just come down, enjoy yourself (in whatever room and to whatever style you enjoy) and leave the politics for another day....ooooh get me

Edited March 29, 200520 yr by TheBigO

This is what I was saying the other day.  I used to like 70's northern.

link

Used to?

Even so, 70's Northern is played alongside Modern/Crossover without much fuss. Or am I wide of the mark here??

I just tend to think that people who don't mind a mix of styles aren't gonna be bleating like a [insert choice]

I personally don't care when/where it's from. As long as it sounds good to my ears.

If a night is billed as 'Northern' some people will expect a mix, some 60's only. That's the problem.

Why don't people just advertise it as 'Mr M's' night then there'd be no mistakes then, would there?

at the casino main room the d.js played new discoveries that are now classed as oldies.so what did they play in mrMs...erm oldies, so are they mega oldies then.. soul music is soul music ..just lets get on with it

if you like oldies go in the oldies room, if you like newies, 70s,80,00s,go in there if you like lager go to the bar its not rocket science

You know the funny thing is he has one at home!

link

now if you could just show the Collena of Soul how to use it Steve

so why not just come down, enjoy yourself (in whatever room and to whatever style you enjoy)

link

Sorry - too busy - I have things to straddle you know

See you at Modern by Moonlight

Sometimes hard Dodger if the "moddun room" doesn't have a CD player 

link

Does that still happen in this day and age????? Unbelievable if it does.

I remember a few years back when I was doing the Winsford modern room during the time of Gavin, Dave Thorley, Polly etc. and we used to use Gavin's kit but one night I didn't have my car so had to get the train down and I was buggered if I was going to cart heavy vinyl with me so only took CDs and CDR'd what vinyl I planned to play and when I got there Gavin's equipment had bust and Polly had sorted the kit and only brought one CD player with him!! Gavin kindly told me I could use his twelves which got me out of a hole. Not the easiest gig I've ever done!!

And another time at Winsford I was on between Arthur and Sam who was following me so I purposely finished with a CD single to see what he'd do and he couldn't hack it!!

I think there is a bit of a grey area with some people. Not meant in a disrespectful way, but someone would class say Eddie Billups 'Shake Off That Dream' as '70's Northern', another guy 'Modern' and Pete Smith as 'Sh*t'   

Maybe if the playing area came under '60's & 70's Northern' that might work? 

I know that my 'Old Man' used to class 60's as 'Oldies' and 70's > as 'Newies'. When I started going out I was confused (not hard  ) about phrasing. 'Oldies' were now 'Overplayed 60's' and 'Newies' were '70's Northern'.

What my Dad referred to as 'Newies' now relates to 'Underplayed 60's'. 

Jamie 

link

Whoa........I'm not gonna argue with that!

I simply dont know enough to start telling people whats northern soul and whats not. So my post was generalised. However, when the dance floor empties & people start complaining loudly I know something is a miss.

Dave Rimmers post above illustrates the point well.

Col.

So black and white though Dave - its this assumption that people can't like both, and as one who has been known to straddle both sides of the fence I enjoy hearing both played together - I'm just weird like that  One of the most enjoyable nights Ive had in recent years was a 40 years of soul event that Dean Johnson promoted in the High Peaks.

We got down to Robert Parker and to pre-releases & everything else inbetween. I danced to it all and didnt groan once. Now I don't for one minute think that everyone should want the same "one nation under a groove" that I hanker for, but the 60's/70's/modern-only voices do seem to shout loudest.

I'd hazard a guess there's more folks out and about on the soul scene that want it all, but because they choose a wider spectrum they tend not to be so vocal or militant about it.

The term across the board has been bastardised - and is seen as an excuse for any old populist tat as opposed to real quality soul music. As it is I'll just have to dip in and out of everything thats on offer to be assured I get my soul served up in several different guises.

link

like a lot of us ali,we grew up with the northern scene in the 70's and have been on both sides of the fence.i just find i have a much better time these days on the modern scene.still love northern and always will, just moved on musically and discovered so many great records.shame so many people think of the usual stuff like kenny thomas etc as being the hub of the scene,when we know it's much much more than that

As usual Taffy - spot on! Having felt in your box ( ) I know what quality lies hidden in the darker recess

As usual Taffy - spot on! Having felt in your box ( ) I know what quality lies hidden in the darker recess

link

thats what all the girls say

Why don't people just advertise it as 'Mr M's' night then there'd be no mistakes then, would there?     

link

Because if you put on a Northern Soul night, Joe Punter is going to expect to hear what is generally recognised as Northern Soul and that's uptempo 60's soul

On the subject of Fingers he is a quality DJ and a good friend and thus the reason why I have always had him DJ at the club. Problem is slotting him on later, like Nathan in The Ghetto!, due to guests etc etc etc.

By the way, this was just meant to be a public announcement posting and all of a sudden it's a mass debate on the pros and cons of sixties vs modern. like Alison I am a lover of all styles of Soul, just so long as it's good so why not just come down, enjoy yourself (in whatever room and to whatever style you enjoy) and leave the politics for another day....ooooh get me

link

Best make sure the Stannah is working in May then, cos I may just take my zimmer up them stairs just to se what all the fuss is about. Is there room for my zimmer on the dance floor?

Because if you put on a Northern Soul night, Joe Punter is going to expect to hear what is generally recognised as Northern Soul and that's uptempo 60's soul

link

Didn't think you'd bite at that, Pete

But thank you, it made me smile

I agree with what you are saying though, I think the message is be very clear in your wording when advertising a night.

(Along with a 15 page supplement of what each record is now classed as )

Jamie

So black and white though Dave - its this assumption that people can't like both, and as one who has been known to straddle both sides of the fence I enjoy hearing both played together - I'm just weird like that 

It's not an assumption that people can't like both. It's a realisation that if there are two rooms, and one is advertised as Northern Soul, it should be just that if the other is advertised as modern Soul

One of the most enjoyable nights Ive had in recent years was a 40 years of soul event that Dean Johnson promoted in the High Peaks.

We got down to Robert Parker and to pre-releases & everything else inbetween. I danced to it all and didnt groan once. Now I don't for one minute think that everyone should want the same "one nation under a groove" that I hanker for, but the 60's/70's/modern-only voices do seem to shout loudest.

Well, yes, because we are the ones who have generally paid to get in, and have found that the music isn't to our taste, whether it be 6Ts fans moaning about Modern, or Moderm fans moaning about 6Ts

I'd hazard a guess there's more folks out and about on the soul scene that want it all, but because they choose a wider spectrum they tend not to be so vocal or militant about it.

They can have it all, but in seperate rooms. Here's a comparison for you.

If I buy a burger I can put red sauce on it, or brown sauce on it, because I like either. I don't like red and brown sauce mixed together, it spoils the taste of everything, including the burger.

But if I buy two burgers, I can put red sauce on one, and brown sauce on the other. So I get all the flavours I want, but don't spoil either ofthe burgers

As it is I'll just have to dip in and out of everything thats on offer to be assured I get my soul served up in several different guises.

See, we're back to burgers again !

link

The 'Modern' scene hasn't been through the mix of styles that 'Northern' has.

erm how did you come to that conclusion "modern" has had more mixes than a MAW 12

regards

dave lucas

If I buy a burger I can put red sauce on it, or brown sauce on it, because I like either. I don't like red and brown sauce mixed together, it spoils the taste of everything, including the burger.

But I bet you'd check the authenticity of the labels on the sauce bottles before you put the sauce on!!

But I bet you'd check the authenticity of the labels on the sauce bottles before you put the sauce on!!     

link

Of course, counterfeit sauce can contain all sorts of horrible toxins, haven't you been watching the news recently.

The 'Modern' scene hasn't been through the mix of styles that 'Northern' has.

erm how did you come to that conclusion "modern" has had more  mixes than a MAW 12

regards

dave lucas

link

Hiya Dave,

perhaps I'm thick, but what the hell is a MAW 12 ?

Hiya Dave,

perhaps I'm thick, but what the hell is a MAW 12 ?

link

1.71 times the size of them little black things you play

MAW = masters at work

12 = size of record not the number of pints of bitter you consme

regards

dave

Masters At Work 12"

They do a lot of remixes & veer towards soulful garage. Generally more garage than soulful.

The 'Modern' scene hasn't been through the mix of styles that 'Northern' has.

erm how did you come to that conclusion "modern" has had more  mixes than a MAW 12

regards

dave lucas

link

I am familiar with Masters At Work

The point I was clumsily trying to make is that you couldn't really use 'playing 60's in a modern room' as a comparison as not the same thing as the other way around

(Stop digging Jamie )

And those guys who play 'DJ friendly' 12's should learn to mix. That's why they're 12 mins long with 2 mins intro and fade out.

Nothing worse than hearing 'bumble de bumble' when you haven't got your pitch right

(runs for nearest foxhole and pulls the chinstrap down )

Jamie

MAW =

link

Men At Work ... I come from a land down under? ... Isn't it ... mmm ... Marvellous !

Men At Work ... I come from a land down under? ... Isn't it ... mmm ... Marvellous !

link

Quality

I shall pass your kind words on next time I see Louie, Kenny & the boys in New York

Of course, counterfeit sauce can contain all sorts of horrible toxins, haven't you been watching the news recently.

link

Who makes this counterfeit sauce? Simon Saussan?

I'll get me coat . . .

Here's a comparison for you.

If I buy a burger I can put red sauce on it, or brown sauce on it, because I like either. I don't like red and brown sauce mixed together, it spoils the taste of everything, including the burger.

But if I buy two burgers, I can put red sauce on one, and brown sauce on the other. So I get all the flavours I want, but don't spoil either ofthe burgers

As it is I'll just have to dip in and out of everything thats on offer to be assured I get my soul served up in several different guises.

See, we're back to burgers again !

link

You bounder - I'm hungry now. Bang goes the diet

You bounder - I'm hungry now. Bang goes the diet 

link

But remember we don't play Burgers on the modern soul scene...

Does that still happen in this day and age?????  Unbelievable if it does. 

Polly had sorted the kit and only brought one CD player with him!!   

link

Not at all uncommon at "gigs" to see 1 CD player in the modern room - this makes for a harder job if trying to string together a few new CD cuts in a rhythmic flow, especially for those of us who have "problems" playing these "neo-tailor made" 12s.

So black and white though Dave - its this assumption that people can't like both, and as one who has been known to straddle both sides of the fence I enjoy hearing both played together - I'm just weird like that  One of the most enjoyable nights Ive had in recent years was a 40 years of soul event that Dean Johnson promoted in the High Peaks.

We got down to Robert Parker and to pre-releases & everything else inbetween. I danced to it all and didnt groan once. Now I don't for one minute think that everyone should want the same "one nation under a groove" that I hanker for, but the 60's/70's/modern-only voices do seem to shout loudest.

I'd hazard a guess there's more folks out and about on the soul scene that want it all, but because they choose a wider spectrum they tend not to be so vocal or militant about it.

The term across the board has been bastardised - and is seen as an excuse for any old populist tat as opposed to real quality soul music. As it is I'll just have to dip in and out of everything thats on offer to be assured I get my soul served up in several different guises.

link

Alison, I agree with you, about assumption people not liking both, Ive said it in another thread before that Im glad that I can pick and choose as liking both - Im sure that there isn't just 2 of us out there the same!!

Not at all uncommon at "gigs" to see 1 CD player in the modern room - this makes for a harder job if trying to string together a few new CD cuts in a rhythmic flow, especially for those of us who have "problems" playing these "neo-tailor made" 12s.

link

I'm afraid that's down to the promoter not being on the ball. I still have the worry about this kind of thing although in my recent experience and the gigs I've done there's always 2 CD players as the majority of promoters are aware it's now 2005, but I still take enough vinyl with me just in case!!

This is what I was saying the other day.  I used to like 70's

link

Who are you and what have you done with the real Mr Smith

Who are you and what have you done with the real Mr Smith  

link

It must be that other Pete Smith who sent me that superb crossover/70s tape a few years ago. I kid you not!!

What a can of worms

I just want a time machine to transport me back to 1974 - Life was so simple then

What a can of worms  

I just want a time machine to transport me back to 1974  - Life was so simple then

link

oh no it wasn't! My understanding from the lads old enough at the time (1978 was my introduction to the scene) that this arguement over what should be played has been raging for over 30 years...agree with you, lets just get on with enjoying the music we all love, everything else doesn't really matter. Just enjoy what you like.

Edited March 30, 200520 yr by TheBigO

What a can of worms  

I just want a time machine to transport me back to 1974  - Life was so simple then

link

I can feel a bad lyrics moment coming on

"can it be that it was all so simple then

or has time re-written every line

if we had the chance to do it all again

tell me

would we"

And the answer is YES.

But I don't know about it being simple then, trying to get from north wales to wigan at some ghastley hour, lying to get into clubs cos you too young. Worrying about who was going to be there and was "that guy" going to notice you, were you wearing the right gear.

As some wise man once said "youth is wasted on the young" or sommut like that,

and as BigO said just enjoy what you like and try tolerate others taste in music (you never know you might learn somfink - i never have still an old soulie at heart but I do try)

If i'd known what i know now maybe i wouldn't be the orginal QOF and if I wasn't the QOF I wouldn't be me so......................

It must be that other Pete Smith who sent me that superb crossover/70s tape a few years ago.  I kid you not!! 

link

You fibber. Surely this can't be true, if it is, I don't remember it happening

oh no it wasn't! My understanding from the lads old enough at the time (1978 was my introduction to the scene) that this arguement over what should be played has been raging for over 30 years...agree with you, lets just get on with enjoying the music we all love, everything else doesn't really matter. Just enjoy what you like.

link

Longer than that in fact "O". I found myself recently somewhat curiously pouring over some old "Black Music" magazines from the mid 70's and the days of Tony Cummins so called "expose's" of the northern scene. Basically where he took the mic out of all of the imperfections and flaws in our scene, rather than recognising it for what it was (DJ's playing "Hawaii 5-0" because "the kids wanted to hear it" etc.).

In these articles there were a lot of quotes over the Casino / Mecca split - and what constituted "proper" soul. Levine "banned" from Wigan, "Ladies Choice" "banned" (both allegedly by Russ), and then the Mecca kids who were held us as champions (smartly dressed, into soul music etc etc)....

In fact it seems to have been an "issue" ever since more than one decade of music was made. It's always been there, and I guess it always will be then....

Have taken on board the comments made by quite a few of you, both here and via email, and have decided that the Main Hall will be, as requested, a 100% Northern Soul room, keeping the Modern upstairs. Now the fun will begin when we play something like Flame N King, Ann Sexton etc in the Main Hall To me, it's 70's Northern

link

The music at your last event has to be compared with the last all dayer in the padded cells at Wakefield Prison.

One of the worst nights I have ever had.

Dont come back with excuses about all nighters at Stoke ect.

Do every body a favour. Work within your capabilities. Keep it simple. Go back to basics. Just play dance music. :angry:

The music at your last event has to be compared with the last all dayer in the padded cells at Wakefield Prison.

One of the worst nights I have ever had.

Dont come back with excuses about all nighters at Stoke ect.

Do every body a favour. Work within your capabilities. Keep it simple. Go back to basics. Just play dance music. :angry:

link

I'm sure when you wrote this you knew what you meant.

But, if you could be a little more specific for us mere mortals it would help.

'Go back to basics' is a rubbish statement.

'Just play dance music' is almost meaningless.

Col.

Col. I think you're being generous to say the above comments are "almost meaningless"!