Tlscapital

Mutt-Jeff 16 - Charles Perry - 'move on love' (005) b/w 'how can I' (006) (November 1965) (PROMO ONLY ?) Mutt-Jeff 17 - Sun Lover's - 'my poor heart' (007) b/w 'I'll tell the world' (008) (June/July 1966) Magnum 728 - Charles Perry - 'move on love' (005) b/w 'how can I' (006) (late 1966) M-G-M 13621 - Charles Perry - 'move on love' b/w 'how can I' (November 1966) Mutt-Jeff 18 - Sunlover's - 'you'll never make the grade' (009) delta # 67031 MJ 009 (June/July 1967) b/w 'this love of ours' (010) delta # 67031-x. MJ-010 (June/July 1967) Mutt-Jeff 16 seems to have had a WLP release only... Mutt-Jeff 17 is rather rare and prove how "poor" was Joe Jefferson promotion through distribution was then. His first "breakthrough" happened through the Magnum lease but somehow totally failed commercially with MGM's lease. One can easily understand how disappointed everyone involved in this 45 must have felt. Many such story in the music business. A first act with enormous potential that couldn't get the exposure it begs for... A second medium start and when the "BIG" thing is bound to happen; it vanishes... It took that long (8 months or so) for a second venture for a new release on the label that also suffered not to have had the exposure it required. Likely the second lease of life for Charles Perry 'move on love' on Magnum gave Joe Jefferson the "kick" he needed to develop some his Mutt & Jeff project. That's why I'm led to believe these flat Mutt-Jeff logo releases predate the yellow "Disney" logo variation, that are more common. With Mutt-Jeff 18 being a "bridge" record with the new Mutt & Jeff yellow "Disney" logo. Enjoying reissues as well from his back catalog. Sometimes years later... Leaving the dates for the yellow "Disney" logo versions rather hard to place as they used the same pressing plant judging from the typos, templates and matrixes. They could be contemporary just as well if I was told that one use to see both logo variations as "new" releases on the stalls back then... Mutt & Jeff 16 - Charles Perry - 'move on love' delta # 56293 (005) b/w 'how can I' delta # 56294 (006) (November 1965) Mutt & Jeff 18 - Sunlover's - 'you'll never make the grade' (009) b/w 'this love of ours' (010) Mutt & Jeff 18 - Sunlover's - 'my poor heart' delta # 62161 (016) (June/July 1966) b/w 'this love of ours' delta # 67031-x (010) (June/July 1967) Mutt & Jeff 19 - Johnny Hendley - 'my baby came out of nowhere' (011) b/w ''I'll tell the world' (0??) Breakthrough 1001 - Inspirations - 'no one else can take your place' (01) delta # 69491 HL 01 (December 1967/January 1968) Breakthrough 1002 - Sunlover's - 'my Poor heart' - delta # 62161 MJ-016 (June/July 1966) b/w "This Love of Ours" - delta # 67031-x. MJ-010 (June/July 1967) Breakthrough 1003 - Buddy Conner - 'when you're alone' (BT 002) delta # ??? (1970)

That or even a tad later if ever. I always suspect this record to be way later than the 1966 "consensus" given date all over the place. That sets the Breakthrough releases after the final 1967 releases of the Mutt & Jeff label (MJ 20). My gut feeling was always there.

Unearthed my copy of the Sunlover's 'my poor heart' on the yellow Disney Mutt & Jeff copy. Shows the same matrix and template (no surprise) as the Breakthrough issue. Should be the same for both the Mutt-Jeff and Mutt & Jeff pressings of Charles Perry. It should be the same for both releases of 'you'll never make the grade'. Date with Delta # is welcome and appreciated though. But what about the delta date for the Inspirations 'no one else can take your place' on Breakthrough then ? 😮

Yes OK but past MJ 19 there's no more 'plot' to be inquired into as far as we're concerned here. And prior JM16 I couldn't find what Joe Jefferson produced on other labels if he ever did to attribute a JM15, 14, 13... And what about those MUTT and JEFF Jamaican label variations... 😜

All indicate same pressing plant. Only label variations.

True but there's no entry before MJ 16 and past MJ 19, the matter is of another concern I thought.

Knowing for fact, OK; no ! Not yet at least. But in regard of the evolution of the labels, logos and info on the labels would/should put your orange Mutt-Jeff one first. The Delta matrix should provide some helpful informations if one could gather and place them for each sides on each releases. Mutt-Jeff 16 - Charles Perry - 'move on love' (005) b/w 'how can I' (006) Mutt-Jeff 17 - Sun Lover's - 'my poor heart' (007) b/w 'I'll tell the world' (008) Mutt-Jeff 18 - Sunlover's - 'you'll never make the grade' (009) b/w 'this love of ours' (010) These 3 above share the same flat design with horizontal lines. Mutt & Jeff 16 - Charles Perry - 'move on love' (005) b/w 'how can I' (006) Mutt & Jeff 18 - Sunlover's - 'you'll never make the grade' (009) b/w 'this love of ours' (010) Mutt & Jeff 18 - Sunlover's - 'my poor heart' (016) b/w 'this love of ours' (010) Mutt & Jeff 19 - Johnny Hendley - 'my baby came out of nowhere' (011) b/w ''I'll tell the world' (0??) These above yellow Mutt & Jeff with the "Disney" logo came after... The Breakthrough before, in between and/or after if ever...

True Anorak real question for me as well. While I'm still wondering or waiting for credible factual argument on the matter, I have come to dig down the label variations to do some assumption deductions that can prove false if ever... What is interesting though is that the Charles Perry 'how can I' b/w 'move on love' is often claim to be released first on Magnum then on MGM (promos only !!!) before being finally re-issued on Mutt & Jeff. As this happens sometimes after an "independent" lease deal with a wider distribution company or even a major record company (both in this case) that didn't achieve the expected success hoped for due to lack of promotion or such misfortune... Hence that Charles Perry had a promo release on Mutt-Jeff (NOT Mutt '&' Jeff !!!) that bares the same design as your Sunlover's. Could it be that this Charles Perry Mutt-Jeff promo release pre-dated the lease to the Magnum issue ? If so this could explain why the people claim to first see the Magnum copies in the record stores back then and the Mutt & Jeff later... re-released out of disappointment after the short Magnum small success break-out and the Major MGM lease big let-down. If this would be the case, this could indicate that this Sunlover's Mutt-Jeff orange label variation of yours could actually pre-date the switch to the new then yellow label design of Mutt & Jeff re-release. Worth noting that the Charles Perry Mutt-Jeff promo has a P.O Box address on the label, the Sunlover's orange Mutt-Jeff has a P.O. Box and a phone number and the Charles Perry on yellow Mutt & Jeff has only a phone number.

At first I'd have automatically said planet Mars, but maybe to be more realistic (if ever those Americans USA democrats NASA anti-USSR actors behind cardboard scenes where there...); on the Moon. For real wishing to soon soil the Moon picture with Trump... 🤢 I know it's not a nice picture, but likely more realistic than those nut requested prices on Discogs. Sorry if that doesn't actually help you in your quest as such, which I truly respect (for I love that tune !!!) as I understand the hopeless need for the format one's wish to own 😉

Doesn't exist I believe as the promo with the cartoon design (styrene)

My "soft spot" has also always been for the 'I hove done told you baby' side. Those screen captures are just for references.

The man I expected to intervene... So predictive :)) Thanks for all of that Robbk.

Hi would anyone know which one actually came out first ? Often it is quoted the Music Chicago Bag to be first but I see no evidence to that. Anyone would know better ? With a story about it maybe...

Not anymore. Even if I had, I know the titles of my records for most I have for sale hopefully. Not their catalog numbers ! I seriously doubt you'll get a lot of answers from people having to dig out the catalog numbers on their record for sale...

Do you have some titles to propose or should we fetch the library guy... For real !

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And some more...

Wow, never seen that before... What a piece that is !

Honestly I never thought ...at all if ever To say the least and just as they look; Lo-Fi I have always find rumors back then was that they where "made" to fund the actual purchased records featured on them...

The one in my quote here above Phil Flowers 'discontented' on a WDJ Dot with red vinyl.

Oh yes it is. Likely done for the USA market (beach scene or else) and often presented as a rare red vinyl promo variation copy. Inducing it's a variant press but not claiming it is the real deal at the same time...

That is some bootleg stuff that would bring the tread to other comments and proportions I am afraid.

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The colored vinyl Jetstar 45's are let's say "common". If a tad rarer than their black vinyl stockers counterparts, it's only by a thin margin. I believe to less common/known variations are the target for this topic... Like anything decent that use to float around, they just do not anymore indeed.

Yes the Dave Coleman 'down in the basement' on Togo copy I was referring to is indeed also one of those Bell/Amy/Mala printed on (plastic) styrene label...