Was the eighties a time when the Northern Soul scene redefined itself and became underground again ?

Simon Murray

Was the eighties a time when the Northern Soul scene redefined itself and became underground again ?

Simon Murray

About time it did it again.........

About time it did it again.........

Why'd ya say that Ken ?

Simon

Hey up Simon,

Always makes me laugh does this topic.

1 minute everybody's saying get it back underground then the next minute when attendances at venues start to drop & nights shut down everybody's discussing how to get new face's & younger fans into the scene to keep it going.

Best thing is we get a few new faces into a club & what happens?

We all slag e'm off & call e'm bloody "handbaggers"

Make's my blood boil at times

Sorry if this sounds like a bit of a rant but i've just had some Jehova's witnesses at the front door & boy did they get it. Don't think they'll be back for a while

Got to agree with you Simon M,in my opinion the scence was alot better and more progresive,Alot of people i know was on the scene then but not now.Most clubs now days are playing and sticking to top "100 oldies stuff" and it gets a bit repetetive after while.

I found the 80's( diminished but progressive) scene very friendly , although the 60's mafia bunch did seem a bit scarey if you did not know them ..

Quite agree,Simon. That Dean Anderson!! Most softly-spoken polite headbanger I've ever met. And Guy "Mephistopheles" Hennigan was a Machiveallian manipulator without equal.Forcing me to take the Groovettes and Larry Wright for some imagined favour I'd done him.

Thoroughly nasty pieces of work,the pair of them!!

ROD

Quite agree,Simon. That Dean Anderson!! Most softly-spoken polite headbanger I've ever met. And Guy "Mephistopheles" Hennigan was a Machiveallian manipulator without equal.Forcing me to take the Groovettes and Larry Wright for some imagined favour I'd done him.

Thoroughly nasty pieces of work,the pair of them!!

ROD

Hammy

Was the eighties a time when the Northern Soul scene redefined itself and became underground again ?

Simon Murray

=================

Redefined itself how?

Winnie:-)

when i think of the 80s i think of stafford,underground ? definately not ! new,old,progressive,unknown,known etc, stafford had them all

I dont think that any mas influx of new blood has appeared on the scene

Just old soulies who had lost interest and were sparked into'' returning'' when they discoverd that the soul scene was still alive and kicking when they discoverd the internet

Which probably explains the demise in numbers recently at soul venues

A lot of folk who came back into the fold after getting bored of it

have got bored of it again

We seem to of survived through the 80ts with low numbers and im sure we will carry on untill the last one of us drops

But their wont be another revival to moan about

I dont think that any mas influx of new blood has appeared on the scene

Just old soulies who had lost interest and were sparked into'' returning'' when they discoverd that the soul scene was still alive and kicking when they discoverd the internet

Which probably explains the demise in numbers recently at soul venues

A lot of folk who came back into the fold after getting bored of it

have got bored of it again

We seem to of survived through the 80ts with low numbers and im sure we will carry on untill the last one of us drops

But their wont be another revival to moan about

==========

Not just sparked by the internet IMO, lot of peoples families had grown up, so were able to go out again

Why'd ya say that Ken ?

Simon

Cause it deffo` aint no underground scene at the mo`.Liked it better then.

Got to agree with darren,people blame kids for alot of things but" Northern soul "is no excuse.

when i think of the 80s i think of stafford,underground ? definately not ! new,old,progressive,unknown,known etc, stafford had them all

Was the eighties a time when the Northern Soul scene redefined itself and became underground again ?

Simon Murray

Well Simon, perhaps few right now would ever want to concede or contemplate this ... but possibly the future and cutting edge of rare soul appreciation may lie overseas, outside the UK ???

Have a look right now at the flyers for the upcoming S.O.U.L gig in Spain or the Gold Coast gig in Queensland Australia . These are events with a DJ mix of locals as well as established UK guests , they have music policies that can and do embrace all strands of "soul" from 50's RnB to Year 2K Soul , deep funk even and boogie tunes, and everything in between.

The emphasis is firmly and squarely on the MUSIC - DANCING, COLLECTING RECORDS & SOUL in all its forms rather than preserving the traditions of what was happening north of Watford back in the 60's & 70's.

I think you'll find that with most scenes outside the UK, there is a much younger element and while there is a respect for the traditions of northern soul as it originated in the UK, there is far less paranoia about whether the stereotypical Northern Soul scene - as we all know it - will or won't survive.

Even the flyers alone for these two events make all the advertising for current UK events look positively ancient !!!

If it is true that many "returnees" are again departing the scene after having had their fill again , well that's because to begin with they were first and foremost only "casual" soul fans into a bit of dancing and a bit of fun (nothing wrong with that by the way!) in the their youth as distinct from SOUL MUSIC enthusiasts who also happen to be Northern/Rare Soul fans and who are likely to be into all forms of soul music until their dying day.

As for the scene going back "Underground", well, despite all the TV commercials and other commercial exposure in various forms that 'northern soul" has been subjected to over the last 10 years or so , I think the scene remains firmly underground - and always will - because it demands the sort of attitude and dedication that will always be beyond your average punter.....

Edited October 8, 200618 yr by sunnysoul

Well Simon, perhaps few right now would ever want to concede or contemplate this ... but possibly the future and cutting edge of rare soul appreciation may lie overseas, outside the UK ???

================

Pretty much agree with this, no preconceptions about what should be played, so the one-upmanship factor that prevails in Britain, hasn't taken hold yet.

About time it did it again.........

yea and quick

Ok i wasn't able to attend in the 80's but to view what it is today i still see Northern soul as partly underground. Now i know songs etc get on adverts and whatever else so people are aware of it.

but in technical terms not everyone my age etc would know of it because for one thing they have attended say a night of normal classic soul or to a club that has played some soul music but as soon as they hit the Northern soul night they hear a totally new sound 50 odd songs they not know and the odd Temptations - Ain't To Proud To Beg cause it was played at there classic soul night they attended.

So to them they could see it as underground scene

Ok i wasn't able to attend in the 80's but to view what it is today i still see Northern soul as partly underground. Now i know songs etc get on adverts and whatever else so people are aware of it.

but in technical terms not everyone my age etc would know of it because for one thing they have attended say a night of normal classic soul or to a club that has played some soul music but as soon as they hit the Northern soul night they hear a totally new sound 50 odd songs they not know and the odd Temptations - Ain't To Proud To Beg cause it was played at there classic soul night they attended.

So to them they could see it as underground scene

The Temps are about as underground as a bridge

Still my fav time for Northern was the 80's, never really went anywhere, used to keep in touch listening to Guy H on radio Derby with Terry Christian playing all his latest discoveries on a tuesday evening, great memories.......would love to see the scene dwindle a little and small cosy venues become the way forward, ah oh we can but dream.......

Ok i wasn't able to attend in the 80's but to view what it is today i still see Northern soul as partly underground. Now i know songs etc get on adverts and whatever else so people are aware of it.

but in technical terms not everyone my age etc would know of it because for one thing they have attended say a night of normal classic soul or to a club that has played some soul music but as soon as they hit the Northern soul night they hear a totally new sound 50 odd songs they not know and the odd Temptations - Ain't To Proud To Beg cause it was played at there classic soul night they attended.

So to them they could see it as underground scene

==============

I think a younger crowd would definitely see the northern scene as underground. Can't honestly see how anybody views it differently, it's hardly in the public eye. Population of say 20/30 million adults in Britain, how many know anything about it?

I would personally like the scene to be promoted through mainstream media.

I am not going to tell Ady Croasdell what to do but i would deffo put the 100 Club dates in Time Out if I was in charge. i am also sure the Saturday Guardian 'What's On' guide would love to do a story on a big allnighter.

Spread the word

Shane

I would personally like the scene to be promoted through mainstream media.

I am not going to tell Ady Croasdell what to do but i would deffo put the 100 Club dates in Time Out if I was in charge. i am also sure the Saturday Guardian 'What's On' guide would love to do a story on a big allnighter.

Spread the word

I thought it was almost impossible to get into those kind of papers with Sub/genre like rare soul ...?

Simon

Edited October 9, 200618 yr by Simon M

I would personally like the scene to be promoted through mainstream media.

I am not going to tell Ady Croasdell what to do but i would deffo put the 100 Club dates in Time Out if I was in charge. i am also sure the Saturday Guardian 'What's On' guide would love to do a story on a big allnighter.

Spread the word

Shane

===============

Still my fav time for Northern was the 80's, never really went anywhere, used to keep in touch listening to Guy H on radio Derby with Terry Christian playing all his latest discoveries on a tuesday evening, great memories.......would love to see the scene dwindle a little and small cosy venues become the way forward, ah oh we can but dream.......

==============

Not sure what size venues you're talking about John, but think if they're very small, it could lead to even less people travelling, and fragment the scene further. You're not going to go 150 miles if you're not sure you can get in. As I say, not sure what size venues you're on about, small and cozy to you could mean 250 people, so apologise if theres a misunderstanding on my part

"Well Simon, perhaps few right now would ever want to concede or contemplate this ... but possibly the future and cutting edge of rare soul appreciation may lie overseas, outside the UK ???"

We are talking about the UK scene aren't we? So the fact that there's a night on in Melbourne really has no bearing on whether scene here is contracting again.

I would like to know though what 45s they play overseas that we don't or haven't at some stage.

I was coming home from Winsford the other night at 4am with hardly any traffic on the road and lights out in all the houses and I was thinking to myself that I'd left 200 people dancing away in some small market town in Cheshire. I think that can be considered "underground" still despite odd bit of Media coverage.

ROD

Edited October 9, 200618 yr by modernsoulsucks

Hey Chaps , I was talking about the 1980's . But hey the thread is a bit more interesting now !! BTW surely the answer , to low turnouts , is consolidation ?

Simon

Hey up Simon,

Always makes me laugh does this topic.

1 minute everybody's saying get it back underground then the next minute when attendances at venues start to drop & nights shut down everybody's discussing how to get new face's & younger fans into the scene to keep it going.

Best thing is we get a few new faces into a club & what happens?

We all slag e'm off & call e'm bloody "handbaggers"

Make's my blood boil at times

Sorry if this sounds like a bit of a rant but i've just had some Jehova's witnesses at the front door & boy did they get it. Don't think they'll be back for a while

I thought it was almost impossible to get into those kind of papers with Sub/genre like rare soul ...?

Simon

One of the editors of The Guide is a soulie and one of the editors on Time Out is a Mod so it's not too hard to get in there.

They do pieces now and again.

The Rocket allnighters (the Metropolitan Soul ones) had loads of coverage, which definitely had an impact on the crowd/mix at the following nighter.

They came, They f*cked about, They spilled their beer everywhere, they f*cked off again ...never to return.

Was the eighties a time when the Northern Soul scene redefined itself and became underground again ?

Simon Murray

Wouldn't have said so really. Did a thread a wile back https://www.soul-source.co.uk/index.p...c=10144&hl= to disprove the scene was on it's knees in the 80's. As someone said that it was. Just have a look at the number of venues that were on in the eighties.

The 80's was a great time for rare soul, you could say it was when it got it's second wind. Underground, not sure about that, but it wasn't so media friendly. But the influx of new, young people gave it a sparkle.

As to the couple of comments about the future and the soul scene outside the UK, have to agree. I travel a fair bit to europe to DJ and do a monthly gig in Germany. Great DJ's much younger crowd, up for everything from 60's northern & funk to current soulful R&B and house. I get asked to play there cuz of what i play today, they couldn't give a flying rip about the past. Your only as good as your last set, which is great you have to work hard to get their respect, and that how it should be.

A bit of a plug I know, but thats what we want to do with the Villa event. Bring those DJ's over here to play along side good UK DJ's. Maybe some of their cool spirit will rub of on us and have a positive effect in the UK.

The future is everyone coming together internationally, northern soul may have started here, but now days that means little.

Dave

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Not just sparked by the internet IMO, lot of peoples families had grown up, so were able to go out again

I think that goes for many of us....... well in my case anyway!

Did'nt have much to do with the scene in the 80s due to kid's and mortgages etc, allthough TBH I had become a little p****d off with the scene towards the end of Wigan anyway.

I have also not noticed any big influx of `young blood` but have noticed more people around our own age at venue's who were perhaps never into the Music first time round as it where, but have joined of late because its a night out with people their own age, more than a night out listening/dancing to Northern Soul!!.

Surely the fact that the scene isn't mainstream automatically puts it into the 'underground' bracket?

As already stated, how many people in your everyday life know about rare soul?

How many of them would quite happily travel hundreds of miles to appreciate the sounds of rare soul and happily stay and dance all through the night?

Not going to pretend to be an expert on this, as it's only the last couple of years that I have found a massive appreciation for 'rare' soul, so does that make me 'new blood'?

I also tend to agree about a more youthful movement starting up in Europe, the same can be said for the Mod scene too. The only reason I can think off is that it's all 'new' to them, they haven't had it before, so they wont get people the same age as their parents attending their nights out. Not exactly rebellion is it?

I put this comment on a Mod forum, and would be interested to hear a 'soulie' perspective.

The Mod and/or Soul scene would never have a 'revival' as both are very British phenomenums. Unfortunately, and here's the key difference between ourselves and Europe, our culture is more in tune with America and we no longer have our own identity.

What do you think?

Surely the fact that the scene isn't mainstream automatically puts it into the 'underground' bracket?

As already stated, how many people in your everyday life know about rare soul?

How many of them would quite happily travel hundreds of miles to appreciate the sounds of rare soul and happily stay and dance all through the night?

Not going to pretend to be an expert on this, as it's only the last couple of years that I have found a massive appreciation for 'rare' soul, so does that make me 'new blood'?

I also tend to agree about a more youthful movement starting up in Europe, the same can be said for the Mod scene too. The only reason I can think off is that it's all 'new' to them, they haven't had it before, so they wont get people the same age as their parents attending their nights out. Not exactly rebellion is it?

I put this comment on a Mod forum, and would be interested to hear a 'soulie' perspective.

The Mod and/or Soul scene would never have a 'revival' as both are very British phenomenums. Unfortunately, and here's the key difference between ourselves and Europe, our culture is more in tune with America and we no longer have our own identity.

What do you think?

Go to the inner city of most european cities and the common music of the young kids is hip hop, american culture is just as strong there. In fact in many german cities it is even more so because of the strong US miltary presence. You will find many Hip Hop clothing stores and music shop. Soul is an underground scene as here. The difference is they don't have the same holier than thou politics of the UK