HI AGAIN

I WAS ALWAYS LED TO BELIEVE THE YELLOW COPIES WERE BOOT ,IS THIS THE CASE OR GENUINE 2ND ISSUE?

THANKS

NEV

Paul M

just to clarrify something for me.Was the B side Girl your my kind of wonderfull re recorded ?. As I have an old tape with a version on which sounds different to the version I have heard from the yellow single. I have the version by the Olympics on Warner Bros but am sure there is a different version. Any idea?

Adam

Sadly, Bob Relf is in poor health and is unable to remember very much these days.

So do any royalties go to his upkeep then?

Paul M

just to clarrify something for me.Was the B side Girl your my kind of wonderfull re recorded ?. As I have an old tape with a version on which sounds different to the version I have heard from the yellow single. I have the version by the Olympics on Warner Bros but am sure there is a different version. Any idea?

Adam

Hello Adam,

I've never heard a different version, all I know are the Bob Relf and Olympics' versions. By the way, "Girl, You're My Kind Of Wonderful" was actually the official 'A' side.

Let me know if you find the different version.

Best regards,

Paul Mooney

So do any royalties go to his upkeep then?

Of course they do!!!

In fact, Pete, I'm proud to say that Bob has earned some real money from that track - but only since he signed with Millbrand in 2004 and we took steps to recover "lost" royalties and issue licenses for current uses.

Prior to that he hadn't earned one penny from the bootlegs, reissues and numerous compilation albums (sixteen of them) which had featured the track. Disgraceful.

By the way, he also gets income from "Harlem Shuffle" following a court case which finally awarded one-third shares to Bob and to Earl Nelson (who is also very ill at the moment). It's sad that they were robbed of so much money in the past.

And it was nice of The Rolling Stones to send Bob a signed copy of their songbook which featured "Harlem Shuffle". Their version earned him quite a lot of money.

Best regards,

Paul Mooney

i have an orange label, always assummed and was told by people like adey pierce it was a proper first issue, im pretty sure it was a torch sound,if not very early wigan,ezzie also spoke to ian cunliffe about it recently and we both thought our identical orange copies were first pressings, getting a bit complicated now, aint it!

Edited July 23, 200718 yr by ezzie brown

i have an orange label, always assummed and was told by people like adey pierce it was a proper first issue, im pretty sure it was a torch sound,if not very early wigan,ezzie also spoke to ian cunliffe about it recently and we both thought our identical orange copies were first pressings, getting a bit complicated now, aint it!

These problems happen when you buy records from dealers who are colour blind.

Paul Mooney

These problems happen when you buy records from dealers who are colour blind.

Paul Mooney

im going deaf as well so its real hard, also the flood water is still rising,so i may have a water damaged copy for sale in a minute!!!!!!!!11

i have an orange label, always assummed and was told by people like adey pierce it was a proper first issue, im pretty sure it was a torch sound,if not very early wigan,ezzie also spoke to ian cunliffe about it recently and we both thought our identical orange copies were first pressings, getting a bit complicated now, aint it!

Ezzie,

Don't worry about the Orange copy, it is an original and with the same gloss paper quality etc. Which makes me think it was a "rerun" and not too much a later press. It was certainly NOT a special press for us folks. I've found orange copies in Philly, Boston etc as well as the west coast.

But ALL the previous Trans American release 45s have yellow labels, so we figure Yellow first, Orange next when the telephone changed, then 5 years later the release on TRANS.

So Adey P. is not wrong ORANGE is not a repro as such, just commoner and a later run with diff. phone #.

Do you fish? It used to be my dream, to own a home by some water..

i have an orange label, always assummed and was told by people like adey pierce it was a proper first issue, im pretty sure it was a torch sound,if not very early wigan,ezzie also spoke to ian cunliffe about it recently and we both thought our identical orange copies were first pressings, getting a bit complicated now, aint it!

Brilliant, Soul Source at it's best. Thanks for all the Information.

Here's my copy, as usual there's always more to collect, fascinating stuff.

im going deaf as well so its real hard, also the flood water is still rising,so i may have a water damaged copy for sale in a minute!!!!!!!!11

Hey Ezzie,

In further experimentation to validate the authenticity of these records, i've just been testing orange & yellow copies in the bath. Good news mate ! the orange ones float !

When it gets up to neck level, perhaps you'd better load up & come over to my place, nice n dry here

Regards,

pottsy

ps

The yellow ones sank

hi all, i think nev is having my orange copy as the consensus is that its real and as pottsy sayes FLOATES!!! he might have remembered seeing it as it was in my box in that dungeon in cockneyville ,but it was so dark you had a job to see anything, alright then thats my excuse anyway!!!!

I think you must have your years a bit wrong Paul, because Paul Mooney says this was from 1975.

pottsy

ps

Dont shoot me, i'm just the messenger.

Although the black magic release was 75, I'm pretty sure it was 74 that soussan sent the demos across. I may be wrong though.

Paul

Ezzie,

Don't worry about the Orange copy, it is an original and with the same gloss paper quality etc. Which makes me think it was a "rerun" and not too much a later press. It was certainly NOT a special press for us folks. I've found orange copies in Philly, Boston etc as well as the west coast.

But ALL the previous Trans American release 45s have yellow labels, so we figure Yellow first, Orange next when the telephone changed, then 5 years later the release on TRANS.

So Adey P. is not wrong ORANGE is not a repro as such, just commoner and a later run with diff. phone #.

Do you fish? It used to be my dream, to own a home by some water..

The 'Trans' yellow copy has the same lovely glossy quality label too! The stamp is authentic, and the phone number is the same as the yellow 'Trans Atlantic' original too!

Winner!

The 'Trans' yellow copy has the same lovely glossy quality label too! The stamp is authentic, and the phone number is the same as the yellow 'Trans Atlantic' original too!

Winner!

Oh dear !!

So, lets get all this into some kind of order.

1st press = Yellow label, stamped in dead wax, TRANS-AMERICAN - Tel. no 213-384-9334

2nd press = Yellow label, stamped in dead wax, TRANS - Tel. no 213-384-9334

3rd press = Orange label, stamped in dead wax, TRANS-AMERICAN - Tel. no 213-389-9938

Bootleg = Yellow label, Trans-American, thin vinyl, no stamp.

May even be a Trans boot ?

Pottsy

Hello,

All I know is that some yellow 'Trans' copies were pressed at the same plant (Rainbo) in the early 1970s using the same stampers which had been used back in 1968.

Paul Mooney

But Paul,

They couldn't have done. Not unless they somehow got their telephone number changed back to the one they had many years before.

pottsy

I`m not happy,found a yellow stamped shiney Trans-whatever and left it cause every chuff said it was a boot

Edited July 23, 200718 yr by ken

Oh dear !!

So, lets get all this into some kind of order.

1st press = Yellow label, stamped in dead wax, TRANS-AMERICAN - Tel. no 213-384-9334

2nd press = Yellow label, stamped in dead wax, TRANS - Tel. no 213-384-9334

3rd press = Orange label, stamped in dead wax, TRANS-AMERICAN - Tel. no 213-389-9938

Bootleg = Yellow label, Trans-American, thin vinyl, no stamp.

May even be a Trans boot ?

Pottsy

So you think the Trans came out before the orange label Trans American do you Sherlock?

i thought all trans only s were boots,but what do i know compared to u lot!!! anyway i still think mines cosher! so boo hoo!!! ITS NOT RAINING AT THE MOMENT!!!! IL PUT THE WASHING OUT!!! if the lines not under water!!!!!!!!!!!!

god sakes...what was the question? Has someone got a box of these to sell??

Ezzie,

But ALL the previous Trans American release 45s have yellow labels, so we figure Yellow first, Orange next when the telephone changed, then 5 years later the release on TRANS.

You sure bout that john ?

I`m not happy,found a yellow stamped shiney Trans-whatever and left it cause every chuff said it was a boot

it's a re-issue done especially for the scene to cater for so called demand. I still wouldn't buy one.

it's a re-issue done especially for the scene to cater for so called demand. I still wouldn't buy one.

Not according to this topic/thread Chalkster mate

Not according to this topic/thread Chalkster mate

I've read nothing to say otherwise (apart from Pottsy's post), done by the label owner apparently reading this thread, still a re-issue whoever done it.

I've read nothing to say otherwise (apart from Pottsy's post), done by the label owner apparently reading this thread, still a re-issue whoever done it.

Pottsy`s allways right aint he didnt Ovenchip say the same,cant be arsed reading through the thread again

Oh dear !!

So, lets get all this into some kind of order.

1st press = Yellow label, stamped in dead wax, TRANS-AMERICAN - Tel. no 213-384-9334

2nd press = Yellow label, stamped in dead wax, TRANS - Tel. no 213-384-9334

3rd press = Orange label, stamped in dead wax, TRANS-AMERICAN - Tel. no 213-389-9938

Bootleg = Yellow label, Trans-American, thin vinyl, no stamp.

May even be a Trans boot ?

Pottsy

Hi Pottsy

I would agree with the order apart from the Trans copy, only the Telephone Number suggests 2nd Press.

However the Name Change suggests a different time period.

I couldn't see them changing from Trans-American to Trans & then back to Trans-American.

Just a thought,

Also, would they all be pressed at the same pressing plant, and if so which plant.

and

Did other releases recieve similar treatment.

Edited July 23, 200718 yr by 45cellar

Hi Pottsy

I would agree with the order apart from the Trans copy, only the Telephone Number suggests 2nd Press.

However the Name Change suggests a different time period.

I couldn't see them changing from Trans-American to Trans & then back to Trans-American.

Just a thought,

Also, would they all be pressed at the same pressing plant, and if so which plant.

and

Did other releases recieve similar treatment.

Hey 45cellar.....love your last played clip!!!!

Hi Pottsy

I would agree with the order apart from the Trans copy, only the Telephone Number suggests 2nd Press.

However the Name Change suggests a different time period.

I couldn't see them changing from Trans American to Trans & then back to Trans American.

Just a thought,

Also, would they all be pressed at the same pressing plant, and if so which plant.

and

Did other releases recieve similar treatment.

Hi mate,

Both John Manship & Paul Mooney have said there was a LEGITIMATE repress done of this record 5 years after it's first release in 1968, for the U.K. market. They have said the pressing company used the same plates.

The company had nothing to hide, as it was legitimate, it was good news for them after all. So they are hardly going to put a false telephone number on the label.

I'm only looking at the facts.

Pottsy.

Hi mate,

Both John Manship & Paul Mooney have said there was a LEGITIMATE repress done of this record 5 years after it's first release in 1968, for the U.K. market. They have said the pressing company used the same plates.

The company had nothing to hide, as it was legitimate, it was good news for them after all. So they are hardly going to put a false telephone number on the label.

I'm only looking at the facts.

Pottsy.

Hi Pottsy

Yes, no problem with the Trans copy being Legitimate.

I just couldn't see it being pressed before the Orange Copy.

Is that what is being suggested. I would be shocked if it was,

but ? ................ anyone

Edited July 23, 200718 yr by 45cellar

Hey 45cellar.....love your last played clip!!!!

Hi

Yes, I was trawling through Refosoul to see which version was uploaded.

The only CD I know of with the correct middle section is this one, which apparently was remastered from TAPES/45's

Edited July 25, 200718 yr by 45cellar

Look I'm going to have to come clean, it was in fact me who pressed them on the Trans label, I was only 13 and still at school at the time but couldn't spell the word American so I just used the first part. I used the money from my paper round to finance the pressing. The rest is history.

Look I'm going to have to come clean, it was in fact me who pressed them on the Trans label, I was only 13 and still at school at the time but couldn't spell the word American so I just used the first part. I used the money from my paper round to finance the pressing. The rest is history.

If only you'd said earlier, you could have saved two pages of going round in circles

Hi Pottsy

Yes, no problem with the Trans copy being Legitimate.

I just couldn't see it being pressed before the Orange Copy.

Is that what is being suggested. I would be shocked if it was,

but ? ................ anyone

Hello Roger,

I was shocked as well Roger, but like John always says, you have to look at the facts.

If they had pressed Aki Aleong, then Bob Relf on a yellow with the same telephone number on the label, as they did do. Then press a legit orange label with a different phone number (like we all want to believe). Then that would mean that 5 plus years later down the line when they did another legit repress for the UK demand that they had to go to the phone company & get the phone number back that they had years prior. Sorry

I'd like to be proved wrong, as I have 3 orange labels & only 1 yellow

Regards,

Pottsy.

Hello Roger,

I was shocked as well Roger, but like John always says, you have to look at the facts.

If they had pressed Aki Aleong, then Bob Relf on a yellow with the same telephone number on the label, as they did do. Then press a legit orange label with a different phone number (like we all want to believe). Then that would mean that 5 plus years later down the line when they did another legit repress for the UK demand that they had to go to the phone company & get the phone number back that they had years prior. Sorry

I'd like to be proved wrong, as I have 3 orange labels & only 1 yellow

Regards,

Pottsy.

"this threads blowing your minds to pieces"

Hello Roger,

I was shocked as well Roger, but like John always says, you have to look at the facts.

If they had pressed Aki Aleong, then Bob Relf on a yellow with the same telephone number on the label, as they did do. Then press a legit orange label with a different phone number (like we all want to believe). Then that would mean that 5 plus years later down the line when they did another legit repress for the UK demand that they had to go to the phone company & get the phone number back that they had years prior. Sorry

I'd like to be proved wrong, as I have 3 orange labels & only 1 yellow

Regards,

Pottsy.

Hi Pottsy

So it would come down to who had the Orange Labels done, and when.

I have 2 Orange Labels and 0 Yellow.

The Trans-American - Trans - Trans-American is still a puzzle.

Why did they keep changing names if you follow the Telephone Number, route.

Edited July 24, 200718 yr by 45cellar

Hello Roger,

I was shocked as well Roger, but like John always says, you have to look at the facts.

If they had pressed Aki Aleong, then Bob Relf on a yellow with the same telephone number on the label, as they did do. Then press a legit orange label with a different phone number (like we all want to believe). Then that would mean that 5 plus years later down the line when they did another legit repress for the UK demand that they had to go to the phone company & get the phone number back that they had years prior. Sorry

I'd like to be proved wrong, as I have 3 orange labels & only 1 yellow

Regards,

Pottsy.

A few years back when I ordered some new buisiness letter heads they arrived from the printers with my old phone number on.I had forgoten to update the printer when I ordered.My fault.No arguments,I just had to cough up again for a re-run.However,if I had made the same cock up knowing no-one would ever need an up to date telephone number anyway, (like the Bob Relf scenario),would I have bothered spending on a re-run?

Just a possible solution ?

A few years back when I ordered some new buisiness letter heads they arrived from the printers with my old phone number on.I had forgoten to update the printer when I ordered.My fault.No arguments,I just had to cough up again for a re-run.However,if I had made the same cock up knowing no-one would ever need an up to date telephone number anyway, (like the Bob Relf scenario),would I have bothered spending on a re-run?

Just a possible solution ?

Martyn,

But if we follow what you have just suggested the orange release would then have the 213-384-9334 number on them, but they don't.

pottsy.

It's really interesting all this - confusing, but interesting.

We is all geeks with macs!

Martyn,

But if we follow what you have just suggested the orange release would then have the 213-384-9334 number on them, but they don't.

pottsy.

Not if they had changed numbers between the yellow & the orange,but returned to the same printer for the yellow Trans release who took the number from the original yellow label?

Not if they had changed numbers between the yellow & the orange,but returned to the same printer for the yellow Trans release who took the number from the original yellow label?

We're not talking about a few weeks later, or even a few months, if Paul Mooney & John Manship are correct, & I cant see for one minute why they're not, we're talking 5+ years later.

We can speculate, or more to the point you can, but all I just did was laid the facts down that we have at hand.

We're not talking about a few weeks later, or even a few months, if Paul Mooney & John Manship are correct, & I cant see for one minute why they're not, we're talking 5+ years later.

We can speculate, or more to the point you can, but all I just did was laid the facts down that we have at hand.

Agreed mate,I'm only speculating.There has to be some rhyme & reason to the telephone number change & (alleged) change back though.

Not if they had changed numbers between the yellow & the orange,but returned to the same printer for the yellow Trans release who took the number from the original yellow label?

Does a printer keep copies of work he's done? From years earlier? Or does he rely on a piece bought in by his customer?

hi all, i think nev is having my orange copy as the consensus is that its real and as pottsy sayes FLOATES!!! he might have remembered seeing it as it was in my box in that dungeon in cockneyville ,but it was so dark you had a job to see anything, alright then thats my excuse anyway!!!!

he cerainly is Ezzie

just waiting on a late payer myself.

but my word is my bond,if i says i is gonna have it ,i will deffo have it!

nev

p.s amazing how far this thread has come from a simple enquiry..Brilliant stuff guys.

good job we arent a jury hearing a city fraud case!!!!!!!!!!!!! GO ORANGE IS WHAT I SAY>>>YELLOW ALL LOOK DODGY DESPITE THE FACTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Does a printer keep copies of work he's done? From years earlier? Or does he rely on a piece bought in by his customer?

Well my printer certainly keeps my letter heads,compliment slips,invoices,quotation forms on file.Ijust phone up when I need a run.After all,he owns the artwork.