Tlscapital

What specific source mentions that exactly ? A name ? It's a "tell tale" I've read here and there but without a name to back it up some or to counter verify... Numbers evidently don't add up in my book neither. Like you I'd have believe more than double that of copies just in circulation plus those still sitting uncovered.

The sellers blurb sounds genuine to me and he mentions a certain L. Allen rathe that a Larry ! But he evidently tries to sell a L. Allen copy... The snippet on the other hand is some words spread here and there on the net and borrowed as a "tell tale". How true is all that in real ?

Many examples as such where people give wrongly an "alternative" press the "first" press annotation because then, or just to them, it's rarer as "unusual" and so... But not ! Sometimes at least it's not the case. In this case many leads are not so reassuring about the Larry Allen copies I feel.

Well, they're both done at the same pressing plant. Some copies of the Larry Allen sold on the eVilBay over the years and few were in not so great shape. But that doesn't tell something when there's money to be made... Not implying this is necessary the case here, but it could also be some forgery. Mind you beside the different shade of green print, the Larry versus the L. and the move of the 'Jerry Reed Production' credits either at bottom or middle right, I love the annotation on the real 'A' side under the L. Allen 'and a band of angels'. Why this change ? For 'air play' clearer presentation ? This could be and explain why more copies of the Larry Allen came out later and cleaner as the 'second' release success wouldn't have made it to the sales and poped-up later as NOS. Only a theory but they looks so close to each one another it's hard to tell if they're really contemporary or not. Hence from this previous tread a Dave Thorley comment; The Label was owned by the same guy that owned Jeree records, Jerry Reed. The studio was still open up until a few years ago and you could walk in and just chat to Jerry and the other guys there. The studio was a contract studio, where they would record anyone that walked in the door and paid their money. As part of the deal they could arrange records to be pressed or just put it out on the Jeree label.

My first copy 20 years ago was a L. Allen bought directly from the USA in G+ condition. Worn and scruffy from a rough life but still playable with snaps and pops. Then I manage to trade a L. Allen copy in Ex condition from a UK seller who said that he had just "upgraded"his copy for a rarer Larry Allen one. But when I finally got to see a Larry Allen copy I remained unimpressed. Few years ago I was reading stories on here on Soul Source with knowledgeable people like Dave Thorley about the L. Allen copies first being found and brought from the USA. After what some Larry Allen copies started surfacing... as a rarer, supposedly first pressing with the full name... But with the 'A' side of 'somewhere there is paradise' for the L. Allen and a Band of Angels credits...

So the Smith Brothers were 4 members then of whom 3 were brothers. Eugene Johnson, Donald Smith, Jesse Smith & John Smith. So 'D.J. Smith' could still be any of them 3... Or them 3 actually ?

OK, song 'on the wild' and 'wishing'. Miss Chandler and a certain D.J. Smith... But no. Not even after some digging around on the net.

Which songs ? D.J. Smith the hockey player born in 1977 ?

Another Smith Brothers 45 on Shield from 1976 (so no need to change the name to the Magnificents unless one wants to hide) has the most complete publisher's of any; Companies, etc. Distributed By – T.K. Productions, Inc. Produced For – Just Productions, Inc. Phonographic Copyright (p) – Shield Records Published By – Bon Jose Music Published By – Tippy Music Published By – Sherlyn Pub. Published By – Daedalian Music Published By – Baku Music Credits Arranged By – Jack Ashford Producer – Jack Ashford

That dark blue common design of the MAM (while still running only outside of the USA by then though) is a made up picture done by the guy who posted that YT video. Cheap trick using that Gilbert O'Sullivan single, blanking out the credits and date of release using the most unconvincing fonts the put the band name and title credits... None of those 3 MAMs being the Magnificent & Miko have released dates on them... Unlike the major MAM London distributed label. I still don't see any match between those two labels. Not even their pressing plant. I wouldn't be surprised if Jack was just "playing" around some with all of that. And indeed present them as "new" releases.

Why those two Smith Brothers track ? Likely because they where the most recently recorded from 1974. Why the Perfections and Eddie Parker ? Maybe because they where amongst their best sellers from their back catalogue. And as I said as a guess maybe as an attempt to see if that could open a breach for the British sixties northern soul market... Which it did not evidently. But little did the American boy know the British phenomenon. How could he ? Why the change of names and publishers ? My guess is in order to pass by unnoticed and cash on in alone. But none of that change the fate into success. And I am still weary of the involvement of the major MAM here... It's odd.

OK, back on track 😉; let's not forget that late Lorraine Chandler was not aware of those releases on MAM until recently (few years back) and was naturally a bit upset on that matter having to recall those years made of share and a split up with Jack Ashford topped with such low "betrayal". Was Jack Ashford intentionally trying to cash in solo and doing so tried to do so behind some smoke screen ? So these are very troubled waters we're diving into since the materials use to be part of the ex-couple partnership in music. The 3 singles on MAM/Miko/Magnificent, the only ones with that design, not mentioning the same publisher's nor London records or even Epic as the major MAM did, are all alternate takes/recordings of previously released sides but for one never released before 'but if you must go'...

No, not you solely Mister Robbk. If indeed you 'responded' reusing that idea, which I only believe to be not correct, don't know for a fact though, is a wrong assumption I believe. So I was trying to bring another light on the OP of these records that I love and don't own BTW. So if ever you come ro stumble across them I'll be willing to unload them from you 😶 And we all know your aversion of post 1969 record production by now 🤢 Now 1969 is it ? I remember you saying 1967 some years ago 😛 or even something like by March 1966 since that day the face of the world change 🤯 and the plot against good music made for Robbk proved to be unstoppable. David against Goliath but David with no fight in him 😉

But is that MAM/Magnificent/Miko records Jack Ashford's own (one out of others) really linked to that infamous MAM (London Distributed) British label founded by a certain Gordon Mills and sponsored by Tom Jones and Engelpert Humperdinck ? If going by the Discogs discography of the label, MAM USA was then, by 1976, DEAD ! Or non producing/releasing in the USA anymore. UK and non USA pressings still going on. And the following productions in the USA was merely badged 'MAM' on Epic. Assuming MAM made a deal with small act like Eddie Parker "surfing" on the UK Northern Soul front trying to jump in the wagon or something that desperate, nothing on this (fantastic pop-cartoon logo IMO) small run label links this MAM to the major MAM.

Well I've read that the Smith Brothers and the Magnificents have slight musical variations as well. Begging the question if it's a mastering job doing that or are they other/alternative takes. The same for the Perfections actually that I never could compare...

Yes, different takes.

Joe Matthews's tone pitch is similar but indeed his singing phrasing is more melodic. If Billy Kennedy's tone and syncope way of singing is similar, like almost talking, he still doesn't groan at all. And if Emmanuel Laskey timber is of the lower kind; he groans, talk and has that 'tremolo' in his voice... Aftermath; Emmanuel Laskey sounds more of a match in comparison with the other pair after closer attention. IMHO. Maybe one needs to listens to Emmanuel Laskey's 'I've got to run for my life' to compare "similarities" even if pitched up. Sounding like it could even be from the same studio session.

Well yes. The thing is that I read that whole subject's comment a while ago as a 'theory'. Yet the only record to my ears where Joe sings almost like that is his 'nothing you can do'. But Spyder's imposter 'he's good enough for me' might have been pitched up in speed. Where if it's Emmanel's voice it sound 'pinched' some and more of "higher" tone somehow. So it could very well be Emmanuel's distinctive groaning there and not Joe's doing it.

Yes and indeed the instant reaction of the public and broadcasting channels of his 'stand by me' prompted M-G-M to get a 'rush commercial release' but without further Spyder's own material to flip his 'infamous gimmick' record. So they borrowed, likely as Robbk pointed out through Clay McMurray but also through Spyder's own connections as he was familiar/friend with those at Thelma's & Co., a tape featuring one of Joe Matthews unused track...

Thanks for this OP that turns out to be of educative for me. Although I have always understood the importance of the composer, and loved to read her name in brackets under those explicit/univoqued titles. Yet never was I totally impressed by many of her actual singing recordings. But 'stone good lover' evidently conquered me the first time I heard it. Those Mike Terry arrangements are class***** Now I got to dig 'I who loves you so' ('I feel an urge' never did it for me really, sorry boys 😜), 'there's not too many left like him' is rather good and 'I got the vibes' is enjoyable. So 4 tunes of her in my collection is not much for this none the less fantastic and prolific artist. A 5th is still missing that I know for a long time now; her 90's modern soul silky sleeper 'won't you join the band'. But I still wait and hope to get a cheaper copy than that those proposed on the net. So I did NOT know that she is/was Deena Johnson... If I read it before I guess I did not take that for a reliable 'source'. Never got excited by her Simpson sides. Although 'the breaking point' was a record on my 'wants' at one time, this changed the day I got to hear Brad Lundy's version 😮. But at least now I know that Deena is/was Jo. And I can link those records that I play and love to those/other's of her that I don't appreciate as much and picture a mental 'map' of the who's, where and what with a little story to tell to those who might care for if ever. Thanks a bunch Y'all !

There use to be a tab for the OP to click-on once he/she got his/hers quest 'ANSWERED'... 😋

Fantastic ! Cheers for that. Any luck on your quest for a stocker of LaBrenda Ben on Motown ? BTW my Gordy WDJ copy has the same matrix as your Discogs entry edit.

🤠

Does anybody knows what's that 'DR' (direct release ?) handwriting that frequently appears on some 1961 up to 1963 smaller acts on Tamla, Motown and Gordy 45's releases from the Terre Haute pressing plant ? RobbK and other's help is welcome to shed some light on this long unsolved to me yet mystery... 😉