Hi everyone

The current thread on Margaret Little got me thinking about so-called 'vanity recordings'.

I guess 'vanity recordings' probably fall into two categories:

1) Person sets up own label to release own song for 'vanity' purposes.

2) Another person releases someone else's recording for that other person's 'vanity' purposes.

In general 'vanity recording' seems to be a derogatory term - the person can't sing, or has a bad song, but has enough money or the 'right' contacts so they can still put out a record.

Here is an example of what I think is a 'vanity' release.

Ray Bailey owned Bailey Records in Detroit - best known for a much better release by Gino Johnson. However, this one is pretty much rubbish - but then, it was his own label

Got any others Soulsourcers?

Cheers

Richard

Ray Bailey & United Five - Hollywood Part 1 (Bailey 8109 A)

https://soundcloud.com/user1502162/ray-bailey-united-five

Edited December 22, 201212 yr by Premium Stuff

Hi everyone

The current thread on Margaret Little got me thinking about so-called 'vanity recordings'.

I guess 'vanity recordings' probably fall into two categories:

1) Person sets up own label to release own song for 'vanity' purposes.

2) Another person releases someone else's recording for that other person's 'vanity' purposes.

In general 'vanity recording' seems to be a derogatory term - the person can't sing, or has a bad song, but has enough money or the 'right' contacts so they can still put out a record.

Here is an example of what I think is a 'vanity' release.

Ray Bailey owned Bailey Records in Detroit - best known for a much better release by Gino Johnson. However, this one is pretty much rubbish - but then, it was his own label

Got any others Soulsourcers?

Cheers

Richard

Ray Bailey & United Five - Hollywood Part 1 (Bailey 8109 A)

https://soundcloud.com/user1502162/ray-bailey-united-five

What a waste of a decent backing track. The Gino Johnson recording was quite nice.

Brings to mind Dora Hall, and her Calamo, Cozy and Reinbeau labels funded by her multi-millionaire husband, owner of the Solo Cup Company.

https://youtu.be/dPoBTToXBLo

Edited December 22, 201212 yr by RobbK

What a waste of a decent backing track. The Gino Johnson recording was quite nice.

That's it Robb - exactly - the backing track isn't too bad - bit of a teaser as it could have been half-decent - but they had the chance and screwed it up all for vanity

Cheers

Richard

Edited December 22, 201212 yr by Premium Stuff

The Knights and Arthur made some pretty decent vanity records, which could have been much better with a "real" professional lead singer. The other group members were a solid Soul group, and the always used some of the best philadelphia musicians, and arrangers, and they sang great songs written by Curtis Mayfield, and other top Chicago and Philadelphia Soul music writers.

Edited December 22, 201212 yr by RobbK

Hi everyone

The current thread on Margaret Little got me thinking about so-called 'vanity recordings'.

I guess 'vanity recordings' probably fall into two categories:

1) Person sets up own label to release own song for 'vanity' purposes.

2) Another person releases someone else's recording for that other person's 'vanity' purposes.

In general 'vanity recording' seems to be a derogatory term - the person can't sing, or has a bad song, but has enough money or the 'right' contacts so they can still put out a record.

Here is an example of what I think is a 'vanity' release.

Ray Bailey owned Bailey Records in Detroit - best known for a much better release by Gino Johnson. However, this one is pretty much rubbish - but then, it was his own label

Got any others Soulsourcers?

Cheers

Richard

I'm pretty sure I've talked about this before...vanity recording is not meant to be derogatory as vanity is commonly used.

Back in the 1960s, most decent sized cities had recording studios where for a flat rate, you could record anything you wanted, and arrange to have the recordings made into a record. So if a person could scrape together the money, they could make a record. The people at the studio would pretty much let you record what you want, only giving help in terms of miking, setting amp levels, etc. A lot of garage bands were playing music that was not especially liked by the older generation who ran the studios but they put up with it as they were simply running a business and the teenagers were one of the main customer bases.

So, for a price of $300 or so you could spend 2 hours recording, have the studio send the tape (or acetate) to a pressing plant* and have 300 or 500 records made.

*some studios had their own pressing plants as part of the operation - but this was the exception, not the norm

The label on the record could be a generic name for the studio, or a name selected by the client. A client selected name would likely be a one - off name that was for their record to be never used again.

These one off label names are more common for garage and country records than soul records. Many of the names represent something like peoples initials, places they lived, etc.

Records with these one off label names are not to be considered 'record labels'. There's a lot of web sites that have a misguided concept on what a 'record label' is and how they are to be documented, listing numerous single entry 'record labels' that never existed except written on a pressing order sheet.

There are also records that were home recorded and where the artists sent their self recorded tape to a pressing plant without any third party.

The records I've described are what I consider 'vanity records'.

A good example that explains this is the Shaddows 45 on United Audio. They were a self contained band, mostly students at Harding High School in Warren, Ohio. A man they knew with some cash put up money to finance a recording. The band went to United Audio recording studio in Youngstown and recorded the two songs. The studio arranged the pressing at QCA in Cincinnati and a few weeks after they recorded the songs, the band was sent the 500 or 1000 copies of the record directly. They sold record at a couple local record stores on consignment, their live dances, and at their school(s). The record had the United Audio label that was used by any of the clients who recorded at the studio - including garage bands, gospel, country, pop crooners, polka bands, etc. The records were never sent to distributors or radio stations (except for a couple local stations that had the records hand delivered by the band).

Anyways, I've written myself tired. Hope this helps

George, well presented.

A lot of lesser known South east beach / soul influenced garage sounds were done this way. Arthur Smith Studios and others did loads of 'custom' one offs for these artists, which explains fairly obscure 'releases' often in 500 lots max, given to the band to do with what they will, sometimes some to the band to give away - and occasionally a few to the local radio station. The Chashers "Without my girl" on Uncle was very likely one of these, recorded at Mark V studios. The cane on the label logo was apparently the lead singers stage cane (a la JB). No other 'releases' on the label.

Another example is Novas Nine "Pain / Why listen" on Heritage, pre-ABC, this was an Arthur Smith custom job. See very few of these around.

Edited December 23, 201212 yr by Windlesoul

What a waste of a decent backing track. The Gino Johnson recording was quite nice.

Brings to mind Dora Hall, and her Calamo, Cozy and Reinbeau labels funded by her multi-millionaire husband, owner of the Solo Cup Company.

https://youtu.be/dPoBTToXBLo

Hi Robb

I always though there might be an interesting story here though. Even though she covered many Pop standards, she also covered a fair more obscure soul/R&B titles. Why, where did she hear them etc, etc

As informative as always Robb

Dave

Another example springs to mind is Anthony Renfro's version of "I'm Scheming" on Renfro, his vocal is shocking!

Hi Robb

I always though there might be an interesting story here though. Even though she covered many Pop standards, she also covered a fair more obscure soul/R&B titles. Why, where did she hear them etc, etc

As informative as always Robb

Dave

I've seen the overall list of Dora Hall's record releases. MOST of her songs were MOR Pop music. She sang remakes of maybe 15-17 "Soul" songs. But, from what I remember NONE of them were "obscure". All of them charted, and, more importantly, I believe ALL were not only Soul chat hits, but ALL were pop chart hits ("I Heard It Through The Grapevine", "Groovin' ", "Barefootin' ", etc.). I don't remember her singing any songs that didn't make the Pop charts. She lived in Chicago. I imagine she heard those songs on WLS. I doubt that she listened to WVON.

Do you remember, offhand, any "obscure" Soul songs she sang (released either on 45 or LP)?

Good info - thanks guys

What are the main Northern Soul so-called 'vanity recordings' that are played on the scene or collected - are there any?

Cheers

Richard

Here's a link to the first page of a 3-page discography of all Dora Hall's releases:

https://www.discogs.com/artist/Dora+Hall

I saw only MOR Pop, old standards and a few Soul/pop crossover hits. What's interesting is that her husband spent many, many thousands of dollars on recording her and producing TV specials starring Dora. with guest stars such as Frank Sinatra Junior, Rosey Grier and others. It was quite laughable. You can watch all her TV shows on video.

My god Robb - what are you trying to do to us That version of Barefootin' is total ruggish

Are there any credible, good quality vanity recordings played on the scene?

Cheers

Richard

My god Robb - what are you trying to do to us That version of Barefootin' is total ruggish

Are there any credible, good quality vanity recordings played on the scene?

Cheers

Richard

Wasn't Nabay a vanity record?

Wasn't Nabay a vanity record?

Good answer - keep 'em coming folks

Richard

I'm certain a shed-load of releases were actually paid for by the singer or done as favours - look at most label listings and there will be oddballs within them.

Without hard evidence it's difficult to make anything but assumptions.

A high proportion of non main label gospel cuts were vanity recordings.

The group / singer would perform week in week out on the 'church circuit' and lots of times their manager / leader would arrange to go into a studio to allow them to cut a 45 / LP for them to sell at their gigs.

Many were made at the same studios and released on the same labels (the studios house label; Designer, Champ, Rae Cox, Crown Ltd, Sound of Birmingham, Bright Star, Boddies labels out of Cleveland, etc).

We've had a few threads on here about said studios / labels / records. Many are great and a few have been played on the soul scene.

Edited December 30, 201212 yr by Roburt

A high proportion of non main label gospel cuts were vanity recordings.

The group / singer would perform week in week out on the 'church circuit' and lots of times their manager / leader would arrange to go into a studio to allow them to cut a 45 / LP for them to sell at their gigs.

Church gigs...profits into the donations box, I assume?!

Church gigs...profits into the donations box, I assume?!

Gospel groups / singers would tour all over the US playing gigs in local black churches. They would be 'paid' for these shows and usually 'put up' / fed in the homes of members of each church's congregation in turn.

It was only the big gospel acts that played 'proper halls' / theatres, all the rest played most of their gigs in churches.

Weird thing was (from my point of view), the male singers had many fanatical fans and even attracted a 'groupie following'.

So they would leave a trail of babies behind them, hardly very church like.

I believe Carrie Cleveland's records could be considered vanity records that are played on the "scene". As I understand it they were home recorded with her husband in their home studio in Oakland, which probably explains their charmingly amateur arrangements. The "Make Love To Me/I Need Love" 45 on Audio Ent was financed by Carrie. 50 promo copies that are the ones with the better mix without the cheesy organ in the forefront, then 100 copies of the organ mix or something close to that.

Weren't all The Knights and Arthur's recordings vanity recordings? The guy, (Krass) had a large business in Philadelphia that could help him pay for his singing hobby. I guess he fancied himself a "Soul singer". He couldn't sing, but had a professional Soul backup group and used the best Philadelphia arrangers and session musicians and songwriters (and also Curtis Mayfield songs). He had lots of money to fund them. Here is his version of The Impressions' "Man Oh Man":

There was also this release on Landa:

Edited December 30, 201212 yr by RobbK

Hi Robb

I always though there might be an interesting story here though. Even though she covered many Pop standards, she also covered a fair more obscure soul/R&B titles. Why, where did she hear them etc, etc

As informative as always Robb

Dave

Many Dora Hall recordings were arranged by H.B. Barnum.

Happy new year everyone...!

Dora Hall's version of Yolanda and the Charmaines Hoochi Koochi Girl isn't actually that bad (and a good example of a fairly obscure r'n'b track for her to have covered)

Dora Hall's version of Yolanda and the Charmaines Hoochi Koochi Girl isn't actually that bad (and a good example of a fairly obscure r'n'b track for her to have covered)

Hi Micheal

Dora Hall's version of Yolanda and the Charmaines Hoochi Koochi Girl isn't actually that bad (and a good example of a fairly obscure r'n'b track for her to have covered)

Yes! That's obscure enough. I didn't know she sang that.

Did not Billy Arnell Tough Girl on Holly come under this heading? Seem to recall a story similar to that about Tough Girl. Also regarding Nabay I am sure he was from the Middle East and needed to either fund his fare home or something similar?? Maybe he actually owed money!! Cant recall the story just now.

Boba might know more but Geraldine De Haas outa Chicago can't sing for toffee so is a contender. Also Marilyn Barbarin outa New Orleans aint great IMO.

The Rodd Keith records could be classed as vanity recordings - amateur song/poem writers sent the words in to the label and they were set to stock tunes.