I'm working on a set sale atm, and wanted to ask just to be sure: Anyone ever encountered a boot of an issue copy of "rosemary, what happened", or is it only the demo copy that was booted?

And does anyone know what the matrix number were for the original demo and issue copies?

booted as demo's only.

I hate that record.....why would anyone want to boot it?

booted as demo's only.

thanks for the info!

The labels on the original have a more matt finish and there's a stamp which isn't on the pressing, unfortunately I haven't got one at the moment did have about 3 months ago and remember comparing it then

I hate that record.....why would anyone want to boot it?

Because it's a classic

Because it's a classic

...So is the Carstairs, Pete

...So is the Carstairs, Pete

saw that one coming

I'm working on a set sale atm, and wanted to ask just to be sure: Anyone ever encountered a boot of an issue copy of "rosemary, what happened", or is it only the demo copy that was booted?

And does anyone know what the matrix number were for the original demo and issue copies?

Matrix

Vocal

Scratched in Matrix on the Stock Copy

"W ---------------- KA - 15218 -11 ---------------- LW ---------------- AT"

The "LW" is on it's side. & the Matrix all happens within in one half (180 degrees) of the DeadWax.

I'm not sure which Label Variations were used for this one.

i.e. The Soul Twins had a few different DEMO's

I hope that this helps.

...So is the Carstairs, Pete

...in your opinion maybe

Spot on as always...looks like my copy's 100% orignal. Thx!

Matrix

Vocal

Scratched in Matrix on the Stock Copy

"W ---------------- KA - 15218 -11 ---------------- LW ---------------- AT"

The "LW" is on it's side. & the Matrix all happens within in one half (180 degrees) of the DeadWax.

I'm not sure which Label Variations were used for this one.

i.e. The Soul Twins had a few different DEMO's

I hope that this helps.

...in your opinion maybe

No, it is a classic, whether you like it or not (and of course I know you don't) - frankly I'm not as in love with it as most people on here are, either. There are a lot of other records that don't yank my chain, but I'd still call 'em 'classics', from "Space Oddity" to "Let's Get It On".

I don;t think 'Rosemary's a classic though, it'll always be just an interesting novelty record to me...

No, it is a classic, whether you like it or not (and of course I know you don't) - frankly I'm not as in love with it as most people on here are, either. There are a lot of other records that don't yank my chain, but I'd still call 'em 'classics', from "Space Oddity" to "Let's Get It On".

I don;t think 'Rosemary's a classic though, it'll always be just an interesting novelty record to me...

I like Space Oddity more than Rosemary..

Spot on as always...looks like my copy's 100% orignal. Thx!

No problem, Anytime.

Pleased that your copy is an Original.

I like Space Oddity more than Rosemary..

Oh, that's a bit harsh!

Oh, that's a bit harsh!

No, he only mentioned space oddity because he knows I used to be a massive Bowie fan/collector

I like Space Oddity more than Rosemary..

So do I!

I don't think 'Rosemary's a classic though, it'll always be just an interesting novelty record to me...

Never been so keen on the vocal side (which obviously has something of a "novelty" lyric about it), but remember it was originally played exclusively as an instrumental in '74, and that side does has a unique haunting quality when you hear it loud I think. It was certainly HUGE first time around anyway, being held in equally high regard as the likes of Major Harris etc. and during the final months of the Catacombs, the instrumental of "Rosemary What Happened" sounded very creepy indeed echoing down those long corridors!

I always felt that "Lost Time" on ABC (1975) had a similar feel to "Rosemary" and given the evocative titles, that haunting/nostalgic instrumentation is obviously a deliberate part of the production, unique to Pocorn Wylie perhaps.

I never even knew it WAS bootlegged myself! Same time as Life perhaps? (Original demos should be fairly easy to spot though 'cause everyone had 'em autographed at Hinckley!)

Edited July 7, 200717 yr by mel brat

I like Space Oddity more than Rosemary..

Why am I not suprised by that...?

I wonder If Sir Bob,heard this before he recorded I dont like Mondays.It is in the same vain.

Kev

I never even knew it WAS bootlegged myself! Same time as Life perhaps? (Original demos should be fairly easy to spot though 'cause everyone had 'em autographed at Hinckley!)

No this was a late one - it was done after it had already been released on Grapevine and it hadn't been done by the time I stooped going to Wigan which was end of summer 78 - same as the Pointer Sisters on Atlantic, bootlegged on Wright Sounds in 77, the other two Atlantic boots didn't come til much later

Think its a take it or leave sort of sound : although with Popcorn Wylies pedigree and workbase respect is due ; but there again anything is better than the White Wigan pop brigade -see the growing Casino White Pop appreciation society on YouTube have placed the likes of Holly Shit James -opps sorry St James ,Ruth Swann , Bobby Paris etc etc as Northern Soul Classics ; classics my arse - and they used to call the Mecca for going funky - lol . You wouldnt be one of those Wigan White Popsters would you Mr Smith if you think "Space oddity" is better than "Rosemary What Happened ". Sure you appreciate the real Northern Soul as played at Blackpool and the Ritz !!!! The real people that kept the real faith .

Nigel S

No this was a late one - it was done after it had already been released on Grapevine and it hadn't been done by the time I stooped going to Wigan which was end of summer 78 - same as the Pointer Sisters on Atlantic, bootlegged on Wright Sounds in 77, the other two Atlantic boots didn't come til much later

Never been so keen on the vocal side (which obviously has something of a "novelty" lyric about it), but remember it was originally played exclusively as an instrumental in '74, and that side does has a unique haunting quality when you hear it loud I think. It was certainly HUGE first time around anyway, being held in equally high regard as the likes of Major Harris etc. and during the final months of the Catacombs, the instrumental of "Rosemary What Happened" sounded very creepy indeed echoing down those long corridors!

I always felt that "Lost Time" on ABC (1975) had a similar feel to "Rosemary" and given the evocative titles, that haunting/nostalgic instrumentation is obviously a deliberate part of the production, unique to Pocorn Wylie perhaps.

I never even knew it WAS bootlegged myself! Same time as Life perhaps? (Original demos should be fairly easy to spot though 'cause everyone had 'em autographed at Hinckley!)

Rosemary (what happened) ive seen soulies fall over each other to get on the floor bit of a mind blowing sound when ur standing in the que at boots chemist.

Billy

Ive got great memorys,of Rosemary what happened,but where did the years go

Kev

Edited July 7, 200717 yr by good angel

Ive got great memorys,of Rosemary what happened, but where did the years go

Kev

I really have no idea. (Pass the Sanatogen!)

The man himself. Richard Popcorn Wylie at Hinkley (exclusive!)

Edited July 8, 200717 yr by mel brat

Rosemary (what happened) ive seen soulies fall over each other to get on the floor bit of a mind blowing sound when ur standing in the que at Boots chemist.

Billy

...for Viagra and botox injections...(!?)

Edited July 8, 200717 yr by mel brat

Wasn't too keen on Rosemary at first, as mentioned, the inst was first played. I remember comments about the guitar lead "Feckin' led Zeplin music" etc.

I also remember a well loved guy on the scene who is no longer with us, flogging copies of "Rosemarys Baby Original Soundtrack" LP at Wigan . A bit naughty there Pete!

Paul

Think its a take it or leave sort of sound : although with Popcorn Wylies pedigree and workbase respect is due ; but there again anything is better than the White Wigan pop brigade -see the growing Casino White Pop appreciation society on YouTube have placed the likes of Holly Shit James -opps sorry St James ,Ruth Swann , Bobby Paris etc etc as Northern Soul Classics ; classics my arse - and they used to call the Mecca for going funky - lol . You wouldnt be one of those Wigan White Popsters would you Mr Smith if you think "Space oddity" is better than "Rosemary What Happened ". Sure you appreciate the real Northern Soul as played at Blackpool and the Ritz !!!! The real people that kept the real faith .

Nigel S

Whats it to you if I like a David Bowie record?

If you asked me to pick one or the other to take with me to a desert island I'd pick Space Oddity as a rock selection and some other northern record as a soul selection.

Doesn't mean I don't "appreciate" northern soul. Have you ever heard one of my rare northern podcasts, they p*ss on almost anything else you'll ever hear. or would you like to tell me exactly what I should like and what I should listen to?

...for Viagra and botox injections...(!?)

Viagra no problem in that department ,botox injections,can u get high on it lol.

Billy

I'm working on a set sale atm, and wanted to ask just to be sure: Anyone ever encountered a boot of an issue copy of "rosemary, what happened", or is it only the demo copy that was booted?

And does anyone know what the matrix number were for the original demo and issue copies?

i used to like spinning the instrumental of this ,i'm sure the grapevine release instro is slightly diifferent mix can anyone out there confirm this

i used to like spinning the instrumental of this ,i'm sure the grapevine release instro is slightly diifferent mix can anyone out there confirm this

Yes most definitely. I only have the Grapevine released instrumental on the compilation album, but it is lacking the haunting girlie vocal interjections that make the US original so appealing! (So the original US inst. version is a actually a "semi-instumental"!)

Yes most definitely. I only have the Grapevine released instrumental on the compilation album, but it is lacking the haunting girlie vocal interjections that make the US original so appealing! (So the original US inst. version is a actually a "semi-instumental"!)

thought so , do you know if the pressing is the same ?

thought so , do you know if the pressing is the same ?

Sorry, no idea about the pressing. (I hate bootlegs). As I said, I didn't even know there was one! I would have thought it would be the original mix though wouldn't it? I can't understand why it was bootlegged at all once it had come out on UK Grapevine, since it was the vocal side getting all the plays by then...

Yes most definitely. I only have the Grapevine released instrumental on the compilation album, but it is lacking the haunting girlie vocal interjections that make the US original so appealing! (So the original US inst. version is a actually a "semi-instumental"!)

The vocal side is also different, when the backing girlies sing the word "Rosemary" at the start, it's followed by an electric guitar riff on the original, on Grapevine they repeat the word "Rosemary" over the top of that riff. Doesn't sound much but the backing appears at different points on the reissue to the original and it caused a bit of a fuss at the time

Holly Shit James Bobby Paris etc etc as Northern Soul Classics ; classics my arse -

These happen to be decent tunes compared to some of the fcuking shite that was played at the Casino - and other venues over the years.

These happen to be decent tunes compared to some of the fcuking shite that was played at the Casino - and other venues over the years.

Yes it's easy to look back on those days with derision in these soul-filled times. Who gives a toss, we had great fun and didn't need to know what colour the singers skin was. I Walked Away is a tremendous northern soul record, I'd even class it as a soul record in it's own right.

david bowie ? is this a soul sight ?

These happen to be decent tunes compared to some of the fcuking shite that was played at the Casino - and other venues over the years.

Oh really. .......and what shite are we talking of? Court Davies?Elvis? Flirtations? Cecil Washington?Gary Lewis?Mel Brit?Tim Tam?Anderson Bros?Deadbeats?Carol Anderson?...........All filled the floor in their day when people were less inclined to chin stroking & more inclined to dancing

Oh really. .......and what shite are we talking of? Court Davies?Elvis? Flirtations? Cecil Washington?Gary Lewis?Mel Brit?Tim Tam?Anderson Bros?Deadbeats?Carol Anderson?...........All filled the floor in their day when people were less inclined to chin stroking & more inclined to dancing

Whoever first played Gary Lewis & The Playboys should be publicly hung and the video shown on YouTube as a warning to others!

Edited July 12, 200717 yr by mel brat

Whoever first played Gary Lewis & The Playboys should be publicly hung and the video shown on YouTube as a warning to others!

...and that Richard Searling is such a nice chap as well, what a shame

Whoever first played Gary Lewis & The Playboys should be publicly hung and the video shown on YouTube as a warning to others!

The point I was trying to make was that the dancers used to decide what was good & what was bad,not someone sitting behind a keyboard with the benefit of 30 years hindsight !

You certainly wouldn't catch me doing that......... ..............

The point I was trying to make was that the dancers used to decide what was good & what was bad,not someone sitting behind a keyboard with the benefit of 30 years hindsight !

You certainly wouldn't catch me doing that......... ..............

I'm not sure the dancers did decide what was good and what wasn't. I used to hit the dancefloor on arrival and hardly be off it all night no matter what was played. I think the Riker Laboritories had more of an impact on what got danced to *coughs* for some people obviously not me

Whats it to you if I like a David Bowie record?

If you asked me to pick one or the other to take with me to a desert island I'd pick Space Oddity as a rock selection and some other northern record as a soul selection.

Doesn't mean I don't "appreciate" northern soul. Have you ever heard one of my rare northern podcasts, they p*ss on almost anything else you'll ever hear. or would you like to tell me exactly what I should like and what I should listen to?

Why you've got a big head !!! Sure you can fit it all on this forum . For some one that was going around smashing up the Carstairs Northern Classic ,I dont know if I want to listen to your podcast. Nobodys telling you what to listen to ; just seems mighty odd that you preach to people about records like Carstairs and other 70s Mecca real soul gems, which you make clear you dont like .

Are didums you took offence did you - well thats your problem - you seemed to have dished it out in your time

These happen to be decent tunes compared to some of the fcuking shite that was played at the Casino - and other venues over the years.

Sorry Pete are we getting are wires crossed here - these true soul classics of the white pop nature were played at the Casino !! Isnt that what the Casinos played . And they had the gall to preach to the Mecca & Ritz about Soul !!

Yes it's easy to look back on those days with derision in these soul-filled times. Who gives a toss, we had great fun and didn't need to know what colour the singers skin was. I Walked Away is a tremendous northern soul record, I'd even class it as a soul record in it's own right.

I didnt know that we'd all particpated in a scene that was paying homage to white pop and cabaret soul acts .Thought when the scene evolved in the late 1960s it was about cutting edge black soul music . Good god , and for all these years I just listened to black music ,thinking I was keeping the faith - what ever did I miss . What was it Colin Curtis said ,"..certain venues(or venue!! ) managed to take a wonderful vibrant scene which searched out new and creative black soul music , and instead turn it into a preservation society .. "

My god Holly St James against Bessie Banks ; Bobby (Mr Las Vegas) Paris against Voices of East Harlem - is there any comparison .

Soul filled times now . They were "Soul filled times " then ;but there again I suppose it depended where you went to dance to your "real soul music" !

I didnt know that we'd all particpated in a scene that was paying homage to white pop and cabaret soul acts .Thought when the scene evolved in the late 1960s it was about cutting edge black soul music . Good god , and for all these years I just listened to black music ,thinking I was keeping the faith - what ever did I miss . What was it Colin Curtis said ,"..certain venues(or venue!! ) managed to take a wonderful vibrant scene which searched out new and creative black soul music , and instead turn it into a preservation society .. "

My god Holly St James against Bessie Banks ; Bobby (Mr Las Vegas) Paris against Voices of East Harlem - is there any comparison .

Soul filled times now . They were "Soul filled times " then ;but there again I suppose it depended where you went to dance to your "real soul music" !

David & The Giants(both tracks) Mecca

The Present Many's The Slip(According to levine the vocal to bak To Back) Mecca

Country Store Caught with My Heart down-Mecca

MVPs Turning My heartbeat Up-Mecca

The Black Abbots(Russ Abbot) The Painter(covered up as Eddie Foster I am The Painter)-Mecca

Wombat gettin'On Life borrowed off a mate of mine & played by Levine

And many others I can't remember at this time.

Wigan did fall by the POP wayside at times, but during 74-76 when I attended both venues on a regular basis, Mecca with it's forward thinking policy, was playing the same records in the highland room as was played downstairs in the Bali Hi. Ester Phillips What a difference, George Benson Supership, Hubert Laws Etc. I attended venues to hear predominantly Soul records with a 60's uptmpo style that were not the tracks played at your normal run of the mill disco.

Also don't forget that the Wheel type era, although the sound were mainly soul acts many big sounds by white artist were also played.Charlie Rich, Ronnie Milsap, Round Robin, Mitch Ryder etc.

I may be wrong in my thinking, but essenially "Northern Soul" is a scene, not an actual musical Genre.

There are many typical Northern soul records, but the music played on the scene through the years, covers many styles, and the only thing that links them is the fact that they were played on the scene, and to a greater or lesser extent accepted by the people that matter, not the DJs, but the paying public.

I would rather dance to Tommy Sands "The Statue" than than kenny Lynch "Movin' Away", or for that matter Dr Buzzard.

but that is My opinion.

Paul

I have my faith & I will keep it in the same way I have kept it for about 38 years. But I will not tell other people how thiers should be kept

Yes most definitely. I only have the Grapevine released instrumental on the compilation album, but it is lacking the haunting girlie vocal interjections that make the US original so appealing! (So the original US inst. version is a actually a "semi-instumental"!)

i have an emi disc somewhere with this on and it is a different mix to the grapevine one 8th avenue band the whole thing on the b side which does nothing for me but i love rosemary

kev

I'm not sure the dancers did decide what was good and what wasn't. I used to hit the dancefloor on arrival and hardly be off it all night no matter what was played. I think the Riker Laboritories had more of an impact on what got danced to *coughs* for some people obviously not me

Fair Play.

Has anyone an email address for Mr Riker ? I need to ask him if Cheryl Ann is Shite

huh huh

Edited July 13, 200717 yr by martyn

Why you've got a big head !!! Sure you can fit it all on this forum . For some one that was going around smashing up the Carstairs Northern Classic ,I dont know if I want to listen to your podcast. Nobodys telling you what to listen to ; just seems mighty odd that you preach to people about records like Carstairs and other 70s Mecca real soul gems, which you make clear you dont like .

Are didums you took offence did you - well thats your problem - you seemed to have dished it out in your time

Oh dear here we go again. Rent-a-tosser are doing us proud this week.

Oh dear here we go again. Rent-a-tosser are doing us proud this week.

People in this office think I'm mad. I'm supposed to be writing a committee paper on the impact of the Gambling Act but this made me laugh out loud.