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Guest Roccia

Temptones - Ringleaders

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Guest Roccia

I was listening the Temptones "Girl I Love You" and it reminds me the Ringleaders "Baby What Has Happened To Our Love" especially the backing horns...

Have these two tunes any connection inbetween...?

TIA for any info...

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I was listening the Temptones "Girl I Love You" and it reminds me the Ringleaders "Baby What Has Happened To Our Love" especially the backing horns...

Have these two tunes any connection inbetween...?

TIA for any info...

None what so ever Roccia, One - Derful / M-Pac was Chicago based and Arctic was out of Philadelphia, also The Temptones were a Blue Eyed outfit i'll think you will find that Daryl Hall And John Oates of 'Hall and Oats' fame were group members of The Temptones and at a guess i would think The Ringleaders were of Afro American decent.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

Edited by Mark Bicknell

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I was listening the Temptones "Girl I Love You" and it reminds me the Ringleaders "Baby What Has Happened To Our Love" especially the backing horns...

Have these two tunes any connection inbetween...?

TIA for any info...

No idea, but the Ringleaders where from Chicago & The Temptones where from Philidelphia (Daryl Hall, of Hall & Oates fame on lead))

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No idea, but the Ringleaders where from Chicago & The Temptones where from Philidelphia (Daryl Hall, of Hall & Oates fame on lead))

I just said that well almost..was it just Daryl Hall or both of them...i knew there was some connection...lol

Mark Bicknell.

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Wernt the ringleaders the Nu-rons? or was that just done for the boot?

As far as i remember the nu-rons is only a test pressing?? with a few copys of that nocking about :lol:

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I just said that well almost..was it just Daryl Hall or both of them...i knew there was some connection...lol

Mark Bicknell.

He (Halll) is on the wirting credits too - but i seem to remember they put his name as 'Haul' or something like that.

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I just said that well almost..was it just Daryl Hall or both of them...i knew there was some connection...lol

Mark Bicknell.

Just Daryl Hall was a member of the Temptones although I might have read somewhere that Oates was used as a musician along the lines somewhere.

The Ringleaders were Willie Hawkins, Edgar Donahue, Vandy Lane and Brent Anderson.

Baz the Ringleader were previously known as 4 Temples and All Of My Life is the acetate.

Edited by chalky

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I just said that well almost..was it just Daryl Hall or both of them...i knew there was some connection...lol

Mark Bicknell.

Just Daryl, Oates was in the Masters from Philadelphia too. There's a CD of Artic stuff and in the sleeve notes there's a peach of a picture of the Temptones, 20 year old going on 70, sports jackets and think rimmed glasses. Called the Temptones in reverence of the Temptations.

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The Temptones were a blue-eyed soul group from Philadelphia, PA. Their recording career began while they attended college and lasted less than two years, from 1966 to 1967. Daryl Hall, who went on to superstardom with John Oates, debuted with the Temptones as their lead singer. The other members were Barry Glazer, Ken Halpern, Brian Utain, and Paul Fogel (considered the fifth Temptone). Oates joined the group toward their end playing rhythm guitar on live gigs; he never recorded with the Temptones.

The guys came in second on a James Brown Talent Show in Philadelphia at the Uptown Theater. The Godfather held the contest during his two-week engagement. The prize was a little cash and a recording contract with Arctic Records. Their contracts were signed as individuals and Gamble & Huff and Jimmy Bishop produced the recordings. According to Glazer, they would rehearse the songs then cut them live at Sigma Sound Studios in Philadelphia -- no overdubbing. Two recordings were released. Both stiffed and the association with Arctic ended. The group disbanded when one member left and another got drafted.

They were more popular live than their recordings, however. They played many gigs including two Freedom Shows in Philadelphia, the Uptown Theater, and several television shows including The Jerry Blavatt Show. Music comrades were the Vibrations, the Delfonics, the Intruders, the Temptations (Glazer called the late Paul Williams their sponsor), and fellow blue-eyed soul men, the Magnificent Men. Group members recall being booed when they first came on stage but always were applauded after being heard. Happy times included singing "Old Man River" (Temptations-style) in Philly at the Freedom Show for 10,000 people. Glazer went on to own a photo-processing lab, Paul Fogel became a doctor, and Daryl Hall became a star. In 1996, Bear Family Records in Germany released a 21-track CD of Temptone recordings. Some of the tunes are the Radiants' "Voice Your Choice," the Impressions' "I've Been Trying," and many Temptations songs. ~ Andrew Hamilton, All Music Guide

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Guest Roccia

Thanks for the infos, very interesting things, but have anyone noticed before, how these two tunes are similar...?

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I was listening the Temptones "Girl I Love You" and it reminds me the Ringleaders "Baby What Has Happened To Our Love" especially the backing horns...

Have these two tunes any connection inbetween...?

TIA for any info...

Sorry Roccia but you asked in your original post if there was a connection somewhere between the two 45's, they may sound similar but there is no musical or label connection between the two, two seperate records and groups from two different cities....the only connection if any is they are both stunning records.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

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Guest Roccia

Sorry Roccia but you asked in your original post if there was a connection somewhere between the two 45's, they may sound similar but there is no musical or label connection between the two, two seperate records and groups from two different cities....the only connection if any is they are both stunning records.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

Right Mark, two brilliant records... I've seen on JMs book the Temptones are tagged £400, is that still realistic nowaday...?

Anyway they are too similar to be just a coincidence...

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Sorry Roccia but you asked in your original post if there was a connection somewhere between the two 45's, they may sound similar but there is no musical or label connection between the two, two seperate records and groups from two different cities....the only connection if any is they are both stunning records.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

I think Roccia is missing the point in that they're bound to sound somewhat alike because that was the 'in' sound of the times, and groups and record labels wanted to emulate groups like the Tempatations because they were selling literaly millions of records. The Ringleaders sound like the Temptones who sound like the Accents who sound like the Volcanos who sound like the Blenders.etc..........and that's just those two label outfits.

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I think Roccia is missing the point in that they're bound to sound somewhat alike because that was the 'in' sound of the times, and groups and record labels wanted to emulate groups like the Tempatations because they were selling literaly millions of records. The Ringleaders sound like the Temptones who sound like the Accents who sound like the Volcanos who sound like the Blenders.etc..........and that's just those two label outfits.

I'm with Roccia on this one. They sound extremely similar and it's not as though one was a hit - as in the hundreds (well tens maybe...) of songs that sound like Uptight for example. Wouldn't be the first time that someone had 'borrowed' a tune heard elsewhere :lol:

Godz

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I'm with Roccia on this one. They sound extremely similar and it's not as though one was a hit - as in the hundreds (well tens maybe...) of songs that sound like Uptight for example. Wouldn't be the first time that someone had 'borrowed' a tune heard elsewhere :thumbsup:

Godz

Sorry Roccia/Godzilla, i see what you mean now i thought were the records or groups connected in someway, as i said agree they do sound perhaps similar and yes it happened a lot back then.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

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Baz the Ringleader were previously known as 4 Temples and All Of My Life is the acetate.

Ah yes thats why i got it mixed up with the Nu-Rons same title (ish)

Ringleaders M-pac or Onderful (????) demo is the boot off four temples acetate who has the original acetate must have herd it out quite abit

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The Temptones.

Barry Glazer (Centre) Daryl Hall (Extreme Right) Co-writers of "Girl I Love You" on Arctic.

Daryl Hall (originally Hohl as credited on the record) was only 21 years of age when he recorded with The Temptones. The group split up in 67 when they were all drafted into the forces.

Hall was, of course, responsible for some of the greatest Soul Music of the 70's both with his buddy John Oates (The Temptones Guitarist) and as a Solo artist.

He also recorded one of the finest Soul records of the past 5 years (IMO) with the wonderful "All By Myself".... a sleeping giant... future discovery!

Been a big fan for 30 years and buy everything I can get my hands on by the man.

Sean

post-4120-1165791338_thumb.jpg

Edited by Sean Hampsey

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Guest Roccia

Who are the Ringtones then?

Not bad for a cover-up... Ericson Dial & The Ringtones...

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Daryl Hall (originally Hohl as credited on the record) was only 21 years of age when he recorded with The Temptones. The group split up in 67 when they were all drafted into the forces.

Hall was, of course, responsible for some of the greatest Soul Music of the 70's both with his buddy John Oates (The Temptones Guitarist) and as a Solo artist.

Sean

In between The Temptones and stardom, there was another group - Executive Suite, who issued "Christine" on Jubilee in 1970. No relation, AFAIK, to the ES of "When the fuel runs out" fame...

Jerry.

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I was listening the Temptones "Girl I Love You" and it reminds me the Ringleaders "Baby What Has Happened To Our Love" especially the backing horns...

Have these two tunes any connection inbetween...?

TIA for any info...

Which one came first?

I have to say that as a musician, I find it impossible to believe the Temptones hadn't previously heard the Ringleaders or vice versa.

Musically the intros are incredibly similar, right down to the the same first 3 notes at the very begining. The chorus line "girl I love you" uses the same 2 notes as the vocal refrain "Do do do do do do do do" and both have the same harmonies in the same place.

I would guess the Ringleaders came first as the whole song sounds like a continuation of what is set up on the intro, where the Temptones sound like they have nicked a bit of "BWHHTOL" and created a new song around it. It can't be a coincidence. However I love both records :thumbsup:

Ian

Edited by Ringleader

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Just Daryl, Oates was in the Masters from Philadelphia too. There's a CD of Artic stuff and in the sleeve notes there's a peach of a picture of the Temptones, 20 year old going on 70, sports jackets and think rimmed glasses. Called the Temptones in reverence of the Temptations.

The Masters - I Need Your Love - Crimson - cracking little dancer which Times Square used to have in quantity, I must have bought half a dozen off them, probably disappeared now and £100 :thumbsup:

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The Masters - I Need Your Love - Crimson - cracking little dancer which Times Square used to have in quantity, I must have bought half a dozen off them, probably disappeared now and £100 :thumbsup:

Both sides Pete, corking little record and as you state copies dried up now, i reckon i paid about a tenner way back, seen it for over a ton mate.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

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Ah yes thats why i got it mixed up with the Nu-Rons same title (ish)

Ringleaders M-pac or Onderful (????) demo is the boot off four temples acetate who has the original acetate must have herd it out quite abit

The Ringleaders, first recorded as the 4 Temples. Thier name change must have happen around the time of "Baby what has happen". When I first got two studio discs from John Anderson in about 1982, he told me he had got them in Chicago, from the old manager of the Ringleaders. One disc had "Baby what has happen" on one side and on the other side was an unreleased tune called "Win you over", still gets a full dance floor today. The other disc had the unreleased "All of my life" on.

About ten years later Tim Brown found the master tape to "All of my life", credited to The 4 Temples and released the track under that name on a Goldmine CD. Then about five years ago a record dealer on the west coast did the boot of "All of my life", as the Ringleaders on a white demo.

Hope that helps with the Ringleaders bit at least.

Dave

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I have to say that as a musician, I find it impossible to believe the Temptones hadn't previously heard the Ringleaders or vice versa.

I'm with you on that one. They are extremely similar. It wouldn't suprise me if Hall, Oates and those other guys bought every record they could find on labels like M-Pac/One-Derful/Mar-V-Lus and wore them out. Those were pretty big labels back then considering the success of The Five Du-Tones etc. Love most of Hall & Oates pre-1983 stuff. The "Abandoned Luncheonette" LP and the self-titled "silver album" are superb.

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