The Four Voices

[Quinvy]

I may be missing something here, but how do we know that the gold label ones with the Nashville Matrix in the run outs are legit? I've not heard anything definite to say they are. Why can't they have come from someone who's found the pressing plates? I did think it was strange when they first showed up, in a small quantity, but then as demand grew a load more came along.

Just a thought.

pottsy

I heard a rumour that the gold copies were actually pressed up in Belgium?

[Guest Brian Ellis]

I may be missing something here, but how do we know that the gold label ones with the Nashville Matrix in the run outs are legit? I've not heard anything definite to say they are. Why can't they have come from someone who's found the pressing plates? I did think it was strange when they first showed up, in a small quantity, but then as demand grew a load more came along.

Just a thought.

pottsy

Not sure how it can be irrefutably confirmed, or otherwise - but John Manship has both the Green (£1,250) and Gold (£75) listed in his latest Price Guide, with no reference to the record being 'booted'.

May be John can provide a more definitive view on this?

Brian

[Modernsoulsucks]

I deffo don't disagree with your contention that a record is worth what people are prepared to pay but Andy did ask if we considered it a "fair" price.

Im also not too sure that all the people buying it are aware it's a re-issue. Just had a look at latest ad and the fact that it's a re-issue is NOT stated. I guess people ought to know what they're buying but Andy for sure isn't and took the time to check.

You're quite right to bring up Nike as I think this is exactly the same. Produced for peanuts and sold in a gullible consumer market for must-have items. The artists etc seeing little of the profit I would imagine.

Time will tell if it holds it's value but not looking that good so far, from £250 to £75. Luckily value IMO is or shouldn't be what Northern Soul is all about. People who've bought it are happy with it and it gives them pleasure. That's fine.

Finally couldn't help noticing you can afford to pay £5k for Margaret Littles. Can you lend me twenty quid till payday?

ROD

[Guest Andy Kempster]

I deffo don't disagree with your contention that a record is worth what people are prepared to pay but Andy did ask if we considered it a "fair" price.

Im also not too sure that all the people buying it are aware it's a re-issue. Just had a look at latest ad and the fact that it's a re-issue is NOT stated. I guess people ought to know what they're buying but Andy for sure isn't and took the time to check.

You're quite right to bring up Nike as I think this is exactly the same. Produced for peanuts and sold in a gullible consumer market for must-have items. The artists etc seeing little of the profit I would imagine.

Time will tell if it holds it's value but not looking that good so far, from £250 to £75. Luckily value IMO is or shouldn't be what Northern Soul is all about. People who've bought it are happy with it and it gives them pleasure. That's fine.

Finally couldn't help noticing you can afford to pay £5k for Margaret Littles. Can you lend me twenty quid till payday?

ROD

i most certainly didn't know but do now, just goes to show that this forum works, ice to know that valid info can be gained, think i'll just sit tight on this for now and hope to pick up a gold one cheap enough at some point, you never know, in the meantime mp3 it is, cant play it outside the confines of my own home anyway

[Modernsoulsucks]

No Andy you can come to my house and play it but you can't go to Chalky's!!! Do keep up please with current PC thinking.

ROD

[Guest miff]

As I seem to be one of the dim wits thats paid too much for a reissue 45 can I stick my twopenath into the debate. As far as ime concerned the gold is a legal reissue and as such is no differant from any other legal reissue be it on UK or US, Why should I not play the gold one out, has every Tom Dick or Harry got a copy No, would people enjoy hearing it, yes, If it got relased on a nice UK lable, lets say Stateside, No one would bat an eye if it got played out. In fact some would prefer a UK 45 to be played. Yes I would prefer to have a green copy but the aint no way I can afford one, The point is as far as I can see is its legal, can the same be said for the ones anglo are selling. and if they are not are all those with the high morals going to stop buying records from dealers that sell illegal boots. and all the dealers sell them. If no one sold them no one would press them in the first place.

[Guest Brian Ellis]

I deffo don't disagree with your contention that a record is worth what people are prepared to pay but Andy did ask if we considered it a "fair" price.

Im also not too sure that all the people buying it are aware it's a re-issue. Just had a look at latest ad and the fact that it's a re-issue is NOT stated. I guess people ought to know what they're buying but Andy for sure isn't and took the time to check.

You're quite right to bring up Nike as I think this is exactly the same. Produced for peanuts and sold in a gullible consumer market for must-have items. The artists etc seeing little of the profit I would imagine.

Time will tell if it holds it's value but not looking that good so far, from £250 to £75. Luckily value IMO is or shouldn't be what Northern Soul is all about. People who've bought it are happy with it and it gives them pleasure. That's fine.

Finally couldn't help noticing you can afford to pay £5k for Margaret Littles. Can you lend me twenty quid till payday?

ROD

No problem mate, here you go - don't forget, you owe me!

Alternatively I can fax you 2 Mickey Thomas tenners!

Brian

Edited January 4, 2007 by Brian Ellis

[Guest Brian Ellis]

As I seem to be one of the dim wits thats paid too much for a reissue 45 can I stick my twopenath into the debate. As far as ime concerned the gold is a legal reissue and as such is no differant from any other legal reissue be it on UK or US, Why should I not play the gold one out, has every Tom Dick or Harry got a copy No, would people enjoy hearing it, yes, If it got relased on a nice UK lable, lets say Stateside, No one would bat an eye if it got played out. In fact some would prefer a UK 45 to be played. Yes I would prefer to have a green copy but the aint no way I can afford one, The point is as far as I can see is its legal, can the same be said for the ones anglo are selling. and if they are not are all those with the high morals going to stop buying records from dealers that sell illegal boots. and all the dealers sell them. If no one sold them no one would press them in the first place.

Spot on Miff - highlights an hypocrisy that knows no bounds on the NS scene. Can anyone claim the moral high ground, i.e. their collecting over the years has never once been compromised by the purchase of a boot, have never once been heard playing out a reissue (I include British releases of original US records e.g TMG, Stateside, Capitol, RCA etc), have happily taken big profits from records they bought for next to nothing, have bought records from dealers who quite openly sell bootlegs (including the country's major supplier).

If so - go straight to the NS monastery where your purity will be forever honoured.

Brian

[Mick Reed]

Spot on Miff - highlights an hypocrisy that knows no bounds on the NS scene. Can anyone claim the moral high ground, i.e. their collecting over the years has never once been compromised by the purchase of a boot, have never once been heard playing out a reissue (I include British releases of original US records e.g TMG, Stateside, Capitol, RCA etc), have happily taken big profits from records they bought for next to nothing, have bought records from dealers who quite openly sell bootlegs (including the country's major supplier).

If so - go straight to the NS monastery where your purity will be forever honoured.

Brian

Surely, this record cannot be this rare. Records by mail have 79 copies in stock.

[Mick Reed]

Surely, this record cannot be this rare. Records by mail have 79 copies in stock.

four voices that is

[Guest Brian Ellis]

Surely, this record cannot be this rare. Records by mail have 79 copies in stock.

Are you talking about Craig Moerer's site? I see he's knocking it out @ $90 (£45ish). I couldn't see his stock numbers though, whereabouts on his site did you spot the stock numbers?

Brian

Edited January 4, 2007 by Brian Ellis

[Mick Reed]

Are you talking about Craig Moerer's site? I see he's knocking it out @ $90 (£45ish). I couldn't see his stock numbers though, whereabouts on his site did you spot the stock numbers?

Brian

Yeah I am. little trick, change quantity then update quantity which shows how many he's got. its as easy as that. like i said, can it be rare and all M-?

Mick

[Guest Brian Ellis]

Yeah I am. little trick, change quantity then update quantity which shows how many he's got. its as easy as that. like i said, can it be rare and all M-?

Mick

Mick

Didn't seem to work for me, i.e. couldn't see a stock level - but I kept updating until I got to 25 copies and it seemed to be happy to 'cart' them all for me, with the bill steadily rising to $2,250. I would presume the software wouldn't allow you to cart any more than the stock level - so maybe there is a stash here.

Some great detective work going on about this record for Andy.

New value of Gold 4 Voices - $90 + P&P from across the pond!

Brian

PS - reset my cart to zero after playing with the numbers - just in case the Soul Police think I'm about to import a quantity and sell at exhorbitant prices!!

Edited January 4, 2007 by Brian Ellis

[Mick Reed]

Mick

Didn't seem to work for me, i.e. couldn't see a stock level - but I kept updating until I got to 25 copies and it seemed to be happy to 'cart' them all for me, with the bill steadily rising to $2,250. I would presume the software wouldn't allow you to cart any more than the stock level - so maybe there is a stash here.

Some great detective work going on about this record for Andy.

New value of Gold 4 Voices - $90 + P&P from across the pond!

Brian

brian, definately 79 copies in stock and it would let you order the whole lot, but don't forget to remove them after you've finished. i think you lose them out of your cart if you do forget. you can do that on any record, not many people know that. been doing it for years now. he has a really good site, thats why when you order he nearly always has the stock. nice speaking to you mate

Mick.

[Guest Brian Ellis]

brian, definately 79 copies in stock and it would let you order the whole lot, but don't forget to remove them after you've finished. i think you lose them out of your cart if you do forget. you can do that on any record, not many people know that. been doing it for years now. he has a really good site, thats why when you order he nearly always has the stock. nice speaking to you mate

Mick.

Cheers Mick

I amended my post with a PS to reflect the fact that I had removed them!!

Best for 2007.

Brian

[bri pinch]

AH WELL... MISSED THE BOAT ON THE CHEAP GOLD ONE'S, SHAME. I'LL HAVE TO MAKE DO WITH MY GREEN LABLE COPY .

BRI.

[Guest]

Perhaps should've included an "in my opinion" in my previous post.

In my opinion the gold Four Voices 45s shouldn't be considered valuable to someone who collects original 45s because it is NOT the original release.

But there are hundreds second relased 45s that are valuable, Roy Roberts, Big Frank and the Essencces, Lorraine Chandler I could go on all day! The 4 Voices was a genuine release was it not? It was pressed in a very limited run was it not? I think it is massive tune, it can only increase in value ! I see it the same way a the 100 club 45s, Genuine releases of quality tunes on limited runs, instantly collectable!

I collect originals and would have no problem with sticking that Four Voices in my box,

thats my oppinion!

[Chalky]

But there are hundreds second relased 45s that are valuable, Roy Roberts, Big Frank and the Essencces, Lorraine Chandler I could go on all day! The 4 Voices was a genuine release was it not? It was pressed in a very limited run was it not? I think it is massive tune, it can only increase in value ! I see it the same way a the 100 club 45s, Genuine releases of quality tunes on limited runs, instantly collectable!

I collect originals and would have no problem with sticking that Four Voices in my box,

thats my oppinion!

I don't think it was a limited run, 100's done. The 100 club releases have more credence IMHO, at least they are unreleased and I'd play 'em. Got my doubts about Four Voices and personally it doesn't interest me on Gold.

[Cheltsoulnights]

But there are hundreds second relased 45s that are valuable, Roy Roberts, Big Frank and the Essencces, Lorraine Chandler I could go on all day! The 4 Voices was a genuine release was it not? It was pressed in a very limited run was it not? I think it is massive tune, it can only increase in value ! I see it the same way a the 100 club 45s, Genuine releases of quality tunes on limited runs, instantly collectable!

I collect originals and would have no problem with sticking that Four Voices in my box,

thats my oppinion!

are you not refering to tunes put out on another label as a normal release at the time, not a repress or re-release on whatever label to cash in on the northern soul scene?

Personally i believe the four voices 45 to be a re-issue and only worth £10 to £20, Theres not alot stopping me from repressing it myself if you think about it.

[Guest]

are you not refering to tunes put out on another label as a normal release at the time, not a repress or re-release on whatever label to cash in on the northern soul scene?

Personally i believe the four voices 45 to be a re-issue and only worth £10 to £20, Theres not alot stopping me from repressing it myself if you think about it.

Any record released twice has been re - released (in my oppinion!) From local to National, USA to UK......Whatever.... !! The First pressing can only ever really be described as the original!

We are going on about the 4 voices because it is a recent (ish) thing with questions being asked about rarity and legallity

What if the 4 voices was a 35 year old dog rare 2nd release with a matrix stamp ?

In my oppinion it is still about demand and copys available. If they do vanish off Craig Moerers site etc and the demand is still there, i think they will be collectable.

How many of these were pressed? Are they real licensed releases?

If the answer is 500 and yes to those 2 questions, Then i can only see it becoming a collectable piece!

(Unless everyone gets really sick of the tune?.....and that won't happen as it is Brilliant!!)

[Chalky]

Any record released twice has been re - released (in my oppinion!) From local to National, USA to UK......Whatever.... !! The First pressing can only ever really be described as the original!

We are going on about the 4 voices because it is a recent (ish) thing with questions being asked about rarity and legallity

What if the 4 voices was a 35 year old dog rare 2nd release with a matrix stamp ?

In my oppinion it is still about demand and copys available. If they do vanish off Craig Moerers site etc and the demand is still there, i think they will be collectable.

How many of these were pressed? Are they real licensed releases?

If the answer is 500 and yes to those 2 questions, Then i can only see it becoming a collectable piece!

(Unless everyone gets really sick of the tune?.....and that won't happen as it is Brilliant!!)

I know many a brilliant record that I'm sick of hearing

Are the Four Voices legit? I've got my doubts. Just because done using original plates stamped etc doesn't mean they are legit. Whoever did them it was done for one reason and thats to cash in on the northern record market. There are plenty around on the market and it shouldn't be anymore than £20, the same price other boots and re-issues are selling for cause it's no rarer, in some cases it's far more common than some boots/re-issues.

[Guest]

I know many a brilliant record that I'm sick of hearing

Correct, and fair play!

But how many, when and who produced the Four Voices? Is it a legal issue? Anybody really know ?