WTF!!!!!!

I hope no one on here is bidding on this?

Bit of a naughty listing "RE" is the onyl mention of it being a reissue.

Edited March 28, 200718 yr by James Trouble

That's pretty honest in comparisson (?) to some other cnut who's presently offering the same on ebay without any mention of it being a re-issue. Hope he gets the runs.

Is this the reissue Jazzman had on his site for a fiver?

Rich.

That's pretty honest in comparisson (?) to some other cnut who's presently offering the same on ebay without any mention of it being a re-issue. Hope he gets the runs.

I don't hope he gets the runs I hope his next shit is a hedgehog

curreent high bidder has baught stuff from me in the past good stuff as well :>)

just sent him a friendly piece of advice.

Is this the reissue Jazzman had on his site for a fiver?

Rich.

Reissue? It's a Bootleg!!!!!!

Reissue? It's a Bootleg!!!!!!

Surely that depends on your definition of 'Bootleg'.

As I understood it, the Jazzman 45's are legitimate 'licensed' reissues.

Are you sure that this is not the case?

Sean

Reissue? It's a Bootleg!!!!!!

mmmmh, bought it of a well respected dealer a few weeks ago believing it was legit.

Surely that depends on your definition of 'Bootleg'.

As I understood it, the Jazzman 45's are legitimate 'licensed' reissues.

Are you sure that this is not the case?

Sean

I'm afraid not. They are bootlegs.

mmmmh, bought it of a well respected dealer a few weeks ago believing it was legit.

Ask for your money back?

Edited March 28, 200718 yr by James Trouble

WTF!!!!!!

I hope no one on here is bidding on this?

Bit of a naughty listing "RE" is the onyl mention of it being a reissue.

Very naughty. I hope the high bidders have the good sense to retract their bids....Describing a record as "Re" is meaningless. Fed up with these rip off merchants all over the place, they are making collecting a less attractive pursuit for many who don't know the difference. I note Switzerland again - are there any genuine soul dealers in Switzerland, they all seem to be rippers :angry:

must check when i go home but i don't think dynamite exploded has love addict on the flip

you can buy the repro/boot for a tenner

i guess the high bidder has too much cash, not enough sense

must check when i go home but i don't think dynamite exploded has love addict on the flip

you can buy the repro/boot for a tenner

i guess the high bidder has too much cash, not enough sense

No it doesn't. It has a slowish crossover crawler side on the flip - very nice too - which was an old Soul Essence spin for me a few years back.

I suspect the high bidder has been duped into thinking it's some sort of original which I really object to. I do expect a degree of openness and honesty from dealers as not everyone who wants to buy records has the knowledge of 20 or 30 years of collecting behind them.

Steve

As I understood it, the Jazzman 45's are legitimate 'licensed' reissues.

Are you sure that this is not the case?

Jazzman 45s ARE licensed - Honey & the Bees isn't a Jazzman release...

"Supreme sista funk that's recently acquired anthemic status and is highly coveted by those DJs lucky enough to possess the original.

Lookalike repro that will sit well in the box of anyone with good taste not just cos of the A side but also the excellent and hugely in-demand big-money Northern stomper on the flip!

Only a fiver? A definite must, esp considering this very issue has recently fetched £25 on ebay, which means only ONE copy per customer please!"

Quote Jazzman site.

Sorry, I did'nt mean to confuse anyone... I just ment is it the same as the ones Jazzman were selling.

Cheers,

Rich.

Sent the listing to ebay as false representation. Sometimes that works...

"Supreme sista funk that's recently acquired anthemic status and is highly coveted by those DJs lucky enough to possess the original.

Lookalike repro that will sit well in the box of anyone with good taste not just cos of the A side but also the excellent and hugely in-demand big-money Northern stomper on the flip!

Only a fiver? A definite must, esp considering this very issue has recently fetched £25 on ebay, which means only ONE copy per customer please!"

Quote Jazzman site.

Sorry, I did'nt mean to confuse anyone... I just ment is it the same as the ones Jazzman were selling.

Cheers,

Rich.

It's a nasty bootleg.

must check when i go home but i don't think dynamite exploded has love addict on the flip

you can buy the repro/boot for a tenner

i guess the high bidder has too much cash, not enough sense

The flip is 'Together Forever' well actually this is the 'A' side 'Dynamite Exploded' was considered to be the filler on this 45 hence it doen't appear on the Demo which has a blank flipside. See you Sat Phil

Jazzman 45s ARE licensed - Honey & the Bees isn't a Jazzman release...

I understood it that these were 'done' by Jazzman, but under the Arctic Logo.

Is that not correct?

In the same way as they are selling a Lou Pride SUEMI Repro 'Overstock' 45's from the Lou pride Box set that they put out.

They are also promoting their new Jazzman CD, featuring the Honey & Bees "Love Addict" side.

I can't imagine that they'd be putting the Honey & Bees track on their own JAZZMAN logos CD compilation, if they hadn't licensed it... nor can I imagine that they'd be selling 'Bootleg' 45's of a track ('Booted' by someone else) that they DO have the rights to.

I'm all for castigating Bootleggers, but if someone has obtained the rights to legitimately reissue a track I dont see that they should be tarred with that same brush.

Think I'll contact Jazzman and Jamie/Guyden (who are still active) and ask them.

Sean Hampsey

I understood it that these were 'done' by Jazzman, but under the Arctic Logo.

Is that not correct?

In the same way as they are selling a Lou Pride SUEMI Repro 'Overstock' 45's from the Lou pride Box set that they put out.

They are also promoting their new Jazzman CD, featuring the Honey & Bees "Love Addict" side.

I can't imagine that they'd be putting the Honey & Bees track on their own JAZZMAN logos CD compilation, if they hadn't licensed it... nor can I imagine that they'd be selling 'Bootleg' 45's of a track ('Booted' by someone else) that they DO have the rights to.

I'm all for castigating Bootleggers, but if someone has obtained the rights to legitimately reissue a track I dont see that they should be tarred with that same brush.

Think I'll contact Jazzman and Jamie/Guyden (who are still active) and ask them.

Sean Hampsey

i'll speak for jazzman sean, as i dont think he's a member on here....yes the love addict on my sister funk cd is 100% licenced (he tried to get 7" rights but the guy didnt want it released as a 45, only on a compilation) but the love addict/dynamite exploded 45 is categorically nothing to do with him and IS a bootleg, word is that it came out of germany...why gerald is then stocking them on his site is another argument altogether, and one i've tried to have out with him on numerous occasions :angry:

Edited March 29, 200718 yr by wrighty

i'll speak for jazzman sean, as i dont think he's a member on here....yes the love addict on my sister funk cd is 100% licenced (he tried to get 7" rights but the guy didnt want it released as a 45, only on a compilation) but the love addict/dynamite exploded 45 is categorically nothing to do with him and IS a bootleg, word is that it came out of germany...why gerald is then stocking them on his site is another argument altogether, and one i've tried to have out with him on numerous occasions :angry:

Thanks for the clarification. So now it's up to one of us to shop this ebay crook.

Edited March 29, 200718 yr by Steve G

So Gerald got the licence for love addict for the comp, but if he can't get it for the 45, then he'll just sell other people's bootlegs of that and dynamite exploded anyway?

Edited March 29, 200718 yr by James Trouble

i'll speak for jazzman sean, as i dont think he's a member on here....yes the love addict on my sister funk cd is 100% licenced (he tried to get 7" rights but the guy didnt want it released as a 45, only on a compilation) but the love addict/dynamite exploded 45 is categorically nothing to do with him and IS a bootleg, word is that it came out of germany...why gerald is then stocking them on his site is another argument altogether, and one i've tried to have out with him on numerous occasions :angry:

Hi Ian,

Many thanks for that.

Does seem strange to me that Gerald would take the time to go through the correct procedures in order to license his own releases and yet would also support a Bootlegger, through stocking the other items in question.

I take it that he is aware of the potential legal implications in the sale of counterfeit goods and, of course, the commercial consequence that some might, erroneously, be lead to conclude that the 'legit' releases might not be 100% Kosher also.

Suggest you 'have it out' with him again mate!

Many thanks for the clarification. Because of the source, from which they came, they certainly had me fooled.

Sean

Its now at 102.50 with someone from the UK bidding on it

Its now at 102.50 with someone from the UK bidding on it

OMG

The Bidder is a VERY good friend of mine.

Will send him a Text right away!

Thanks Steve.

Just Unbelievable.

Sean

OMG

The Bidder is a VERY good friend of mine.

Will send him a Text right away!

Thanks Steve.

Just Unbelievable.

Sean

Glad to be of service Sean......perhaps he should ask the seller a question "is this the recent press or an original"......

Believe me, I'm not taking the sellers "side" or the bootlegger for that matter... and the item description is VERY fuzzy despite the seller knowing that it's a bootleg, but... if someone is willing to spend $100+ on a record... shouldn't they do SOME research at all first? If you do a google search for either of the following lines...

honey & the bees love addict

honey & the bees dynamite exploded

...the first and second result respectively goes to a Honey & The Bees discography which states the correct flipsides for both "Love Addict" and "Dynamite Exploded".

Once again, I'm not saying that it's fair to list an item like this seller did, I'm just highlighting that people don't do the research that I at least think they should do before spending serious money on 45s.

There's a picture, both sides are listed and RE in block letters is a common abbreviation for "Re-issue"

Maybe we should also make sure that the bidders don't have access to sharp implements and are safetly back on the ward by 8pm.

ROD

Glad to be of service Sean......perhaps he should ask the seller a question "is this the recent press or an original"......

Just texted him and he called me straight back.

He's GOBSMACKED and didn't know it was recently put out (and he's a VERY serious collector).

Must say, I was aware of them, Steve, but honestly thought that Jazzman had put them out legit, purely on the basis of their good reputation in doing stuff the right way.

I'm amazed that they are stocking and promoting Counterfeits.

What's more, I just can't believe that a track like this has been booted as a 'Repro'.

Is nothing sacred?

Sean

There's a picture, both sides are listed and RE in block letters is a common abbreviation for "Re-issue"

Maybe we should also make sure that the bidders don't have access to sharp implements and are safetly back on the ward by 8pm.

ROD

Funny that...on his originals there are no abbreviations and things like "100% genuine original copy" as opposed to a two letter abbreviation........I come from the old school that expects dealers to act with integrity, I am not seeing it with this geezer. I know it's not an original because I've had an original for years, but that's my good fortune and not everyone has time to do internet searches etc. Sebastian. Sorry nurse is calling me back to the ward - I may be some time!

There's a picture, both sides are listed and RE in block letters is a common abbreviation for "Re-issue"

Maybe we should also make sure that the bidders don't have access to sharp implements and are safetly back on the ward by 8pm.

ROD

He's just taken his medicine and is promptly retracting the bid.

And an early night has been recommended.

Sean

Believe me, I'm not taking the sellers "side" or the bootlegger for that matter... and the item description is VERY fuzzy despite the seller knowing that it's a bootleg, but... if someone is willing to spend $100+ on a record... shouldn't they do SOME research at all first? If you do a google search for either of the following lines...

honey & the bees love addict

honey & the bees dynamite exploded

...the first and second result respectively goes to a Honey & The Bees discography which states the correct flipsides for both "Love Addict" and "Dynamite Exploded".

Once again, I'm not saying that it's fair to list an item like this seller did, I'm just highlighting that people don't do the research that I at least think they should do before spending serious money on 45s.

Fair comment Sebastian, but my Bidder friend said that he'd only put a low bid in and didn't expect to win it so hardly read the description.

When you consider that this guy has over 30,000 45's and owns everything from George Blackwell to Chuck Cockerham, I believe that he never gave it a seconds thought and just slapped a bid on.

The consequence though would be, whether he won it or not, that the seller would end up receiving an even higher price for the record. So, he is retracting on the basis that he has since been informed that it is a worthless 'Counterfeit' rather than a legitimate 'Re-Issue' as advertised.

Cheers

Sean

I know it's not an original because I've had an original for years, but that's my good fortune and not everyone has time to do internet searches etc. Sebastian.

Everyone who has time to search for an item on eBay have time to make the most basic google search when they're in the process of placing a $100+ bid. I really, really do believe that.

Looking at his other records he has this in one description... "All Records are original copies, if not, there is a hint !!!"

Look Here

Cheeky bugger.

Just had a quick look at his ads. Dr Truelove is on Soul Mafia but doesn't say re-issue. A lot of albums say orig. So not quite sure what you're talking about really Steve.

I saw the ad before I read it on here. I knew it wasn't an original but there's enough info there, esp. RE to show any collector that it's not an original.

What kinda person spends loadsa money without any idea of what they're buying. Is it dishonest. Not as far as I can see because on seeing the ad there's nothing there to suggest it's the original.

Is it a marketing ploy/sales blurb. Deffo yes. The use of "rare" confirms that.

However, Steve I do agree that he is taking advantage of gullible people by auctioning it and not now withdrawing it and making plain to the bidders that it's not what they hoped it was.

Everyone is blaming the seller but I think the bidders are equally at fault. If no one bid on all these boots on Ebay they'd eventually disappear cos there'd be no profit in it.

ROD

Just had a quick look at his ads. Dr Truelove is on Soul Mafia but doesn't say re-issue. A lot of albums say orig. So not quite sure what you're talking about really Steve.

I saw the ad before I read it on here. I knew it wasn't an original but there's enough info there, esp. RE to show any collector that it's not an original.

What kinda person spends loadsa money without any idea of what they're buying. Is it dishonest. Not as far as I can see because on seeing the ad there's nothing there to suggest it's the original.

Is it a marketing ploy/sales blurb. Deffo yes. The use of "rare" confirms that.

However, Steve I do agree that he is taking advantage of gullible people by auctioning it and not now withdrawing it and making plain to the bidders that it's not what they hoped it was.

Everyone is blaming the seller but I think the bidders are equally at fault. If no one bid on all these boots on Ebay they'd eventually disappear cos there'd be no profit in it.

ROD

Hi Rod,

We know that the Seller is not claiming its an Original as he states its RE which we know means Re-Issue.

But, of course, even this is a misleading description.

I thought that this title was a 'Re-Issue' when I first saw it advertised on the JAZZMAN site some months ago, but it transpires that it is neither an Original or a Re-Issue, but a Counterfeit.

A Boot.

Of course, it's difficult to prevent people bidding on 'these Boots' when the Seller claims that they are 'Reissues' (whether they claim its an original or not is a seperate thing).

I certainly wouldn't have spent $100+ on a Reissue, though, in any event.

Credit to the original poster for flagging this as otherwise my mate would have been stung and although we could claim that he's not taken a duty of care in his bidding the fact is the onus should be on the seller to make it explicit in the description that the items in question are illegal counterfeits (as if they would).

Sean

About a year ago, I put some record up on ebay, can't remember what it was, and I put in the description "this is not the original, it's a very high quality counterfeit" and I mentioned it on Soul Source so people could see I was being honest. Within an hour, someone on Soul Source reported me to ebay for selling a counterfeit item

About a year ago, I put some record up on ebay, can't remember what it was, and I put in the description "this is not the original, it's a very high quality counterfeit" and I mentioned it on Soul Source so people could see I was being honest. Within an hour, someone on Soul Source reported me to ebay for selling a counterfeit item

That was the RSoul Police Pete

I totally agree that it is the buyer's responsibility to check the authenticity of a record before buying or bidding.

However, the sellers should be fair in their description.

When I started collecting just 3 years ago I like many others bought a couple of "boots". But after a few months I decided to buy Manships Price Guide and The Guide To Northern Soul Bootlegs. These two books alongside internet resources such as this site have proved to be invaluable when buying rare records.

It's a tricky business when you start collecting though. And paying a huge amount for a boot is enough to put any young or old collector off.

Rich.

That was the RSoul Police Pete

Yeah I know who it was Steve and he's still a c*nt

Yeah I know who it was Steve and he's still a c*nt

I hate stuff like this :angry:

I always want to know 'who' when the carrot gets dangled

Edited March 29, 200718 yr by Jamie

You never know, he might actually admit it!

You never know, he might actually admit it!

To which part?

You never know, he might actually admit it!

It wasn't me

Sean

I don't hope he gets the runs I hope his next shit is a hedgehog

Blimey! Hope I don't upset you fellas!

(though it's probably too late for that... )

Just had a quick look at his ads. Dr Truelove is on Soul Mafia but doesn't say re-issue. A lot of albums say orig. So not quite sure what you're talking about really Steve.

I saw the ad before I read it on here. I knew it wasn't an original but there's enough info there, esp. RE to show any collector that it's not an original.

What kinda person spends loadsa money without any idea of what they're buying. Is it dishonest. Not as far as I can see because on seeing the ad there's nothing there to suggest it's the original.

Is it a marketing ploy/sales blurb. Deffo yes. The use of "rare" confirms that.

However, Steve I do agree that he is taking advantage of gullible people by auctioning it and not now withdrawing it and making plain to the bidders that it's not what they hoped it was.

Everyone is blaming the seller but I think the bidders are equally at fault. If no one bid on all these boots on Ebay they'd eventually disappear cos there'd be no profit in it.

ROD

Fair comment to a degree to say let the buyer beware, but equally I want to encourage younger new bloods into collecting, rather than it just being the preserve of pot bellied 50 year olds and if these younger folks are getting ripped off by mis-descriptions they won't bother collecting for long. I think his comment "if it's not an original there's a hint" is appalling.

It's fair to say without being flippant that I am lucky enough to know quite a bit about rare soul as most of you know (but we all continue to learn more all the time), but that's because I have been collecting since the 70's - some young Turks don't have the benefit of this history and years of trawling through boxes and collecting. It's those guys that I feel deserve a bit of integrity and encouragement, rather than clever games of spot the bootleg if you can.

And that's why I say the seller is a CROOK.

Edited March 30, 200718 yr by Steve G

ive just emailed all the bidders & told them that john manship has them in stock for £10

ive just emailed all the bidders & told them that john manship has them in stock for £10

Theres a real one just gone up on e-bayif anyone wants it

ive just emailed all the bidders & told them that john manship has them in stock for £10

So it's ok for some people to sell them but not others? Just that earlier in the thread someones having a go at "Jazzman" for selling them

So it's ok for some people to sell them but not others? Just that earlier in the thread someones having a go at "Jazzman" for selling them

Funny you should say that. A mate of mine mentioned the same thing to me yesterday.

I want to encourage younger new bloods into collecting, rather than it just being the preserve of pot bellied 50 year olds

Hey, my wife doesn't collect!!

OK,Steve we'll agree to differ. To me it's just a symptom of today's market in everything, advertising, double glazing, gas suppliers etc where what is promised is often not what is delivered and the marketing borders on the misleading.

I do agree with Pete though and I said this on the "bootleg/Amnesia" thread that it sometimes appears that when cases such as this are highlighted they can seem very selective as to who is being condemned.

ROD