So, every time I see anything about Northern Soul these days (and I've seen lots) it seems that when the casino closed the scene died. I know from a lot of comments on here that many are annoyed with this view. So I'm taking it upon myself to do some research and write an article on the days after Wigan. I'll put it on my site initially but I also have plans to create a magazine in the near future so this would be a great thing to publish.

 

I don't do things by half so if I'm going to write it I'm going to be thorough. Which means I need as much info and as many contacts as possible. I have my own recollections of the time, but they won't be enough!

 

Anyone who can help, please let me know. 

To document and research the soul scene after Wigan is music to my ears. I came along in 1987 but am proud to say that I was honoured and privileged to be accepted and be amongst who I will always refer to as the true die hards. My taste spans from The Wheel right up to the present day with a love for soul across the board.

So many people are totally unaware of just how many fabulous records continued to be discovered and are also unaware of the commitment and passion dedicated by so many people over the 30 years that followed.

These people who are referred to as the Soul Police deserve the utmost respect and recognition as well as being the loyalists who can tell it like it is. Why should such a magical underground music scene have Northern Soul portrayed by people who have returned after over two decades of absence. It makes a mockery of the fact that without your real diehards there wouldn't have been a soul scene to come back to.

I am in a very biased position being married to Dave Molloy but am under no disillusion knowing full well that my husband is one of the true soul men who went from Wigan with a passion, prolific knowledge and determination to take northern soul into it's next era of succession.

I just hope you identify with and speak to the right people, the very same people who can also speak from the heart on behalf of the influential characters, sadly no longer with us.

I wish you every success and look forward to seeing the media take off their blinkers and research with 100% accuracy.

Must agree with Julie here

Although it has been said many many times, there has been a great many fantastic records , people and venues since the end of Wigan, and not just because tempos and peoples acceptance have altered (i.e crossover etc)  

 

There have also been many all-nighters that have "came and gone" - some great, some brilliant, some not so great

The point I make is that as Mrs M says, there have been loads of people all over the UK who, since Wigan closed, have continued to push the scene forward 

There have also been people who pushed the scene forward when Tonys. Empress Ballroom closed, when Stafford closed etc. etc. 

i was very young when I went to Wigan, and at that time was lucky enough to be surrounded locally by a lot of knowledgable people who helped guide me along and educate me on real soul as opposed to poppy shit!

As I only went to Wigan a couple of times, it's hard to say how it affected my opinion on the general scene, however having been to many many venues since, I would stay that for me at least, the times after Wigan were better - late 80's through to early 90's being the peak

 

So some sort of documented history from Wigan onwards would be an interesting read, but also, I fear will be an immense task, as the has been a lot happened over that period

 

good luck with your project

 

jim

Copies of Shades Of Soul will probably be quite invaluable to this project as they include:

 

venue reviews

sales lists

record reviews

readers top 10's

 

 

That fanzine to me was wonderful, I learnt and discovered so much from reading such as Eddie Hubbards reviews of 45's hardly any of which I knew and would probably never of heard out until several years later at such venues say as Thorne. I never went to Wigan so can't comment on that period but during through the 80's and early 90's it struck me, (rightly or wrongly) that a whole rich seam of quality records were finding their way out of collections and bedrooms and into venues and onto dance floors that previously may not have done. Perhaps everyone feels that about a specific given time and I think that's great. 

 

Interesting  stuff anyway, good luck with it. Setting your parameters, as has has been mentioned, will be a task in itself I think !

 

 

Must agree Shades will give a lot of great info for certain periods and well done to Derek Pearson for keeping it going

I too read cover to cover many times, taking notes of records - I remember Tim Brown tipping Alex Brown "I'm not responsible" on SUNDI - and managed to get it from a list a few weeks later

like you also loved Eddie Hubbards reviews and managed to pick up some great records from his tips - and many other peoples tips too!!!

Chalky on here will also be able to help the writer with some historical ads etc, as he seems to have collected a lot of this type of stuff over the years

 

good luck with your project, but it is a huge task 

 

jim

Must agree Shades will give a lot of great info for certain periods and well done to Derek Pearson for keeping it going

I too read cover to cover many times, taking notes of records - I remember Tim Brown tipping Alex Brown "I'm not responsible" on SUNDI - and managed to get it from a list a few weeks later

like you also loved Eddie Hubbards reviews and managed to pick up some great records from his tips - and many other peoples tips too!!!

Chalky on here will also be able to help the writer with some historical ads etc, as he seems to have collected a lot of this type of stuff over the years

 

good luck with your project, but it is a huge task 

 

jim

Jim

Great call Derek is a must to be talked to,still see him from time to time & he's an encyclopedia of info with a lot of it written down on scraps of paper,lists from the year dot,photos etc.

Knowing I was from Hull he gave a record that that was made of the speeches from the opening of the Humber Bridge.......picture sleeve of course

Cheers

Martyn

First Clifton Hall nighter October 1980.

First Clifton Hall nighter October 1980.

 

When did it finish Steve?

Yeah, Keb's in my sites!

Actually, that reminds me.. I remember a magazine I stumbled upon maybe 15-20 years ago now. There was an interview with Keb where he basically talked about exactly this. It wasn't a soul mag so it was quite an odd feature but was pretty meaty.. Anyone got any idea what I'm on about?

It was on a t.v programme think I still have a video of this. I think the record was J.J. Barnes : Our Love Is In The Pocket.

Hazy. 84 I'd guess maybe 1985 at a (big) push. In any event it was 90% oldies at the end.

Pete I don't remember it like that, I don't mean that awfully, I just don't remember it being good that's a reason why we stopped, other than work commitments, it went all Jazz Funk etc but I'm sure your right & I maybe missed somethings but I don't think so.  

Spot.   

thats the thing with you pete............ya don,t miss a trick  lol

we,ve returned to the days of going out to a banging night..........full circle l believe

I've asked Keb, he says it was at Loughborough (Town Hall I presume) and it was Darrell Banks. Played it about 5 times and said something like "there you are, great record, but are you not fed up with it yet?  I'm now going to play something new instead".  He thinks he threw it into the crowd, he can't remember if he broke it or not.

Have a word with Eddie Hubbard, he started collating information, documentation, interviews etc for a similar book back in 2010 / 2011 ....

Edited November 2, 201410 yr by Philly

Exactly what I'm trying to say. The point of the story is the change in music, passion and attitude that came about in a time when the general consensus is that the scene died.

If you can find that thread it would be a big help.

Tried to cut and paste the link but since I've upgraded to iOS 8 I can longer do that on my iPad. If you search on here in forums for Book on the1980s you'll find it.

Hazy. 84 I'd guess maybe 1985 at a (big) push. In any event it was 90% oldies at the end.

steve it followed on from wigan , and in my ears you and rest of the djs played some great modern and new releases as well as classic oldies

Hazy. 84 I'd guess maybe 1985 at a (big) push. In any event it was 90% oldies at the end.

 

Think I'd have said '83.

 

Passage of time seems to throw everyone into turmoil.

 

But my memory is perfect!

 

 

Sean

I'm way out with 85 Sean as something has just come to mind. Sure there was a third anniversary which would make it October 83.maybe the Dobie Gray no show. There were a few more after that.

Hadn't you fled the fold then anyway? It was 90% oldies towards the end as the line ups show and nothing like what was being played at Croftys Cleethorpes.

Some people id suggest are vital to add to the full Story: Jim Ohara for Shotts, Kitch as a collector and reluctant DJ, Dean Anderson for turning up tunes in the back ground, Ion, Colin Law, of course Guy and Butch, Barry May for downstairs at Bradford, Rob Marriott, Dave Malloy, Gilly... Can have a word with some to see if they'd like to be involved.

Thanks Byrney, if you could that would be fantastic!

No books remotely nailed it but articles and essays like Chalky's and others have covered parts of it very well. There's certainly been enough Wigan analysis so I think you're on fertile ground.

Totally agree Ady. I'll take your comment as an offer to help

I had a scooter (GP250) and I was on the scene throughout the seventies and early eighties, but I can't remember there being any notable 'scooter boy' or 'mod' presence. Always puzzles me to see the two linked. Just saying.

 

The scooter scene has strong links to the mod scene, as does Northern soul, so it's not difficult to see the link. I think the earlier post maybe referred to NS at scooter rallies though (Allniter club of GB was linked to the rallies I'm sure?) rather than scooterists attending the venues we're discussing.. 

Copies of Shades Of Soul will probably be quite invaluable to this project as they include:

 

venue reviews

sales lists

record reviews

readers top 10's

 

 

That fanzine to me was wonderful, I learnt and discovered so much from reading such as Eddie Hubbards reviews of 45's hardly any of which I knew and would probably never of heard out until several years later at such venues say as Thorne. I never went to Wigan so can't comment on that period but during through the 80's and early 90's it struck me, (rightly or wrongly) that a whole rich seam of quality records were finding their way out of collections and bedrooms and into venues and onto dance floors that previously may not have done. Perhaps everyone feels that about a specific given time and I think that's great. 

 

Interesting  stuff anyway, good luck with it. Setting your parameters, as has has been mentioned, will be a task in itself I think !

 

I've been thinking about Shades of Soul - I only ever had a few copies and, despite hoarding a ton of stuff, I can't seem to locate them. 

Thanks to everyone who's commented here and for the PMs and emails I've received over the weekend.

 

Last week I had a notion to write a short(ish) article for my site, this week I'm considering approaching some publishers and writing a book!

 

Please keep adding to this thread as everything is being noted. I have a LOT of researching to do, and many people to speak to so this is probably now going to take over my life. Comments here are totally invaluable and much appreciated!

The fleet if I remember had closed and then reopened under the management of danny Everard? I believe but yes the original fleet was on in the 70's and I think Clifton hall there was a couple of months crossover between them both that's all.

Fleet definitely open in 1981 - I have a live tape made the week after Wigan closed. Kev Draper played Larry Santos and said "This is Wigan when it used to be good". They had an assortment of people running the place after the East Anglian Soul Club including Jon Buck and even Ian Clark did one or two... 

You mean there was soul after Wigan  And before 

 

Steve

JUST A LITTLE BIT

      MICK L

Regarding the scooter scene.There were large numbers of scooterists in the mid seventies going to northern allnighters and venues.The scooters were usually left at home for niters and they wore contemporary northern soul fashion.This lasted up until the mod revival of 79 which was a southern media led movement.A lot of the northern scooter lads jacked it in.The main seventies runs were to Scarborough and northern soul clubs like Rudies.Right the eighties...scooter runs always had niters and events on with John Buck,Brian Rae etc etc and the allniter club of Great Britain.There were even boots specifically made for the scooter scene.Dobie Gray pic disc springs to mind.Scooter scene music got more diverse..ie I.O.W fiasco and northern niters were stopped.The Niter Club of GB pulled out and vfm took over....speak to John Buck.

Stealing from Wigan

Cleethorpes was the Business imho playing brand new and lots of unknown oldies , plus known oldies   but a great mix imho 

Unknown oldie? Is this the same as a forgotten newie? sorry just struck me funny.

Whenever it was it wasn't when Stafford started in April '82 unless it was another DJ.

 

 

Chalky's right Guy and Keb didn't join until a year in. They arrived to a venue that was already mainly playing new material through the likes of Clarkie, Dave Withers, Pat Brady, Gary Rushbrook and others. They were a very important part of what happened after Wigan, but only part of the story, people like Robin, Adam, Soul Sam, Arthur, all had a major part to play at venues around that time.

Edited November 12, 201410 yr by Dave Thorley

I know you said you're not interested in knowing if any were played earlier but Checkmates Ltd was definitely played at W*g*n  - maybe 79ish...

Definitely known earlier than that - Pete had it in his collection which he gave away in 1975.

Dx

 

I did an outline for Dave once of how I thought you should tell the story of the 80's, starting in Wigan Tiffanies October 1981 when most people were leaving for their 15 years of something or other excuse.

 

I recall after the last Casino, Wigan Tiffs tried to take off to replace it. Felt so weird being in a club as opposed to a ballroom venue

Wrong thread

Edited December 2, 201410 yr by Alan Bonthrone1

The grandfather, Mr Barnfather, AKA soul Sam,From the wheel till now must be one of the longest serving member of the northern soul sene,

he was my first mentor and was forward thinking from the start on many a night at Whitchurch and the Raven hearing a new record on it's first outing and then becoming a must have for most DJs.

Surely you will need his input

Don't think so, I'm afraid - sams a DJ, not one of the longest standing members of the northern scene

only my opinion of course 

The grandfather, Mr Barnfather, AKA soul Sam,From the wheel till now must be one of the longest serving member of the northern soul sene,

he was my first mentor and was forward thinking from the start on many a night at Whitchurch and the Raven hearing a new record on it's first outing and then becoming a must have for most DJs.

Surely you will need his input

 

he hasn't played a decent record since Whitchurch closed 

This is Frank Elsons take on the end.

Glad to see this thread is still running. I've been swamped for weeks so this has had to take a back seat.. for now. I've got a few quiet weeks coming up so I'll be attacking this with gusto!

Unknown oldie? Is this the same as a forgotten newie? sorry just struck me funny.

 

Struck you funny Wettin meself here mate

Glad to see this thread is still running. I've been swamped for weeks so this has had to take a back seat.. for now. I've got a few quiet weeks coming up so I'll be attacking this with gusto!

Great Stuff, I'd recommend speaking with Jim Ohara regarding Allenton ( few posts above this).

Jim's already in my sites

I did a thread  a few years ago about the nighters after wigan and the venues which may be of use

It was over 100 !!!!