Guest Bernadette Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 https://www.bbc.co.uk/music/soulbritannia/ Has anyone been involved or even interviewed for this??? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ady Croasdell Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I & Roger Armstrong, one of the directors of Ace, were interviewed for background info, on the recommendation of jerry dammers, and didn't hear any more until we were invited to the preview which involved free booze and grub: so I went. I wasn't expecting too much, though it was super to see Ian levine at the pre-film soiree, but it turned out to be a terrific documentary with some great appearances and apt reminiscences from Georgie Fame, Eric burdon and a brilliant old mod whose name i've forgotten but compiles ska and reggae CDS now I think. There's some brilliant footage of Jimmy James and some incredible doo wop from the Chants, among others and Geno is very funny. Northern gets a quick mention though as the first doc was meant to be the 60s scene it's technically in the wrong show unless they put more in that as well. Mr Levine gets to contribute a few words too. Well worth watching but about the UK scene as it happened rather than the Northern end of it. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest mel brat Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 (edited) https://www.bbc.co.uk/music/soulbritannia/ Has anyone been involved or even interviewed for this??? This is exactly what I've been saying elsewhere! I dread to think whom the highly paid "researchers" got to do their work for them! Nipped accross the corridor and had a quick chat with that well-known "Northern Soul guru" Trevor Nelson I suppose! Personally, I simply can't WAIT to hear about how Wigan Casino helped to relieve the agitated souls of the simple working classes in the, (quote) "...dreary North"! "By the 'eck! hang, on chuck! weers me bloody dancin' clogs th'ken...?" Edited January 23, 2007 by mel brat Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mike Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 will merge this and other posts on same later just so you know Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest WPaulVanDyk Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 sounds good but it gives me ideas on creating a cd of Soul/R & B and Rap from the UK music scene. Use some of the biggest stars. we did have a fair few over decades who quite well could be as good as the American stars Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 https://www.bbc.co.uk/music/soulbritannia/ Has anyone been involved or even interviewed for this??? No but...........Anything to do with our thing on the telly is gotta be better than BIG BROTHER ! Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Bernadette Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 will merge this and other posts on same later just so you know Hi Mike I did do a search before i posted but couldn't find anything! Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark Bicknell Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 No but...........Anything to do with our thing on the telly is gotta be better than BIG BROTHER ! How about a 'Northern Soul' version of 'Big Brother' now that would be interesting....lol Regards - Mark Bicknell. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Dean Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 How about a 'Northern Soul' version of 'Big Brother' now that would be interesting....lol Regards - Mark Bicknell. Place your bets on kicked out first!!!!!!!!!!!! No please please no responses, Dean Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Goldwax Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 There is a series of events to coincide with this at the Barbican Centre in early Feb - all British artists except for Sam Moore I think. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest TONY ROUNCE Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 I & Roger Armstrong, one of the directors of Ace, were interviewed for background info, on the recommendation of jerry dammers, and didn't hear any more until we were invited to the preview which involved free booze and grub: so I went. I wasn't expecting too much, though it was super to see Ian levine at the pre-film soiree, but it turned out to be a terrific documentary with some great appearances and apt reminiscences from Georgie Fame, Eric burdon and a brilliant old mod whose name i've forgotten but compiles ska and reggae CDS now I think. ...My mate Steve Barrow, is who it was/is that you're referring to, Ady. And unlike many of the people who will undoubtedly come on this forum and bitch about what wasn't included, or what was wrong about this series (and I see that some have already made a start at that, even though it's not even been transmitted yet!) Steve was actually 'there', he did go down the Scene, Flamingo etc and other places of that ilk. I've not seen this series myself, but those I know who have (like Ady and Roger) are people whose opinions I trust to be right and neither they nor anyone else I know who has seen the previews has said a bad word about it so far. As has been said elsewhere, it's better than CBB. And we really do need to be positive about these kind of programmes at all times, in order to keep the BBC commissioning them. Let's face it, it's not like we get 'em every week, is it? TONE Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Goldwax Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 Link to Barbican Soul Britannia series: https://www.barbican.org.uk/music/series.asp?id=375 Prob mostly a bit mainsrteam for a few on here but looks like a good night out or two to me. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest mel brat Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 No but...........Anything to do with our thing on the telly is gotta be better than BIG BROTHER ! Not necessarily! (Read above...) Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest mel brat Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 (edited) ...and unlike many of the people who will undoubtedly come on this forum and bitch about what wasn't included, or what was wrong about this series (and I see that some have already made a start at that, even though it's not even been transmitted yet... TONE How MANY times have "we" (the Soul fans) been shafted and short-changed by the BBC and other TV companies over the years??? Is it any wonder we're cynical, when the first most of us had heard about it was the synopsis for the show which talks about "the DREARY north.." in such a patronising and insulting manner! As for the series itself, people were simply asking WHO had been interviewed for it, and I was questioning the degree of research, as nobody on the scene appears to have heard about the project until it was completed. If it turns out well, then great. I'll be the first to commend it. I'm glad that bona fide fans and supporters of the SOUL scene (as opposed to just the usual characters) have contributed to the series and hope it turns out well. I won't be "bitching" if it is in any way accurate! (but less dismissal of the "dreary north" from the dreary London based media would be more than welcome in the meantime, thank you!) Edited January 24, 2007 by mel brat Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest TONY ROUNCE Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 (edited) How MANY times have "we" (the Soul fans) been shafted and short-changed by the BBC and other TV companies over the years??? Is it any wonder we're cynical, when the first most of us had heard about it was the synopsis for the show which talks about "the DREARY north.." in such a patronising and insulting manner! As for the series itself, people were simply asking WHO had been interviewed for it, and I was questioning the degree of research, as nobody on the scene appears to have heard about the project until it was completed. If it turns out well, then great. I'll be the first to commend it. I'm glad that bona fide fans and supporters of the SOUL scene (as opposed to just the usual characters) have contributed to the series and hope it turns out well. I won't be "bitching" if it is in any way accurate! (but less dismissal of the "dreary north" from the dreary BBC would be more than welcome in the meantime, thank you!) One of the main researchers on the series is James Maycock, very knowledgeable bloke and a man for whom soul music has always come first. I've no idea what the makeup of the final programmes is, but I do know that James was trying to assemble a well rounded picture of the evolution of and appreciation of soul in the UK, which may well be why he didn't confine his research to speaking with the percentage than makes up the Northern side of things. As he spoke to Ady, whom I regard as being a worthy ambassador for all of us, I don't think we should be worried that the series is going to misrepresent our piece of the rock in any way. And I'm pretty sure that you won't see the usual assemblage of talking heads (e.g. Davina, Jamie Theakston or the deeply unpleasant Gina Yashere) on there pontificating about how they all used to meet at Watford Gap services en route to or from the Mecca... If you saw the previous "Jazz Britannia" and "Folk Britannia" series you would already know that this is flagship stuff from the BBC. These series actually made me want to listen to some stuff that I hadn't heard in years, or that I'd had no previous interest in. I'm sure that "Soul Britannia" will have a similar effect on people... TONE Edited January 24, 2007 by TONY ROUNCE Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Soul Shrews Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 https://www.bbc.co.uk/music/soulbritannia/ Has anyone been involved or even interviewed for this??? It's not been aired yet and we're already bitching, what does that tell you? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ady Croasdell Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 It's not been aired yet and we're already bitching, what does that tell you? We're bitches (do i win anything?) Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest TONY ROUNCE Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 It's not been aired yet and we're already bitching, what does that tell you? ...Tells me that you didn't read my first post a bit further up that said more or less the same thing. Actually, bearing in mind that you're one hour ahead of us over there, maybe you said it before me anyway TONE Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Soul Shrews Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 ...Tells me that you didn't read my first post a bit further up that said more or less the same thing. Actually, bearing in mind that you're one hour ahead of us over there, maybe you said it before me anyway TONE I did ...........or you did............or was that a while ago?.......Or was that ........oh never mind! Cheers Paul PS I'll be tuneing in. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Soul Shrews Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 We're bitches (do i win anything?) A gold handbag! You bitch! Cheers Paco Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Soul Shrews Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 . Actually, bearing in mind that you're one hour ahead of us over there, TONE Oh we're soooo much more than just one hour ahead of you darling! Cheerz Paul Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest sydney bridge Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 How about a 'Northern Soul' version of 'Big Brother' now that would be interesting....lol Regards - Mark Bicknell.great idea mark,its a shame pete lawson and baz riley wont be around to star in it. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest mel brat Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 (edited) One of the main researchers on the series is James Maycock, very knowledgeable bloke and a man for whom soul music has always come first.... TONE In that case, everything's fine and I'm sure we'll have no complaints. Thanks for putting our fevered minds at rest! Edited January 25, 2007 by mel brat Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest mel brat Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 (edited) It's not been aired yet and we're already bitching, what does that tell you? Is it so wrong to demand input to the writing of our own "history" BEFORE a TV programme about it gets made and aired? Once a magazine article (or TV programme) is published it becomes history. Future researchers use it as reference, and on and on. Any distortions become presented as "fact" and before we know it, our own past is re-written and distorted by people who weren't even born at the time! Here's an example of the "impartiality" I was referring to, from the BBC site... VOTE Cast your vote: Who do you think has been most influential on UK Soul? Jimmy James Dusty Springfield Loose Ends Sade Soul II Soul's Jazzie B (I think I would have to vote for "none of the above"!) Edited January 25, 2007 by mel brat Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest mel brat Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 (edited) great idea mark,its a shame pete lawson and baz riley wont be around to star in it. Imagine sharing any house with Ian Levine.... Edited January 25, 2007 by mel brat Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Sweeney Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 (edited) Is it so wrong to demand input to the writing of our own "history" BEFORE a TV programme about it gets made and aired? Once a magazine article (or TV programme) is published it becomes history. Future researchers use it as reference, and on and on. Any distortions become presented as "fact" and before we know it, our own past is re-written and distorted by people who weren't even born at the time! If we're being perfectly honest, the Northern/Rare Soul scene is no more important than any of the other British-based scenes that have embraced Black American and Jamaican musical forms in the last 50 or so years. It could even be argued that a combination of the uncompromisingly insular and retrospective nature of the scene and the lack of a tangible musical legacy makes it less relevant to the development of the aforementioned musical forms in the UK than say, the British Reggae or Jazz Funk scenes. I looked at the Soul Britannia website and it certainly doesn't profess to be a definitive record of "our own history" in any case. It's more a UK-centric primer for people with an interest in music in the same way the sister series on Jazz and Folk were. I perceive it to be aimed at an "Observer Music Monthly" demographic - people who like the idea of obscure or interesting music, but aren't anal or daft enough to travel thousands of miles/pay ludicrous sums of money to listento/own the original artifacts in the same way that we might. Personally, I'll watch it with an open mind and will doubtless see things I haven't seen before and learn things I didn't know previously. Jazz Britannia and Folk Britannia opened my mind to things I'd previously discounted and I hope this will do the same. I suggest if you feel strongly about the alleged misrepresentation of the Northern/Rare Soul scene (which Soul Britannia doesn't profess to depict) you do what the enterprising people behind Soul Britannia did and pitch an idea to the BBC. Edited January 25, 2007 by sweeney Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest andyrattigan Posted January 26, 2007 Share Posted January 26, 2007 (edited) You cant please all the people all the time as the saying goes. However, if Soul Brittania is a patch on Folk Brittania or Folk Hibernia recently aired on the BBC then we are in for a treat.Im just delighted that there is something interesting to watch that doesnt involve "celebrities" or "reality". How anyone watches these shows? We should be commending intelligent documentary making and I dont understand how people who havent seen this programme feel qualified to run it down. Reserve your judgement until after. There is nothing laudable in condemnation prior to investigation. Edited January 26, 2007 by andyrattigan Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
FrankM Posted January 26, 2007 Share Posted January 26, 2007 However, if Soul Brittania is a patch on Folk Brittania or Folk Hibernia recently aired on the BBC then we are in for a treat. I certainly enjoyed the Jazz and folk series but possibly individuals with a more specialist knowledge did not. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Modernsoulsucks Posted January 28, 2007 Share Posted January 28, 2007 Mel, I don't think the programme is about the Northern scene except a passing reference so bit unrealistic to expect in-depth interviews with past or current movers and shakers. I do agree however most things on TV in the past have seemed superficial but then you'd need a 25 part series to cover it all. I don't know about anyone else but I'd never heard of James Maycock and looking on the net he appears to have written about James Brown, not exactly a firm favourite Northernwise. I will take bets that James gets more mentions than Eddie Parker!! Im sure it will have loads of interesting coverage of the 60's mod scene. In London of course. But without those old mods and their Tamla Motown etc we probably wouldn't be here to post on this site. ROD Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Soul Shrews Posted January 28, 2007 Share Posted January 28, 2007 Is it so wrong to demand input to the writing of our own "history" BEFORE a TV programme about it gets made and aired? Once a magazine article (or TV programme) is published it becomes history. Future researchers use it as reference, and on and on. Any distortions become presented as "fact" and before we know it, our own past is re-written and distorted by people who weren't even born at the time! Here's an example of the "impartiality" I was referring to, from the BBC site... VOTE Cast your vote: Who do you think has been most influential on UK Soul? Jimmy James Dusty Springfield Loose Ends Sade Soul II Soul's Jazzie B (I think I would have to vote for "none of the above"!) I can't argue with that statement Mr brat I agree with every word Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
FrankM Posted January 29, 2007 Share Posted January 29, 2007 No mention of Paula Parfitt, Muriel day and Chapter 5 never mind Wigan's Chosen few who must have exerted some influence on british soul. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest mel brat Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 If we're being perfectly honest, the Northern/Rare Soul scene is no more important than any of the other British-based scenes that have embraced Black American and Jamaican musical forms in the last 50 or so years. It could even be argued that a combination of the uncompromisingly insular and retrospective nature of the scene and the lack of a tangible musical legacy makes it less relevant to the development of the aforementioned musical forms in the UK than say, the British Reggae or Jazz Funk scenes. I looked at the Soul Britannia website and it certainly doesn't profess to be a definitive record of "our own history" in any case. It's more a UK-centric primer for people with an interest in music in the same way the sister series on Jazz and Folk were. I perceive it to be aimed at an "Observer Music Monthly" demographic - people who like the idea of obscure or interesting music, but aren't anal or daft enough to travel thousands of miles/pay ludicrous sums of money to listento/own the original artifacts in the same way that we might. Personally, I'll watch it with an open mind and will doubtless see things I haven't seen before and learn things I didn't know previously. Jazz Britannia and Folk Britannia opened my mind to things I'd previously discounted and I hope this will do the same. I suggest if you feel strongly about the alleged misrepresentation of the Northern/Rare Soul scene (which Soul Britannia doesn't profess to depict) you do what the enterprising people behind Soul Britannia did and pitch an idea to the BBC. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Geoff Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 Im sure it will have loads of interesting coverage of the 60's mod scene. In London of course. But without those old mods and their Tamla Motown etc we probably wouldn't be here to post on this site. ROD Some truth in that statement. I will watch the series when it is shown, hope it is at a reasonably convenient time as I can't seem to video from the digital stations. As others have said, better than some of the stuff on TV, I was beginning to think I was alone in disliking the celebrity, etc programmes. My opinion is that it would be easier to do a history of soul music in the UK in the form of a radio series. For TV, you've always got to have film of what they are talking about, therefore no film, not much to say, whereas in a sound only format, records can be played, interviews, reminiscences, etc. While you wouldn't see films of Northern dancing, which is of interest to us I guess, and amusement to non soulies, you would hopefully get intelligent discussion of the music, its growth, stylistic progression, etc. And it could cover the different scenes in the north and south, etc. It would be more scholarly, sort of thing that would fit on Radio 3. No point pretending that we are not a minority group musically speaking. This is just my opinion of course, I may be in a minority of 1. I missed the first ASADAN series, with the exception of the last programme, did that cover the history of NS, from the Twisted Wheel onwards, or did Stuart Maconie just play records and chat about them? If anyone has got them on tape or other format would be interested in hearing them. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest niallcrowley Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 British 'soul singer' Beverley Knight and 'cultural critic' Jacqueline Springer were on the radio yesterday talking about the upcoming series Soul Britannia, Here's some of what was said (my sarcasm in brackets): Interviewer: How do you think that soul music first made its entrance into Britain? BK: through a mixture of immigration... popularisation on the radio... culturalism... Jacqueline Springer: When I think of erm, soul music and this country... it seems to me that before even the HMS Windrush sailed into the shores... soul music had already made inroads (what? In the 1940s?). It started of with people loving jazz... and that became one way, rock & roll, and in the other direction came what we came to know as soul music. So there's always been an affection in this country for music with a back beat... I think it really kicked up a gear once the diaspora arrived... my parents' generation arrived in the country and brought with it a lot of the black American music they'd been hearing, and that was also played on the radio here as well. Interviewer: Dusty Springfield was heralded as the queen of British soul. Did it matter that she was white? Jacqueline Springer: I think it did... The fact that she was given the title showed she was cherished and respected... It showed the Americans that if that's the best they have to offer... not to discredit Dusty's obvious skills but if you're talking about the power of the ??? compared to Aretha... the enshrined queen... we had to Anglicise the whole coronation of Dusty, that way she couldn't be seen as queen of an entire genre. On the 80's and Soul II Soul Jacqueline Springer said "We were spoilt (tortured more like!) - we had Sade who represented jazz-funk" She goes on to talk about Lisa Stansfield etc. I think one of the problems with the upcoming series, similar ones before it and possibly the comments quoted above is that they're not very specific about what they think soul is. If you grow up listening mostly to reggae, but like a bit of "Aretha", "Stevie" and "Otis" then you're not a soul fan in my book (incidentally I grew up listening mostly to reggae and loved every minute of it). Unfortunately so much of these shows are dominated by people who don't really know too much about soul music or the soul scene/s and it's really frustrating when they have all the say. I suppose if we want the real story/stories of soul music in Britain to be told then it has to come from people like us. Anybody fancy making a TV show? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Modernsoulsucks Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 I don't think you could describe UK soul acts as being innovative apart from IMO Soul II Soul gang and that whole "Street Soul" thing. One thing quite recently has picqued my interest and I may be on my own here. I've had Jimmy Thomas "Beautiful Night" for years but I think it was Carl Willingham who flipped it and so I took a listen. Is it me or is it very like Marvin Gaye "What's goin' on" kinda layered sound. Im sure Jimmy's 45 was done here around 68/69 and Marvin's album didn't come out till 1971. Could we claim that as a milestone in soul even before Marvin's classic album. Maybe the more modern guys could comment as I may be a 6T's fan with cloth ears. ROD Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Modernsoulsucks Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 (edited) Sorry, posted twice. Edited February 1, 2007 by modernsoulsucks Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Sweeney Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 (edited) Unfortunately so much of these shows are dominated by people who don't really know too much about soul music or the soul scene/s and it's really frustrating when they have all the say. I suppose if we want the real story/stories of soul music in Britain to be told then it has to come from people like us. Anybody fancy making a TV show? Can you imagine the Northern/Rare/Modern scene agreeing on the title let alone anything else? What is the 'real' story of soul music in Britain? Is there a definitive answer? I only know MY version of it which will be different to just about everyone else on this board. No more 'real' than for example, my mum who bought a Motown single in the late 60s because she heard it on the radio and liked it enough to buy it next time she was in Woolies. Maybe that's part of the attraction, it means so many different things to different people. It strikes me as slightly patronising (not you specifically Niall, this topic in general) that we believe that we have a divine right to 'Souliness' over others. Why is this? Is there some sort of scoring system based on miles travelled multiplied by the average cost of records owned divided by years on the scene? I think we should be told. Edited February 2, 2007 by sweeney Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest niallcrowley Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 No offence taken Mr Sweeney but I think you are agonising over it too much. I was still going to school discos in the late 70s so would never profess to tell the story of the scene from my point of view. But history is history and things happen and certain people and events make them happen. If you're telling the story of soul music in the UK specifically, rather than lumping it together with reggae, then we can say something about it's development over here. We know about black GIs bringing over their music, we know about Godin's work and influence, we know about the mod scene and the soho clubs and then of course it all goes up north. A slightly different scene emerges in the south east which should also be explained but I don't know too much about that (even though I live in London. Obviously that's an extremely rough sketch and there's lots to argue about in there but I should think it's pretty straight forward. From the interview I heard on the radio and what I suspect we'll hear on the TV tonight, the 'story' is all over the place and wrong in parts. They conflate different kinds of black music from different parts of the world and lump them all together. Many of us have our own musical histories in both soul and reggae, but there are two very distincts musical forms, each with largely different histories in this country. Soul music obviously wasn't around in the 1940s and from what I understand didn't arrive on the back of West Indian immigration. Lisa Stansfield isn't a soul singer, Sade certainly wasn't a jazz-funk artist and Soul II Soul weren't the greatest thing since sliced bread. Still, I'm setting my video recorder for BBC4 tonight. Thanks Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark Bicknell Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Most enjoyable television, nothing much in there that i did'nt already know....one thing that did come out of it for me was to confirm that i really don't like Robert Elms...still who does? always comes across as a self professed 'know it all' like he invented youth culture, still as with all television such as this the makers often feel that they have to give the subject matter 'street cred' and i guess people like 'Elms' who have an opinion on everything yet basically know very little or rather know enough to blag an interview and say sod all to add to the subject will always be included and contribute. All in all a most enjoyable hour of television. Regards - Mark Bicknell. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Rowly Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Yeah I really enjoyed it too.... some great old footage I'd not seen before. And yup you're spot on Mark - Elms is a complete knob! Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Matt Male Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Not bad, not original. It all got a bit confused when they were talking about GIs at the Flamingo in the 60s and started showing footage and stills of people in the 40s. Not very good in terms of chronology, it kept switching backwards and forwards all over the place. The best point that was made by Eric Burden and even Tom Jones was that although they loved soul music, they didn't want to be black or American, they created something of their own from what they heard. They didn't just copy it. I'd say the same went for the mods. Most 'green with envy' moment was when Georgie Fame was talking about GIs bringing US 45s to him on a regular basis to listen to... Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest rasfoz Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 its now gonna repeat after the avengers as i missed it earlier Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Soul Shrews Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Not bad, not original. It all got a bit confused when they were talking about GIs at the Flamingo in the 60s and started showing footage and stills of people in the 40s. Not very good in terms of chronology, it kept switching backwards and forwards all over the place. The best point that was made by Eric Burden and even Tom Jones was that although they loved soul music, they didn't want to be black or American, they created something of their own from what they heard. They didn't just copy it. I'd say the same went for the mods. Most 'green with envy' moment was when Georgie Fame was talking about GIs bringing US 45s to him on a regular basis to listen to... What about all those people dancing to ska ...........with a soul soundtrack? Cheers Paul Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Karen Heath Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 I thought it was a highly enjoyable way to pass an hour, much better than Ugly Betty at any rate! There was some really lovely old footage, not so much of artists but of people in general which gave it more of a social history feel. I liked it a lot and look forward to next week ! Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 I enjoyed it...not bad at all, and it was interesting to hear from the people that were there Georgie Fame and Steve Barrow in particular adding some pertinent insights...lots of stock footage but on the whole I thought it was well put together....what did make me sit up was some short footage of TheTwisted Wheel in Brasennose Street, never seen that before (is there more? Pete?).....and didn't The Temps look good?, literally brought tears to my eyes.... ....anybody got a tissue? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest TONY ROUNCE Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 one thing that did come out of it for me was to confirm that i really don't like Robert Elms...still who does? Oh, I think you'll find that Robert Elms likes himself enough for all of us, Mark I enjoyed the show as much as I believed I was going to, which was quite a lot. I don't have any complaints about the occasional mismatching of music to footage - after all, there isn't always a whole lot of footage to go round in some cases and better than than a blank screen. I thought that almost all of the 'talking heads' came over well and made their points extremely intelligently... ...but please - and this is a request to all programme makers, present and future - can we be spared any more of Elms' pontificating every time we turn on a programme that has anything to do with music or youth culture from the past 100 years? Or if we have to listen to his uninformed droning, can his every word be accompanied by a loop of music from James Brown's "Talkin' Loud And Sayin' Nothing" TONE Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mark R Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 I too thought it was great..............particularly as it filled some gaps for me............despite being to young to have attended, I feel I know enough about the clubs in the North, but I have limited knowledge of the early London scene, so it was great for that! Have to agree about the Wheel footage..............never seen that, so that was great.............I sort of assumed it was the Whitworth St venue, forgetting that it was originally Brasenose St (am I dreaming this......it did move didn't it??) The programme in general..............well, people that truly love and feel black music tingle inside with excitement when watching such programmes..............and one thing it did confirm to me after listening to all those people who obviously know their onions.............is that us pontificating on here regarding what is soul and what is not is just a load of bullshit...............it's what YOU feel, and can't simply be described. Does give us something to talk about though I suppose! Can't wait for next week! Cheers, Mark R Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest vinylvixen Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 (edited) there isn't always a whole lot of footage to go round in some cases and better than than a blank screen. I thought that almost all of the 'talking heads' came over well and made their points extremely intelligently... TONE You're right Tony. There were some moments when I thought - hang on, this is 1940's footage - but the Twisted Wheel footage more than made up for everything...can you imagine the sheer LUXURY of having a super 8 or 16mm cine camera. Probably somebody borrowed their dad's on the sly. But, little did they realise that their albeit too brief b&w, grainy, shakey, dodgy focus 30 second clip would make peoples knees go weak 35 years down the line. Full marks to the researcher who tracked that down....and I suspect that there would be a couple of SS'ers who have similar things tucked away in their attics As for the selected 'talking heads', Georgie Fame always gives me a frisson....1) because I wanted to marry him when I was 4 - and still have a huge crush on him and 2) he was there - he was a one man scene and 3) for me, he's one of the coolest men on the planet... Eddie Amoo of the Chants/ Real Thing was fascinating and his collection of shots and anecdotes of the group with the Beatles was priceless. The footage of them at the Cavern (?) was jaw dropping. I'd like to commission him to narrate/ present a series on the alternative 'Merseybeat' scene...doesn't he breed and show Afghan hounds at Crufts now? Jimmy James & Geno were super interesting and were looking fabulous - it's all those late nights in smokey nightclubs that keeps them looking fit Looking forward to the rest of the series....with or without Elms... Jo Edited February 3, 2007 by vinylvixen Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest vinylvixen Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 youth culture Mark, I too will him if I hear him utter the phrase 'youth culture' one more time....Jo Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest vinylvixen Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 (edited) Some truth in that statement. I will watch the series when it is shown, hope it is at a reasonably convenient time as I can't seem to video from the digital stations. As others have said, better than some of the stuff on TV, I was beginning to think I was alone in disliking the celebrity, etc programmes. My opinion is that it would be easier to do a history of soul music in the UK in the form of a radio series. For TV, you've always got to have film of what they are talking about, therefore no film, not much to say, whereas in a sound only format, records can be played, interviews, reminiscences, etc. While you wouldn't see films of Northern dancing, which is of interest to us I guess, and amusement to non soulies, you would hopefully get intelligent discussion of the music, its growth, stylistic progression, etc. And it could cover the different scenes in the north and south, etc. It would be more scholarly, sort of thing that would fit on Radio 3. No point pretending that we are not a minority group musically speaking. This is just my opinion of course, I may be in a minority of 1. I missed the first ASADAN series, with the exception of the last programme, did that cover the history of NS, from the Twisted Wheel onwards, or did Stuart Maconie just play records and chat about them? If anyone has got them on tape or other format would be interested in hearing them. Geoff, any series producer of 6Ts London worth their salt should interview you You were there back in the day; you went to the clubs; you went to gigs and you still have the photos to prove it...PLUS - you still have all your marbles Even a tiny personal glimpse into an era that I wasn't old enough to participate in is brilliant. When you recount your jaunts to me Geoff, it's genius....there's always YouTube And whilst I'm in my interviewing mood, I'd have Tony Rounce coz he's super Jo Edited February 3, 2007 by vinylvixen Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
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